Thread: Game System: Tavern Revelries

Note: This post is the original idea made in August 2007. An updated, more current 2.0 version was posted in April of 2012.

Introduction

Revelries are group-based non-combat actions executed within specific locations that can generate sustaining enhancements and attributes for fellowships, raids, or chance groups of adventurers. Group-gathering and interaction in non-combat is the basis of the Revelry system; the more a gathering can muster merriment and activity, the more powerful the results can be.

Like Maneuvers, different combinations of Revelry actions will result in different enhancements of varying duration and potency. The combination of these actions, in the form of pairs, flushes, or straits, grants bonuses for using Fellowship Maneuvers when adventuring. In addition to these conjunction buffs, Revelries can produce various secondary effects ranging from long-term resists, attribute enhancements, non-combat heals, morale increases, power increases, or a combination of all nine possible actions.


Merriment

Revelries can occur at Taverns (or "Gathering" Halls), Player Houses or Halls, and Campfires. Each of these locations has a Merriment Level. This level is increased as players enter the location and engage in leisure activities with others such as eating, drinking, smoking, dancing, playing music, and others. Minstrels have Skills which can rapidly increase the Level, while Scholars can create items such as books and scrolls of uplifting tales that form the same function.

Merriment Skills (rough draft)

Tier 1 Skill: Light Ballad of Fellowship
Tier 2 Skill: Uplifting Ballad of Fellowship
Tier 3 Skill: Inspiring Ballad of Fellowship
Tier 4 Skill: Triumphant Ballad of Fellowship

Crafted Merriment Items

Drink converted into Revelry Item
Pipeweed converted into Revelry Item
Book converted into Revelry Item

Revelry Action Wheel

As the Merriment Level peaks, a Revelry commences. When the Revelry is started each participant within the area will see a color wheel appear on their screen asking them to choose one of nine contributing actions.

After a few seconds (whether a participant choose a color or not), the revelry is resolved. Selecting an action will grant that player a small buff on its own. But when queued with other actions, this buff can increase substantially, depending on the length and combinations of them.

Like Maneuvers, once you select your Revelry (color), your action will appear in the next empty slot in the contribution queue for others to see. The final order of the Revelry actions is dependent on the group type. Fellowships receive first consideration in the que, followed by Raid groups, and finally un-grouped bystanders.

What this means is that your fellowship can lock in your own complex combo for just your group without outsiders ruining the order. If you are in a Raid group, your contributed action becomes an extension of the group. Any actions contributed by bystanders are added to the the queue behind any Fellowship groupings, and are shuffled automatically to form pairs and flushes wherever possible.

The more complex the combination the stronger the effect and higher the level. The more participants engaged in the Revelry, the longer the effects tend to last.

When the Revelry Action wheel appears, players should select one of the nine colored icons, each of which represents a different Social Activity:

Revelry Actions and their Effects

Feasting (Green)

Feasting starts off as a simple bonus to all Fellowship Maneuver heals (Eagle’s Cry) and a temporary increase to maximum morale. At the 2nd level of power it adds a temporary increase in Vitality. At the 3rd tier of power it adds Disease resistance.

Players must use crafted food for this action.

Drinking (Yellow)

Drinking allows a temporary bonus to Guile Maneuver skills (Spider’s Guile). At higher tiers it provides a non-combat morale regeneration as well as increased resistance to Fear.

Players must use crafted drinks for this action.

Music (Blue)

Music provides a noticeable bonus to Fellowship Maneuver power regeneration (Stallion’s Spirit). At higher tiers, Music grants an increase to Fate, as well as resistance to Shadow and Magic damage.

Players must have a musical instrument for this action and/or perhaps use a crafted music consumable of some type.

Smoking (Red)

Smoking does not grant much in the way of adventuring buffs, but it does provide a relief from Dread over time in the form of a % resistance of defeat effects. Smoking also grants special smoke effects that enhance the pipeweed attributes. The side-effect to smoking buffs is that it increases your chance for induction interruption of other skills during combat.

Players must use crafted pipeweed for this action.

