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  1. #1

    Question Bit confused by missions

    Now that I can actually login and get to the missions hub I'm a bit confused.

    What is the point of missions?
    They have all the flaws of goblin bounties in Wells, quick for champs but tedious for cappies but with none of the benefits - only 5 and they give embers and VXP.
    Also given you have to go to the hub, pick one of the 8 available missions, I'm can't quite see how it's supposed to work as duo type thing for levels 20-130, plus you'll be longer asking lff than running the missions.
    Plus am I the only one who gets frustrated trying to guess where the damned chest, the "reward" which is 1-3 coins, and dwarf scout/return to base npc will turn up?

    I didn't mind paying £15 for this beforehand but now I can't help but feel all the complaints were right, missions are neither interesting or offer any reward so won't be run. Thanks to new virtue system everything should offer weekly VXP as a minimum.
    Evernight - Walred (Champ), Walmur (RK), Walbert-2 (Cappy)

  2. #2
    Also, when I started WotTP, somewhere in the mission introduction quest was a statement that said something like "Missions give a scaling reward when run at max level". Did I mis-read? All I've gotten yet on a lvl 130 char are some coins from the reward chest, and you can only trade cosmetic stuff and housing items for those.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Gorikon View Post
    Also, when I started WotTP, somewhere in the mission introduction quest was a statement that said something like "Missions give a scaling reward when run at max level". Did I mis-read? All I've gotten yet on a lvl 130 char are some coins from the reward chest, and you can only trade cosmetic stuff and housing items for those.
    I agree on both points, I thought I saw such a text yet only reward is 1-3 coins
    Evernight - Walred (Champ), Walmur (RK), Walbert-2 (Cappy)

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Once_of_Bree View Post
    I agree on both points, I thought I saw such a text yet only reward is 1-3 coins
    I haven't purchased the expansion yet but, it's a little disappointing about the embers. How is a pve player going to earn them besides Wells and MM. IF that is true then why purchase the expansion right now? Are there ways of getting better gear at least? What are the benefits?

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gorikon View Post
    Also, when I started WotTP, somewhere in the mission introduction quest was a statement that said something like "Missions give a scaling reward when run at max level". Did I mis-read? All I've gotten yet on a lvl 130 char are some coins from the reward chest, and you can only trade cosmetic stuff and housing items for those.
    From the Update 28 release notes:

    The Gabil'akkâ stable-masters will take you to the Annâk-khurfu (War Room) in Elderslade, where you can begin your experience with Missions. Missions are a great way to earn leveling loot and more, and are also an excellent way for players to level regardless of what level they are in the game. Check them out!
    I've only run them at 130, so I don't know anything about lower level rewards, but the instances don't appear to give any "loot" (i.e. gear, weapons, LI items, etc...). The expansion page also advertises mission "loot". I'd like to hope I'm wrong, and the lower level missions do reward some kind of "levelling loot", but if not then the above statement is literally a complete lie, and the expansion is being falsely advertised on this point.

    What exactly is this "levelling loot" supposed to be?

  6. #6
    Also what are the additional sources of Embers of Enchantment now available? As mentioned in the release notes

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morellian View Post
    From the Update 28 release notes:



    I've only run them at 130, so I don't know anything about lower level rewards, but the instances don't appear to give any "loot" (i.e. gear, weapons, LI items, etc...). The expansion page also advertises mission "loot". I'd like to hope I'm wrong, and the lower level missions do reward some kind of "levelling loot", but if not then the above statement is literally a complete lie, and the expansion is being falsely advertised on this point.

    What exactly is this "levelling loot" supposed to be?
    I just took a level 65 alt through missions. There is no chest at the end of the instance like there is at level cap, so all you get is two coins per mission for hand in. There is no gear for barter for lower levels at the vendor either.

    Levelling loot - is non existent.

    The XP is okay, but no more than you get from an on level quest hand in, and regardless, without loot as we level, these are useless.
    Sometimes, no matter how hard you look, there is no best light.


