I was trying not to post on the forums anymore, but couldn't find a post about this anywhere, so I thought someone should say it. I see so much complaining about how one side if OP, or how something is unfair. I will admit freeps are a little more powerful than creeps from my experiences in the moors over the past five years. There are some cases where I see being 1 side, or the other has made the influence of a battle. The biggest factor in these things I see though is player skill, I always see people complaining about how in X vs. X fights how one side is broken. I could understand your complaining if you knew everyone in your raid is doing what they're suppose to. I'm not trying to say in any way that a certain group of people is bad, but I see complaints about freep dps ALL the time, but 50% of the battles i don't see defilers throw even 1 heal. Of course your raid is going to get demolished if your healers aren't healing(freep or creepside). There are some arguments that are valid about how certain things are overpowered. Although, if you are losing with more than 2:1 numbers, no matter what side you're on, i strongly suggest you try to evaluate what your raid is doing wrong instead of what the other raid is doing right. I've not seen 1 battle won by one side with 2:1 numbers, or more, without one side doing something extremely wrong like not following target assist, or not playing healing classes properly. This is why certain groups can roll you with more, they tell each other what they're doing wrong and help them to become a better player instead of focusing on how the other side is broken and just trying to zerg them.
Even though this thread will probably be filled with QQ of the worst abusers of what I've stated, but no matter what the case you know what I say is right, because without knowing your allies and helping them improve, you will never accomplish anything as a player.
~If this changes the way 1 player sees pvp, I will be happy because the moors will be a better place with even more competitive pvmp
I was trying not to post on the forums anymore, but couldn't find a post about this anywhere, so I thought someone should say it. I see so much complaining about how one side if OP, or how something is unfair. I will admit freeps are a little more powerful than creeps from my experiences in the moors over the past five years. There are some cases where I see being 1 side, or the other has made the influence of a battle. The biggest factor in these things I see though is player skill, I always see people complaining about how in X vs. X fights how one side is broken. I could understand your complaining if you knew everyone in your raid is doing what they're suppose to. I'm not trying to say in any way that a certain group of people is bad, but I see complaints about freep dps ALL the time, but 50% of the battles i don't see defilers throw even 1 heal. Of course your raid is going to get demolished if your healers aren't healing(freep or creepside). There are some arguments that are valid about how certain things are overpowered. Although, if you are losing with more than 2:1 numbers, no matter what side you're on, i strongly suggest you try to evaluate what your raid is doing wrong instead of what the other raid is doing right. I've not seen 1 battle won by one side with 2:1 numbers, or more, without one side doing something extremely wrong like not following target assist, or not playing healing classes properly. This is why certain groups can roll you with more, they tell each other what they're doing wrong and help them to become a better player instead of focusing on how the other side is broken and just trying to zerg them.
Even though this thread will probably be filled with QQ of the worst abusers of what I've stated, but no matter what the case you know what I say is right, because without knowing your allies and helping them improve, you will never accomplish anything as a player.
~If this changes the way 1 player sees pvp, I will be happy because the moors will be a better place with even more competitive pvmp
Until things like the open and direct exploitation of audacity by groups like the garnival is fixed in the moors, I don't wanna hear shyt from anyone. When my groups are togther people are doing their jobs or they will not be asked back. When 18 creeps can't take down 6 freeps, the OP imbalances you are crying about are just bothersome little fleas. What groups like this do is blatantly exploit the 30% damage reduction with certain buffs and passive skills making them all but unkillable. So the creeps surely know what imabalance is, I assure you.
"The freeps largeness disappears when they see Plok's largeness"
and now for something fun and full of zest. Pete's cover of an English Beat classic:
*edit* hmm folks are already self editing, or dem mods are to be deleting...
either way, jump up from your chair shake your booty and think of something happy... and if that isn't possible curl up in a bitter corner and listen to this song instead:
Last edited by Fraegster; Jun 20 2012 at 03:57 AM.
