I was planning to buy RoR with my first paycheck ever sometime in August. However, since that would mean paying to see sparkling dummies in Snowbourn, I am not doing it. I'm really sorry about it, but if there is one thing cheapening Middle-Earth as a whole, this is it. Not the Store-bought armor, not the relic removal scrolls, not the lootboxes lottery - this. I have well over a thousand screenshots of Middle-Earth saved on my PC and I am deeply saddened that many of them are now the only way I ever get to see iconic places such as Rivendell, Twenty-First Hall or Caras Galadhon without those awful sparkling dummies again.
1. Remove the sparkle effect.
2. Move them in-doors or at least somewhat out of the way from where everyone sees them all the time.
3. Leave them only in the three starter areas. Why the need to have them in every single zone when the four outfits are all the same anyway?
I am generous with you, Turbine. You only need to do two of the above for me to decide on buying RoR once again. That should suffice in any case.
They're not shouty ads. Good lord, that's being a little exaggerated and dramatic. Soon enough you won't even see them. And frankly it's Turbine's prerogative what they do and when they do it. Good for you for paying, however this isn't the end of the world and this certainly isn't going to keep you from doing your thing. I pay to play too, and yet I'm not appalled or completely obstructed by them. Maybe your issue with them is your own, and thus I return to my previous statement. This game isn't catered directly to you.
Out of curiousity, who do you think the game is catered to now?
"Sam thinks it a queer place, but I think he likes it, too." - Frodo
"If you're in advertising or marketing, kill yourself." - Bill Hicks
So what you're saying is: Subscribers should not be subjected to the in-game ads, right? Or perhaps I missed your point?
The only thing I'm suggesting is that people respect the company for their choice to do as they please, seeing as they continue to provide and expand this game. I subscribe and I don't care if I see them. And debating them ad nauseum probably isn't going to change anything.
The only thing I'm suggesting is that people respect the company for their choice to do as they please, seeing as they continue to provide and expand this game. I subscribe and I don't care if I see them. And debating them ad nauseum probably isn't going to change anything.
How about Turbine respecting the wishes of their paying customers?
I agree with raychmo 100%. My cable company made a convenient air raid siren sound that blasts over every channel I watch, but that's their choice as a company and as their customer I have to respect that decision. I probably won't even hear the siren in a couple of months anyway.
I do not see this implementation as getting us closer to dress up dummies in our home. At best is a tiny step because Turbine has upped the visuals for a landscape object. Turbine did a landscape beauty upgrade as part of Rise of Isengard.
All Turbine did was create a landscape object that looks like a Avatar. Most likely it is a composited as single item. Lot like a tree. Added to the landscape designers tool kit as another object than can be dragged and dropped on the landscape. When the landscape block updates are finished, the tooling generates all the files for our client to render the visuals.
It seems very similar to putting down a statue. One thing they probably could do with out too much trouble is create a hookable decoration for each of these fixed apperances.
It is a long hard road to get a dummy with multiple slots that can be placed in our houses. New artwork for each piece. Update the rendering engine to properly build the frame for all character and camera positions.
I can see all that. At the same time though much older MMO's have a wardrobe model/ mannequin for personal housing. Heck one that comes to mind even had a quest to collect all the different parts from all over the world. Semi rare items that were tradeable/ sellable. After you get em all bring em back and have your mannequin made. Once made and placed in your house you could then equip it... From head to toe... To include back, off and main hand, no Bling though, but hey... it was neat to walk in your house and see some nice Duds standing around. They were race specific too which made it fun for altoholics too.
At any rate, if a game from 2001 could do it, then surely it can be done at Turbine.
Out of curiousity, who do you think the game is catered to now?
Those who will accept everything and anything Turbine does and who expect everyone else to do the same.
I for one think this is ridiculous. Preach all you want about advertisement but that doesn't mean they are right to put random nonsensical things in game just because they need money. No one is asking for them to remove the dummies completely, they are merely asking to be at least somewhat lore considerate. Sparkly? Poses? Littered everywhere in the most inappropriate areas? Come on, get real here. You can't argue the absurdity of that, business or not, advertisement or not. Some thought and creativity should be given here.
