Turbine have only ever opened up the Beta to players about a week before it goes live (sometimes 2 at the very most)
RoR is slated for early Sept release, so if history stands then we wont get a peek until at least the 3rd week in August
And that gives Turbine all the time they need to call anticimex for all the bugs found, right?
Well, they released the Beta only two months before Isengard, and take a look at what that was.
Although, since this expansion has no instances on the exact release, I would assume it would be cleansed of landscape bugs and mounted combat (Since that is the entirety of it)
Although, since this expansion has no instances on the exact release, I would assume it would be cleansed of landscape bugs and mounted combat (Since that is the entirety of it)
I doubt your assumption is valid. Turbine has never released any Lotro content that is bug free. That includes the initial launch, all previous expansions and all major content updates. Only a few of the minor content updates have been bug free. Many of the minor updates either didn't fix the problems the update was deployed to fix or released new bugs into the wild that often were worse than the bug they were trying to kill.
We can all hope Riders of Rohan works better than Rise of Isengard. RoI was in pretty bad shape.
Unless stated otherwise, all content in this post is My Personal Opinion.
We can all hope Riders of Rohan works better than Rise of Isengard. RoI was in pretty bad shape.
Because your memory is clearly better than mine.
I can remember the major issues with wardens, Draigoch, and 1 landscape quest and 1 landscape region [Pit of Iron]. The landscape region was entirely completable with persistence (and led to community guides and friendly tours.), the quest didn't take long for people to find the solution to the quest text error.
Apart from these notable issues, what bugs are sticking out as concerning? Obviously I hope Rohan will turn out better than Isengard, but apart from Draigoch, and Wardens (if you were happened to play one),
and the Minstrel coda-wipe, all the major issues I can think of were easily dealt with prior to the first hot-fix even.
Turbine have only ever opened up the Beta to players about a week before it goes live (sometimes 2 at the very most)
RoR is slated for early Sept release, so if history stands then we wont get a peek until at least the 3rd week in August
Open beta is 1-2 weeks prior to live, but closed beta is typically 2 months prior; closed beta is invitation only. The Bullroarer forum is no longer publicly available, so it's a good assumption that closed beta has started or is near to starting.
I doubt your assumption is valid. Turbine has never released any Lotro content that is bug free.
NO company has EVER released non-trivial software with no bugs in it.
Some releases are buggier than other. There was one IBM release of OS/360--a version of OS/MFT, IIRC, though it could have been OS/MVT--that was notorious for both the number and severity of bug. A count was made showing that that particular release had *10,000* SIGNIFICANT defects in it.
Open beta is 1-2 weeks prior to live, but closed beta is typically 2 months prior; closed beta is invitation only. The Bullroarer forum is no longer publicly available, so it's a good assumption that closed beta has started or is near to starting.
In the past, the Bullroarer server and forum have often been taken down when there is no beta content to be tested. The fact that they're down now doesn't really tell us anything more than that they're down.
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Originally Posted by fett666
Soon?
Yes.
Originally Posted by Malindruel
Going off past history
Turbine have only ever opened up the Beta to players about a week before it goes live (sometimes 2 at the very most)
RoR is slated for early Sept release, so if history stands then we wont get a peek until at least the 3rd week in August
Expansion Betas last a few months normally. Not weeks. It's usually by invitation only, starting with small groups and growing larger as we approach launch. usually these groups are invited based on a number of factors including whether or not they pre-purchased the expansion.
Originally Posted by Namesse
The Bullroarer forum is no longer publicly available, so it's a good assumption that closed beta has started or is near to starting.
Yep, we close off the Bullroarer forums as we prepare for beta.
Rick Heaton, Community Manager, The Lord of the Rings Online.
Expansion Betas last a few months normally. Not weeks. It's usually by invitation only, starting with small groups and growing larger as we approach launch. usually these groups are invited based on a number of factors including whether or not they pre-purchased the expansion.
Yep, we close off the Bullroarer forums as we prepare for beta.