Dancing (Purple)

Dancing produces a useful Maneuver bonus for all power regeneration (Stallion’s Spirit). At higher tiers it also grants a temporary increase in Agility as well as stronger resistance to Poison and Wounds.

Players must use a crafted consumable of some point to trigger the dance action for the Revelry.

Greeting (Silver)

Greetings, in the form of emotes and social interactions, grants a bonus to Guile Maneuver skills (Spider’s Guile). At higher levels it provides non-combat power regeneration bonuses.

Tales (Aqua)

Storytelling grants bonuses to all Maneuver morale regeneration (Eagle’s Cry). At continued levels, it provides temporary increases to Will, Light Damage, as well as stronger resistance to Magic attacks.

Players must use crafted story manuscripts for this action.

Revelries that contain combination of Tales will cause images of dramatic deeds to appear, to immitate images being called to mind while a narrator is speaking (e.g. the Fall of Gil-galad).

Gifts (Brown)

Gift-giving grants a Maneuver bonus to power regeneration skills (Stallion’s Spirit), as well as increasing resistance to Fear. At higher levels, upon successful Revelries involving Gifts, the Tavern Keeper will present all participants with a small gift in the form of collectables, wearables, Dale toys, or other small items that are bound upon acquire. Some of these are temporary and break or fail after use.

Tussle (Gray)

Tussles or brawling can break out in any tavern when drinking is heavy. And yet, some encounters are more sportsman-like. Tussles can provide bonuses to Maneuver damage skills (Ent’s Strength). At higher levels, it also grants temporary increases in Might. Should a Tussle break out, the players receive their buffs, a few bounders will then round up the offenders and kick them out of the Tavern and told to sober up.

Tavern Revelry Opportunities

At least two players are required to initiate a Revelry. Players must target another player when performing actions to increase Merriment and when participating in the Revelry. Small groupings such as these will yield modest results, so the more members of a fellowship, raid, or bystanders at a location, the more powerful the successful Revelry will be.

Taverns are not the only locations where Revelries may occur. Players may also throw gatherings at houses and kinship halls to increase their buffs in anticipation of adventuring or just for fun. The Gifts and Tussle actions are not available at these locations, however.

Image of House Revelry Wheel

Sometimes hearth and home are just too distant. But weary travelers can take heart in the wilderness when gathering round a strong fire to share meals and tales of great deeds. Players need only gather round a placed campfire and increase the Merriment Level around it, triggering a Revelry. As with Housing, the Gifts and Tussle actions are unavailable, as well as the Dancing action.

Image of Campfire Revelry Wheel

Example Revelries

The numbers below are merely for example and do not fully represent a final suggestion.

Tavern Revelries can be fun because even if you are in a Fellowship and planning out combinations, you do not always know who else is going to be present and what actions they are going to contribute as bystanders or as a participating fellowship.

Revelries can also unlock unique Traits and Skills. For example, the more times a successful Dancing-centric Revelry occurs, a new dance is temporarily learned by the participants. Like accumulating a Deed, the more this Revelry dance is unlocked the more that Deed is progressed until it becomes a permanent skill to the player.

Example Screenshots

Feasting Revelry
Drinking Revelry
Music Revelry
Smoking Revelry
Greetings Revelry
Tussle Revelry
3-player Revelry
4-player Revelry

Discussion Index

Some Revelry questions answered
More Revelry answers
Vastin's post
Response to not wanting combat buffs with Revelries
Alternative non-combat buffs for Revelries by Rikilii
Support for Rikilii's buff alternatives post
Taverns and Lodgings Location Map
Chuck Norris approves of the idea
More Revelry answers
Additional Revelry explanation
Revelry Buffs not active in Moors
Revelries tied to SWG-like Fatigue system by RavenNightNS
Description of Gift-Giving Revelry
More explanation on how Revelries work
Sneak Peek at Homestead Taverns
Answers on how Solo Bystanders work with Revelries
Revelry Hotspot Location Map
Comments on Fatigue system
Description of Gathering Feature for Revelry Items (News/Tales/Dance/Music)
Description of News/Chatting Revelry
Description of Tales Revelry


Other Concepts in the Tavern Series
Tavern Reputation
Tavern Larders

Hayoo, that has got to be the best suggestion post I have ever had the pleasure of reading in my near-decade of MMO gaming. Wonderfully organized and thought out!