  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Once_of_Bree View Post
    What is the point of missions?
    I know this one! The answer is that there are actually several reasons for these, but some of them might not be immediately obvious if you've been playing the game for a long time. If you've been playing forever, you've probably seen all the regions we've added to Middle-earth, both in the "present day" and through jaunts to the past. You've seen the War of the Ring, you saw inside Moria, you engaged in Mounted Combat on the plains of Rohan and fought Epic Battles at Helm's Deep (and loved it all, I bet ). When Durin declares that he's going to march on Gundabad and seize it from the Orcs, chances are pretty high if you've stuck with us this long that you'd be right there with him.

    But what about everyone else? We hear from players a lot that 'if only new people could try LOTRO, they'd love it!' (and I tend to agree), but it's daunting. Starting any game thirteen years in is going to be daunting, and there's just *so much* LOTRO by now that anyone starting has a pretty uphill climb. I think that uphill climb is worthwhile (especially if you love all things LotR), but it's a loooooong climb. If everyone is talking about the dwarves fighting to take Gundabad, and you're still back in the Lone-lands killing spiders, it's hard to feel like you're a part of things.

    Missions are one way to address this a little. Since they scale to your level (instead of scaling you up to *their* level, like we've tried occasionally), you can participate in the assault on Gundabad even if you haven't been along for the ride since the beginning and don't have a cap-level character. You can get into these easily, and they let you see some of the high-level sights and locations you wouldn't otherwise get to safely see. You get to feel like you're helping the dwarves, and that you're a part of it, even though you're technically a dozen years behind in the storyline. It's *my* hope that once you've seen some of those sights, you'll be even more interested to play through the story and see everything.

    But for those of you who've been here all along, I get that seeing these sights isn't the real draw -- you've seen the Glimmerdeep, for instance, and you know all about Skarhald, and these are places in which you've already adventured. So why do Missions?

    Because I'm a fluffy story guy, my answer is that Durin's got a war to fight, and he needs adventurers to take on these tasks to secure ground and prepare his forces to retake the sacred Mountain-home. But aside from that, they're popcorn. It's dial-up-some-gameplay, instant action. Most of the Missions are a simple monster camp, or a short dungeon, a quick bit of gameplay you can drop into and knock out in a few minutes. If you string them together every day, it's a quick dash of MMO endorphins, and with eighty total Missions there's a lot more content all at once than we tend to drop in a single new system. It's not expected that you just play Missions. The idea is that you participate in the war effort for a bit, and then there should be plenty of other activities to do.

    I'm interested in a different aspect of Missions, though. I like the potential of creating narrative-based Missions in different areas of Middle-earth, playable by everybody and scaling to every player's level. Now that we have the tech underlying Missions, I'm excited to use it in other places.

    MoL

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by MadeOfLions View Post
    I know this one!
    I'm sure you're all extremely busy developing the game, but I miss having this sort of context introduced in developer diaries when new game systems are added.

    Developer diaries have the bonus of being translated into all of the game's supported languages, and make excellent promotional material for new players.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by MadeOfLions View Post
    I know this one! The answer is that there are actually several reasons for these, but some of them might not be immediately obvious if you've been playing the game for a long time. If you've been playing forever, you've probably seen all the regions we've added to Middle-earth, both in the "present day" and through jaunts to the past. You've seen the War of the Ring, you saw inside Moria, you engaged in Mounted Combat on the plains of Rohan and fought Epic Battles at Helm's Deep (and loved it all, I bet ). When Durin declares that he's going to march on Gundabad and seize it from the Orcs, chances are pretty high if you've stuck with us this long that you'd be right there with him.

    But what about everyone else? We hear from players a lot that 'if only new people could try LOTRO, they'd love it!' (and I tend to agree), but it's daunting. Starting any game thirteen years in is going to be daunting, and there's just *so much* LOTRO by now that anyone starting has a pretty uphill climb. I think that uphill climb is worthwhile (especially if you love all things LotR), but it's a loooooong climb. If everyone is talking about the dwarves fighting to take Gundabad, and you're still back in the Lone-lands killing spiders, it's hard to feel like you're a part of things.

