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  1. #26
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    I think they should add them to the store now. Reasons are.....

    2 points are locked by doing Epic Battles, not many players do EBs anymore. Very hard to get now.

    We can buy tokens to instant level to 95 but what's the point if we have to go back and do quests anyway to get the trait points. May as well have just quested and saved the points for something else. The instant level 95 should have included the trait points from earlier quests like helms deep area. All skill deeds should have been unlocked too.

    Nearly everything else is on the store, virtues, stats etc. Why not trait points?

    I do not need or want to do every quest over and over after 9 years of playing this game.

  2. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Happychappy View Post
    I think they should add them to the store now. Reasons are.....

    2 points are locked by doing Epic Battles, not many players do EBs anymore. Very hard to get now.

    We can buy tokens to instant level to 95 but what's the point if we have to go back and do quests anyway to get the trait points. May as well have just quested and saved the points for something else. The instant level 95 should have included the trait points from earlier quests like helms deep area. All skill deeds should have been unlocked too.

    Nearly everything else is on the store, virtues, stats etc. Why not trait points?

    I do not need or want to do every quest over and over after 9 years of playing this game.
    Another good point +100500.

    Btw my champ is 95 now......Turbine, hurry up please.

  3. #28
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  4. #29
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  5. #30
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    This is why we can't have nice things.

    (because instead of paying for nice things [fun/compelling game design], you'll pay them to just give you the reward and bypass the game. Now, tell me, where in there is the incentive to design a more fun/compelling game?)

  6. #31
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    Lest we all just repeat ourselves yet again, here is the thread where this has already been established as just one more plunge down the slippery slope.

    The primary argument in favor seems to be that so long as we've already plunged into the mire, we might as well wallow in it rather than beginning to clean ourselves off.

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hurin View Post
    Lest we all just repeat ourselves yet again, here is the thread where this has already been established as just one more plunge down the slippery slope.

    The primary argument in favor seems to be that so long as we've already plunged into the mire, we might as well wallow in it rather than beginning to clean ourselves off.
    It's no use linking to the same topic that's been on page one of these (mostly dead) forums since December of last year. Maybe if you could find some way to charge them for that information they'd be able to find some small value in it.

  8. #33
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    I now have FOUR (minstrel, captain, guardian & RK) characters at various points in the early parts of HD, all on the premise of doing the content to get the 5 trait points but unable to progress because I'm just sick to death with the tedium that is HD.

    So Turbine, just put the sodding points in the store and you've got some extra TP sales from me. We all know you need the cash so do us all a favour.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hurin View Post
    Lest we all just repeat ourselves yet again, here is the thread where this has already been established as just one more plunge down the slippery slope.

    The primary argument in favor seems to be that so long as we've already plunged into the mire, we might as well wallow in it rather than beginning to clean ourselves off.
    Of course you're right but we went down that slope back in late 2010 and quite honestly I've given up with worrying about whether the game should or could be better without the pay for grind avoidance model as it's been 5 1/2 years and nothing's going to change. So as I'm cash rich and time poor, Turbine should cater to my needs.

  9. #34
    in about two weeks, i will have 9 toons with 81 traitpoints. still, some time will go on until the first has 82 points... slayer deeds for traitpoints are a real pain. please dont do that again.
    Diskutierer, Fragenbeantworter, Twinker, Händler, Handwerker und Gründer der 'Gemeinschaft der freien Völker' auf Belegaer.
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  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by BangoTwinkletoes View Post
    I now have FOUR (minstrel, captain, guardian & RK) characters at various points in the early parts of HD,
    And I've got the same (having completed it on three). Yet I still disagree. Go figure. . .

    So as I'm cash rich and time poor, Turbine should cater to my needs.
    Thus guaranteeing that the game only gets worse, never better, and driving away (and keeping away) those who maintain some standard of integrity for the games on which they spend their time and money.

    It's a pity that they can't/won't "cater" to the "needs" of those who value games with integrity. But then, they can't so long as they have people willingly/enthusiastically throwing money at them, thus disincentivizing any improvement, and incentivizing further bad design, all while demanding that they "cater to my needs."

    As I've been saying: We have the game we deserve.

    Edit: So many of the replies here can be summed up as: "You're right of course, but this time I want it, so the principle doesn't matter. Gimme."
    Last edited by Hurin; Apr 28 2016 at 11:44 AM.

  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hurin View Post
    And I've got the same (having completed it on three). Yet I still disagree. Go figure. . .


    Thus guaranteeing that the game only gets worse, never better, and driving away (and keeping away) those who maintain some standard of integrity for the games on which they spend their time and money.

    It's a pity that they can't/won't "cater" to the "needs" of those who value games with integrity. But then, they can't so long as they have people willingly/enthusiastically throwing money at them, thus disincentivizing any improvement, and incentivizing further bad design, all while demanding that they "cater to my needs."

    As I've been saying: We have the game we deserve.