/takeoffhat
/bow
/signed!

I am thoroughly impressed. Very creative. This would certainly help make inns and taverns more of a player hub.

Thank you very much for your kind words.

I am truly impressed and I think you spent a lot of time on this I love it!!

and i think it would help out with the whole RP a bit more..
/signed! All the way!

Heh, I must be tired I thought this was about tavern rivalries...

Really cool idea, though some aspects of it seem difficult to implement: who is given priority if there are two groups in a tavern, etc.

Balancing would be a trick as well, do we make merriment easy to get up? Can this only be done in a reasonable amount of time if there is more than a FG? how good are the buffs?

Most importantly how hard is it going to be to come up with good combos (eg. ale and song) for 9 different things.

I love this idea, it gives leisure a place in the main action, which is really cool, but the devil is in the details.

Oh my goodness.

I'm so pleased, and impressed, with this post. This (or something like) would be so wonderful! And because it ties in with combat/buffs, it'd be sure to see a lot of use, and could creatively tie RP in with game mechanics.

This is amazing its obvious you took a good amount of time to prepare this good job
/signed

That is prolly one of the most well thought out suggestions i've ever seen in an MMO forum. That, and i love it. THAT would bring a true LOTR feel to the game, as you can recall many scenes of that type of activity from the Tolkien books.

One suggestion i have is that it focus a little more on hope and/or resistance to the new hope debuff effects. I love the current format, but just in general it seems that the frivolity of these kinds of actions would be more of a spiritual boost. I see the red branch does this in some manner, but i would make it an overall effect of using the system and allow red to focus on more of the adventuring buffs like you have the others doing. Just my 2cp on the idea

Well done.

That is an absolute genius post. I am not only hitting this to keep it bumped, but also giving a full /sign /sign and more /sign to the concept.

Nice Work!

(Where is the HR dept for Turbine? Get them on the phone!)

Originally Posted by Strayious

(Where is the HR dept for Turbine? Get them on the phone!)

seriously. You should attach a resume to your post, OP

Would love to see something like this implemented in the game. It would be wondrous.

/signed
/signed

What a terrific idea
It would be cool if one of the devs could comment on this. Be interested to know if this, or something similar would/could be considered in a future update.
This would be a big hit with the majority of the playerbase i would imagine.

Its been said already, but deserves another: That is awesome! Please devs take note! What a great unique (to me at least, does any other game do this?) idea!

/signed

Originally Posted by speaksoftly

Heh, I must be tired I thought this was about tavern rivalries...

Really cool idea, though some aspects of it seem difficult to implement: who is given priority if there are two groups in a tavern, etc.

Thanks. It works from the vantage point of the individual player. The group you are in gets priority as far as action combos, from which you get your adventuring buffs. The second group nearby is treated as a single player to you, as in that fellowship does a successful Revelry, of which you receive a extension to the duration of your enhancements. Then the system factors in the number actions of un-grouped bystanders. You do not receive anything from their buffs except the duration modifier for how many are participating.

For example: You and your friend accomplish "A Welcome Meal". So you get a 1% buff to Morale Fellowship Maneuvers and a "+" to your max morale for the next 18 minutes. The Fellowship near you completes Ale and Song. But because your group is not allied with theirs in a Raid Group, the system treats them (to you) as if they were a group of bystanders). Aside from their help in raising the Merriment Level of the Tavern, what you get from that group is a bonus to your enhancement duration, depending on how many players are in their group.

Balancing would be a trick as well, do we make merriment easy to get up? Can this only be done in a reasonable amount of time if there is more than a FG? how good are the buffs?

I agree it would be tricky. We wouldn't want the merriment level to be increased instantly just because we have a large gathering, but we also don't want to invalidate smaller fellowships. So I think it would be a balance between steady progress towards a Revelry but that even small groups can use Minstrel skills (longish cooldown timer) or Scholar items (not so long timer) to speed things along. Even two people should be able to trigger a Revelry without too much effort or cost. The potency of the buffs themselves would need some "real-world" testing on their usefulness. I figured it was better to be a bit conservative in my estimates rather than risk going overboard at the start.

