I've been playing on Brandywine for quite some time now. I have just a premium account (with 6 other family members and their premium accounts). This works well for us as we help each other gain the turbine points we need. Back in beta we had an excellent system to supply our kinships with everything our members would need or want. This required housing storage. I won't go into all the tedious details. You all will be able to imagine the storage required to be able to offer any item from the simple common flax fibers to the most precious of metals.
Now we finally have gathered the gold to engineer the spawning of a new homestead, move in and buy up 11 houses (4 of which would be kinship houses). This development plan ended before it got started. We find there is no new housing available for such a monumental plan. We now have nothing to offer potential kinship recruits other than what everyone else has; being friendly and helpful (and perhaps not even that. Sometimes I'm downright mean). Who, then, would not join another kinship that has at least one house? With nothing to build for a gaming community (trust me..this supply plan of mine won't work with just bank space) I have a new plan. Hit 'em where it hurts...
The time we would have used building up a syndicate of kinships that offers what no one else ever had will instead be used to gain turbine points for as many people as we can. I haven't worked out all the details yet such as who of us will grind deeds for entire teams on what days or even if this would be recieved well (the grind will be just as boring for the grindees as for the grinders). Thus the post; to learn how much support this would recieve before making the plan. The basic working of gaining these turbine points would function as how we already help ourselves. We each keep at least one character slot available to create junk characters. After getting these junkers out of the introduction we keep them for a time while another family member leads a team through some of the simple deeds. We easily gain ourselves over 200 points in a few hours then go back to playing normally. We do this often (what can I say, I'm a farmer at heart and my family follows my lead readily..because I get the results).
What, you may ask, would this have to do with getting our desire for more housing met? Give me something else to do, Turbine. Provide me the means to build, maintain and supply the most awsome kinship LotRO will ever see (...and I don't mean just something with a website, vent and scheduled raids and such. Heck, everyone does that).
To this point we've kept our techniques, tips and tricks to ourselves. There is, after, no game to play if Turbine is making no money. Beyond this point, however, for us..for me..there is no game to play. I want to build a kinship that offers what no one else ever has. I need storage accessable by others (we do need a break sometimes). I want to lead..to rule as the IRON LADY of commerce..to take over the world, PINKY!
That's it then. We've nothing to do but farm up some points. Who's in?
They need to steal EQ2's versatility as far as player housing goes. You can do anything you want, within reason. It's cartoony though. If I could manipulate Lotro's housing the way I did my x4 Hall of Fame house in EQ2, my god...it's would be fantastic stuff
i just dont think they realize the goldmine they are sitting on. I would so pay 20 dollars to have my player house look just like the prancing pony in bree. They dont even have to give us new houses. just re-skin areas in Lotro already and make them a house....good sweet baby panda.....the moneyz they would make.....
Interior of House
Get rid of the hook system, as this is outdated and I believe a carry over from Asheron’s Call.
In place of the hook system, we should have free form placement for items in all houses. There should be a limit to the number of items that can be displayed however such as the following:
Small House: 150 items
Deluxe House 300 items
Kinship House: 1000 items
When choosing a model for this, if anyone has experience with Star Wars Galaxies housing, it should more or less be modeled after that. I don’t believe that lag should be an issue, as (if I am not mistaken) all neighborhoods are instanced, as well as each house interior is instanced.
Yard
The yard should also have free form placement of items, though also with an item limit like that of the interior, though much less (we don’t want the yards to look like trash heaps of course!).
Limit yard items to roughly 20 items. Keep the current size restrictions (no Enormous yard items in small and deluxe homes).
Crafting Changes
With the change to free form placement, more housing items should be added to all levels of crafting for every profession, which will boost the in game economy, as well as give crafters something neat and unique to their professions that they can sell or share with friends.
Taxidermy Changes
Allow any item to be turned into a displayable housing item. As a Guardian I’ve come across some amazing weapon and armor art in game, and I’d love to be able to hang some swords and shields on the walls in my house.
Now to Turbine’s favorite part…where they can make money and pay for this development.