Xnoy - rank something or other Warg, and Wyver - rank mango fiesta delight Defiler
Until things like the open and direct exploitation of audacity by groups like the garnival is fixed in the moors, I don't wanna hear shyt from anyone. When my groups are togther people are doing their jobs or they will not be asked back. When 18 creeps can't take down 6 freeps, the OP imbalances you are crying about are just bothersome little fleas. What groups like this do is blatantly exploit the 30% damage reduction with certain buffs and passive skills making them all but unkillable. So the creeps surely know what imabalance is, I assure you.
You think i haven't fought team garny? I've had a lot of good small group on small group fights with them, and instead of just exploding on the fourms, I'm just going to say that from the garny video's I've seen your raid is never on target assist, which i've experienced while in your raids also, i'm not saying it's your fault, your raids are pretty simple, but i still yet to see very few defilers play the class as it's ment to be played.
You think i haven't fought team garny? I've had a lot of good small group on small group fights with them, and instead of just exploding on the fourms, I'm just going to say that from the garny video's I've seen your raid is never on target assist, which i've experienced while in your raids also, i'm not saying it's your fault, your raids are pretty simple, but i still yet to see very few defilers play the class as it's ment to be played.
I dont remember seeing my raid in may of those epeen videos he posts. As I said people in my raid are doing their jobs.
"The freeps largeness disappears when they see Plok's largeness"
Until things like the open and direct exploitation of audacity by groups like the garnival is fixed in the moors, I don't wanna hear shyt from anyone. When my groups are togther people are doing their jobs or they will not be asked back. When 18 creeps can't take down 6 freeps, the OP imbalances you are crying about are just bothersome little fleas. What groups like this do is blatantly exploit the 30% damage reduction with certain buffs and passive skills making them all but unkillable. So the creeps surely know what imabalance is, I assure you.
When you use a word like "exploit" you're saying people are cheating. I really would like to understand how there is cheating. In the past I have seen you say this, and I always wondered if you meant the damage reduction when a RK is healing with All Fates active, coupled with Audacity and stun immunity from a LM. But yet, the last two times we have all squared off and fought for 5 minutes each time btw, no RK was even healing.
So, please explain how wearing audacity - just like you - playing one's class, using CDs when needed, getting off a timely rez in combat, etc., is cheating.
What "certain buffs" - what "passives"?
Last edited by Gillianrial; Jun 20 2012 at 08:38 AM.
♦ R13 Minstrel ♦ Guardians of the Dagorlad ♦ Jaiyne ♦
Until things like the open and direct exploitation of audacity by groups like the garnival is fixed in the moors, I don't wanna hear shyt from anyone. When my groups are togther people are doing their jobs or they will not be asked back. When 18 creeps can't take down 6 freeps, the OP imbalances you are crying about are just bothersome little fleas. What groups like this do is blatantly exploit the 30% damage reduction with certain buffs and passive skills making them all but unkillable. So the creeps surely know what imabalance is, I assure you.
working on it atm and this is no diss to the garnival whatsoever
gonna get a group of 8 creeps and take out the 6 from the garnival, ill even make a video of it
(again only to prove that its not impossible to take them out)
dont hold your breath though, still need to build audacity on the creep set up
Im just curious here, can you detail a bit more what you mean by this? How should Defilers being played?
A lot of the random defilers don't blight groups, they blight the solo away from the group, or they just don't use hots and wonder why everyone is dying.
Not all freep classes are OP when it comes to the moors. The problem is, most playing freeps tend to play the most op of the classes. There has been a rapid influx of RK's Minstrels, Wardens and Champs. Lore-masters have skills that are so lopsided when facing creep players. Most of the skills given these classes were designed to give them an edge in PVE. But when used in pvp these skill sets make them almost unbeatable.
We hear cries from the other side of "Learn to play your Class!" but most f the creeps I know are well versed in their class, and work as a team. But when we are out healed, out dpsed, out cc'd and have to deal with Napalm and epic conclusions of 4-5k a hit, well, no amount of skill will help.