Most importantly how hard is it going to be to come up with good combos (eg. ale and song) for 9 different things.

Oh yes. It's already a headache. Enough combos can be made given enough time, but good ones will take more.

I love this idea, it gives leisure a place in the main action, which is really cool, but the devil is in the details.

Yeah, that's why I'm only going so far with it. Only enough to get the idea across and have some fun with it.

Originally Posted by Aegorian

One suggestion i have is that it focus a little more on hope and/or resistance to the new hope debuff effects.

Sure, I can still add hope or dread resistance to it. I was just worried about replacing the other hope skills and items in the game, considering how central they are to the mechanics and parts of the economy. Perhaps hope buffs can appear with certain combinations as rewards for gathering a coordinated group.

I love the current format, but just in general it seems that the frivolity of these kinds of actions would be more of a spiritual boost. I see the red branch does this in some manner, but i would make it an overall effect of using the system and allow red to focus on more of the adventuring buffs like you have the others doing. Just my 2cp on the idea

Well done.

Thank you, thank you. Yes, the current format is geared more towards buffing Fellowship Maneuver skills, a kind of Pep Rally before going out and slaying the beast. To aid the solo players I had to make sure to add other buffs that would be useful in a single play session, like the resists and the attribute buffs. I also did not want risk replacing (in the eyes of the players) the current skills and items. It's definitely an exercise in balancing. Perhaps as the concept gets revised and tightened, this balance can be achieved (at least in theory).

I love this idea!

Two thumbs way way up!

I like it! I really hope that you get some Dev feedback on this. A+ and half a cookie ( i got hungry).

Great idea hayoo! I see how you went to alot of trouble not to replace the already ingame items and skills. I think the animations for this would be great to see! Plus this would give farmers and cooks a reason to sell beer and pipeweed. Like always great job.

Somebody get Hayoo a job at Turbine!

That was an absolute pleasure to read. I really hope something like this makes it into the game, pure genius.

/signed

Very, very nice! It'd give people something extra to do at taverns. A cookie for you, my friend!

This looks perfect to me. The perfect way to get players into taverns and to give us all some REASON to get together and have fun.

This should be fast-tracked to live!

Best suggestion I've ever seen for any game in my 27 years of computer gaming. The devs would have to be crazy not to implement this idea ASAP.

I hope Turbine gives this idea some thought. It will do wonders for LOTRO. It's an extremly well thought out idea, plus it gives a reason to go to Taverns (Inns). Maybe also some racial traits to increase some of them even further. Each time they use a certain buff that's their "Specialty" it increase the effectivness of the buff, and can even make the group version of the buff even more effective. These would be the kind of revilries each race trait would effect:

Dwarves: Drinking and Tussling
Hobbits: Feasting and smoking
Elves: Music and dancing
Men: Greetings and Tales

This would expand it even more. Keep up the good work!

/signed

Now everybody’s died
So until our tears are dried
We’ll drink and drink and drink and drink,
and then we’ll drink some more
We’ll dance and sing and fight
until the early morning light
Then we’ll throw up, pass out, wake up, and then go drinking once again

--Da Vinci's Notebook, Another Irish Drinking Song


That proposal is to the exact standard required of a game's design document. Well done, well thought-out.

I'd ask what the devs think, but I'm pretty sure they're doing some "live roleplay testing" of this system to see how it works out. Might take a few iterations and test cycles to nail this one down...

Simply brilliant!

This would be a perfect compliment to player housing.

Turbine, hire this man! I command you!

Obey. Obey... OBEY!

Wow. Thank you, everyone.

