Ettenmoors Outline - 2025

[Laforza]

Always agreed with the idea that any melee class in a pvp oriented space needs some form of gap closer without making it too powerful. Something that worked in almost any situation to either close distance to a target, or to put distance between you and your target. The greatest weakness of any melee is if they can't actually get into melee. Issues arise when something like a champion or guardian sprint can be traited to last a really long time which they used to. Other considerations are some melee classes have slows that are much weaker in % of movement slowed compared to some slows of ranged/tactical classes. Stuns and slows have always and will always be a major part of pvmp. Brands/Insignias not working to mitigate these is also a huge factor, though it sounds as though it's being looked into.

No melee in a group will want to rush into range to actually hit something if there isn't much point trying to out damage competent heals while also making themselves the primary target simply due to proximity. Maybe they need to rework things like the induction setback all melee attacks do towards heals/channeled skills. So that a single or at least concentrated melee group is the most efficient way to overcome the other side. There are just so many variables and the simple fact that ranged skills allow much less movement to attack multiple targets in any focus target scenario.

 

[wardous]

i mean it's not unknown that WL and Defi Heal is a bit over tuned.., you sometimes need 6+ players to kill 1x WL or Defiler

you also need about 7-8 creeps to kill a single healing rk so whats your point here ?

 

[wardous]

Probably the best evidence that Creep heals are overpowered compared to Freep heals is that you always see a bunch of Defis and WLs running around in heal modes, but you rarely see Freeps doing the same. If Creep heals weren't overpowered in comparison, nobody would be willingly playing them because they'd be redundant.

Not to mention all the times you can compare those moments where one side baits the other out with a false retreat, and then does a 180 and tramples straight back over the enemy. When it's a WL/Defi caught by surprise, they just outheal the damage and escape into a Keep/One-shotters, but if it's a Mini/RK, they almost immediately get flattened before they can even turn around.

And nothing is more powerful than the WL bubble. It's not even debatable at this point. You were right when you said "joke post", you spotted what he was very quickly.

out heal and escape into a keep ? oh we are just gonna leave the blue traited guards out of this with the ridiculous sprint ? all while fighting a 12 man craid and just runs off uncatchable and escapes death ? so we just gonna over look that right ?

 

[wardous]

yes i was earlier talking about 1WL and 6Freeps.., this what i wrote after that was an ''example'' and this ''example'' of mine is how it's most of the time, there are sometimes 3xWL's and 3xDefilers if not like mentioned above ''more'' which results in a not ''Win-able'' fight, and if you win, it's just after a very long Time of fighting.., also like Doro said.., 1x WL or 1x Defiler in comparsion to our Healers is ''over tuned'' 1WL on Heal or even 1Defiler is not easy to ''Kill''.., but our healers lets say 1RK or 1Mini etc.., they're going down in x seconds in comparsion to what they're able to do.., i saw on Orcrist a WL holding agains 12Freeps.., like how should this even be possible?

No WL is out living 12 freeps with the amout of utility freeps have. oh come on already if you cant defeat a single WL with 12 its most defiantly a skill issue. typical freep wanting ezmoding 600k-700k moral plus broken LM's and 200k-300k epic conclusions isnt enough it seems

 

[Hoppendi]

Balance issue #2: 2v1 should NEVER be easy no matter the skill level.

Sorry i just lurk around this thread and seen this statement. My PvMP time is from some years ago and i with my rank 9 warg i couldn't solo a Captain-General. But one time i encountered a weak freep group (all low ranks) which went 4v1 or 5v1 vs me solo. we were close to a revive circle and i killed the whole group, they came back and got wiped again. Really don't think they can stand a chance when they probably casual and completely new (just writing this because you said "never").

Only had this happen one time, was a fun experience and instantly got accused of rank farming by another warg. As if i would find five humans to do nothing else than pretend to fight me - whatever... killed my mood.

 

[Nanganark]

No WL is out living 12 freeps with the amout of utility freeps have. oh come on already if you cant defeat a single WL with 12 its most defiantly a skill issue. typical freep wanting ezmoding 600k-700k moral plus broken LM's and 200k-300k epic conclusions isnt enough it seems

i guess you never played PvP then.., your bad then, not mine.., but i can assure you i saw it.., and you obviously not.., so please do comment your things somewhere else.., Thank you

 

[Perseverance]

It's less about the state of melee and more about the state of Minstrel, RK, and LM, which are all absolutely broken and comically easy to play.