TP Paid Items:
House additions
Through paid purchase with TP, make the following items available to players:
Basements
Attics
Stable for front yard (Let us display the models for up to 3 horses that we currently own)
Crafting Station (Let’s limit this to 1 type, but as a Weaponsmith, makes sense that I’d have my own forge. Allow a lesser TP purchase for a standard forge for example, and a higher purchase for a Superior station. Make up the difference with TP if a standard forge was bought first, like an upgrade.)
I’m sure marketing wizards can come up with other items to sell as well.
Pets Allow for 1 interior pet and one yard pet. We already have property guards and the door-mouse items. Let me get a house cat that wanders my home (could be very simple pathing perhaps, not sure if possible with free form placement, though maybe some collision detection could be employed), and maybe a dog with a dog house that wanders the yard, or a property guard.
Conclusion:
A robust housing system will accomplish many things in this game. I for one like having a house and decorating it is a game in itself (until I’ve more or less run out of options because of placement on hooks) and am the type that will seek out people, mobs and instances if they can provide me with more neat things for my house.
New crafting recipes will help drive the economy in game, and allow for players to make gold. Many will spend more time raiding and doing instances or PvMP if there are unique rewards to be had, which in turn gives people something to do. More people in game doing things means a more vibrant community, which in turn keeps players interested. The more interest the more accounts will be active.
The more accounts active could result in more accounts going VIP and/or buying TP. Overall this translates into more money for Turbine, and the players get what they want too.
Last edited by Schreik; Aug 09 2012 at 01:20 PM.
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Ideas and opinions related to housing are welcome. My intention, however, is not to beat the dead horse. What I'm saying here is there's a few of us ready to put a good amount of time into gaining turbine points for as many as we can as the plan we had no longer requires our time. I will instead use that time to organize point farming, taking potential income away from turbine until our desired housing availability is met and we may continue building a syndicate of kinships with a supply system like no one has ever seen. I like to play a single character trapsing around the country side beating up monsters..sure. What is more enjoyable for me is to actually build something from which others benifit. If all there is left to do is run around killing enemies I may as well do that while I farm for you.
Farmees and farmers unite. Who want's some free points? We all want houses..for personal use or for greater plans. Let's get 'em!
i just dont think they realize the goldmine they are sitting on.
im of this mind too. i just do not get it.
"I am always serious; I am never serious." -Me
"I make the most outrageous and exaggerated statements of any man to ever live, has ever lived, or that will ever live." -Me
Just an FYI regarding you desire for a single neighborhood. When all houses of a given type are gone from every neighborhood of a given race 3 new neighborhoods spawn. For example, if you wihsed to be in a Bree homested ares, you would watch all neighborhoods in the bree homesteds. Typically all delux houses will become sold out in every heighborhood at whish point 3 new neighborhoods will all appear at the same time and you can then buy many houses of all types in one of those neighborhoods. My kinship on Landroval has done this several times and now holds most of the houses in 5 areas.
Perhaps the ball has been rolling for 4 years. In that time was the chatter merely "I wish", "They should" and "moan, complain, threaten to quit"? Has anyone before come up with a plan to really, truely roll the ball? Ever hear of the Green Machine? Your grandfather will know what that was. My idea is the same principle. What I'm proposing will work. Turbine will sit up and take notice. Join not only your voice to mine; bring also your action.
In the recent interview that talked about housing (the Q&A), Turbine showed clearly they will not do any work on housing in the near future. I am pretty sure that we will never have any housing improvements, unless the game was doing very well AND they suddenly decided to invest more money it the game. Right now Turbine is clearly doing the minimum just to keep it running and the money coming in. For example, they have not invested in enough dev. staff time to get RoR ready in time for release with instances. How likely is it that they would say "yeah, we know we have lag making the game unplayable for some players, and yes, RoR is not ready, but we are going to assign you to work on housing"? It's just not going to happen.
The sad truth is that this game is stable in its current state and we will very likely see few improvements to the game from this point on. Especially new features like kinship improvements, housing improvements, new hobbies, etc. We have seen no willingness on Turbine's part to invest all that money they are making in the store on polishing and improving the game - other than putting out new content in expansions and updates - which they have to do to keep people playing. New hires and new money coming in is going to their next MMO or console project.
I would love to be proven wrong, but have been waiting for years to see more money invested in the game.