Last edited by PoeticNightmare; Jul 09 2012 at 03:21 PM.
The only thing I'm suggesting is that people respect the company for their choice to do as they please, seeing as they continue to provide and expand this game. I subscribe and I don't care if I see them. And debating them ad nauseum probably isn't going to change anything.
Well, perhaps they will learn to respect their customers if they lose enough revenue over it.. They can do what they want with their game, but that doesn't mean anyone is obligated to like what they do with it or to continue playing it. I've only been playing since Feb. and I'll probably continue playing, but I don't feel as inclined to re-up my VIP subscription when it runs out in less than a month. This is just tacky...
A smart move for Turbine in dealing with this, would be to add an option for VIP players to hide these silly dummies.
Maybe if people weren't so tight with the purse strings, as the vibe is from reading the forums (I mean really, whole threads dedicated to a new way to farm free TP in order to never have to buy anything?) then there wouldn't be such a need to place advertisements in-game. I've only been playing since about May and even I've spent damn near $80-$90 on this game. Yes I am a frugal shopper and gravitate toward sales and the like, but as a small business owner myself, I know that when I need cash I launch an ad-campaign. And to be honest, the use of mannequins is actually a genius and kind of adorable way to provide a link to the store.
Luckily I don't run a business where people can use my product without paying for it, so maybe I'm not as generous as Turbine/WB. However I find it more disgusting that so many people find it acceptable to complain about a form of advertisement in a world full of benefits they enjoy, on many occasions for free. Ads create revenue and revenue keeps your world alive. Would you rather have a few apparel dummies that get people into the store and thinking "man I need some more TP for this, let me grab Ye Olde Debit Card" (be it apparel or whatever else they may find), or would you rather no game at all? I mean, come on guys, advertisements are a business's prerogative and it's their choice to find new and interesting ways to bring in revenue. I guarantee the amount of enjoyment you've gained from this game doesn't even come close to the dollar figure you've spent, because this company believes in providing a free world (minus VIP and expansions, don't jump on me for negating that~). However, nothing is ever truly free in business, so ads are inevitable and these ads are more than acceptable. Telling them to stick their dummies inside stores is a little bit asinine. That's like saying I should only advertise where no one will see it unless they're in my shop. That doesn't get me new customers.
Frankly, a couple of dummies in not very flattering poses (sorry, my business is actually IN fashion and that is really my only gripe!) scattered around your world aren't going to hinder your game play or keep you from enjoying yourself, unless you allow them. I on the other hand, will never reach 75, as I will now get sucked into making even MORE cosmetic outfits, all day every day. Just remember, this is a service you use probably every.single.day and nothing is ever going to be catered directly to you and your play style. Don't take it for granted and don't lose your cool just because this company is coming up with ways to further their revenue and thus further business and further your game.
You know what, bub? I've been gaming my whole life. For decades. I spend $80 on games with development teams that HAVE A CLUE and LISTEN to customers.
This has made me decide not to spend a dime on this game right now. If the issue isn't resolved, I WILL NEVER soend any money on this game. And right now, I don't even want to play, because I don't want to walk past a store advertisement EVERY TIME I go past the first blacksmith in Bree, when store promotions are already in a HUNDRED different places in my UI.
The only thing I'm suggesting is that people respect the company for their choice to do as they please, seeing as they continue to provide and expand this game.
In other words: We shouldn't be telling here what we like or don't like in the game. Umm.. no. I want to be a good customer and give feedback, positive or negative, whenever I feel the need to do so.
"All of us with faces dour
waiting for the judgement hour"
Out of curiousity, who do you think the game is catered to now?
Well I'm not so ignorant to believe it's catered to any one play style. It's catered to the most broad standard of player possible, in order to bring in the most users and revenue for the business so that they can in turn continue this adventure they've created. I don't create my products so that only a select few can identify with them. That would turn my customer base into a fraction of what it is. I also don't believe they're money-hungry evil overlords who are just in it for the dollar figure. Very few businesses are run that way, despite what people believe. The fact that they provide new content that is most likely toiled over and stressed about at length is proof enough. But in order to make money you must market toward those that haven't yet purchased your product. That's also why it's F2P. Marketing is about creating a product and making your customer think "I need that". So now they'll see the cosmetics and it will be just like when I first started playing. I got a taste of the game and thought, "I need to buy this in order to keep enjoying it now".