Melee classes require some semblance of movement skill to succeed on, and all do significantly less damage than any tactical class out there right now. Melees have much higher survivability but that's fairly useless in a raid, so you tend to only see them solo/small grouping out and about.

SSG really do need to do something about the vast, vast majority of all Freeps being one of three classes, and the remaining 10% being every other class. It's honestly a touch ridiculous it's gone on so long.

Totally agree, and it's compounded by the fact that only mage classes get picked up in a group, cause they are super OP, all the melee classes just get shoved to the side, like we are doing something wrong.

 

[Thradin Stoneshield]

Totally agree, and it's compounded by the fact that only mage classes get picked up in a group, cause they are super OP, all the melee classes just get shoved to the side, like we are doing something wrong.

In terms of PVMP Melee classes are going to inherently have lower DPS than ranged because even if you're really good at positioning, it is nigh impossible to keep perfect facing since this is a "no collision" game. Physical damage is also massively reduced compared to tactical so that is an inherent problem also.

This is personally why I think all ranged attacks (greater than 10m) should be reduced across the board by 50%. That will put ranged classes on par with melee classes in terms of damage, it will allow them to approach into melee range, and give more balance to the fights because the most problematic skills are all ranged nukes that overperform.

 

[Ena]

Totally agree, and it's compounded by the fact that only mage classes get picked up in a group, cause they are super OP, all the melee classes just get shoved to the side, like we are doing something wrong.

Problem is not that ranged classes are better, but easier/safer, for the lack of better word. I mean that's it literally. They don't waste time running to the target, and they can more easily avoid many harmful effects, just by being away. But in any serious group setting, you will have good mix of all classes, because they all bring something else to the table, and you will have them together (balled up), to benefit from all buffs and heals (among other things, like not spreading puddles all over the place). Devs recognized this issue, and we see changes in the design, that is to say some harmful effects got range, and group is encouraged by design and mechanics to stick together.

 

[Ena]

I was watching Bludborn stream with Orion, and was really happy to hear that creeps are getting a new class finally - Angmarim Sorcerer. Can't wait to see it live, and will surely play it.

Let me just say, for years, my wish was Morroval. I hope you can consider it. I imagine Morroval having mix of ranged and melee skills, bat as a pet, something akin to Sic 'em, shriek effects (fear, blight) and bleeds. And goblin would be also fun to see.

 

[Wheresthefight]

A blue-traited Guard is nothing by comparison to a WL, especially when we're talking about heals. So yeah, it's not even relevant to the discussion.

??? Why on earth would you compare a Blue Guard and a WL? A WL is a healer, a Blue Guard is a tank spec, why should a Blue Guard be able to heal as much as a WL?

Not to mention the fact that in terms of pure survivability, a Blue Guard has no business dying to less than 12 Creeps in anything under 30 seconds, and a WL will be vapourised the second War Forged ends, 10 seconds in.

Your skewed look at Creeps, whilst playing the most broken survivability (and also useless) spec in the Moors RN is just a sight to behold. Just go play a War-leader for like 30 minutes, you'll get absolutely deleted by RKs 50 times in that time, and then you'll have different opinions.

 

[Urwendil]

A Morroval with a stable Morvul and temporary (a la Captain Oathies) bat-swarm pet would be nice.

 

[Starmonster]

we needed somthing to match an RK, is this the best choice?

 

[Starmonster]

dont get me wrong, would love to see a new class in the Moors, but this sounds more like a deebuffer

 

[Ena]

dont get me wrong, would love to see a new class in the Moors, but this sounds more like a deebuffer

All classes, apart from damage, need some additional utility. Upcoming Angmarim Sorcerer will be mostly about buffs and debuffs. My proposed Morroval would be dps class, with strong bleeds and a bat pet and bat swarm that could resemble some of the LM skills (Minor and Major pet command, and Sic 'em). It would make sense if they are looking at what creep classes are already doing in pve and basing their choices on it, which I think they do.

To be completely honest, I'm not sure why people have problem with RK. All tactical classes has good damage and can harras from distance, but RK doesn't have great survivibility. I find minstrel harder to kill.

 

[Ryzer]

Smh. I understand wanting all of this bs put in game to try to kill off the GV/Grams camp. But get real, it's not going to. All you're doing is adding more things like glory seeking or whatever it's called that nobody is going to use.