I really do think a complete overhaul or 'revamp' is required to get housing going good. I believe that turbine should see it as a potential investment, and also something that if done properly and right, would not need changing ever again till the game reaches its finale!
Right now Turbine is clearly doing the minimum just to keep it running and the money coming in.
I have already described my plan of action. It will work if that action is taken instead of just discussing the thought. I've already noted what I will do. Alone with a few friends and family won't do the whole trick but I'm willing to be the one to start. I've also previously wrote my purpose for this thread is to learn how many would be on board be ye farmer or farmee. So far I've seen only one reply vaguely interested. You are correct in thinking Turbine is at least satisfied with their LotRO income. Consider, though, that income taking a noticable drop. Would you not try to do what you could to bring that income back up? Yes, Turbine will keep cranking out update after update, one end game addition after another (I'm all for new content myself), endless minor store curiosities such as mounts with various skins..until we act. This action of which I speak is easily possible. Easily. I say to you as I have to another: Join not only your voice to mine; bring also your action.
Ever hear of the Green Machine? Your grandfather will know what that was.
Doubtful. My grandfather was a farmer in the middle of Iowa.
Originally Posted by Ariellyn
What I'm proposing will work. Turbine will sit up and take notice. Join not only your voice to mine; bring also your action.
I re-read your original post. I didn't see a proposal. I read the second post, which seemed to be a request for people to farm Turbine Points...which I honestly don't understand how that would take away income from Turbine.
You play (and presumably enjoy) LotRO, made by Turbine.
You want to cut the profit generated by LotRO
Correct?
Correct.
Now think a little further than I'm just some angry, crazed maniac trying to take down a corporation that made me mad. I'm not angry at all. Think a little further: a company throws out products (digital entertainment modules in this case) that makes them money. A large part of their consumers enjoy the products but they want one major, specific thing. The company takes no steps to provide this one desire but continues using man-hours cranking out actually useless product such as, again in the case of LotRO, cosmetics (Lord knows you GOTTA look good for the goblins you kill), mounts of various skins that all have the same function, buffs and boosts (not so useless but still temporary), food and drink (seriously? Isn't that what in-game cooks do?)..the list continues. You get the idea. Then one comes along with the plan; hit 'em in the pocket book. Not to take them down and end the game. They won't walk away from their creation if it wasn't going to fail on its own. They WILL do what they can to recover the declined income. Turbine is creating many usefull additions to LotRO. I'm just saying they HAVE the man-hours to create the one substantial thing for which so many have waited so long; you may see it yourself: Someone is taking the time to produce all the aforementioned useless stuff. Just put the useless item production on hold for a moment to use the effort in another direction; complete the goal then return to the fancy horses and Antonio Banderez clothing later.
Now think even further still: Join not only your voice to mine; bring also your action. (I'm startin' to like that cantchya tell?)
Doubtful. My grandfather was a farmer in the middle of Iowa.
I re-read your original post. I didn't see a proposal. I read the second post, which seemed to be a request for people to farm Turbine Points...which I honestly don't understand how that would take away income from Turbine.
People pay money to buy turbine points. They won't have to pay money when they get those points for free. A few high level characters can crank out lowbie deeds fast. gain a few hundred points, repeat with new junker characters. Heck, any server will work..points are applied to accounts no matter what server from which they're gained. I and my friends and family are willing to be the first farmers. This may not make a dent in Turbine's income (I wouldn't be surprised, though, if just a few to start actually did noticable affect that income..we are fanatical farmers). Now imagine more and more rallying to farm occasionaly as well as getting farmed. This is what I do. I lead well. My plan was..IS to lead the greatest Kinship of LotRO while absolutely enjoying the building of that very organization. I need a base of operation. Without that option I will build and lead another way.
Join not only your voice to mine; bring also your action.
Doubtful. My grandfather was a farmer in the middle of Iowa.
In the years after the Great Depression many of the immigrants were Irish. They were treated horribly..ignored by their own government. What Big Brother nerver noticed was the Irish were a majority..once they stood together as the Green Machine..taking their votes as one to the poles. Politicians had to meet their desires or be replaced. 'Twas a beautiful operation..almost as satisfying as the black American Jesse Owens taking the gold in the olympics in Germany just as Hitler was finalizing his internal powers to let loose his vision of an Arian race.