In addition to my other addition, maybe we can get a special bonus at special events (parties, etc.). For example, Turbine could make it so that every month, there's a party at the Party Tree. When you're at the Party Tree during the party, the merriment icon's backround will be light blue instead of green. This will be called, "Enhanced Merriment". When it's at this state, a few things will happen. First, you will gain Merriment at a faster rate. Second, Something different will happen when your Enhanced Merriment bar is entirly full. The Merriment icon will start to glow light blue. The Merriment wheel will as do the same, and the icons for each buff will be enhanced looking. When you're at this state, all of the buffs will be enhanced greatly. In addition, they will last for 12-24 hours (Turbine will decide on the time). It makes sense that you get the most merriment at parties/special events. I think this will be a great addition to the Merriment system, and will bring the LOTRO community for one big great party! This will apply to not only parties at the Party Tree, but everywhere in Middle-Earth (except orc parties, they're different). Again, I hope Merriemnt's added to the game, it's VERY well thought out.

I dont know anything about programming or game development so i have no idea how difficult this type of system would be to impliment. It would be great to hear from a dev on this idea. I relize they cant reply to all the suggestions put forward but this one imo deserves a little dev feedback. I noticed that the new cloak suggestion was replied to. That was great as it explained why they couldnt add those types of cloaks, shame but at least we now know. Anyway wonderfull job Hayoo

Brilliant idea. I hope someone from Turbine sees this.

Oh man. This is so brilliant.

We already know that things can be done with other players in the relative area due to those "forced" emotes that champs and captains and others can do... we already know that fellowships can pull manuveurs... who is to say that this could not happen? It would take some creativity on the coder's end... but MAN. This is SO awesome.

I think this is a great idea, Hayoo, and it's brilliantly illustrated. I especially like your choices of key words for the system - Revelry, Merriment, tussle. They fit the spirit of the game world pefectly.

I agree with speaksoftly that making all the wheels and gears mesh in game would be the tricky part. Moreso because you are suggesting that the Revelries grant buffs that apply to the "serious" aspect of the game - fighting mobs. This makes balancing it a *lot* more critical - a lot harder for Turbine. It's also something I'm not sure about in theory, since it makes revelries a serious mechanic, one forcused on the main play mechanic of "beating" the game, disguised as an play/RP mechanic.

This is not to say that doing it this way is not the best choice since it insures that a larger part of the playerbase enjoys and uses the system. But an alternative would be if the Revelries provided social/RP benefits rather than serious ones. For example, a dance revelry resulting in a special series of synconous dance steps for the Fellowship, or a tussle revelry giving the participants a couple of special emotes of "hand to hand combat" moves for a minute of so - like some wirework spin in mid-air for example.

Allowing non-Fellowship/Raid players in the vicinity of the group to join in the revelries seems to me to be the trickiest part in terms of implementation. Even if Turbine could develop a mechanic for non-fellowship members that would sort out which of 2 or 3 Fellowships doing a revelry in the same location at about the same time they were part of, there is still the problem of players who are in the middle of something else and don't want to be involved. Those just passing through and on the way out, or those in the middle of another interaction - a trade, re-arranging their traits with the bard, and so forth. My feeling is that the bast way for non-members to "participate" is to act as members of the audience and enjoy the show. This would especially true if the revelries resulted in special emotes, dance moves and the like. Not as wide reaching, but probably more achievable.

Originally Posted by Taste_Tester

I think this is a great idea, Hayoo, and it's brilliantly illustrated. I especially like your choices of key words for the system - Revelry, Merriment, tussle. They fit the spirit of the game world pefectly.

Thank you.

I agree with speaksoftly that making all the wheels and gears mesh in game would be the tricky part. Moreso because you are suggesting that the Revelries grant buffs that apply to the "serious" aspect of the game - fighting mobs. This makes balancing it a *lot* more critical - a lot harder for Turbine. It's also something I'm not sure about in theory, since it makes revelries a serious mechanic, one forcused on the main play mechanic of "beating" the game, disguised as an play/RP mechanic.

No disguises. All serious. It is meant to be part of the larger game of adventuring, not a pastime or roleplaying side-game. Countless times in Tolkien's tales there is the gathering of the heroes before the send-off. This is meant to mirror that. But in the interest of not competing with the hard-won skills and items we already have, I would like these Maneuver buffs to be small even though they can last a while. Such as a 0.5% buff to Maneuver Heals over 20min. These already exist as Racial traits you earn, but Revelries are only temporary and require activation in certain locations.