Just wondering a bit here, but wouldn't it be for the best interest of the game to include some lifetimers? We actually were, and are, dedicated enough to the game to buy a subscription for LIFE. I know that we may not be many enough to be of very much monetary value to you, and as such, there's never been made any option to pre-purchase the expansions with TP's, but we ARE long time players, and we ARE dedicated enough that we should be in the consideration for this. In my humble opinion ofc. And sorry If I stepped on any toes by saying this.
Sincerelly Yours
European.
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Just wondering a bit here, but wouldn't it be for the best interest of the game to include some lifetimers? ...
What makes you think lifetimers are not invited to closed beta?
Unless you actually want to say that lifetimers should get preferred invitation. In that case one can only say that this would skew the player average ( a mix of all types, Lifetimers to F2P, Hardcore players to casuals) that you want to have for representative test results.
A lifer is just a perma-VIP, nothing more, nothing less. People bought lifetime accounts because it seemed like a profitable long-term investment, and not because they were the most dedicated players/customers.
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Originally Posted by European1000
Just wondering a bit here, but wouldn't it be for the best interest of the game to include some lifetimers? We actually were, and are, dedicated enough to the game to buy a subscription for LIFE. I know that we may not be many enough to be of very much monetary value to you, and as such, there's never been made any option to pre-purchase the expansions with TP's, but we ARE long time players, and we ARE dedicated enough that we should be in the consideration for this. In my humble opinion ofc. And sorry If I stepped on any toes by saying this.
Sincerelly Yours
European.
You certainly aren't stepping on any toes and I hope I don't step on any with my reply.
The reason why we consider pre-purchasers first is very close to your argument. They made the commitment first to the expansion and as such should rightly be moved to the head of the line and afforded the opportunity to get a first look at what they have paid for. It's not a 100% guarantee of beta access, but it's as close as we get.
Rick Heaton, Community Manager, The Lord of the Rings Online.
What makes you think lifetimers are not invited to closed beta?
Unless you actually want to say that lifetimers should get preferred invitation. In that case one can only say that this would skew the player average ( a mix of all types, Lifetimers to F2P, Hardcore players to casuals) that you want to have for representative test results.
A lifer is just a perma-VIP, nothing more, nothing less. People bought lifetime accounts because it seemed like a profitable long-term investment, and not because they were the most dedicated players/customers.
Hm. there are always someone who assumes a hidden agenda. No I don't think lifetimers should get preferred invites. I'm not saying that everyone is dedicated, but the odds of someone being dedicated ARE pretty decent, wouldn't you agree? And The only reason I posted this is that I haven't met eny lifetimers who got this invite, so I thought they may be excluded, for monetary reasons, which would be a shame, imho. If I'm wrong, I'm happy to know it, cause, as I said. it would be for the best of the game!
European l75 Hunter
Roulette l75 Runekeeper
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You certainly aren't stepping on any toes and I hope I don't step on any with my reply.
The reason why we consider pre-purchasers first is very close to your argument. They made the commitment first to the expansion and as such should rightly be moved to the head of the line and afforded the opportunity to get a first look at what they have paid for. It's not a 100% guarantee of beta access, but it's as close as we get.
Thank you for answering I only wish us to be considered. That s all
European l75 Hunter
Roulette l75 Runekeeper
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...
Apart from these notable issues, what bugs are sticking out as concerning?...
The biggest RoI "bug" still is that almost the whole region is sterile and free of side games/challenging mobs to hunt (i.e. rares) or stuff to explore that the on-rails questing did not pull you past.
Assuming you're talking about Rohan, normally closed betas start with an NDA period during which even saying that you were given an invitation outside of the beta-server and beta-forum itself is grounds for immediate dismissal.
The biggest RoI "bug" still is that almost the whole region is sterile and free of side games/challenging mobs to hunt (i.e. rares) or stuff to explore that the on-rails questing did not pull you past.
I said "bug", not "disagreements in design philosophy".
Assuming you're talking about Rohan, normally closed betas start with an NDA period during which even saying that you were given an invitation outside of the beta-server and beta-forum itself is grounds for immediate dismissal.