Housing remains, in my opinion, a problematic return on investment for Turbine. The presumption that 'fixing' or upgrading housing is a small incremental cost, to me, hasn't been substantiated by the community.
Turbine, looking for as many edge revenue streams as possible, it is reasonable to presume, has concluded the R&D costs don't add up to a viable and sustainable revenue stream. The numbers aren't adding up or it would be queued for redevelopment.
That people are willing to spend TP has been asserted. I'll go with that presumption. The issue is would 'enough' people be willing to spend 'enough' TP to pay for the development, maintenance and ancillary costs, to mention just a few in a very general way.
At the moment most people have spent in-game gold to purchase housing. Gold has zero real value. People also can grind about $35USD in TP and not spend any additional real currency.
So what would be a reasonable real-world to TP valuation for an in-game house?
Would people be willing to pay a housing only subscription fee? Can you get, say, 5,000 people to subscribe? At $5.00USD per month? Even using those numbers it won't generate any worthwhile revenue after factoring real costs.
The ideas are legion and some are very compelling mini-games.
Translating the ideas into a sustainable return on investment is the gate.
Some do, sure. I imagine the majority of people use their subscriptions for points.
Those people pay money to play the game. Are you advocating people should cancel their subscriptions?
Oh no of course not. Take only what I say as what I mean. Don't add anything to it. I'm the one who watches those lawyer television shows and when the lawyer asks the witness "Did you kill John Doe" then the witness answers "Why would I do that I liked John Doe" I'm yelling at the tv screen "That's NOT what he asked! Did..you..kill..John..Doe?"
If I didn't call for subscribers to cancel I didn't intend for such to be understood. I try not to imply. I inted to be straight forward and understood.
As for LotRO players I imagine the majority are not subscribers but are premium or free to play and spend money as they go..buying content just a little ahead of their character levels. I further imagine most of those players are the "gotta have it all now" gamers and even invest enough money to get level 60+ quest content zones even though their lv 20 characters wont see those areas for a long time..long enough to have farmed the points for free in the first place. These are the players I want to join not only their voices to mine but to bring also their actions. Any subscribers that want on board with my plan are welcome. Everyone likes free points.
So you're suggesting that players band together and stop enjoying the game? They instead farm TP (that they may or may not want to spend on anything).
Turbine notice this (very minor) dip in income from people who are now farming TP instead of playing the game.
If they notice it at all, they won't suddenly think "Well it's time to devote man hours into better housing then!". They'll find much cheaper ways of recouping the (minor) fall in income. Probably by introducing some more stuff to the store that people will buy.
If you want better housing the way to go about it isn't some, frankly unusual, in game militant activity.
Suggestion forums and dev's are the way to go. All farming TP will do is show Turbine that people are grinding deeds rather than paying using real money. They'll have stuff in place for this. In fact they do have stuff in place for this; the subscribers and people who will pay using cash.
Oh, this has worked? I've seen a lot of discussion ending in the same result: many have been waiting four years for suggestion forums and devs to work.
If you're dead set on leading a rebellion perhaps the best bet would be to continue spending and aquiring TP as normal but making a point not to spend TP on anything Housing related. Turbine would then note that Housing was the worst performing area of the store and give the content some revamping.
That or they'd continue to work on whatever it is they were doing anyway. Which is what they'll do anyway.
Guys hang on..I just noticed there's a lot of talk about improving housing and how Turbine isn't doing anything about it 'cause there's other easier ways for them to make money. Improving housing with more hooks or various skins wasn't my first concern. Just the quantity of available housing. The system is already in place. We just need more of it. Let's get the houses first..worry about the improvements later. Really..how hard can it be? RAM? Hard disc space? They're already cranking out update after update, new item after item..this must be stored in memory somewhere. Let's get some of that memory dedicated to more houses.
Guys hang on..I just noticed there's a lot of talk about improving housing and how Turbine isn't doing anything about it 'cause there's other easier ways for them to make money. Improving housing with more hooks or various skins wasn't my first concern. Just the quantity of available housing. The system is already in place. We just need more of it. Let's get the houses first..worry about the improvements later. Really..how hard can it be? RAM? Hard disc space? They're already cranking out update after update, new item after item..this must be stored in memory somewhere. Let's get some of that memory dedicated to more houses.
