The 5 set bonus on the lvk 85 Unyielding Rage set was revealed to reduce the pip cost of Remorseless Strike to 0. Seems to me that will reduce champ single target rotations to spamming Remorseless Strike over and over, and hitting Clobber every time it is up. You won't have to use any pip builders at all.
That is a stupid, stupid set bonus. It's bad enough someone came up with the idea, but even worse that it got okay'd to be posted in the preliminary dev diary. Mind = blown.
Turbine, I will gladly test for you in exchange for a free sub, since you apparently have no internal testing or QA team at all.
Even if it wasn't OP, it would still dumb down the class. Allowing important skills to be used without costing pips (see: bracing in glory and this) seems to be the exact opposite of what should be done on a class where pip building and spending is one of the most important factors in winning and losing a fight. Instead of needing to weigh the benefits to the costs of using the skill, it just becomes another skill to be randomly spammed in a skill rotation.
Honostly...op claims again , how bout flys that suck power from all freeps nearby within seconds, and if you are a champ in the moors that can do nothing but spam remorseless strikes, then congrats cause you are truly op..... stop complaining people. every class and race has an op skill that everyone complains about; i.e. bubbles, burrow, hips, dying rage, etc. just fight and learn new strategies
Good thing PVP isn't in the title, otherwise it would be obvious.
It's absolutely not obvious.
Most of the discussions about something being "over-powered" or "under-powered" on the forums have been about the PvE end, as only a small subset of the game population regularly PvP (I've only started doing it two weeks ago to get the PvP Burglar set). So naturally this has been true even when PvP gear become controversial as being over-powered--the Unseen set for Burglar being an example:
I only use the keyboard to use my skills, and I have my Second Wind skill traited. I use it on the F1 button every 10 seconds with no late, so it's very quickly. Even with this, I sometimes have power problems when I'm DPSing like a crazy man.
"That's one small step for a man, one giant leap for mankind"
2. Even if the bonus is what you think it is, why can't we have over-powered gear for once? Two wrongs make it right in my opinion!
You must not remember the BG or OD gear then. Those were some awesome set bonuses. The BG gear added a PIP every time Blade Wall crit. That's any crit, main hand or off hand, on any target. So if you're in an AoE situation, you were practically running full time Deathstorm from the constantly full fervour.
The OD set was even better imo. The 3 piece set granted extra PIPs from a Remorsless strike crit. Main hand or off hand again, and it used to grant 1 or 3 PIPs per crit (no pattern ever emerged). So you could use Remorseless, crit, and be instantly full on fervour again. Not only that, but the 5 piece set bonus granted an extra -5% Attack Duration when in fervour. For a while during RoI after they made flurry permanent in fervour, you could even put on your OD gear, hop into fervour, then put on your regular gear and enjoy the -5% AD bonus.
/singlesadtear for my OD set. I still keep it in my vault and won't destroy it.
You must not remember the BG or OD gear then. Those were some awesome set bonuses. The BG gear added a PIP every time Blade Wall crit. That's any crit, main hand or off hand, on any target. So if you're in an AoE situation, you were practically running full time Deathstorm from the constantly full fervour.
The OD set was even better imo. The 3 piece set granted extra PIPs from a Remorsless strike crit. Main hand or off hand again, and it used to grant 1 or 3 PIPs per crit (no pattern ever emerged). So you could use Remorseless, crit, and be instantly full on fervour again. Not only that, but the 5 piece set bonus granted an extra -5% Attack Duration when in fervour. For a while during RoI after they made flurry permanent in fervour, you could even put on your OD gear, hop into fervour, then put on your regular gear and enjoy the -5% AD bonus.
/singlesadtear for my OD set. I still keep it in my vault and won't destroy it.
I started playing around RoI. So of course I don't know what went on before Orthanc raids
Not only that, but the 5 piece set bonus granted an extra -5% Attack Duration when in fervour. For a while during RoI after they made flurry permanent in fervour, you could even put on your OD gear, hop into fervour, then put on your regular gear and enjoy the -5% AD bonus.
/singlesadtear for my OD set. I still keep it in my vault and won't destroy it.
That would have been even better than what the OD set really did ;-)
The 5-piece set bonus never reduced your attack duration by 5% (though I would have loved to see that), isntead it added 20% DMG to you auto attacks, which still was huge on its own.
That would have been even better than what the OD set really did ;-)
The 5-piece set bonus never reduced your attack duration by 5% (though I would have loved to see that), isntead it added 20% DMG to you auto attacks, which still was huge on its own.
Wow, you're completely right. Don't know where my head was this morning when I posted that!
You are correct, it was +20% damage to your auto attacks. I think I remember at the time though that it was roughly a 5-6% increase in dps based on the percentage of my damage that was auto attacks at the time.
if you're the only one it's not obvious to, then....yeah it still is. Spoilers. Who's gonna complain about a dps class with high burst in PvE and be taken seriously? Hunters are already pen-shot wonders.
Where would that same class in current state of survivability + extreme burst be most Imbalanced?
Few of the questions that make it obvious.
Originally Posted by Celestrus
I only use the keyboard to use my skills, and I have my Second Wind skill traited. I use it on the F1 button every 10 seconds with no late, so it's very quickly. Even with this, I sometimes have power problems when I'm DPSing like a crazy man.
And there's also the fact that full audacity grants....-18%(iirc) power cost, in tandem with a good rune it's -28% power cost to strikes, ergo you literally have to be doing multiple things horribly wrong to be draining that much power short of a standard power potion now and then.
And there's also the fact that full audacity grants....-18%(iirc) power cost, in tandem with a good rune it's -28% power cost to strikes, ergo you literally have to be doing multiple things horribly wrong to be draining that much power short of a standard power potion now and then.
Pretty much.