    Missions are one way to address this a little. Since they scale to your level (instead of scaling you up to *their* level, like we've tried occasionally), you can participate in the assault on Gundabad even if you haven't been along for the ride since the beginning and don't have a cap-level character. You can get into these easily, and they let you see some of the high-level sights and locations you wouldn't otherwise get to safely see. You get to feel like you're helping the dwarves, and that you're a part of it, even though you're technically a dozen years behind in the storyline. It's *my* hope that once you've seen some of those sights, you'll be even more interested to play through the story and see everything.

    But for those of you who've been here all along, I get that seeing these sights isn't the real draw -- you've seen the Glimmerdeep, for instance, and you know all about Skarhald, and these are places in which you've already adventured. So why do Missions?

    Because I'm a fluffy story guy, my answer is that Durin's got a war to fight, and he needs adventurers to take on these tasks to secure ground and prepare his forces to retake the sacred Mountain-home. But aside from that, they're popcorn. It's dial-up-some-gameplay, instant action. Most of the Missions are a simple monster camp, or a short dungeon, a quick bit of gameplay you can drop into and knock out in a few minutes. If you string them together every day, it's a quick dash of MMO endorphins, and with eighty total Missions there's a lot more content all at once than we tend to drop in a single new system. It's not expected that you just play Missions. The idea is that you participate in the war effort for a bit, and then there should be plenty of other activities to do.

    I'm interested in a different aspect of Missions, though. I like the potential of creating narrative-based Missions in different areas of Middle-earth, playable by everybody and scaling to every player's level. Now that we have the tech underlying Missions, I'm excited to use it in other places.

    MoL
    THANK YOU!

    Thank you for your years of amazing work on this wonderful game.

    THANK YOU FOR COMMUNICATING WITH US.

    I'm so sorry for what the execs have done.
    Landroval - The Council of the Secret Fire Friendly, Casual, Mature, and always seeking more!
    Message moondog548 here, on Steam, Twitch, and Discord as moondog548#6830
    Moondog on Landroval, Isilroa on Anor, Reckless on Bombadil

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadeOfLions View Post
    I know this one! The answer is that there are actually several reasons for these, but some of them might not be immediately obvious if you've been playing the game for a long time. If you've been playing forever, you've probably seen all the regions we've added to Middle-earth, both in the "present day" and through jaunts to the past. You've seen the War of the Ring, you saw inside Moria, you engaged in Mounted Combat on the plains of Rohan and fought Epic Battles at Helm's Deep (and loved it all, I bet ). When Durin declares that he's going to march on Gundabad and seize it from the Orcs, chances are pretty high if you've stuck with us this long that you'd be right there with him.

    But what about everyone else? We hear from players a lot that 'if only new people could try LOTRO, they'd love it!' (and I tend to agree), but it's daunting. Starting any game thirteen years in is going to be daunting, and there's just *so much* LOTRO by now that anyone starting has a pretty uphill climb. I think that uphill climb is worthwhile (especially if you love all things LotR), but it's a loooooong climb. If everyone is talking about the dwarves fighting to take Gundabad, and you're still back in the Lone-lands killing spiders, it's hard to feel like you're a part of things.

    Missions are one way to address this a little. Since they scale to your level (instead of scaling you up to *their* level, like we've tried occasionally), you can participate in the assault on Gundabad even if you haven't been along for the ride since the beginning and don't have a cap-level character. You can get into these easily, and they let you see some of the high-level sights and locations you wouldn't otherwise get to safely see. You get to feel like you're helping the dwarves, and that you're a part of it, even though you're technically a dozen years behind in the storyline. It's *my* hope that once you've seen some of those sights, you'll be even more interested to play through the story and see everything.

    But for those of you who've been here all along, I get that seeing these sights isn't the real draw -- you've seen the Glimmerdeep, for instance, and you know all about Skarhald, and these are places in which you've already adventured. So why do Missions?

    Because I'm a fluffy story guy, my answer is that Durin's got a war to fight, and he needs adventurers to take on these tasks to secure ground and prepare his forces to retake the sacred Mountain-home. But aside from that, they're popcorn. It's dial-up-some-gameplay, instant action. Most of the Missions are a simple monster camp, or a short dungeon, a quick bit of gameplay you can drop into and knock out in a few minutes. If you string them together every day, it's a quick dash of MMO endorphins, and with eighty total Missions there's a lot more content all at once than we tend to drop in a single new system. It's not expected that you just play Missions. The idea is that you participate in the war effort for a bit, and then there should be plenty of other activities to do.