I contend it isn't about 'how hard' but 'how much' is it going to cost and will Turbine make its money back and then profit.
So you're suggesting that players band together and stop enjoying the game? They instead farm TP (that they may or may not want to spend on anything).
Turbine notice this (very minor) dip in income from people who are now farming TP instead of playing the game.
If they notice it at all, they won't suddenly think "Well it's time to devote man hours into better housing then!". They'll find much cheaper ways of recouping the (minor) fall in income. Probably by introducing some more stuff to the store that people will buy.
If you want better housing the way to go about it isn't some, frankly unusual, in game militant activity.
Suggestion forums and dev's are the way to go. All farming TP will do is show Turbine that people are grinding deeds rather than paying using real money. They'll have stuff in place for this. In fact they do have stuff in place for this; the subscribers and people who will pay using cash.
+rep for a thoughtful, intelligent post. This game has some issues. No doubt about that part of it. The housing ball is square. It stopped rolling a long time ago and, according to Turbine, it won't start rolling in the foreseeable future, if at all.
Should housing get some dev attention? I sure think so. But the "solution" proposed by the OP is truly bizarre. A mindless TP grind sounds to me like very little fun. I prefer to spend the little time I have to play the game these days on something that I enjoy doing. And, as noted by the poster I've quoted, even in the extremely unlikely case that Turbine's revenue dropped by a noticeable amount, they wouldn't have a clue that it was related to The Big Housing Boycott.
But I think the greatest irony here is that the OP is trying to use the Turbine forums to organize an action against LOTRO. What's next? A boycott of Big Macs on the McDonald's forums?
When all the houses in one neighborhood are sold, a new instance is generated and more houses become available for purchase.
From the Wiki.
If you want a Kinship exclusive housing instance then surely you can just buy up all the houses of one type and then pop into the new instance? As far as I'm aware there's an infinite number of availalbe housing, new instances will be unlocked everytime the previous one fills up.
How you'd go about coordinating the mass purchase I'm not sure, but it should be doable under the current gaming conditions.
I did misunderstand what you were asking, I apologise for that, but even so I think you can achieve exactly what you're trying to within the game as it is?
If anyone's ever tried anything like this it'd be good to know how it went.
If you want a Kinship exclusive housing instance then surely you can just buy up all the houses of one type and then pop into the new instance? As far as I'm aware there's an infinite number of availalbe housing, new instances will be unlocked everytime the previous one fills up.
How you'd go about coordinating the mass purchase I'm not sure, but it should be doable under the current gaming conditions.
I did misunderstand what you were asking, I apologise for that, but even so I think you can achieve exactly what you're trying to within the game as it is?
If anyone's ever tried anything like this it'd be good to know how it went.
250 maximum homestead instances. I'm on Brandywine. We're full. The solution has got to be easy. Find the code where the 250 is, back space that out and type in 350. Next year make it a 450. Now I know that's just a simple description of something that would be written in some basic programming but no mater what code is used it's that easy. ya just need the ram and hard space. They have it. those new fancy store items that keep comming out are stored somewhere..as well as every single chunk of copper ore i dig out and throw into a bank space.
[QUOTE=bigsix66;6349689Should housing get some dev attention? I sure think so. But the "solution" proposed by the OP is truly bizarre. A mindless TP grind sounds to me like very little fun.[/QUOTE]
As I said in the original post (not that I'm bizarre. I am. That grinding points will be as boring for the farmee as it is for the farmer). When reading and replying do most people skim through fast and get half the picture or is anyone taking the time to get the whole story? I don't think my solution is bizarre. I know it would work. If farming isn't for you that is ok by me. I've come to like farming and am sure there's others that like it too. Those are the ones I'm waiting to see within the thread.
250 maximum homestead instances. I'm on Brandywine. We're full.
Well then, that is ridiculous, fair enough. That does need to be sorted and I agree it shouldn't be too hard for Turbine to do... I still don't think TP farming is the way to go though, try messaging some blue names and see if you can get an answer as to why the number of instances hasn't been increased.
Last edited by Curandhras; Aug 09 2012 at 07:22 PM.