I feel for people who find these things obtrusive but ultimately is it something that's going to bug you so much during your next raid you won't be able to perform because your mind is bogged down by the thoughts that GODFORBID there's apparel dummies in Aughaire?
I agree with raychmo 100%. My cable company made a convenient air raid siren sound that blasts over every channel I watch, but that's their choice as a company and as their customer I have to respect that decision. I probably won't even hear the siren in a couple of months anyway.
I agree with raychmo 100%. My cable company made a convenient air raid siren sound that blasts over every channel I watch, but that's their choice as a company and as their customer I have to respect that decision. I probably won't even hear the siren in a couple of months anyway.
Well, perhaps they will learn to respect their customers if they lose enough revenue over it.. They can do what they want with their game, but that doesn't mean anyone is obligated to like what they do with it or to continue playing it. I've only been playing since Feb. and I'll probably continue playing, but I don't feel as inclined to re-up my VIP subscription when it runs out in less than a month. This is just tacky...
A smart move for Turbine in dealing with this, would be to add an option for VIP players to hide these silly dummies.
While a great idea, it will never happen. We've all been asking for a VIP option to remove some of the adds. How many time must you keep throwing screens of quest packs at me for content I already have as VIP? Seriously, the higher level you get, the less benefit you really get being VIP over premium
With each update, they bring something horrible and I say "they can't possibly ruin their own game any further than this.", and they manage to prove me wrong, everytime.
Great job Turbine!
Glowing and dancing stars around the dummies is a nice touch. It really improves the Middle-earth feeling in every hub I visit.
+1
Whenever I try to convince people to give Lotro a spin, I tell them it has great atmosphere and an immersive world. But this becomes less and less true with every new expansion and every update.
I could understand placing the dummies in Bree in some outfitters shop. But how does it make sense for mannequins to stand around in plain view in Moria of all places? It's supposed to depict an ongoing battle between orcs an dwarves desperately fighting to reclaim their homeland. A fashion show has no place there!
The only thing I'm suggesting is that people respect the company for their choice to do as they please, seeing as they continue to provide and expand this game. I subscribe and I don't care if I see them. And debating them ad nauseum probably isn't going to change anything.
But one of the big selling points for this game is the immersion into the world of Tolkein. It's hard to feel like you're actually walking around Michel Delving when you come across four glittering dummies trying to sell you something. Also, its not just the dummies themselves but what they represent that people find so troubling. They're the first feelers into in game advertising and that is something people absolutely don't want.
Turbine already gets my money in subscriptions and when I buy their expansions. I don't need their store shoved down my throat when I'm already financially supporting the game. Really that should be one of the benefits of VIP: turn off all store ads both in and out of the game.
Players are expressing their outrage on the forum because it can have surprising results. Look what happened with the RoR debacle.
Last edited by donxavier; Jul 09 2012 at 03:31 PM.
They're not shouty ads. Good lord, that's being a little exaggerated and dramatic. Soon enough you won't even see them. And frankly it's Turbine's prerogative what they do and when they do it. Good for you for paying, however this isn't the end of the world and this certainly isn't going to keep you from doing your thing. I pay to play too, and yet I'm not appalled or completely obstructed by them. Maybe your issue with them is your own, and thus I return to my previous statement. This game isn't catered directly to you.
Ok my last reply and i will shut up. (Hears sighs of relief.) Have you logged into Galtrev? They flash at you in highly coloured, inappropriate gear exactly where the milestone and all services are. This, for me is visual pollution. I do NOT get used to visual pollution. There a planning laws to prevent it in real life for good reasons.
It DOES affect my game because it has been so badly (well?) done it is unavoidable. It has nothing to do with Middle Earth and that is the reason I chose this game and not WOW or Clone Wars or...... even my little pony- no disrespect to Bird of Hermes intended.
