WHAT? This has to be a bug. I had read crafting was going to give you XP, but I never thought it would give me more then mobs or quests.
So I get 60XP for pounding on a piece of barrow iron ore, and only 30XP for a barrow wight? And to add insult to injury you expect me to pay not to get XP for crafting? Has some one lost their ever loven mind?
I've been waffling back and forth about lotro for a few weeks, think I'm done. Sort of regretting spending any money on it because I have just gotten to the areas I bought; 3 of my 5 remaining characters aren't out of the lone lands yet, one has barely started in the north downs and the other is in angmar.
I have to think about this, it's a game braker for me because I already advance in level faster then area.
Yeah, I agree. I can't believe you get xp for crafting now and even for collecting items. So many were complaining about leveling to fast and then this. In my opinion, it is just a way to make money. Force people to buy the item in the store to disable xp. No one needs to get xp doing any crafting except the craft xp to level that tier you are working on. Yeah this is a little ridiculous.
To provide the alternative view, I think it will be helpful for those (like me) who have alts and are bored with certain areas, and skirmishes, and all the other ways to gain exp. My hobbit yeoman burglar will be perfectly happy to craft her way from 58 to 60. My captain scholar/ weapon-smith can get to 70 doing nothing but making guild items. My wife has a number of alts and she likes crafting and gathering. So there are people out here who like this change and don't think it's some form of conspiracy to keep the game afloat by forcing people to spend money.
Yeah, the XP is absolutely nuts. For the moment I quit hoping it will get changed, and if not: unfortunate for Turbine then, my potential spending money goes to another MMO. I'm not going to play a game where you can't enjoy the journey because the devs push you to end-game where there's nothing to do (but even if there was something to do: you have quickly seen it all. I'm not fond of grinding the same instances over and over again. I want to properly go through all areas, the total of which offers a million things more than just end-game alone).
You won't see someone hating grinding more than I do, but this is the other end of the extreme. Lotro was already pushing it, and now it crossed the line. I can't believe some people called leveling in Lotro "grinding" before this update (see some topics where people are defending the XP gain, and it's inevitable someone will say Lotro was a grindfest before).
As people suggested on Bullroarer, it should've been simply like this: XP disabler would stay, AND a new item that also costs 495 TP that enables crafting XP: without that item, no crafting XP. This also would've made Turbine more money.
Yeah, the XP is absolutely nuts. For the moment I quit hoping it will get changed, and if not: unfortunate for Turbine then, my potential spending money goes to another MMO. I'm not going to play a game where you can't enjoy the journey because the devs push you to end-game where there's nothing to do (but even if there was something to do: you have quickly seen it all. I'm not fond of grinding the same instances over and over again. I want to properly go through all areas, the total of which offers a million things more than just end-game alone).
You won't see someone hating grinding more than I do, but this is the other end of the extreme. Lotro was already pushing it, and now it crossed the line. I can't believe some people called leveling in Lotro "grinding" before this update (see some topics where people are defending the XP gain, and it's inevitable someone will say Lotro was a grindfest before).
As people suggested on Bullroarer, it should've been simply like this: XP disabler would stay, AND a new item that also costs 495 TP that enables crafting XP: without that item, no crafting XP. This also would've made Turbine more money.
One thing I don't get in lotro. Why are people so obsessed how other players gain their level. If someone wants to go from 10 to 50 grinding crafting it certainly isn't going to stop me to level by questing and instances.
More then ridicules. It's underhanded. Like some one that mows your lawn applying extra fertilizer and watering it often so they can mow more often.
I read the write up on the disabler and it says nothing about crafting XP, just mobs and quests.
Basically this means my character {if I chose to do any crafting, even so much as working down lumber or ore} will forever be out leveling quests, areas, and deeds. I learned my lesson on that with my hunter, between 20th and 40th level he never had tasks because he had out leveled them before he got to them. Meaning he missed out on a lot of rep points.
Will this actually do anything aside from discouraging people from doing crafting?
This might be good for higher level characters that's advancement has slowed to a crawl, but it means lower level characters will be out leveling mob, quest, and areas long before they get to them. And Turbine wants to charge me to prevent that? That is just wrong.