So you're suggesting that players band together and stop enjoying the game? They instead farm TP (that they may or may not want to spend on anything).
Turbine notice this (very minor) dip in income from people who are now farming TP instead of playing the game.
No. I'm saying that if this plan is for you join me. If it isn't don't worry about it. You will never have to try to figure out what I mean by what I say. I do not intend to imply. I intend to speak and be understood. If I didn't say band together and stop enjoying the game I didn't mean band together and stop enjoying the game.
The dip in income from farming TP is only minor related to not being organized on a larger scale than single player personal use.
As I said in the original post (not that I'm bizarre. I am. That grinding points will be as boring for the farmee as it is for the farmer). When reading and replying do most people skim through fast and get half the picture or is anyone taking the time to get the whole story? I don't think my solution is bizarre. I know it would work. If farming isn't for you that is ok by me. I've come to like farming and am sure there's others that like it too. Those are the ones I'm waiting to see within the thread.
Nope, I don't find farming TP to be bizarre. Lots of folks do that. I just stated that it's not something I'd choose to do. The reason why I think your suggestion is strange was contained in the rest of my post.
Well then, that is ridiculous, fair enough. That does need to be sorted and I agree it shouldn't be too hard for Turbine to do... I still don't think TP farming is the way to go though, try messaging some blue names and see if you can get an answer as to why the number of instances hasn't been increased.
Yes..I suppose I should start gathering information at square one myself. I've thought, however, so many before me have already done so for there are so many housing thread spanning back years beating the dead horse. I figure the same routine..messaging devs and posting them suggestions..will obtain the same result: nothing. To reach a different result may require a different action.
Yes..I suppose I should start gathering information at square one myself. I've thought, however, so many before me have already done so for there are so many housing thread spanning back years beating the dead horse. I figure the same routine..messaging devs and posting them suggestions..will obtain the same result: nothing. To reach a different result may require a different action.
Possibly, but I can't see how acquiring Turbine Points would be this required action.
Perhaps the problem is no one has simply asked before?
You will never have to try to figure out what I mean by what I say. I do not intend to imply. I intend to speak and be understood.
I must say you've failed for this player. I don't understand how people farming TP will cause the devs to update the number of available housing neighborhoods.
I really don't. After re-reading the posts in the thread multiple times, I think I'm just too dense to get it. So...
Possibly, but I can't see how acquiring Turbine Points would be this required action.
Perhaps the problem is no one has simply asked before?
Acquiring the points alone wouldn't work. Turbine would have to be informed a player needs the means to direct organizational desires organizing something else..like supply depot kinships. This would be me doing the informing part..keeping anyone else from consequences that may prevent playing (If I didn't want to increase the number of an array I'd just suspend or ban an organizer taking money outta my pocket).
Perhaps no one has simply asked? That is so simple I kick myself for not thinking it. I'll ask even though I'm positive someone somewhere in the years of threads related to housing already has. Lemmie find that blue button of yours..+rep again for you today.
Perhaps no one has simply asked? That is so simple I kick myself for not thinking it. I'll ask even though I'm positive someone somewhere in the years of threads related to housing already has. Lemmie find that blue button of yours..+rep again for you today.
I'm legitimately serious. You've balled straight into "Farming TP and telling Turbine you're doing it because you want more houses".
If everyone discovers the problem and flies straight into one of the following modes:
Flame Turbine on the forums
Complain in game to their friends/Kin
Start threads having a go at Turbine in suggestion
Complain that this is just another failure on a long list for Turbine (possible fist waving too)
Start a thread drumming up support for a TP farming marathon with possible message to Turbine linking it to Housing shortages
Any/All of the above
Then nothing will be done. Genuine, well structured, thoughtful and polite requests need to be made (admittedly probably more than once) via the correct channels to get anything done. You don't get anywhere against a company or group like Turbine (who are completely in control of this game and have their own set of rigid goals and targets) by threatening and flaming.
Additionally, if it was as simple as changing an array up from 250 to 350 then I imagine it would have been done out of posterity by now, since it's a pointless problem to have.
There must be some reason as to why Turbine haven't done it, which is what needs to be found out. We're not going to find anything out unless people "ask nicely".
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Originally Posted by mothermoy
"I am always serious; I am never serious." -Me
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