We have different reasons for playing, clearly.You are not affected the same way by this world starting to resemble 21st century shopping mall. I am. Your game is not affected. My immersion is. So are a lot of other people's judging by the backlash. As a business person, you will know that for every complaint, 15 people just don't go back. The dummies, themselves, are not the issue for many people here- it is the shoddy implementation that ruins the aesthetic for many of us. You said yourself that they don't look too good. And the fact that the products are unwanted by many customers adds to the problem. As a business and marketing teacher I would use this as a case study on how not to revenue raise. Ads are supposed to create a need and satisfy it. As someone in the fashion industry do these creepy mannequins, sparkles and naff outfits make you want to go to the store? If not, then the whole thing has been a waste of our money.
I don't expect the game to be about me. I chose the game when it went FTP for the world of Tolkien. It makes me sad that the world I escape to seems to becoming secondary to the store and more and more like the one I escape from... and I'm not alone in that feeling. If I were the company I'd be listening to the excellent suggestions on how to do this well and effectively and make a profit without losing either of us.
Also, its not just the dummies themselves but what they represent that people find so troubling. They're the first feelers into in game advertising and that is something people absolutely don't want.
I guess I just don't see it this way as I feel like this is the equivalent to someone condemning me for providing an ad or coupon in the box when someone buys one of my products.
In other words: We shouldn't be telling here what we like or don't like in the game. Umm.. no. I want to be a good customer and give feedback, positive or negative, whenever I feel the need to do so.
A "good customer" eats up whatever the company puts on their dish and learns to either ignore what they dislike or force themselves to like it instead.
I do think its a little jarring to see that pic of apparel dummies in caras galadhorn. I'm not into rp or immersion that much but I've never seen something that non-sensical and... contradictory before?
Haldir (From several epic quests and the books): "Since it's important we'll let you into the city but we're going to have to blindfold before you enter. Especially the dwarf."
Outsider: "Sure"
...
Haldir: "Okay we're here. By the way would you like to buy some clothes? You'll notice we make them in hobbit and dwarf sizes as well!"
Outsider: "...?"
It started with lootboxes mentioning the lotro store in its description.. I do understand the need to market and inform people about the store, but I think this is taking it a bit far. I've bought cosmetics from the store, sometimes in a sale that the game told me about in the loading screen or login window news. Were those methods not good enough?
Maybe if people weren't so tight with the purse strings, as the vibe is from reading the forums (I mean really, whole threads dedicated to a new way to farm free TP in order to never have to buy anything?) then there wouldn't be such a need to place advertisements in-game. I've only been playing since about May and even I've spent damn near $80-$90 on this game. Yes I am a frugal shopper and gravitate toward sales and the like, but as a small business owner myself, I know that when I need cash I launch an ad-campaign. And to be honest, the use of mannequins is actually a genius and kind of adorable way to provide a link to the store.
Luckily I don't run a business where people can use my product without paying for it, so maybe I'm not as generous as Turbine/WB. However I find it more disgusting that so many people find it acceptable to complain about a form of advertisement in a world full of benefits they enjoy, on many occasions for free. Ads create revenue and revenue keeps your world alive. Would you rather have a few apparel dummies that get people into the store and thinking "man I need some more TP for this, let me grab Ye Olde Debit Card" (be it apparel or whatever else they may find), or would you rather no game at all? I mean, come on guys, advertisements are a business's prerogative and it's their choice to find new and interesting ways to bring in revenue. I guarantee the amount of enjoyment you've gained from this game doesn't even come close to the dollar figure you've spent, because this company believes in providing a free world (minus VIP and expansions, don't jump on me for negating that~). However, nothing is ever truly free in business, so ads are inevitable and these ads are more than acceptable. Telling them to stick their dummies inside stores is a little bit asinine. That's like saying I should only advertise where no one will see it unless they're in my shop. That doesn't get me new customers.
Frankly, a couple of dummies in not very flattering poses (sorry, my business is actually IN fashion and that is really my only gripe!) scattered around your world aren't going to hinder your game play or keep you from enjoying yourself, unless you allow them. I on the other hand, will never reach 75, as I will now get sucked into making even MORE cosmetic outfits, all day every day. Just remember, this is a service you use probably every.single.day and nothing is ever going to be catered directly to you and your play style. Don't take it for granted and don't lose your cool just because this company is coming up with ways to further their revenue and thus further business and further your game.