    I'm interested in a different aspect of Missions, though. I like the potential of creating narrative-based Missions in different areas of Middle-earth, playable by everybody and scaling to every player's level. Now that we have the tech underlying Missions, I'm excited to use it in other places.

    MoL
    Thanks for posting, it's nice that you continue to come out and actually respond to players, and such an incredible shame that you're always alone in doing so.

    That said, I'm sure you realise that that's not what the OP was asking. It's not so much "what's the point of missions" from a story perspective, but "what's the point of missions" from a gameplay perspective. Sure, Durin needs people to scout out battlegrounds, secure important areas, etc etc, but he needs people to cook his dinner and do his laundry too. Yeah, we've done mundane quests like that before, but it wasn't marketed as a shiny new rewarding gameplay system. If you're putting something into the game for players to do, that means it needs to be worth doing. It needs to be enjoyable to do, and the player needs to have something of value to show for it at the end. Otherwise nobody will bother doing it, which would be a shame since you clearly have a lot of hopes for the "mission" system.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by MadeOfLions View Post
    I know this one!...

    First, thank you for your response.

    So, these are mainly intended as either intros for newer players or "fluff" for more experienced players?

    This would have been very good to know BEFORE they were sold to customers.

  13. #13
    Bonus glass of decent port for MoL for the explanation, especially the idea that there are 80 different ones and yes, I've been here since the beginning and have, on occasion, started all over on a new toon just to enjoy the world form a different perspective.

    Any reward for doing all 80?

    I can see that on a toon with low dps they will get old quite fast, and my main is a Loremaster so I may well be in that group. I duoed with a kinnie for a mission and the consensus was "faster but just as bland and no greater reward". May well be different for folks who haven't as much game time, but from the PoV of a couple who've seen most of it the reason to do them was a bit unconvincing.
    Mithithil Ithryndi

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Morellian View Post
    If you're putting something into the game for players to do, that means it needs to be worth doing. It needs to be enjoyable to do, and the player needs to have something of value to show for it at the end. Otherwise nobody will bother doing it,

    Exactly this.

    Once again, a lot of work goes into a "new" system, without actually taking the time to make it worthwhile for most players to want to participate.

    So frustrating...again.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by MadeOfLions View Post
    I know this one! The answer is that there are actually several reasons for these, but some of them might not be immediately obvious if you've been playing the game for a long time. If you've been playing forever, you've probably seen all the regions we've added to Middle-earth, both in the "present day" and through jaunts to the past. You've seen the War of the Ring, you saw inside Moria, you engaged in Mounted Combat on the plains of Rohan and fought Epic Battles at Helm's Deep (and loved it all, I bet ). When Durin declares that he's going to march on Gundabad and seize it from the Orcs, chances are pretty high if you've stuck with us this long that you'd be right there with him.

    But what about everyone else? We hear from players a lot that 'if only new people could try LOTRO, they'd love it!' (and I tend to agree), but it's daunting. Starting any game thirteen years in is going to be daunting, and there's just *so much* LOTRO by now that anyone starting has a pretty uphill climb. I think that uphill climb is worthwhile (especially if you love all things LotR), but it's a loooooong climb. If everyone is talking about the dwarves fighting to take Gundabad, and you're still back in the Lone-lands killing spiders, it's hard to feel like you're a part of things.

    Missions are one way to address this a little. Since they scale to your level (instead of scaling you up to *their* level, like we've tried occasionally), you can participate in the assault on Gundabad even if you haven't been along for the ride since the beginning and don't have a cap-level character. You can get into these easily, and they let you see some of the high-level sights and locations you wouldn't otherwise get to safely see. You get to feel like you're helping the dwarves, and that you're a part of it, even though you're technically a dozen years behind in the storyline. It's *my* hope that once you've seen some of those sights, you'll be even more interested to play through the story and see everything.

    But for those of you who've been here all along, I get that seeing these sights isn't the real draw -- you've seen the Glimmerdeep, for instance, and you know all about Skarhald, and these are places in which you've already adventured. So why do Missions?