    Edit: So many of the replies here can be summed up as: "You're right of course, but this time I want it, so the principle doesn't matter. Gimme."
    +10, for truth.
    And if it gets to the point where we are "sick to death" of playing large areas of the game, then maybe not playing really is the best option. Or at the very least, don't give them any more money to keep making areas that we are going to be sick to death of playing in the very near future.

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by BangoTwinkletoes View Post
    I now have FOUR (minstrel, captain, guardian & RK) characters at various points in the early parts of HD, all on the premise of doing the content to get the 5 trait points but unable to progress because I'm just sick to death with the tedium that is HD.

    So Turbine, just put the sodding points in the store and you've got some extra TP sales from me. We all know you need the cash so do us all a favour.



    Of course you're right but we went down that slope back in late 2010 and quite honestly I've given up with worrying about whether the game should or could be better without the pay for grind avoidance model as it's been 5 1/2 years and nothing's going to change. So as I'm cash rich and time poor, Turbine should cater to my needs.
    This is one of the worst arguments for mindless consumerism I have ever read.

  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by NImlonda View Post
    If you have 9 toons..Why on earth do you feel te need to max out every class point and every virtue?
    Is there anything in this game you actually need all that for?
    This is more or less how I feel. I have 18 toons, 11 of them level 100 when U18 dropped. I can't be bothered to max em all out, who has the time? Now with the level 105 max level, I have decided to actually only level three of them, and I just finished #3 last night. Those will be the three I will focus on "maxing out" as best as I can....

    The rest? Crafters. Perhaps to level when I feel like it. I still have a level 95 guard I never bothered to level, he's been locked inside the Galtrev crafting hall for the last 2 years! The other level 100s I have aren't equipped wel either. Some have 2nd agers only, some have dropped purple armor stuff, whatever I could find....

    My 105's are a Hunter, Minstrel, Loremaster, and if I will level another character it will probably be my Runekeeper. But I am in NO hurry.

    Sorry, but if you want to get the rewards, you have to do the work. Keep it "as is" please.
    Moved from Riddermark to Arkenstone on 9/29/2015!
    -----
    Disclaimer: The definition of "Soon™" and "In The Near Future™" is based solely on SSG's interpretation of the words, and all similarities with dictionary definitions of the word "Soon™", "Near", and "Future" are purely coincidental and should not be interpreted as a time frame that will come to pass within a reasonable amount of time.

  14. #39
    Don't bother folks.



    Ok my champ is lvl 105. I've have done all but HD, and 2 MT meta deeds.

    Turbine its time to put em on the store, u know my credit card is ready WTB those 7 points, make a reasonable offer and we'll deal

  15. #40
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  16. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jagannath View Post
    This is one of the worst arguments for mindless consumerism I have ever read.
    It's my money. I've earned it. So what I do with it is none of your 'effing business. That being said, if my spending a £40 on a few TPs sends you into a forum rage then I might just throw some more cash in the direction of Turbine just for the lolz.

  17. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hurin View Post
    Thus guaranteeing that the game only gets worse, never better, and driving away (and keeping away) those who maintain some standard of integrity for the games on which they spend their time and money.

    It's a pity that they can't/won't "cater" to the "needs" of those who value games with integrity. But then, they can't so long as they have people willingly/enthusiastically throwing money at them, thus disincentivizing any improvement, and incentivizing further bad design, all while demanding that they "cater to my needs."

    As I've been saying: We have the game we deserve.

    Edit: So many of the replies here can be summed up as: "You're right of course, but this time I want it, so the principle doesn't matter. Gimme."
    In an ideal world I would completely agree with you. If this were WoW or Eve online then I'd be at the barricades fighting with everyone else against the imposition of crass pay to avoid grind rubbish.

    But this is lotro. The game sold out a long time ago and we're at the stage now where we either accept it for what it is or move on and play something else. As long as we're dealing with Turbine with our eyes wide open then I don't see the issue.

  18. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by BangoTwinkletoes View Post
    It's my money. I've earned it. So what I do with it is none of your 'effing business.
    Yeah. ''None of my ''effing business''. That's why you blabbed about it on a public forum. Good one.

    Quote Originally Posted by BangoTwinkletoes View Post
    That being said, if my spending a £40 on a few TPs sends you into a forum rage then I might just throw some more cash in the direction of Turbine just for the lolz.
    Yeah. Forum rage. You should donate all your money to Turbine. That'll teach me. *Giggle.

  19. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by BangoTwinkletoes View Post
    The game sold out a long time ago and we're at the stage now where we either accept it for what it is or move on and play something else.
    We're also at the stage where you and others encourage the game to get worse because it suits your needs of the moment. Thus potentially causing people to "move on and play something else."

    Again, you agree on the principle. You just see no problem in violating it further because it suits your interest in this case.

    Which, of course, is how this slippery slope got dug out of the hillside in the first place. There have always been the "in this case, I don't see the big deal, gimme" folks since Store-only relics and Stat Tomes were first devised. . . and here we are.

  20. #45
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    I think the problem is that we're just not getting through to some of these people.
    Fortunately I've brought along a crackerjack team of translators to help out in case something like this might happen...