Some of us have been pumping money into this game since before it released. We paid and played long before the game became free to play. Your argument about in-the-world advertising to generate money doesn't work for us. We're not talking about ads in the UI, we're talking about ads *in the game world*, in places where the whole concept doesn't fit and designed in a way where they clearly don't fit.
And I whole heartedly disagree that this addition to the world doesn't ruin the game. FOR ME, it most certainly does. Some of us appreciate the depth of the story. We play to be immersed in the look, feel, and plots of an amazing fantasy world, written by an amazing story teller and retold by Turbine. The world builders are incredibly good at their jobs, and this addition in effect defaces their work. Seeing these dummies in Enedwaith, Galtrev, Aughaire, or any other place other than the racial starting areas completely trashes immersion, and even there they need to be in appropriate locations. The implementation is a joke, and not a good one.
I am not, and never have been, opposed to Turbine/WB making money. I have run my own business and I understand the need for profit. This, however, is not the way to achieve it. In fact, it does the exact opposite by discouraging the very player base who has proven an interest in dumping money into a game. This game.
I can't help but adding that if this implementation of dummies meets with the approval of a significant number of players, then the answer to my dilemma is that this game is no longer for me. I don't yet believe that, and until that day comes I will continue to speak in favor of immersion, and against that which destroys it.
@Calta - I guess we just have different priorities in what we want to see with the game. I don't need a 100% authentic experience because I'd rather see the game reach the finale instead of abruptly end from insufficient funds.
First off let me state that I am a 5 year veteran of the game, a VIP subscriber, buy additional TP when it makes sense and I spend them when I need them. I support this game financially and have for years because I love the world, the game and want to spend time here.
This has got to be the one of the most unforgiveable things that Turbine has done in recent memory. I was ticked when they were selling reputation horses in the store (again, FINE with store exclusive mounts, just not recycling appearances for something you should be earning in game) I'm kind of fine with relic removal scrolls (even though that's removing previous functionality from the game) and all the buttons, ads and other store related things that have been added. I am NOT fine with this.
It's asinine that these dummies exist anywhere other than the major racial hubs (again, not a fan even there, but AT LEAST limit them to these locations, as they seem the most likely for "shopping") and quite frankly you ARE cheapening the world when they appear anywhere like Galtrev, which for all intents and purposes is a more primitive setting, and I find it VERY VERY VERY unlikely that anyone there would produce, let alone sell a silly pirate outfit! I'm probably going to cry internally when I see these things in places like Aughaire and others and it may make my hand move the mouse to the Exit Game button.
I have friends that have just started playing the game, and stuff like this is GOING to turn them off, and you will likely loose not only people that will willingly pay for VIP, but also will purchase TP.
Move the stupid things inside at the very least and better yet, just add a button to the Outfitter to take the player to the cosmetic section of the store. When you get the notice that you can have outfits you could even give the player a quest to go visit the outfitter...anything is better than this garbage.
WoW is the AOL of MMOs. They have millions of subscribers who just don't know any better because they're idiots. - Talaa
Visit www.lotrointerface.com for Lua plugins and UI skinning needs!
@Calta - I guess we just have different priorities in what we want to see with the game. I don't need a 100% authentic experience because I'd rather see the game reach the finale instead of abruptly end from insufficient funds.
But why do they suddenly have insufficient funds?
- Because so many paying customers take their business elsewhere.
Why do they leave then?
- Because they paid to play a good Tolkien-based MMORPG. Which they had 5 years ago. Today it's a cashcow, and an obnoxious one at that. And the Tolkien-based aspect is gone, so what they have here is a poorly done generic fantasy MMO which is desperetaly trying to squeeze money out of their few paying clients because people are leaving and they're not even bothering to try and figure out why that is.
People generally make more profit charging 10$ for a quality product than charging 100$ for a visibly bad product.
Last edited by BirdofHermes; Jul 09 2012 at 03:49 PM.