    Because I'm a fluffy story guy, my answer is that Durin's got a war to fight, and he needs adventurers to take on these tasks to secure ground and prepare his forces to retake the sacred Mountain-home. But aside from that, they're popcorn. It's dial-up-some-gameplay, instant action. Most of the Missions are a simple monster camp, or a short dungeon, a quick bit of gameplay you can drop into and knock out in a few minutes. If you string them together every day, it's a quick dash of MMO endorphins, and with eighty total Missions there's a lot more content all at once than we tend to drop in a single new system. It's not expected that you just play Missions. The idea is that you participate in the war effort for a bit, and then there should be plenty of other activities to do.

    I'm interested in a different aspect of Missions, though. I like the potential of creating narrative-based Missions in different areas of Middle-earth, playable by everybody and scaling to every player's level. Now that we have the tech underlying Missions, I'm excited to use it in other places.

    MoL
    Thanks for your explanation. I understand as a creative, you don't necessarily have to get involved in the financial aspect of things and probably better that way. But when in explaining what made this a mini expansion, Cordovan said it was these missions that did it.

    Now, who here can understand how an expansion pack is for an endgame player; its an additional to level cap (er, not this time because, um, lets just say reasons) the content supplants the previous endgame in terms of content and itemization, and the story builds off the previous spot we stopped at because of the last cap.

    But now you're saying the endgamers are funding starter level activities?? That's why this is a mini expansion? That's some serious BS man. That should be funded internally, like any starter area revamp work that has been in the past.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by MadeOfLions View Post
    ... you engaged in Mounted Combat on the plains of Rohan
    ...
    MoL
    Thank you for the response it is much appreciated and I agree with another poster that this would have made a great dev diary entry.

    I now appreciate the reason for missions, thanks.

    However two things leap out at me
    • If there is a mission that involves mounted combat, I will be very upset , that is an abomination that should never ever return to the game.
    • I like story fluff as much as the next person (I never tire of watching Aragorn find the sapling of the white tree) but it is naïve (which I don't think you are) to think players wouldn't expect some reward for doing these missions as well as the fluffy fun. Add in the controversial cost for a mini-expansion and you have a recipe for a PR disaster.
    Evernight - Walred (Champ), Walmur (RK), Walbert-2 (Cappy)

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadeOfLions View Post
    We hear from players a lot that 'if only new people could try LOTRO, they'd love it!' (and I tend to agree), but it's daunting. Starting any game thirteen years in is going to be daunting, and there's just *so much* LOTRO by now that anyone starting has a pretty uphill climb. I think that uphill climb is worthwhile (especially if you love all things LotR), but it's a loooooong climb. If everyone is talking about the dwarves fighting to take Gundabad, and you're still back in the Lone-lands killing spiders, it's hard to feel like you're a part of things.

    Missions are one way to address this a little. Since they scale to your level (instead of scaling you up to *their* level, like we've tried occasionally), you can participate in the assault on Gundabad even if you haven't been along for the ride since the beginning and don't have a cap-level character. You can get into these easily, and they let you see some of the high-level sights and locations you wouldn't otherwise get to safely see.
    One enormous flaw in this to my eyes is that to be able to do missions you have to purchase a 130 zone (even if you're vip). What person just starting the game is going to do that? Ok they may have "plans" to change this in future but we've all heard SSG's "plans" before that never happen. There's no mention of this in MOL's post anyway.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadeOfLions View Post
    I know this one! The answer is that there are actually several reasons for these, but some of them might not be immediately obvious if you've been playing the game for a long time. If you've been playing forever, you've probably seen all the regions we've added to Middle-earth, both in the "present day" and through jaunts to the past. You've seen the War of the Ring, you saw inside Moria, you engaged in Mounted Combat on the plains of Rohan and fought Epic Battles at Helm's Deep (and loved it all, I bet ). When Durin declares that he's going to march on Gundabad and seize it from the Orcs, chances are pretty high if you've stuck with us this long that you'd be right there with him.