Keep it secret. Keep it safe.
DW. I would never tell anyone. But Talking to ppl AFTER the beta's (when the release is live), noone told me they were accepted. I assume that they would have been allowed to admit it then? Yes I am talking about previous beta's now ofc.
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Fantomet l67 Guardian
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DW. I would never tell anyone. But Talking to ppl AFTER the beta's (when the release is live), noone told me they were accepted. I assume that they would have been allowed to admit it then? Yes I am talking about previous beta's now ofc.
Okay, well, I am a lifer and I've been in every paid expansion beta (Moria, Mirkwood and RoI). Nice to meet you.
The caveat being of course that I did pre-order each of those, so when that became a way to get "to the top of the list" that would have helped.
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Originally Posted by Crell_1
Assuming you're talking about Rohan, normally closed betas start with an NDA period during which even saying that you were given an invitation outside of the beta-server and beta-forum itself is grounds for immediate dismissal.
Keep it secret. Keep it safe.
This is a very important point to bring up. If you are accepted into beta you are not permitted to talk about it anywhere but the official beta forums. Even telling your friends you got an invite will mean you could be ejected from the beta.
As we like to say...
BETA RULES
You do not talk about Beta.
You DO NOT talk about Beta.
If you violate any of the above rules, your beta is over.
Rick Heaton, Community Manager, The Lord of the Rings Online.
Apart from these notable issues, what bugs are sticking out as concerning? Obviously I hope Rohan will turn out better than Isengard, but apart from Draigoch, and Wardens (if you were happened to play one),
and the Minstrel coda-wipe, all the major issues I can think of were easily dealt with prior to the first hot-fix even.
Rune-Keepers' Sigils of Healing are still falling through the floor on top of Orthanc. Not only do we not get the AoE heals from them, but it reduces the effectiveness of our other main group-heal by 30%. Not completely a RoI issue, but the Tower raid is certainly the most problematic. It falls through the floor in other, lesser instances too, and did so before RoI. However, there are surfaces that it DOESN'T fall through, and the Tower of Orthanc SHOULD have been one of them.
While you burn at the stake, I dance with the flames. I take what you love and leave you in tears. I am relentless, unpredictable, and waiting for your last breath.
Rune-Keepers' Sigils of Healing are still falling through the floor on top of Orthanc.
Nice catch. It's been so long since I've healed Saruman on my Runekeeper that I'd forgotten. That said, it's clearly healable without. Draigoch is also completable reliably. I'll also point out the point of my post was talking about non-instanced content. They've delayed the instance content and hopefully that will help keep the quality of instanced content up
They do not fall through the entire floor. There are spots where they fall and stay there to provide the effects, look for them before starting the raid.
If you violate any of the above rules, your beta is over.
Additionally, depending on the severity of your beta rules violation, your live account could receive disciplinary action, up to and including a permanent LIFETIME ban from the beta AND LIVE servers.
NO company has EVER released non-trivial software with no bugs in it.
Some releases are buggier than other. There was one IBM release of OS/360--a version of OS/MFT, IIRC, though it could have been OS/MVT--that was notorious for both the number and severity of bug. A count was made showing that that particular release had *10,000* SIGNIFICANT defects in it.
--W. H. Heydt
Old Used Progammer
Mainframe? Bleh! My company still uses some z/OS and some AS/400. Rock solid, but jeez. You have to be British, play cricket, and drive a Jaguar to truly "understand" it.
While you burn at the stake, I dance with the flames. I take what you love and leave you in tears. I am relentless, unpredictable, and waiting for your last breath.
DW. I would never tell anyone. But Talking to ppl AFTER the beta's (when the release is live), noone told me they were accepted. I assume that they would have been allowed to admit it then? Yes I am talking about previous beta's now ofc.