In the sea without lees standeth the Bird of Hermes. When all his feathers be from him gone, He standeth still here as a stone.
Here is now both white and red, And all so the stone to quicken the dead
The Bird of Hermes is my name, Eating my wings to make me tame.
I'm normally ambivalent towards the store and how it's managed and presented. After all, it is a F2P game, and these stores are how such games survive.
But this is definitely over the top. I seriously hope someone is reading this. For starters, they're an eye sore. I won't go on from there, others here have more eloquently stated the situation better than I could.
Why not just beat us over the head with a stick and tell us to "BUY MOAR!".
Seriously, the store is kind of like your local Ford dealer: they do sell expensive cars like the Mustang, but I bet you their bread-n-butter are things people buy ever day like the Focus. In the same vein, they probably sell more, and make more money on consumables like deed and rez scrolls, than any ROI could justify for the time and development expended on these dummies.
Some of us have been pumping money into this game since before it released. We paid and played long before the game became free to play. Your argument about in-the-world advertising to generate money doesn't work for us. We're not talking about ads in the UI, we're talking about ads *in the game world*, in places where the whole concept doesn't fit and designed in a way where they clearly don't fit.
And I whole heartedly disagree that this addition to the world doesn't ruin the game. FOR ME, it most certainly does. Some of us appreciate the depth of the story. We play to be immersed in the look, feel, and plots of an amazing fantasy world, written by an amazing story teller and retold by Turbine. The world builders are incredibly good at their jobs, and this addition in effect defaces their work. Seeing these dummies in Enedwaith, Galtrev, Aughaire, or any other place other than the racial starting areas completely trashes immersion, and even there they need to be in appropriate locations. The implementation is a joke, and not a good one.
I am not, and never have been, opposed to Turbine/WB making money. I have run my own business and I understand the need for profit. This, however, is not the way to achieve it. In fact, it does the exact opposite by discouraging the very player base who has proven an interest in dumping money into a game. This game.
I can't help but adding that if this implementation of dummies meets with the approval of a significant number of players, then the answer to my dilemma is that this game is no longer for me. I don't yet believe that, and until that day comes I will continue to speak in favor of immersion, and against that which destroys it.
This x1000 here. It's done so poorly I'm just straight up gobsmacked...Especially after dropping $70 on RoR...I'm wondering if I'll be able to stomach this kind of addition long enough to even see my money's worth...
WoW is the AOL of MMOs. They have millions of subscribers who just don't know any better because they're idiots. - Talaa
Visit www.lotrointerface.com for Lua plugins and UI skinning needs!
A smart move for Turbine in dealing with this, would be to add an option for VIP players to hide these silly dummies.
Originally Posted by PoeticNightmare
While a great idea, it will never happen. We've all been asking for a VIP option to remove some of the adds. How many time must you keep throwing screens of quest packs at me for content I already have as VIP? Seriously, the higher level you get, the less benefit you really get being VIP over premium
I disagree with VIP being able to remove the dummies/ads. I'm all for VIPs having perks (I'm premium) but I don't think Turbine should create a problem and then sell a 'solution' to it. The dummies shouldn't be in the world in the first place.
I agree with everyone on here, this update just makes places on middle earth look ridiculous. I hope Turbine read this and immediately get rid of all these dummies, they just ruin the experience of playing this game. I paid for ROI legendary recently and was looking forward to level up to 75, but I don't want to see these ugly things everywhere in the game! Please read Turbine!
Has there ever been a suggestion specifically for dummies that advertise the store cosmetics? Weren't players asking for dummies for housing so that they could put their own gear and weapons on display?
The time developing these could have actually gone to implementing them for housing instead, making a whole lot of players happy instead of causing yet another controversy.
Oh they will, I'm sure, finally add them to housing, and then you will have 2 Apparel Dummy hooks. It seems it is going toward Pay to win here, even if you're VIP. I have no beef with people being able to buy cosmetic items and mounts (that are not also rep mounts) but what I am seeing are game changing items,(buy all your traits, stats blah blah blah here!) that really should remain IN GAME and not in the store. The in-game advertising is annoying to say the least.