Mortemdia this isn't about how other people gain their levels. This is how this has directly effected my game play. Personally I think they have it backward, you should have to buy something to get XP; other then for the craft, crafting.
I like a game that is a challenge, this isn't it. It's a cake walk with extra icing and waiters. I may not have been here long, but this game has deteriorated rapidly in that short amount of time. I like to earn what I get, even if I have to grind for it. Not have it handed to me with little to no effort.
I play all my alts. Each of them are working their way up through just like my main. I don't really play my alts any differently then my main.
I am glad I did my cooking yesterday. I already bought the xp disabler for the character I'm questing on now. Maybe I will refuse to cook until I get my 500 points next month to get the cook her disabler as well. Otherwise she would outlevel the task board for the reputation faction she is working on.
Has anyone done a skirmish with the disabler? Does it halt all kill xp? The bonus xp at the end?
Yes because leveling from 0-85 is way to quick and easy, crafting xp really spoils the game !! what a bunch of whining immature gamers you lot are, I wouldnt mind but 99% of you cant even play the game properly.
This really irritates me because I sometimes play with two friends, and we ONLY play those characters when we're together, except for one of us, who does crafting. Now he's probably going to pull way ahead in levels, unless he buys the disabler.
Few MMOs (at least, of the Western variety) want people staying at low levels for long in games of this age. Developers want people up near the newer and flashier content, where the larger body of consistently active players resides.
And those consistently active high level players frequently have a stable of crafting alts that exist solely to keep them as self-sufficient as they can. People aren't going to stop working on crafting, because there is value in having your own characters that can make the handful of high level items that are actually worth the effort.
Few MMOs (at least, of the Western variety) want people staying at low levels for long in games of this age. Developers want people up near the newer and flashier content, where the larger body of consistently active players resides.
And those consistently active high level players frequently have a stable of crafting alts that exist solely to keep them as self-sufficient as they can. People aren't going to stop working on crafting, because there is value in having your own characters that can make the handful of high level items that are actually worth the effort.
Did no one think of new players, or low levels when the came up with it?
I'm going to be absolutely shocked if even 10% of their customers get the "disabler", whether new, old, or in between. In my experience, relatively few MMO players are upset by "extra" XP (or a wide variety of ways to earn it), and many enjoy it a great deal.
The primary exceptions seem to be completionists and those who spend much of their time in duos with people who play differing amounts of time, and some of those seem to get very upset about not having complete control over their leveling rates.
Was their only thought to please people at the end game?
As I said, I think quite a few "new" people like having the journey to high levels reduced from hundreds of hours down to something a bit less daunting, and also to have more ways to level than just questing and killing.
I also think that the vast majority of new game content in an MMO is going to occur at the higher levels, so a great many players are going to want to get there in a reasonable amount of time.
In any case, they now offer a "disabler" which will allow a character to stall their advancement for 168 hours of /played time. For anyone who's not trying to disable advancement permanently, that's likely to be a one-time purchase for the life of the character. And for a VIP, the cost is basically one month's stipend.
No, they will sell you one and it doesn't block crafting XP. It's a pocket ornament you ware.
Sorry, but all this has done is discourage me from playing. I follow the path before me and am in no hurry to get to it's end. I already have to try not to out level areas, this just made that imposable. And I am not about to pay turbine to exclude me from others impatience.
I thought this game was on the line of too easy already. My character moving up rapidly with few challenges; other then not out leveling areas. This is a running dive to the other side of too easy.
There are far better ways this could have been implemented, as it stands, this is the worst way it could have been done.
No, they will sell you one and it doesn't block crafting XP.
Please define "crafting XP". Do you mean points gained through crafting that levels your crafting ability, or points gained through crafting that levels your character?
If you mean the former, then no the XP disabler does not block that. If you mean the latter, then you are incorrect as it does block that (assuming no changes from the most recent beta build). In the most recent beta build the XP Disabler blocked all "character level advancement XP".
Please define "crafting XP". Do you mean points gained through crafting that levels your crafting ability, or points gained through crafting that levels your character?