As was already posted by another (but just to show he was isn't unique), my wife and I--both with Lifetime accounts--have been in closed beta for all expansions (as well as closed beta before SoA went live). Of course, we also pre-purchased the expansions, just as we have pre-purchased RoR. Since, as Sapience notes, the beta starts "soon" (thus, no invites have gone out), only time will tell if we get in the RoR beta. As a strict believer in adhering to Turbine's NDAs, I am willing to lie about being in a beta if asked directly. So, while an NDA is in effect, I will tell you that I am not in it, regardless of whether I am or not.
As was already posted by another (but just to show he was isn't unique), my wife and I--both with Lifetime accounts--have been in closed beta for all expansions (as well as closed beta before SoA went live). Of course, we also pre-purchased the expansions, just as we have pre-purchased RoR. Since, as Sapience notes, the beta starts "soon" (thus, no invites have gone out), only time will tell if we get in the RoR beta. As a strict believer in adhering to Turbine's NDAs, I am willing to lie about being in a beta if asked directly. So, while an NDA is in effect, I will tell you that I am not in it, regardless of whether I am or not.
So, while an NDA is in effect, I will tell you that I am not in it, regardless of whether I am or not.
--W. H. Heydt
Old Used Programmer
Mostly trying to get to know a noted member of the community better.
Will you admit that you lied about it after the fact? Will you go out of your way to claim that you aren't in the beta?
Edit:
Were you a forum notable in the list here: that in fact had already received an invite? http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.p...15#post5658915
- ..I'm surprised. I thought you were on this list.. I'm still curious about the rest!
Mostly trying to get to know a noted member of the community better.
Will you admit that you lied about it after the fact? Will you go out of your way to claim that you aren't in the beta?
Edit:
Were you a forum notable in the list here: that in fact had already received an invite? http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.p...15#post5658915
- ..I'm surprised. I thought you were on this list.. I'm still curious about the rest!
That list is quite amusing. There are thousands of players who don't post on these forums but I'm sure contribute to the game via /bug reports etc. It's funny that people would think that, because of contributions to the forums, someone would be given more priority for that reason alone - even if their posts are constructive and helpful.
When there are thousands (maybe even hundreds of thousands) of accounts to select from I wonder if any are specifically hand-picked or if they are indeed all selected at random. The sheer quantity would be impossible to sort through manually.
Either way, I don't think it's fair on any players who perhaps may be invited to be scrutinised on a list of 'potential testers' in a hope to provoke a response out of them. As much as I would love to take part in the RoR Beta, if I am not selected then I would rather wait to see the expansion first-hand at launch than know who the people are that get to see Rohan before me.
Mainframe? Bleh! My company still uses some z/OS and some AS/400. Rock solid, but jeez. You have to be British, play cricket, and drive a Jaguar to truly "understand" it.
The particularly buggy version OS/360 was in the late 1960s or early 1970s. IBM has spent a long time and a lot of money working on how to produce good software....and they're very good at it, but--like everyone else--not perfect.
Sometimes their solutions work but leave something to be desired. I found a bug in the COBOL II compiler that IBM "solved" by changing the manual to say that you couldn't *do* that. Ask your z/OS buddies about extending a spanned KSDS VSAM record in COBOL.
Because your memory is clearly better than mine.
I can remember the major issues with wardens, Draigoch, and 1 landscape quest and 1 landscape region [Pit of Iron]. The landscape region was entirely completable with persistence (and led to community guides and friendly tours.), the quest didn't take long for people to find the solution to the quest text error.
Apart from these notable issues, what bugs are sticking out as concerning? Obviously I hope Rohan will turn out better than Isengard, but apart from Draigoch, and Wardens (if you were happened to play one),
and the Minstrel coda-wipe, all the major issues I can think of were easily dealt with prior to the first hot-fix even.
Certain quests being locked out if you did the "wrong" quest to begin with. Then there's also creep mitigationsand codas and markers missing or in the entire wrong place for multiple quests... and quests lockout if you complete certain quests... Timers being off for dailies, great holes opening up in the ground in front of players, mobs not resetting properly, persistent combat (although it existed prior to RoI it got worse), logging issues (after u6... lets not even talk about u7). But apart from those and a few i cba to mention it was practically bugfree
Originally Posted by Crell_1
They've delayed the instance content and hopefully that will help keep the quality of instanced content up
Oh dear, i hope not. I'd rather have improved queality over what we have now. Anyone remember the tower being closed for renovations? Or certain encounters being officially wai but no one able to beat them until they actually fixed those encounters?