Turbine has twiddled and adjusted us into being little more then walking talking renown dispensers. And though we do see some exploitation, on both sides by the way. Most of this is not cheating, but using the broken mechanics introduced by the powers that be to achieve a mean.
Pouncival-Rank 13-Leader of the Pouncing Pwny
We Pounce Because We Care
You guys all take things to seriously. And rat your thinking to hard. Play the game pvp to your best ability and try not to get your &&& kicked.
I know :/....It kinda hurts. I figured people would just tell me I'm stupid or something, but instead they're just show how epeen they are by not being able to admit that there group doesn't work perfectly every time. I'm not afraid to say this just because by saying any group is fine and not making mistakes? please tell me your joking lol.
working on it atm and this is no diss to the garnival whatsoever
gonna get a group of 8 creeps and take out the 6 from the garnival, ill even make a video of it
(again only to prove that its not impossible to take them out)
dont hold your breath though, still need to build audacity on the creep set up
I'm glad someone is actually gonna take the time to test this, I just hope it will be done as a random encounter in the open when he is out with his group running around the moors, and not a set up encounter where they'll know what is being tested and could affect the outcome of the fight.
Last edited by Forza; Jun 20 2012 at 12:14 PM.
Nandir - Caradhraz - Alundil - and others
Burzumgoth - Nardur - Zhugash - and others
You can link it till you're blue in the face sir, it is still the same lame &&&&. In Ultima Online we would have referred to folks like you as the doodish.
Last edited by Aedon; Jun 20 2012 at 12:17 PM.
Pouncival-Rank 13-Leader of the Pouncing Pwny
We Pounce Because We Care
A lot of the random defilers don't blight groups, they blight the solo away from the group, or they just don't use hots and wonder why everyone is dying.
Blight is totally useless in any outdoor battle, because no one in his right mind will stand/step on it beyond the initial exposure. Its a situational skill, useful mostly in a tight area like a stairs/hallway inside a keep, where the opponants cannot avoid it.
I can partialy agree with the second part of your statement. Even if most of the time when im grouping all healers are doing their fair share, sometimes you will group with less talented or dedicated healers. But this is the exception, not the rule.
When you use a word like "exploit" you're saying people are cheating. I really would like to understand how there is cheating. In the past I have seen you say this, and I always wondered if you meant the damage reduction when a RK is healing with All Fates active, coupled with Audacity and stun immunity from a LM. But yet, the last two times we have all squared off and fought for 5 minutes each time btw, no RK was even healing.
So, please explain how wearing audacity - just like you - playing one's class, using CDs when needed, getting off a timely rez in combat, etc., is cheating.
What "certain buffs" - what "passives"?
What you are proving is the system is irretrievably broken, anyone knowingly playing in said manner is exploiting the system to win by any means available to them. This was not a workable mechanic pre audacity and yhey and you know that.
"The freeps largeness disappears when they see Plok's largeness"
What you are proving is the system is irretrievably broken, anyone knowingly playing in said manner is exploiting the system to win by any means available to them. This was not a workable mechanic pre audacity and yhey and you know that.
You keep mentioning some mystical mechanic, yet fail to name it. It's only logical to conclude that the afformentioned mechanic is individual player skill will overcome zerging mouthbreathers unless the afformentioned zergbots have 4 to 1 numbers.
What you are proving is the system is irretrievably broken, anyone knowingly playing in said manner is exploiting the system to win by any means available to them. This was not a workable mechanic pre audacity and yhey and you know that.
This is hard for me to understand. Audacity is a stat available to both sides. Your healers wear it...our healers wear it. Your healers are more tanky than freep healers on their own; while freep healers lean on support - most notably from captains and LMs. Without those classes and without them being played by capable players, freep healing does not work in fights where they're outnumbered. Ever. This is pretty obvious if you look at groups without those two support roles - or without them being played decently.
So again, where is the "exploit?" You said "passives" and "buffs." What are those?