It really is as simple as giving us the DoF back, and tweaking some classes. We all miss the DoF exactly how it was. You don't even need to put the drake back down there, just leave us tree and Gary. Why tf did it need to be closed in the first place?! Haven't you ever heard the saying if it ain't broke don't fix it? You have a pvp zone that is broken all over but you remove the one piece that wasn't LOL.

PvP is in a pretty "decent" spot right now. Do a BA and warg update like you did the WL, and reopen the DoF and it'll be awesome.

 

[Orion]

we needed somthing to match an RK, is this the best choice?

Sorry for being absent from the thread for a bit. I have been head down getting everything into the build for the first BR.

The Sorceress resides somewhere between Rune-keeper and Lore-master.

Her basic skill package focuses on dealing acid damage and reducing enemy armour. This damage is lower while using her basic skill set. Her devotions augment her abilities and give her moment-to-moment specialization.

Balefire, her DPS devotion, focuses on dealing fire damage and uses a combination of DoTs, self-buffs, and direct damage. Over time, she builds critical chance toward a moment where she infuses her next three fire-based skills to always critically strike.

Gelid Wind, the sorceress' control devotion stance, focuses on dealing frost damage, slowing and controlling enemies' movement, and survivability. Gelid Wind deals less damage, but makes up for that with an effect that provides an ever-present risk of crowd control. Whether through roots, knock downs, or stuns, the chilling effect of the gelid wind is ever present.

The Umbral Pall, the sorceress' primary support stance, focuses on reducing enemy skill range, healing efficacy, increasing allied mitigations, reducing enemy mitigations, and providing some damage. All the while, the fear invoked through the continued use of shadow builds on her targets and can invoke true terror in her enemies when she focuses her damaging spells upon them.

She can change stances while in battle to adjust to the moment-to-moment needs, and she can utilize her advanced training and understanding of sorcerous powers to prepare herself before battle by preparing a selection of spells ahead of time. While her prepared spells deal less damage and have shorter durations, she can, through traits, overcome those drawbacks.

Additionally, the sorceress's understanding of the interactions between the elemental powers she commands provides her with a number of boons and banes that result in potent sorcerous synergies. When she, her allies, or enemies are affected by some spells and effects, these banes and boons can augment the current effects for even greater impediment or benefit.

 

[Arabani]

I'll post it here as well, could we have a possibility/an option to turn the pvp rank icons off? At least outside the Ettenmoors?

 

[Louvine]

I'll post it here as well, could we have a possibility/an option to turn the pvp rank icons off? At least outside the Ettenmoors?

They added this months ago.....

 

[Starmonster]

Sorry for being absent from the thread for a bit. I have been head down getting everything into the build for the first BR.

The Sorceress resides somewhere between Rune-keeper and Lore-master.

Her basic skill package focuses on dealing acid damage and reducing enemy armour. This damage is lower while using her basic skill set. Her devotions augment her abilities and give her moment-to-moment specialization.

Balefire, her DPS devotion, focuses on dealing fire damage and uses a combination of DoTs, self-buffs, and direct damage. Over time, she builds critical chance toward a moment where she infuses her next three fire-based skills to always critically strike.

Gelid Wind, the sorceress' control devotion stance, focuses on dealing frost damage, slowing and controlling enemies' movement, and survivability. Gelid Wind deals less damage, but makes up for that with an effect that provides an ever-present risk of crowd control. Whether through roots, knock downs, or stuns, the chilling effect of the gelid wind is ever present.

The Umbral Pall, the sorceress' primary support stance, focuses on reducing enemy skill range, healing efficacy, increasing allied mitigations, reducing enemy mitigations, and providing some damage. All the while, the fear invoked through the continued use of shadow builds on her targets and can invoke true terror in her enemies when she focuses her damaging spells upon them.

She can change stances while in battle to adjust to the moment-to-moment needs, and she can utilize her advanced training and understanding of sorcerous powers to prepare herself before battle by preparing a selection of spells ahead of time. While her prepared spells deal less damage and have shorter durations, she can, through traits, overcome those drawbacks.

Additionally, the sorceress's understanding of the interactions between the elemental powers she commands provides her with a number of boons and banes that result in potent sorcerous synergies. When she, her allies, or enemies are affected by some spells and effects, these banes and boons can augment the current effects for even greater impediment or benefit.

Well this sounds really cool, thanks