If you mean the former, then no the XP disabler does not block that. If you mean the latter, then you are incorrect as it does block that (assuming no changes from the most recent beta build). In the most recent beta build the XP Disabler blocked all "character level advancement XP".
Then I was basing that on misinformation.
None the less, this is a deal bracker. I don't have the TP to buy 5 disablers, and think it ludicrous to expect me to. The last thing I need from this game is more XP. My characters were moving up too fast before this.
Now, can anyone suggest a F2P MMO that is an actually challenge?
Because there is no challenge here, might as well give me XP for logging in, walking around, and playing music.
No, they will sell you one and it doesn't block crafting XP. It's a pocket ornament you ware.
Sorry, but all this has done is discourage me from playing. I follow the path before me and am in no hurry to get to it's end. I already have to try not to out level areas, this just made that imposable. And I am not about to pay turbine to exclude me from others impatience.
I thought this game was on the line of too easy already. My character moving up rapidly with few challenges; other then not out leveling areas. This is a running dive to the other side of too easy.
There are far better ways this could have been implemented, as it stands, this is the worst way it could have been done.
Rather than that overpriced pile of garbage called an XP blocker, I would much rather they sold a book in various flavours that permanently gave your character a -75% xp decrease [And -50 percent and -25 percent etc] And then maybe a restoration tome if you ever wanted to change it back to default. Consumables that have repeat sale value ~gasp~ Oh my god turbine, does your XP blocker have repeat sale potential on one character? Seriously devs, there are some REALLY good economic classes you can take that can help you learn how to make money much easier.
Oh and it wouldn't steal a precious inventory slot either.
"It's a CHARACTER, not a TOON. This is a Roleplaying game, not Spongebob Online."
Rather than that overpriced pile of garbage called an XP blocker, I would much rather they sold a book in various flavours that permanently gave your character a -75% xp decrease [And -50 percent and -25 percent etc] And then maybe a restoration tome if you ever wanted to change it back to default. Consumables that have repeat sale value ~gasp~ Oh my god turbine, does your XP blocker have repeat sale potential on one character? Seriously devs, there are some REALLY good economic classes you can take that can help you learn how to make money much easier.
Oh and it wouldn't steal a precious inventory slot either.
Turbine tried introducing the XP disabler into a recent Beta as a limited duration consumable, and histrionics ensued. The current implementation seems to be more palatable to people, save for some for whom the idea of paying anything to disable XP is anathema.
Apparently whatever Econ courses they took taught them that, "item that some people say they will buy" > "object that no one will buy". (To be clear, the item that some will buy is the current XP disabler).
Apparently whatever Econ courses they took taught them that, "item that some people say they will buy" > "object that no one will buy". (To be clear, the item that some will buy is the current XP disabler).
They would have had far better sales and less people leaving if it was a consumable that gave you XP while crafting.
I hope you feel the same when the game is shut down from everybody leaving and Turbine not making a profit.
"Everybody" left six months ago. Then when Rohan released without instances. Then recently because of open tapping. Then again for the hobby horse, or was it the Yule festival?
They would have had far better sales and less people leaving if it was a consumable that gave you XP while crafting.
Since you can just go kill things\do quests\skirmish for superior gains (not just XP, but also money, task items, resources for crafting, etc), this is unlikely.
I'm fine with the crafting and harvesting xp thing. It seems like a nice (additional) way to throw a bone to people who enjoy crafting and might not want to go through the same content again. It's charging for the xp disabler that I don't get. I can appreciate that maybe this sort of feature is harder to implement than it seems from the outside, that it may have taken a lot of work hours to get added, and that you're hoping to get a return on that investment. This is fine, but at the same time it needs to be considered from the perspective as a player.
You're asking us to pay money to handicap ourselves, that's really what it all amounts to. And it feels especially bad since you release it right when you also add a feature that will speed up leveling, increasing the "necessity" (as necessary as anything in this game can be, that is) of this sort of feature to the portion of the playerbase that would be interested in it in the first place. Normally this is a feature that I could see myself using, but there's no way I'm spending my TP on it (and I accept that might ring hollow coming from a lifetime member who's account has paid for itself years ago and is now getting a free ride).
