Official Policy Stance on our Support of Player Run Events

[PlusDust]

LOTRO has a rich history of fun, interesting and exciting community-run events. We think this is fantastic and would like to better support these activities! To that end, we are making a concerted effort to look into ways for us to support and further encourage participation.

One of the things that we’ve seen detract from these events is the negative behavior and actions of other players. Specifically, we know that players moving throughout the performance area on mounts can be particularly frustrating and distracting. To combat this problem we’re looking into what options are available to help combat this behavior in designated performance (stage) areas. We’ll also be removing players who are mounted from the stage area manually in the meantime. Typically, we’ll take this action upon receiving a help request. We will also take this action if we happen to see it occurring while monitoring events. If this behavior is repeated after we issue a warning we will be taking further action including banning the trolling players. Please keep in mind that this policy is for events that use designated stages. We cannot provide support if the events are held in areas with quest givers, standard gameplay, etc.

If a GM does witness blatant and intentional disruptive behavior other than being mounted in the performance areas we will take action against that disruptive behavior as well. We want to take a common sense approach of fostering these events and removing anyone displaying harassing or “troll” behavior.

If you have any ideas to make events more accommodating for your groups, please post and discuss in this thread. We are always happy to run feedback by the product development team and review our own support and moderation policies to create a better experience for all participants.

Thanks!
+Dust

[Jillymala]

Thanks Dust!
I think acknowledging and working towards a way to better these conditions will go a long way towards some players who feel they've been abandoned.

[Rozalinde]

Thank you very much for the update, PlusDust and Frelorn. We appreciate your efforts in this area, and thank you for listening. Hugs and hobbit pies for you!

[Cartman76]

Thanks
More thanks since I need more characters

[chrisli]

That is wonderful! Thank you!

[osser]

This is good news. Thank you for listening to us. VIP account saved.

[Nathrien_Estelenlaer]

It's about time! You have no idea how much this eases my frustrations

Certainly a step in the right direction.

[GREENFROST]

I don’t play music, but I do enjoy listening to those who do (play me some black Sabbath I’ll tip in gold if it’s good)

I was thinking of a solution, I don’t know if it can even be done but here goes:

Grant “Legit band leaders” officially recognized” and such an Item that doesn’t have a cool down

1) That when used on a troll/griefer’s character it ports the said troll/griefer to the bree jail for 30min (or a determined time) for being disorderly at a public event (kind of like how the guardian acorn ability works) if they got time to park their horse at a stage for xx amount of min…..why not jail….LOL

2) Grant the “Legit band leader” an item that turns the troll/griefer into a very small field mouse for 30min (or a determined time)

3) At designated stages within a certain radius of the stage you get auto dismounted
These might be too harsh…..yall decide!

You would think people got the “decency” about them to “respect” peoples interests that they like to do in game

Cheers, my friends
Greenfrost

[Keli]

Thank you for the acknowledgement of the problem and the possible action to combat it.

One thing I must question, however, is that you seem to be implying that bad behaviour is acceptable outside a "stage" area. Surely, disruptive behaviour should be discouraged everywhere?

[Linawillow]

Colour me among those mightily unimpressed by this policy. By limiting it to actions near just a couple of areas in the game, you are in danger of starting open season on any events held outside them. GM's can now point to this policy and say "not their problem", while any troublemakers know that they will most likely be safe if they stay away from the Prancing Pony stage and the Methel Stage. That sounds like a recipe for disaster to me.

[Bulbous]

I think this is wonderful news. A lot of people were greatly upset by the unchecked actions of what seems like a very small number of individuals.

[SpiritusLOTRO]

This is a welcomed clarification on your harassment policy. Thank you very much.

My constructive solution to ease the burden on your end is to make those put on ignore invisible -- or substantially subdued, like a shadowed circle on the ground. It seems the most logical step after the already in place audial mute and text masking.

[osser]

Thats a good point Lina. Griefing is griefing stage or not. The layout of the bree stage is bad as it is. Most folks play outside the pony on the rock or by the stables. I'm glad you guys plan on taking actions but forcing all the bands on the server to 2? stages seems off to me.

[DanteIL]

First, as an interested bystander (i.e., not musician) I am glad to see Turbine come out with a clear policy about this.