If you enjoy facerolling healers with your 40% mastery buff (yay for outposts) who have to rank for their scaled healing spamming one button then RoR will definitely be your cup of tea.
I don't know why people are so concerned about spamming remorseless. It is only good when one has the Improved Seeking Blade (2m CD) on. Otherwise it hits weaker than brutal strikes. And if we consider real fighting, not training vs a dummy, people tend to run around to much that you get a chance to him them every two or three seconds, not non-stop. And this allows to build up fervor for a brutal strike.
I don't know why people are so concerned about spamming remorseless. It is only good when one has the Improved Seeking Blade (2m CD) on. Otherwise it hits weaker than brutal strikes.
Nope, that only holds true for a 2H setup, as Remorseless is THE staple strike skill in a DW rotation. And with 0 pip costs it will also become THE strike skill for a 2H rotation (if one insists to still call one-button-spamming a rotation at all), not because it hits harder than Burtal on a per skill execution basis, but because it hits almost as hard as Brutal, crits a lot harder and you can actually spam 2.7 Remorseless Strikes in the same time needed to perform just one Brutal+Clobber (Brutal CD is 4.2sec, but Clobber is 5, so one Brutal+clobber costs 5sec). 2.7 Remorseless Strikes net you hell a lot more DMG than one Brutal+Clobber ever could.
Originally Posted by Otdanon
Otherwise it hits weaker than brutal strikes. And if we consider real fighting, not training vs a dummy, people tend to run around to much that you get a chance to him them every two or three seconds, not non-stop. And this allows to build up fervor for a brutal strike.
That only holds true if you define 'real fighting' as PvP (which actually only a small part of the game), as raid bosses and trash won't exactly kite you around. Even in PvP Spamming Remorseless will be more effective. If you have the opprotunity to land a Swift Strike or Wild Attack to build Fervour, you might as well just hit Remorseless, as it hits way harder than your pip builders. Having Remorseless at 0 pips means that every hit you are able to get in on your target will be a big hit. Can't see how Brutal will ever have an edge over Remorseless in a 0 pip cost scenario.
i dont play a champ but when i saw that bonus i knew this disscussion would happen in the champ forums... so i decided to drop by after sobbing some more on the hunter froums and as no one has yet stumbled across this but:
who told you that remoresless would still have its 1.8 sec cooldown like now? for all you know, it could be 10sec or 20sec...
the champ dev diary has not yet come out.... so there is no reason to believe that RS will still be the same as pre ROR.....
i could see the sense in it since RS is already spammed by PVP champs along with brutal + clobber. having it on a longer cooldown with no pip cost would give room for other champ skill while still having an effective SHING skill.
i dont play a champ but when i saw that bonus i knew this disscussion would happen in the champ forums... so i decided to drop by after sobbing some more on the hunter froums and as no one has yet stumbled across this but:
who told you that remoresless would still have its 1.8 sec cooldown like now? for all you know, it could be 10sec or 20sec...
the champ dev diary has not yet come out.... so there is no reason to believe that RS will still be the same as pre ROR.....
i could see the sense in it since RS is already spammed by PVP champs along with brutal + clobber. having it on a longer cooldown with no pip cost would give room for other champ skill while still having an effective SHING skill.
Changing a skill due to the set bonus on a single PvP set would be an awful decision. I have enough faith in Orion that he won't let that happen, but it's not entirely out of the realm of possibility (I'm still slightly bitter at all the Champs who decided to use Clobber as a DPS skill, thus getting its cooldown lengthened).
"Sam thinks it a queer place, but I think he likes it, too." - Frodo
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Changing a skill due to the set bonus on a single PvP set would be an awful decision. I have enough faith in Orion that he won't let that happen, but it's not entirely out of the realm of possibility (I'm still slightly bitter at all the Champs who decided to use Clobber as a DPS skill, thus getting its cooldown lengthened).
That? Try when they made it instant so interrupting was just mashing the key versus timing the skill. The original version required timing because of the attack queue.
That hobbit you just called fat? He's skipping 2nd breakfast.
The dwarf woman you called ugly? She spends hours braiding her beard so you can differentiate her from a dwarf man.
The Uruk-Hai you just killed? he's been abused by Saruman.
See that Gollum creature with the gangly limb and large eyes? For 500 years the ring poisoned his mind.
That elf you just made fun of for crying? She just lost her wizard friend to a Balrog.
Put this as your signature if you're against bullying in Middle-earth!
i dont play a champ but when i saw that bonus i knew this disscussion would happen in the champ forums... so i decided to drop by after sobbing some more on the hunter froums and as no one has yet stumbled across this but:
who told you that remoresless would still have its 1.8 sec cooldown like now? for all you know, it could be 10sec or 20sec...
the champ dev diary has not yet come out.... so there is no reason to believe that RS will still be the same as pre ROR.....
i could see the sense in it since RS is already spammed by PVP champs along with brutal + clobber. having it on a longer cooldown with no pip cost would give room for other champ skill while still having an effective SHING skill.
If not for the fact that such a change would make DW utterly useless for ST pve, maybe I'd agree that that could occur.
Champ dev diary released and no mention of increasing RS cd... guess I better go lvl up my champion, no way can I compete with a skill that regularly crits for 5k and can dev for quite higher, on a 1.8s CD? (Note: 5k is a 75 dps level... Can't wait to see lvl 85 numbers...)
Boo hoo, power? LM or any captain who knows how to use inspire fixes that very quickly...
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Originally Posted by Celestrus
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, how bout flys that suck power from all freeps nearby within seconds, and if you are a champ in the moors that can do nothing but spam remorseless strikes, then congrats cause you are truly op..... stop complaining people. every class and race has an op skill that everyone complains about; i.e. bubbles, burrow, hips, dying rage, etc. just fight and learn new strategies
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