    But what about everyone else? We hear from players a lot that 'if only new people could try LOTRO, they'd love it!' (and I tend to agree), but it's daunting. Starting any game thirteen years in is going to be daunting, and there's just *so much* LOTRO by now that anyone starting has a pretty uphill climb. I think that uphill climb is worthwhile (especially if you love all things LotR), but it's a loooooong climb. If everyone is talking about the dwarves fighting to take Gundabad, and you're still back in the Lone-lands killing spiders, it's hard to feel like you're a part of things.

    Missions are one way to address this a little. Since they scale to your level (instead of scaling you up to *their* level, like we've tried occasionally), you can participate in the assault on Gundabad even if you haven't been along for the ride since the beginning and don't have a cap-level character. You can get into these easily, and they let you see some of the high-level sights and locations you wouldn't otherwise get to safely see. You get to feel like you're helping the dwarves, and that you're a part of it, even though you're technically a dozen years behind in the storyline. It's *my* hope that once you've seen some of those sights, you'll be even more interested to play through the story and see everything.

    But for those of you who've been here all along, I get that seeing these sights isn't the real draw -- you've seen the Glimmerdeep, for instance, and you know all about Skarhald, and these are places in which you've already adventured. So why do Missions?

    Because I'm a fluffy story guy, my answer is that Durin's got a war to fight, and he needs adventurers to take on these tasks to secure ground and prepare his forces to retake the sacred Mountain-home. But aside from that, they're popcorn. It's dial-up-some-gameplay, instant action. Most of the Missions are a simple monster camp, or a short dungeon, a quick bit of gameplay you can drop into and knock out in a few minutes. If you string them together every day, it's a quick dash of MMO endorphins, and with eighty total Missions there's a lot more content all at once than we tend to drop in a single new system. It's not expected that you just play Missions. The idea is that you participate in the war effort for a bit, and then there should be plenty of other activities to do.

    I'm interested in a different aspect of Missions, though. I like the potential of creating narrative-based Missions in different areas of Middle-earth, playable by everybody and scaling to every player's level. Now that we have the tech underlying Missions, I'm excited to use it in other places.

    MoL
    Thanks for weighing in MoL. From that perspective, they work, mostly, and that part of it is obvious to most of us. But to be able to jump in and out of missions and the War, one has got to be level cap. I don't fancy the chances of a level 50, or even a level 100 player, trying to participate in the War of the Three Peaks. So that only works for level cap players - who, as you've already said, have seen all these places before. Completionists will likely do all 80 - one time, to get the deed, but that will be it. Non completionists will stop long before that, because there is no reward involved. So technically, the new shiny missions thing, isn't really for level cap players, it's for new players if you look at it from a story baseline only. I mean, I would never re-buy Great River, I already have it, and I've seen it more than 20 times. But we are now in a position where we have re-bought glimpses of regions we already have with these missions. Glimmerdeep for example. I don't need the flashback, if I want to see it again, I'll go into the instance, where I can earn something for doing so.

    Then there are the new players. They can only do a small fraction of this mini expansion. The rest they can't do until they level to cap - and they will have to buy all of the real experiences of all those glimpses that they have already paid for along the way. As far as I know, this wasn't added as a footnote on the sales page (but it should have been). But in my experience of the game (myself and others that play), players tend to not buy content until they reach the level for it. So it would have been very unlikely a new player would have bought War of the Three Peaks if they weren't at, or close to cap already. These missions, if repeated too many times, may just put them off the idea of visiting the actual areas when they are high enough level to do it, because they've just paid full price for an expansion that is only a third open to them until they level up.

    But the most important question is . . . . where is this levelling loot? There isn't any. I took a level 65 character through the 8 missions today, and the only gain is some XP and some coins for cosmetics (and there is no missions chest at the end of each one, so only half of the coins that a level cap player gets). It has been described on the patch notes as a good way of levelling, but without levelling loot - that will not work because a player will run out of steam as the higher level missions outweigh their gear.
    Last edited by Arnenna; Oct 21 2020 at 01:21 PM.
    Sometimes, no matter how hard you look, there is no best light.