Second, although I would not be as quick to catastrophize this policy as this:

Colour me among those mightily unimpressed by this policy. By limiting it to actions near just a couple of areas in the game, you are in danger of starting open season on any events held outside them. GM's can now point to this policy and say "not their problem", while any troublemakers know that they will most likely be safe if they stay away from the Prancing Pony stage and the Methel Stage. That sounds like a recipe for disaster to me.

BUT this still raises a good point. In order for this compromise to work, at the very least, Turbine would need to consider adding more designated performance (stage) areas, it seems.

[Rozalinde]

Colour me among those mightily unimpressed by this policy. By limiting it to actions near just a couple of areas in the game, you are in danger of starting open season on any events held outside them. GM's can now point to this policy and say "not their problem", while any troublemakers know that they will most likely be safe if they stay away from the Prancing Pony stage and the Methel Stage. That sounds like a recipe for disaster to me.

I suppose there's two ways to read the following section of the policy:

If a GM does witness blatant and intentional disruptive behavior other than being mounted in the performance areas we will take action against that disruptive behavior as well. We want to take a common sense approach of fostering these events and removing anyone displaying harassing or “troll” behavior.

"blatant and intentional disruptive behavior other than being mounted in the performance areas"

or

"blatant and intentional disruptive behavior [in the performance areas] other than being mounted"

I interpreted it as the former... but maybe I was mistaken?

We want to take a common sense approach of fostering these events and removing anyone displaying harassing or “troll” behavior.

I applaud using a "common sense" approach. Obviously, the GMs aren't going to scold someone for going to a questgiver if (for some strange reason I can't fathom) a band plants itself on top of a questgiver. That would just be silly. But when blatant, repeated, and disruptive griefing happens outside of a performance area (but not intermingled with normal gameplay), I hope the GMs will use "common sense".

[EnelyaMorna]

Thank you for listening! This is great news!

(I'd have taken it to mean the first interpretation there as well, Rozalinde)

~ Elimraen, Landroval

[ShireDweller]

Colour me among those mightily unimpressed by this policy. By limiting it to actions near just a couple of areas in the game, you are in danger of starting open season on any events held outside them. GM's can now point to this policy and say "not their problem", while any troublemakers know that they will most likely be safe if they stay away from the Prancing Pony stage and the Methel Stage. That sounds like a recipe for disaster to me.

You've been given a major show of support, and still you say it's not enough.

You've been given suggestions on how to hold events in kinhalls to manage visitor lists, and that's not acceptable either.

It's hard to support the music community when you give the impression that you think everything has to stop and revolve around you and yours, and everyone else has to act exactly the way you expect, anywhere you happen to stop and decide to push a few keys to be "a musical event!"

Non-musicans get griefed in game too, all over the game world. You're coming off as a "Give me exactly what I demand or I'll stamp my feet and hold my breath until I turn blue" brat.

[Warmutkan]

Glad to see Turbine speaking to this and working to repair some of the damage done. Hopefully the "common sense approach" also includes consideration of how to deal with griefers in non-stage areas.

I don’t play music, but I do enjoy listening to those who do (play me some black Sabbath I’ll tip in gold if it’s good)

I was thinking of a solution, I don’t know if it can even be done but here goes:

Grant “Legit band leaders” officially recognized” and such an Item that doesn’t have a cool down

1) That when used on a troll/griefer’s character it ports the said troll/griefer to the bree jail for 30min (or a determined time) for being disorderly at a public event (kind of like how the guardian acorn ability works) if they got time to park their horse at a stage for xx amount of min…..why not jail….LOL

2) Grant the “Legit band leader” an item that turns the troll/griefer into a very small field mouse for 30min (or a determined time)

3) At designated stages within a certain radius of the stage you get auto dismounted
These might be too harsh…..yall decide!

You would think people got the “decency” about them to “respect” peoples interests that they like to do in game

Cheers, my friends
Greenfrost

GMs are GMs, players are players. The two should not mix. If some of us don't trust GMs to mod appropriately, why on earth would we trust "legit" players? I wouldn't want anyone to have the power to lock up my gameplay just because they decided I was griefing them. "LOL" it's funny because someone you don't like gets the suffer. This is the entire reason you don't like griefers - they're doing things to make you (someone they don't like) suffer. A sensible and well-enforced GM policy can address griefers without handing out any unnecessary and easily abused powers. The end goal is to remove the griefing - stick with that, work with the GMs, and hopefully things will get better. No need for the field mice.