I usually try to consider the point of view of the devs when it comes to things like these and I try to get others to do the same. But there are also some times where I think the dev perspective isn't and shouldn't be relevant to the players, and I think this is one of those times.
They would have had far better sales and less people leaving if it was a consumable that gave you XP while crafting.
You sure about that?
I seem to recall people in the crafting XP threads claiming that "nobody asked for crafting XP" and "lots of people want to slow down or stop XP".
I feel confident that I don't have to consult our local self-professed business expert before saying that it's smarter to create and sell the item that lots of people are asking for than it is to make one that nobody wants.
"Everybody" left six months ago. Then when Rohan released without instances. Then recently because of open tapping. Then again for the hobby horse, or was it the Yule festival?
There was a little boy who cried "Wolf!"......
Oh and you some how know for a fact all those people that said they were going to quit didn't? What about those people that aren't active on the forum and just quit with out a word?
Yes, there was a boy that cried wolf, and what happened to him? Right, he got eaten by a wolf.
I'm fine with the crafting and harvesting xp thing. It seems like a nice (additional) way to throw a bone to people who enjoy crafting and might not want to go through the same content again. It's charging for the xp disabler that I don't get. I can appreciate that maybe this sort of feature is harder to implement than it seems from the outside, that it may have taken a lot of work hours to get added, and that you're hoping to get a return on that investment. This is fine, but at the same time it needs to be considered from the perspective as a player.
Players have been asking for a way to reduce XP income for some time. As this is a novelty at best for most people, it becomes a decent fit for the Store. Deployment may have been different if this was a subscription based game, but it isn't; there's a reason almost all of the War-steed goodies are Store exclusive or gated behind Store encouragement.
That it comes out along with crafting XP gains is somewhat unfortunate timing, but the fact is our XP income is only going to go up over time, not down, so there isn't much difference if one change came in this update and another in U10 or later.
People have also been asking for some sort of additional reward for crafting for a long time as well, especially given that someone will create 1000 items they immediately vendor (at a loss) before they even start to get into the ballpark of items that are worth making.
This issue is just part of a much larger strategy by Turbine to boost 'leveling'. In the beginning when you paid cash for the box and then paid a monthly sub it needed to have much more content and take much longer. Now with F2P, it is to their advantage for people to level faster - it reduces the amount of content needed to satisfy the player, since most people have a desire to advance their character. For example, RoR takes maybe 60 days if you are a casual player and do not play everyday. The exp is scaled such now that even with 1million+ exp needed for the next level at 85 it is nothing. I mean you get 14k just going around a corner and talking to another NPC. The difference from when Moria launched to now with RoR is remarkable.
It's great for casual players who care about more than just combat, but it's a detriment to competitive types whom want a real challenge. I wouldn't pay for this feature at the store, however I won't pay to prevent it either.
I'm on my fifth and sixth toons running through the world and I have never, ever out leveled an area. I do the vast majority of the quests except fellowship ones cause there is usually no one around to do it with. I don't kill everything I see and I do turn in tasks. What are you outlevelers doing differently?
Fraid I'm on the this-is-great band wagon cause the sixth time through the game is dull, dull, dull. But I like all my alts and want to level them as fast as possible. They are also top level crafters who can really XP fast now.
Sorry this bothers you go-slow folks. I do think it would have been better to make the purchased item an item to get Xp off crafting. I suspect they thought people might have gotten it confused with the craft Xp items you can buy.
Players have been asking for a way to reduce XP income for some time. As this is a novelty at best for most people, it becomes a decent fit for the Store.
I feel the "novelty" aspect of it (or how many people would actually be interested in using such a feature in the first place) is a valid argument for not investing the resources in implementing it, I'm not so sure if it's a valid argument for charging for it though. Eventually there's a point where it becomes unreasonable to charge for some things. This line varies hugely for different people, but that point does exist. For example, graphical updates are made to the game all the time, updates that require time from paid employees. From the perspective of the people creating the content, would it be unreasonable to bundle some of these graphical updates together, release them as "Ultra+ mode" or something, and charge money for it? Is it really any different, from their point of view, from charging for unique looking steeds or clothes?