  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morellian View Post
    If you're putting something into the game for players to do, that means it needs to be worth doing. It needs to be enjoyable to do, and the player needs to have something of value to show for it at the end. Otherwise nobody will bother doing it, which would be a shame since you clearly have a lot of hopes for the "mission" system.
    I agree, this is the logic that most gamers have! I don't need or want fluff, I want new areas with new story lines. It's not just about killing orcs, I can do that in any number of instances at the drop of a hat. It is advancement towards a goal that will improve the character - not more fluff!
    "Never argue with a fool, it's difficult to tell the difference"

  20. #20
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    20
    This is a great topic for me, especially as it sounds from MoL's post that the missions are aimed at players like myself. Before release I saw the missions as a different way to level my characters. I have 4 on the go just now, one of which is just out the other side of Moria and the others are just approaching it. I had hoped that missions were going to give me another, efficient way to level and give good rewards while I was doing it.

    I've now found out that there's practically no rewards from missions, so why would I do this instead of a skirmish? To me at least, a skirmish is fun, varied and lets me build a nice stack of marks and medallions to buy all sorts of things from the camps. If missions aren't on a par to this, I struggle to see the point and it sounds like I'm one of the target markets for them :-(

  21. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Menarthat View Post
    This is a great topic for me, especially as it sounds from MoL's post that the missions are aimed at players like myself...
    I've now found out that there's practically no rewards from missions, so why would I do this instead of a skirmish? To me at least, a skirmish is fun, varied and lets me build a nice stack of marks and medallions to buy all sorts of things from the camps. If missions aren't on a par to this, I struggle to see the point and it sounds like I'm one of the target markets for them :-(

    Agreed. And it boggles my mind that this wasn't thought through further by the Devs before being introduced.

  22. #22
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    3,689
    Quote Originally Posted by MadeOfLions View Post
    I know this one! The answer is that there are actually several reasons for these, but some of them might not be immediately obvious if you've been playing the game for a long time. If you've been playing forever, you've probably seen all the regions we've added to Middle-earth, both in the "present day" and through jaunts to the past. You've seen the War of the Ring, you saw inside Moria, you engaged in Mounted Combat on the plains of Rohan and fought Epic Battles at Helm's Deep (and loved it all, I bet ). When Durin declares that he's going to march on Gundabad and seize it from the Orcs, chances are pretty high if you've stuck with us this long that you'd be right there with him.

    But what about everyone else? We hear from players a lot that 'if only new people could try LOTRO, they'd love it!' (and I tend to agree), but it's daunting. Starting any game thirteen years in is going to be daunting, and there's just *so much* LOTRO by now that anyone starting has a pretty uphill climb. I think that uphill climb is worthwhile (especially if you love all things LotR), but it's a loooooong climb. If everyone is talking about the dwarves fighting to take Gundabad, and you're still back in the Lone-lands killing spiders, it's hard to feel like you're a part of things.

    Missions are one way to address this a little. Since they scale to your level (instead of scaling you up to *their* level, like we've tried occasionally), you can participate in the assault on Gundabad even if you haven't been along for the ride since the beginning and don't have a cap-level character. You can get into these easily, and they let you see some of the high-level sights and locations you wouldn't otherwise get to safely see. You get to feel like you're helping the dwarves, and that you're a part of it, even though you're technically a dozen years behind in the storyline. It's *my* hope that once you've seen some of those sights, you'll be even more interested to play through the story and see everything.

    But for those of you who've been here all along, I get that seeing these sights isn't the real draw -- you've seen the Glimmerdeep, for instance, and you know all about Skarhald, and these are places in which you've already adventured. So why do Missions?

    Because I'm a fluffy story guy, my answer is that Durin's got a war to fight, and he needs adventurers to take on these tasks to secure ground and prepare his forces to retake the sacred Mountain-home. But aside from that, they're popcorn. It's dial-up-some-gameplay, instant action. Most of the Missions are a simple monster camp, or a short dungeon, a quick bit of gameplay you can drop into and knock out in a few minutes. If you string them together every day, it's a quick dash of MMO endorphins, and with eighty total Missions there's a lot more content all at once than we tend to drop in a single new system. It's not expected that you just play Missions. The idea is that you participate in the war effort for a bit, and then there should be plenty of other activities to do.

    I'm interested in a different aspect of Missions, though. I like the potential of creating narrative-based Missions in different areas of Middle-earth, playable by everybody and scaling to every player's level. Now that we have the tech underlying Missions, I'm excited to use it in other places.