[Fainegdal]

This is wonderful news, thank you!

[Katiepie]

Thank you! This is a wonderful response.

I have one question to ask the official LOTRO staff.

If we are performing a set on stage as a "band" and we are harassed by someone intentionally placing his avatar on our band and/or equipping an instrument, is it recommended that we reposition the band or remain in place?

[Econn71]

LOTRO has a rich history of fun, interesting and exciting community-run events. We think this is fantastic and would like to better support these activities! To that end, we are making a concerted effort to look into ways for us to support and further encourage participation.

One of the things that we’ve seen detract from these events is the negative behavior and actions of other players. Specifically, we know that players moving throughout the performance area on mounts can be particularly frustrating and distracting. To combat this problem we’re looking into what options are available to help combat this behavior in designated performance (stage) areas. We’ll also be removing players who are mounted from the stage area manually in the meantime. Typically, we’ll take this action upon receiving a help request. We will also take this action if we happen to see it occurring while monitoring events. If this behavior is repeated after we issue a warning we will be taking further action including banning the trolling players. Please keep in mind that this policy is for events that use designated stages. We cannot provide support if the events are held in areas with quest givers, standard gameplay, etc.

If a GM does witness blatant and intentional disruptive behavior other than being mounted in the performance areas we will take action against that disruptive behavior as well. We want to take a common sense approach of fostering these events and removing anyone displaying harassing or “troll” behavior.

If you have any ideas to make events more accommodating for your groups, please post and discuss in this thread. We are always happy to run feedback by the product development team and review our own support and moderation policies to create a better experience for all participants.

Thanks!
+Dust

Firstly Arron Campbell lied about housing so how can we trust you on this? Secondly from what I have seen in the past mounts were not the main issue and that's something in every game that people deal with. The main griefing that most people complain about is the idiotic trinkets that the devs have added to the events like saffrons lipstick. You guys put these in the game and now you want to punish people for using them. Simple solution is to remove the questionable items from the game.

That's the problem with you guys at Turbine you fix the little stuff and forget the things that actually matter like housing and content. Housing could have saved you guys from all the layoffs if you would have listened to the community years ago instead of having your heads up your behinds. I will not tell you how much money I have spent in SWTOR, EQII, Rift , and other games with housing and certain furnature in their stores. You guys just go about doing things the wrong way.

[Linawillow]

You've been given a major show of support

Not really, My fear is that I have been stripped of the support I have been previously been given outside of staged areas. Of course, it could be that this support has been given because I play on a server with the RP policy enabled. Whether this new policy trumps that or not, remains to be seen in practice.

It's hard to support the music community...

While I do enjoy in-game music, most of the events I run are not concerts. Some are performances, some are lore nights, some are public video shoots, some are quest-related adventures, etc. etc. So, no, I don't presume to speak for the music community. And most of my events can't really be run at the stages.

In general, griefing has not been a major problem (due to the GM's being on the ball on the few times we have run into problems), but sometimes we run into those who go through the whole range of tricks, from following and jumping up and down on other players, /emote-spamming, doing /pushups on anyone lying down, etc. Actions which, seemingly, is now also part of the stage policy enforcement, but not necessarily elsewhere.

You're coming off as a "Give me exactly what I demand or I'll stamp my feet and hold my breath until I turn blue" brat.

Because I am somewhat critical of a new policy which could end up limiting the service I previously had? Naw, can't really say I agree *smiles*. It's been a while since someone called me a brat, though - I almost feel young again!

[Sullo]

Thank you!

[FionahFeet]

Thank you Frelorn for providing that link in regards to the griefing issue. I think this is a step in the right direction. It is most appreciated. I had a feeling you guys were reading this thread with keen interest. And thank you, PlusDust. Never saw you around before, but nice to know you've responded. *smiles*

Fionah Fairskinne, Leader and Founder
FEET kinship and Toe Jam music band

~ A day without sunshine is like, you know, night. ~ Steve Martin

[noradaddy]

If the Methel Stage is going to be set aside for events like this, you probably want to change the quest "The Last of the Fireworks" to set them off some where else. Otherwise people doing normal questing will be interrupting any events on the stage.