Discussion: Archer or Sage?

ok my cap is almost to level 20 so i thought i should ask. in the past for my caps i went with archer and loved it. but i was thinking about grabing the sage for the AoE. so which one?

Envoyé par Light12

ok my cap is almost to level 20 so i thought i should ask. in the past for my caps i went with archer and loved it. but i was thinking about grabing the sage for the AoE. so which one?

A curveball:

Go with a Sage built for single target DPS.

Why?

A Sage and an Herbalist will use most of the same training skills, so it's less grind to get both of them, whereas you need two complete sets if you decide to get an herbalist after you get an archer.

Setting the Sage to Single Target also helps with it's survivability, since an AE focused sage tends to go **SQUISH** really fast from agro.

I agree on the single target dps. This has 2 advantages: 1. the soldier doesn't aggro multiple mobs and die fast, 2. the soldier kills mobs sequentially which will space out your defeat responses a bit more (it's heuristic, sue me! ).

I'd pick the archer. She's a little tougher than the sage. You'd only share 1 or 2 training traits between the herbalist and the sage anyway so the points spent on those aren't a big deal.

I'm not sure which one does more single target dps, but my guess is the archer.



*(Tactical Potency and what?. I wouldn't use the light armour trait; did you see how much armour it actually gives your soldier? Ick!)

Envoyé par dietlbomb

I'd pick the archer. She's a little tougher than the sage. You'd only share 1 or 2 training traits between the herbalist and the sage anyway so the points spent on those aren't a big deal.

I'm not sure which one does more single target dps, but my guess is the archer.



*(Tactical Potency and what?. I wouldn't use the light armour trait; did you see how much armour it actually gives your soldier? Ick!)

Tactical Potency, Crit, +MOrale and ICPR/FInesse

Envoyé par Almagnus1

Tactical Potency, Crit, +MOrale and ICPR/FInesse

For the herbalist, I would pick Tactical Potency and ICPR, but not crit (last time I parsed it, the herbalist never critted at all.) I think I would go for the evade buff or the physical mitigation buff for number 3.

For the archer I would pick Physical Potency, crit, and either a survivability trait (evade or physical mitigation) or more dps like Armour Penetration or Finesse.

For the sage, I would pick Tactical Potency, crit, and either a survivability trait (evade or physical mitigation) or Finesse.

edit: Also, a nice thing the sage does is debuff your enemies. Don't overlook this when you make your decision. That Chilling Winds debuff is a direct reduction in damage that you will take during the battle.

ok i guess ill try the sage and build it up for single target DPS.

i like archer best. but its close, as im sure most will agree... both are great choices.

out the gate, i found archer to have more dmg (because of the initial skills available... but im goin from memory and might be wrong), but sage quickly equals out.

archer has one end-game edge, it give a ranged bonus that makes your archer pet (if you use one) do more dmg... while small, every little bit helps.

Indeed. They are both pretty equal. I have lots of alts, and some use the sage and some use the archer.

There are only a couple of times where your choice of soldier matters:

1. group skirmishes (12-man especially) where you want zero melee soldiers to ruin your plans for boss fights
2. challenging skirmishes (tier II or III) where you probably want an herbalist for that extra survivability edge

Otherwise, the differences between the archer and sage are marginal.

I'll add one anecdote.

When Attack at Dawn first came out, I went through it solo. I knew that I had to stop the goblins from escaping from the boss fight, so I spent almost the whole fight just attacking adds. Before I knew it, my archer had finished off the boss without me even noticing what was going on.

The sage might be able to do that, but I think the archer has the edge in survivability.

I just want to add something here about the sage - and that is that they don't mix too well with other melee-based skirmish soliders. So for example: if you like to do skirmishes with friends who rely on using Protectors as their tanks - be warned.

For some reason a lot of the abilities the Sage uses will cause melee-based skirmish soliders to stop attacking their current target and go find another target. It can be a real pain sometimes.

Envoyé par Jeremi

For some reason a lot of the abilities the Sage uses will cause melee-based skirmish soliders to stop attacking their current target and go find another target. It can be a real pain sometimes.

Is that the root? I was forewarned to never give the sage the skill to root things (I forget which class I first saw it recommended for) simply because then they are rooted and you can't move the MOBs where you want them.

But secondarily, other soldiers would obviously stop attacking to not break the CC.

You might just unslot the root skill to verify in your case (I've simply never trained it on any sage I've had).



"Sometimes survival comes down to not being hit. Actually, most times." -the chicken skill, Bob and Weave

Envoyé par RJFerret

Is that the root? I was forewarned to never give the sage the skill to root things (I forget which class I first saw it recommended for) simply because then they are rooted and you can't move the MOBs where you want them.

But secondarily, other soldiers would obviously stop attacking to not break the CC.

You might just unslot the root skill to verify in your case (I've simply never trained it on any sage I've had).



"Sometimes survival comes down to not being hit. Actually, most times." -the chicken skill, Bob and Weave

I'm really not sure what it is Ferret. I've never used the Sage personally - but I'd be real surprised if it was just a single move that did it. I would guess that it's at least a couple of moves that they have which causes this to occur.

Because when I skirmish with friends who use them, it's just ridiculous how often it prevents my Protector from attacking the actual mob I tell him too. It's so bad I ususally just give up and accept the fact that if a sage is present, I'm going to be tanking all of the bosses instead of my solider lol

Envoyé par RJFerret

Is that the root? I was forewarned to never give the sage the skill to root things (I forget which class I first saw it recommended for) simply because then they are rooted and you can't move the MOBs where you want them.

But secondarily, other soldiers would obviously stop attacking to not break the CC.

You might just unslot the root skill to verify in your case (I've simply never trained it on any sage I've had).

That Sage skill is called: Tanglefoot - never use it.

And a useful reference for those considering rolling a sage: http://lotro-wiki.com/index.php/Role:_Sage

I went with a sage and then herbalist when I go in raids.

I did a T3 Gondamon with an Herbalist LtC and Banner of War traited and it was really easy. Only problem I had was the herbalist pulling initial aggro on multiple mobs, but Inspire would always bring it back to me. I've also tried it with the Skirmish and Oathbreaker Archers together, which was actually harder. It seems like the stability offered by an Herbalist outweighs the speed offered by the Archer.

Envoyé par GeorgeBaggy

I did a T3 Gondamon with an Herbalist LtC and Banner of War traited and it was really easy. Only problem I had was the herbalist pulling initial aggro on multiple mobs, but Inspire would always bring it back to me. I've also tried it with the Skirmish and Oathbreaker Archers together, which was actually harder. It seems like the stability offered by an Herbalist outweighs the speed offered by the Archer.

I prefer stabiltiy over speed as well.

Envoyé par Jeremi

I prefer stabiltiy over speed as well.

Well, we all DID roll capns!