The only thing I'm suggesting is that people respect the company for their choice to do as they please, seeing as they continue to provide and expand this game. I subscribe and I don't care if I see them. And debating them ad nauseum probably isn't going to change anything.
"The only thing I'm suggesting is that people respect Bank of America for their choice to do as they please, seeing as they continue to provide and expand banking services for us."
I'm not suggesting that Turbine introducing apparel dummies is in any way the same thing (or even in the same league) as what B of A did with their mortgage practices, but the sentiment expressed in your quote and my made up quote is the same: respect authority because, well, it's authority.
That's not something I'm willing to do.
"Anyone who conducts an argument by appealing to authority is not using his intelligence; he is just using his memory."
--Leonardo Da Vinci
Choosing to respect all the choices that a company (or an individual) makes simply because that company or individual does other things that you like is a dangerous mentality.
Originally Posted by raychmo
Well I'm not so ignorant to believe it's catered to any one play style. It's catered to the most broad standard of player possible, in order to bring in the most users and revenue for the business so that they can in turn continue this adventure they've created. I don't create my products so that only a select few can identify with them. That would turn my customer base into a fraction of what it is. I also don't believe they're money-hungry evil overlords who are just in it for the dollar figure. Very few businesses are run that way, despite what people believe. The fact that they provide new content that is most likely toiled over and stressed about at length is proof enough. But in order to make money you must market toward those that haven't yet purchased your product. That's also why it's F2P. Marketing is about creating a product and making your customer think "I need that". So now they'll see the cosmetics and it will be just like when I first started playing. I got a taste of the game and thought, "I need to buy this in order to keep enjoying it now".
I feel for people who find these things obtrusive but ultimately is it something that's going to bug you so much during your next raid you won't be able to perform because your mind is bogged down by the thoughts that GODFORBID there's apparel dummies in Aughaire?
Thank you for your reply. I don't think that anyone is truly ignorant enough to believe that this game is catered to any one play style, I was just wondering what type of person (independent of play style) you believe the game is catered to now.
Personally, I believe it's the "thems what got more dollars than sense" crowd now (the folks who can't do the math that would inform them that buying everything piecemeal is generally more costly; the folks who fritter away money on in-app purchases and Zynga-style games, and; the uninitiated: those who purchase a cosmetic horse for $20 before they've been playing the game long enough to realize that they can get a horse in the game (sometimes even the same horse) for in-game gold instead of real world cash).
You mention that part of marketing is bringing in new customers. Another part of marketing is maintaining brand loyalty. Others have already articulated that, for them, playing (and paying for) LOTRO is something they do because they want to experience Tolkien's world. Dime store mannequins placed conspicuously throughout Middle Earth is definitely not something that those folks expect or want to see - to them, it doesn't jibe at all with the LOTRO brand. Or, perhaps more significantly, it's a further indication that the LOTRO brand has less and less to do with Middle Earth and Tolkien, and may no longer be something they want to associate with, let alone spend their money on.
I'm sure that your business has a particular style that helps maintain customers. Do you honestly believe that if you were to make a sudden and (to some) jarring change in your product that goes against exactly what some of your regular customers liked, that those customers should just respect your choice (because, in this case, you are authority) and not express their displeasure?
"Sam thinks it a queer place, but I think he likes it, too." - Frodo
"If you're in advertising or marketing, kill yourself." - Bill Hicks
I disagree with VIP being able to remove the dummies/ads. I'm all for VIPs having perks (I'm premium) but I don't think Turbine should create a problem and then sell a 'solution' to it. The dummies shouldn't be in the world in the first place.
Agreed, that's preferable, but I was talking about Turbine making a smarter business decision.
I disagree with VIP being able to remove the dummies/ads. I'm all for VIPs having perks (I'm premium) but I don't think Turbine should create a problem and then sell a 'solution' to it. The dummies shouldn't be in the world in the first place.
No, you're right, they shouldn't have been introduced in the first place.
Add my voice to those who don't like this "addition" to the game. They look stupid, out of place, and inappropriate. There might have been a way to do this, if they really had to, by putting them in interior, appropriate locations (e.g inns/ taverns or stores) but out in the open like this, with all the flashy stars, is just horribly done.