  21. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jagannath View Post
    Yeah. ''None of my ''effing business''. That's why you blabbed about it on a public forum. Good one.
    So? The minute I become just the slightest bit concerned about the impact your posts have on my own general view of things I'll let you know.

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jagannath View Post
    Yeah. Forum rage. You should donate all your money to Turbine. That'll teach me. *Giggle.
    [/QUOTE]

    You're the one who posts here telling me what I can and cannot spend my money on - in a forum of a game that you don't play. So I can only assume you're here for masochistic reasons or that you enjoy winding yourself up into a whirlwind of self-righteous indignation.

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hurin View Post
    We're also at the stage where you and others encourage the game to get worse because it suits your needs of the moment. Thus potentially causing people to "move on and play something else."

    Again, you agree on the principle. You just see no problem in violating it further because it suits your interest in this case.

    Which, of course, is how this slippery slope got dug out of the hillside in the first place. There have always been the "in this case, I don't see the big deal, gimme" folks since Store-only relics and Stat Tomes were first devised. . . and here we are.
    The formula I apply is quite simple - does making a stand on a point of principle make the blindest bit of difference? If so then I'm with you all the way. If not then it's either give in or leave.

    So indeed here we are - Turbine are already 80% of the way there - they sell pretty much everything apart from end-game gear & promotion points so really they may as well put promotion points on the store. Of course I'd prefer it if they just had the 82 points acquired just by levelling but we've been making that point since HD went live and they've not changed it so may as well accept the reality of it all.

    Same with the RP server rules - whilst Turbine keep them for Laurelin etc then I'll argue my corner day and night for them to be retained. Once they've gone then that's it - no point going on about it then as it's done.

  23. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by BangoTwinkletoes View Post
    The formula I apply is quite simple - does making a stand on a point of principle make the blindest bit of difference? If so then I'm with you all the way. If not then it's either give in or leave.

    So indeed here we are - Turbine are already 80% of the way there - they sell pretty much everything apart from end-game gear & promotion points so really they may as well put promotion points on the store. Of course I'd prefer it if they just had the 82 points acquired just by levelling but we've been making that point since HD went live and they've not changed it so may as well accept the reality of it all.

    Same with the RP server rules - whilst Turbine keep them for Laurelin etc then I'll argue my corner day and night for them to be retained. Once they've gone then that's it - no point going on about it then as it's done.
    So, again. . . this is just: "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em."

    If that's the "formula" by which you choose to live. . . I can't stop you.

    In essence, you're giving up. On both the game and those who would like to stop the decay. Indeed, you're now enthusiastically on the "other side". . . cheering for further decay. Indeed, demanding it because they should now "cater to you."

    Now, you can repeat yourself again as though you feel you just aren't making yourself clear. But you are being clear. What I've said thus far, each time, is merely a reasonable response to your very clearly stated position.

  24. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by BangoTwinkletoes View Post
    So? The minute I become just the slightest bit concerned about the impact your posts have on my own general view of things I'll let you know.
    You just did. ^.^

    Quote Originally Posted by BangoTwinkletoes View Post
    You're the one who posts here telling me what I can and cannot spend my money on - in a forum of a game that you don't play. So I can only assume you're here for masochistic reasons or that you enjoy winding yourself up into a whirlwind of self-righteous indignation.
    Oh dear. It appears we're having another communication breakdown. Bring on the translators! :O



    Quote Originally Posted by BangoTwinkletoes View Post
    The formula I apply is quite simple - does making a stand on a point of principle make the blindest bit of difference? If so then I'm with you all the way. If not then it's either give in or leave...
    Translation: Principles only matter when they make a difference (therby defeating the point of having principles in the first place).

    principle
    noun
    1.
    a fundamental truth or proposition that serves as the foundation for a system of belief or behaviour or for a chain of reasoning.
    "the basic principles of justice"
    synonyms: truth, proposition, concept, idea, theory, postulate

  25. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hurin View Post
    So, again. . . this is just: "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em."

    If that's the "formula" by which you choose to live. . . I can't stop you.

    In essence, you're giving up. On both the game and those who would like to stop the decay. Indeed, you're now enthusiastically on the "other side". . . cheering for further decay. Indeed, demanding it because they should now "cater to you."

    Now, you can repeat yourself again as though you feel you just aren't making yourself clear. But you are being clear. What I've said thus far, each time, is merely a reasonable response to your very clearly stated position.
    Look, from a point of principle I completely agree with you, and in another circumstance where a game was looking to change from a subscription only to freemium then I'd be arguing the point to keep it that way alongside with you - because subscription is the best model for MMOs and lotro was at its best when it was sub only.

    But... it's 5 1/2 year since lotro went f2p. Me arguing against the excesses of freemium here on the forum is not going to make a ha'porth of difference to the matter, and indeed given that I still spend the odd £40 here and there on points, I would be accused of being just a tad hypocritical. Hence why it's just easier and a lot less time consuming for me to give up that fight.

 

 
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