That list is quite amusing. There are thousands of players who don't post on these forums but I'm sure contribute to the game via /bug reports etc. It's funny that people would think that, because of contributions to the forums, someone would be given more priority for that reason alone - even if their posts are constructive and helpful.
When there are thousands (maybe even hundreds of thousands) of accounts to select from I wonder if any are specifically hand-picked or if they are indeed all selected at random. The sheer quantity would be impossible to sort through manually.
Don't get me wrong. I don't expect that they'd give any sort of priority to users for 'forum discussion' or 'community popularity'. The only kind of priority based beta is the Palantir program which isn't available to non-VIPs. That said, Turbine had the ability to show some discretion in past betas, (insert story about user who posted a major exploit getting a personalized invite.) which I understand wasn't possible in anyway with in the RoI beta.
I do think it's interesting to look the login data that we have available to us, see what kinds of percentages of players are invited (as compared to live login data for similar periods.)
NO company has EVER released non-trivial software with no bugs in it.
I do not know if this statement is true. My old mind is having memory problems. I recall being part of a team of software development engineers years ago. We were one of several companies that were delivering software components for a large system. The core component was done by a company with a reputation for delivering software packages with zero defects.
I can't remember their name. What I do remember is that the specification process was grueling. This company mandated that the customer and interface partners provide a very detailed design specification. We get these long questionnaires asking what should be done.
When you got their software, you got the software plus a complete human readable definition of what the software does. When they delivered their core component, it worked exactly according to the specification. Our company like all the other receivers agreed that this specification fully described what we wanted.
None of us (all the other companies) were able to find anything wrong with their software. There were a few cases where what we asked for did not work when put all the pieces together. They were nice enough to change their software. We had to pay for all the changes. Changes were slow because of their requirement that we specify exactly what we wanted.
Last edited by Yula_the_Mighty; Jun 25 2012 at 05:59 PM.
Unless stated otherwise, all content in this post is My Personal Opinion.
I did not get an invite to RoI beta. I also did not pre-order until very late.
I think but am not sure that the original Isengard program never lifted the NDA (ie, the original alpha testing group), although some players have mentioned being in it. Palantir program is still ongoing so their NDA is in effect.
Also the betas now seem to be a bit different than in the past. Mirkwood beta required an application (sort of like Palantir now), whereas the later ones seem to be much more open (ie, pre-order to apply, or for F2P beta there was a short sign up web page). The new closed betas aren't as completely chaotic as open betas but they are a bit more loose then older closed betas I remember.
Hm. there are always someone who assumes a hidden agenda. No I don't think lifetimers should get preferred invites. I'm not saying that everyone is dedicated, but the odds of someone being dedicated ARE pretty decent, wouldn't you agree? And The only reason I posted this is that I haven't met eny lifetimers who got this invite, so I thought they may be excluded, for monetary reasons, which would be a shame, imho. If I'm wrong, I'm happy to know it, cause, as I said. it would be for the best of the game!
Well, I can tell you that I have one lifetime account (plus a copule others), and my lifetime account, as well as one of my other accounts, has indeed gotten beta invites for Mirkwood, F2P, and RoI, so it does happen. I can also tell you that I have never been in the first wave of invites even though I pre-chased both Mirkwood and RoI, so if you don't get an invite right away, it's safe to assume that you're still in the running and could still get an invite.
You know that random number generator that we hate so much in game because we always seem to lose the rolls for the stuff we want? It's at work here as well, much to my dismay.
I've haven't understood the need for silence on recent expansions. All it seems to be is a period of time where a few people know which items to stockpile for cheap on Live so they can sell them for 10x the price on launch day back to the people they just bought them from.
Work like no one is watching, dance like you don't need the money...
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I only wish us to be considered. That s all 
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