But it does feel massively different from our side. I don't think many people would be keen on being asked to pay for graphical options, even though it affects their experience about as much as (if not more than) cosmetic outfits. There are a lot of things in this game that required significant effort on the part of the people at Turbine to implement, but just because they were hard to do doesn't make it reasonable from the perspective of a player to be asked to pay for it. And I think halting your own XP gain is one of those things.
I see absolutely nothing wrong with it.. and frankly, im very worried about some folks.. this isnt a game made for *you* its for all of us.. and this change benefits, everybody.
I guess some folks just like to complain about things that are overly good for them.. i really cannot see how this chaged the OP's anything.. yesterday you wern't getting any extra xp from anything.. how exactly have you been shafted agian? seems pretty win/win from here.
and yes.. i have alts, and in the 12-20 stage too.. they'll get high level mats to level as i abhor most of the beginning stages (having to grind it again.. nothanks.. that's why they 12-20) i can worry about deeds and virtues when im all "pew pew bam dead.. next.." and now thanks to autoloot thats even faster (i dont need to stop.. at all lol) the last thing im feeling right now is... shafted...
i did the math my 54 champ is 1/4 the way thru the level if i wanted to finish the level with crafting i would need to craft 1750 low quality clanaird ingots or the equvilant
i don't know about you but i don't have that kinda resourses just for one level nobody does and thats for a 50s level imagine would be 10000 or more for levels in the 80's
I feel the "novelty" aspect of it (or how many people would actually be interested in using such a feature in the first place) is a valid argument for not investing the resources in implementing it, I'm not so sure if it's a valid argument for charging for it though.
I don't disagree. Still, adding stuff like this lets players feel like their feedback matters, even if ultimately the important decisions aren't negotiable. This being a F2P game, and this particular feature being at best a niche interest, the Store makes as much sense as anywhere else as a means of delivering it. Recoup some cost (or, more likely, help bleed off stored Points), and anyone who isn't interested can just ignore it.
Eventually there's a point where it becomes unreasonable to charge for some things. This line varies hugely for different people, but that point does exist. For example, graphical updates are made to the game all the time, updates that require time from paid employees. From the point of the people creating the content, would it be unreasonable to bundle some of these graphical updates together, release them as "Ultra+ mode" or something, and charge money for it? Is it really any different, from their point of view, from charging for unique looking steeds or clothes?
Graphics improvements, at least of the kind we see in any frequency, either come with new content expansions (which we pay for), or are, however cool they might look, investments in cultivating continued interest in particular population groups (Breevamp, arguably free but also not anything we asked for, and mostly targeted at new players).
If Turbine wanted to release an Ultra High Resolution Modern Client, with new models and animations and all, odds are fair it would be bought from the Store (probably wrapped as an "expansion"). If there is interest, there is a chance for profit, and a F2P game needs every vector of revenue it can get. This issue is exacerbated in LotRO as there is still a strong core of Lifetimers and subscribers who will probably never buy a significant number of Points, opting instead to save.
But it does feel massively different from our side. I don't think many people would be keen on being asked to pay for graphical options, even though it affects their experience about as much as (if not more than) cosmetic outfits. There are a lot of things in this game that required significant effort on the part of the people at Turbine to implement, but just because they were hard to do doesn't make it reasonable from the perspective of a player to be asked to pay for it. And I think halting your own XP gain is one of those things.
Lots of players object to the Store on principle, but there isn't much to be done about it save not spend money in it. A F2P model means that new stuff is probably going to incur a cost to players somewhere, no matter how minor or niche the addition is. Would it have been interesting if this was an account-toggle free and exclusive to VIPs? Maybe, but F2P means minimizing the number of people who aren't buying (Game) Points.
I'm starting to ramble; it must be almost quitting time
I think the issue here is that crafting gives XP and now festival quests give scaling XP (a level 83 toon gets over 8k per quest in Frostbluff). That in and of itself is surprising. What makes it kinda controversial even more so is that the XP Disabler was released on the same day.
Now it may be entirely coincidental, but it does seem kinda glaring that they added all new ways to get XP on the same exact day that they added in a way to disable XP.
Please note, I am not trying to take sides nor am I saying that Turbine did anything intentionally. I am just stating facts that when looked at as a whole may be worth questioning.
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