Remove them, or move them someplace they don't stick out like a sore thumb.
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First off let me state that I am a 5 year veteran of the game, a VIP subscriber, buy additional TP when it makes sense and I spend them when I need them. I support this game financially and have for years because I love the world, the game and want to spend time here.
This has got to be the one of the most unforgiveable things that Turbine has done in recent memory. I was ticked when they were selling reputation horses in the store (again, FINE with store exclusive mounts, just not recycling appearances for something you should be earning in game) I'm kind of fine with relic removal scrolls (even though that's removing previous functionality from the game) and all the buttons, ads and other store related things that have been added. I am NOT fine with this.
It's asinine that these dummies exist anywhere other than the major racial hubs (again, not a fan even there, but AT LEAST limit them to these locations, as they seem the most likely for "shopping") and quite frankly you ARE cheapening the world when they appear anywhere like Galtrev, which for all intents and purposes is a more primitive setting, and I find it VERY VERY VERY unlikely that anyone there would produce, let alone sell a silly pirate outfit! I'm probably going to cry internally when I see these things in places like Aughaire and others and it may make my hand move the mouse to the Exit Game button.
I have friends that have just started playing the game, and stuff like this is GOING to turn them off, and you will likely loose not only people that will willingly pay for VIP, but also will purchase TP.
Move the stupid things inside at the very least and better yet, just add a button to the Outfitter to take the player to the cosmetic section of the store. When you get the notice that you can have outfits you could even give the player a quest to go visit the outfitter...anything is better than this garbage.
I'm just copying this post because I love it. Please move these things inside at least, or as suggested add a button. This is just crass and insulting.
I guess I just don't see it this way as I feel like this is the equivalent to someone condemning me for providing an ad or coupon in the box when someone buys one of my products.
Not even close...
If I bought something from you and you put an ad or a sale sheet in the box, I could ignore it. Take out of the box what i bought and throw away the rest with out even seeing the ad/sale sheet. Now if you permanently glued it to what ever I purchased then you might be close to a comparison.
Sweet Water and Light Laughter Till Next We Meet!
Looks like after everything that has gone down lately, I will no longer be supporting Turbine with my money.
Turbine, I am appalled. When I see something done right I applaud it, and vice versa. This... is... utterly disgusting, it breaks the atmosphere that you have set in place, what is next? Giant billboards alongside the major travel routes? Remove them from the game please, they are ludicrous, money-grubbing, out of place, and you are out of line.
Fell Deeds awake, Now for wrath,
Now for Ruin, And a Red Dawn.
FORTH EORLINGAS!
They look cheap and amateurish. What happened to all the respect Turbine profess to have for Tolkien and Middle Earth?
Dummies in Moria/Caras Galadhon? Really? It's not annoying me, it just cheapens all the hard work that was put in to create such wonderful scenery and regions. They're just so...tacky.
And to make it worse you say it was a "player suggestion". Which is sort of insulting. Don't go and blame us for your bad ideas.
Last edited by nubcat; Jul 09 2012 at 04:27 PM.
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I'm speechless... and some people have the nerve to support this... this atrocity!
If I wrote my actual feelings about this "idea" and its implementation I would probably get banned, so I will just leave some more civil co players elaborate on this latest lore breaking fiasco.
Arequain Belechael, Legate of Celosien, Minas Brethil, Lebennin
They look cheap and amateurish. What happened to all the respect Turbine profess to have for Tolkien and Middle Earth?
Dummies in Moria/Caras Galadhon? Really? It's not annoying me, it just cheapens all the hard work that was put in to create such wonderful scenery and regions. They're just so...tacky.
And to make it worse you say it was a "player suggestion". Which is sort of insulting. Don't go and blame us for your bad ideas.
If I were one of their talented landscape devs I'd be truly upset. It's like painting a masterpiece of a landscape, and then have some hoodlum come along with a can of spray paint and put in rude and crass images, utterly detroying the atmosphere that you worked so hard to create.
WoW is the AOL of MMOs. They have millions of subscribers who just don't know any better because they're idiots. - Talaa
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