This is not to say that doing it this way is not the best choice since it insures that a larger part of the playerbase enjoys and uses the system. But an alternative would be if the Revelries provided social/RP benefits rather than serious ones. For example, a dance revelry resulting in a special series of synconous dance steps for the Fellowship, or a tussle revelry giving the participants a couple of special emotes of "hand to hand combat" moves for a minute of so - like some wirework spin in mid-air for example.

What you suggest is already part of this system, but is not the central reason for revelries. The more dance-centric revelries you unlock are put towards a Dance "Deed" of sorts. Once you reach the required number of unlocks, you get the dance as a skill. The other actions also have these Deed-ish bonuses.

Allowing non-Fellowship/Raid players in the vicinity of the group to join in the revelries seems to me to be the trickiest part in terms of implementation.

Other Fellowships/Raids are not counted toward your Fellowship's revelries, only the number of participants involved in the Tavern. So your group can largely ignore everyone else, but you still get a slight bonus for being in the proximity of others while reveling at a Tavern.

Even if Turbine could develop a mechanic for non-fellowship members that would sort out which of 2 or 3 Fellowships doing a revelry in the same location at about the same time they were part of, there is still the problem of players who are in the middle of something else and don't want to be involved. Those just passing through and on the way out, or those in the middle of another interaction - a trade, re-arranging their traits with the bard, and so forth.

No one who does not want to be involved in a revelry has to partake of it. They can disable the merriment meter so it never shows up for them. It's kind of like the Assist icon for Maneuvers. If you never click on it, you aren't part of the Maneuver. So it is not a problem.

My feeling is that the bast way for non-members to "participate" is to act as members of the audience and enjoy the show. This would especially true if the revelries resulted in special emotes, dance moves and the like. Not as wide reaching, but probably more achievable.

Oh, they can do that too if they like. Recall how at times everyone in the Auction Hall will suddenly give a cheer for no apparent reason. Bystanders will view the same thing as a Revelry is accomplished.

Some bystanders may actually wish to activate their Merriment meter and receive at least a small buff to one of their attributes or try to unlock a dance without being part of a fellowship. The system will take the actions of these non-grouped participating bystanders (remember to particpate you must have another player targeted and you must activate the merriment meter) and try to group them in two-of-a-kind and three-of-a-kind and so on. This allows solo players to gain maneuver buffs should they later join a fellowship, but a Fellowship will have way more control over complex combos to receive the more potent buffs. But in any case, the more people in the Tavern that participate in any Revelry nearby, the longer the buff for every participant lasts. Almost like a "lasting memory" of happier times that sustain you through your trials to come.

I see this system as a way to rev yourselves up. You run to the Tavern, join in a Revelry, then ride off to your adventure. When the Maneuver buffs fade, and you are deep in the wild and do not wish to waste time going back to a settlement, you can attempt a revelry with your fellowship around a campfire you have made....just like in the books. It is akin to everyone eating food and using Hope tokens right before a fight, except this makes it into a game with small buffs but which can last much longer.

Oh, and campfires and house revelries can be locked to the owner's fellowship or raid to avoid random yahoos running up to every campfire they see without invitation.

too funny, this IS a great idea and sooo well put together that when I was reading it I thought it was going in to the game in book 11 with player housing. What a awsome use for the taverns, and a perfect reason for players to gather and try to interact on a more social level. Good work

I like it, now if only we can get it implemented

I must admit that I like the idea, even if it didn't give (much, if any) in game bonuses.

/signed

Great idea Hayoo.

I like this idea alot would be great to see it go in with book 11

I like this idea, and would love to see something like this implemented.

Who is the developer who might be able to get this looked at seriously? Is there any way to get developers interested and moving on this?

Hayoo, it's a brilliant idea! I like many others here have been thoroughly impressed by how well-put together this concept is.

Nothing much else to add truthfully, but the idea of being able to gather about a Hunter-created campfire in the wastelands of Angmar and keep the gathering darkness at bay by song, tales, even a dance-step or two...

Ah, my RP-funnybone is twitching!

/signed

My two coppers... *plink*plink*