    MoL
    Thank you. There's a lot of anger and frustration on the forums now and part of it is lack of communication. Just before reading this comment I posted on another thread about how much I agree the mission system was a worthless effort. After reading your comment, I understand why it was built and take back my previous negative comments.

    I think sometimes there is a giant disconnect between people like you who truly love this game, the world, the story, the lore, etc. And the folks who make business decisions at SSG. Ordinarily the business layer should not have such an impact on the player base, but for all the reasons that show up over and over across multiple threads, these business decisions have created a really negative and hostile environment on the forums lately. Hope you know we all appreciate what you do, and I think most of us separate the #### that drives us insane from the stuff we love about this game, which is the product of some really amazing game development over the years.
    Servers: Treebeard | Arkenstone | Landroval
    Classes: Hunter | Champion | Loremaster | Warden | Beorning | Guardian | Captain | Burglar
    Creeps: Warleader | Reaver

  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Strider5548 View Post
    I think sometimes there is a giant disconnect between people like you who truly love this game, the world, the story, the lore, etc. And the folks who make business decisions at SSG. Ordinarily the business layer should not have such an impact on the player base, but for all the reasons that show up over and over across multiple threads, these business decisions have created a really negative and hostile environment on the forums lately. Hope you know we all appreciate what you do, and I think most of us separate the #### that drives us insane from the stuff we love about this game, which is the product of some really amazing game development over the years.
    I'm seeing this sentiment coming up again in the growing refrain of the community. Well said again.

    Sad but true.
    Landroval - The Council of the Secret Fire Friendly, Casual, Mature, and always seeking more!
    Message moondog548 here, on Steam, Twitch, and Discord as moondog548#6830
    Moondog on Landroval, Isilroa on Anor, Reckless on Bombadil

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Dec 2019
    Posts
    2,372
    New player given a pay wall to content that has zero advancement rewards. check

    An install that has peeps needing a week of forum trawling to get enough advice to load the game and play. check

    Peak time game loading that gives them "endless" unmoving load bar and a naked char on retry. check

    Gold cap of 2 gold to negotiate from a time many had to borrow the cost of a 3 gold mount at level 35 to a time a hobbit present can have you reach the cap with the first relog. check

    Virtue earnings missing the huge bribe made on implementation. check

    Countless systems in disarray beyond fixing, check

    Priorities!

    As a glutton for punishment and to test a theory I loaded the install on to my old hard drive and ran the 32-bit client from there today. It was stunning to be reminded how we make upgrades in tech in order to play but the game itself seems to degrade with each release. I literally eat half my dinner waiting for a char to load (on a full load bar) then watch the Quit button come up.

    Enticing people with hype then disappointing them in their first moments and there after is why we don't have 60 servers and millions of players. It's fricking LotR not Warcruft.

  25. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by MadeOfLions View Post
    ....

    I'm interested in a different aspect of Missions, though. I like the potential of creating narrative-based Missions in different areas of Middle-earth, playable by everybody and scaling to every player's level. Now that we have the tech underlying Missions, I'm excited to use it in other places.

    MoL
    Thanks for chiming in. I echo others' laments for the end of developer's diaries, a place where one could find your background info like this in one spot instead of maybe eventually stumbling over it in one forum post years later during a random search.

    I hope you're right about attracting newer players.

    Personally, I never liked pole-vaulting over the relatively linear story. I was ticked off when the Anniversary Festival first began, where I signed up for Chapter 1 (thinking that it would reflect the first year or 2 of the game) and it quickly took me to North Ithilien - - where none of my characters had ever been. Was like a spoiler for me. I like the journey as much as the destination and I want to reach locations organically, as one may say. I stopped doing the Anniversary and never went back (although at this point I probably could, with no spoilers).

    Same with Helm's Deep at level 10. Though I suppose I understand that if you're on an alt.

    But I get that some people like collections of independent, unrelated and isolated skirmishes or missions or epic battles. And ya'll may be right about newish folks wanting to jump into missions. I hope you are.
    Last edited by Occum; Oct 21 2020 at 10:17 PM.

 

 
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