These fights are hardly derp fests. They require - and I assume on your part too - a LOT of communication, timing CDs, often people switching roles then switching again to survive the burst from your DPS.
I just want to understand why there is this call being made that players are "exploiting." Not only does that imply cheating, it implies that by simply playing one's class the way it was designed to support a group is somehow wrong. Neither are true.
There is zero exploit in knowing when/where to use CDs, communicating as a team, healing, focus firing, and most notably speaking from a healer perspective - you CANNOT plant feet and free-cast, and you cannot forgo healing yourself FIRST even when your teammate gets low. Creepside or freepside, if you're a healer, you have to move and move constantly.
♦ R13 Minstrel ♦ Guardians of the Dagorlad ♦ Jaiyne ♦
You keep mentioning some mystical mechanic, yet fail to name it. It's only logical to conclude that the afformentioned mechanic is individual player skill will overcome zerging mouthbreathers unless the afformentioned zergbots have 4 to 1 numbers.
No, what it proves is that those playing over powered, over geared against lesser endowed players will win 4 out of 5 times. Unless the numbers on the weaker side are two to three times larger. This is not pvp, this is a shooting gallery.
Pouncival-Rank 13-Leader of the Pouncing Pwny
We Pounce Because We Care
This is hard for me to understand. Audacity is a stat available to both sides. Your healers wear it...our healers wear it. Your healers are more tanky than freep healers on their own; while freep healers lean on support - most notably from captains and LMs. Without those classes and without them being played by capable players, freep healing does not work in fights where they're outnumbered. Ever. This is pretty obvious if you look at groups without those two support roles - or without them being played decently.
So again, where is the "exploit?" You said "passives" and "buffs." What are those?
These fights are hardly derp fests. They require - and I assume on your part too - a LOT of communication, timing CDs, often people switching roles then switching again to survive the burst from your DPS.
I just want to understand why there is this call being made that players are "exploiting." Not only does that imply cheating, it implies that by simply playing one's class the way it was designed to support a group is somehow wrong. Neither are true.
There is zero exploit in knowing when/where to use CDs, communicating as a team, healing, focus firing, and most notably speaking from a healer perspective - you CANNOT plant feet and free-cast, and you cannot forgo healing yourself FIRST even when your teammate gets low. Creepside or freepside, if you're a healer, you have to move and move constantly.
Your healers run out of power, the LM gives them power. Our healers run out of power, Sorry Charlie.
The only think I can agree on with you is it is not an exploit per-say. It is using some of the most op classes in the game, along with broken mechanics to win. Pish, we all like to win, but do not attribute what you group does as playing your class in a far superior manner to those of your foe. It is playing a far superior class, having far superior skills, and a pvp system that needs a revamp to once and for all put an end to mechanics which favor one paying side over the other.
(Smiley faces added to denote friendliness)
Pouncival-Rank 13-Leader of the Pouncing Pwny
We Pounce Because We Care
No, what it proves is that those playing over powered, over geared against lesser endowed players will win 4 out of 5 times. Unless the numbers on the weaker side are two to three times larger. This is not pvp, this is a shooting gallery.
2 or 3? Against that ezmode squad its 4 or 5. 6 and 7k heals, /faceroll
If WL had 5k heal freeps would have a stoke and flip out on Dev foum til it was gone.
"The freeps largeness disappears when they see Plok's largeness"
Your healers run out of power, the LM gives them power. Our healers run out of power, Sorry Charlie.
The only think I can agree on with you is it is not an exploit per-say. It is using some of the most op classes in the game, along with broken mechanics to win. Pish, we all like to win, but do not attribute what you group does as playing your class in a far superior manner to those of your foe. It is playing a far superior class, having far superior skills, and a pvp system that needs a revamp to once and for all put an end to mechanics which favor one paying side over the other.
(Smiley faces added to denote friendliness)
Your defilers had full power - and flies power drain is AoE (so yeah, we would lose any fight where all 6 of those defilers used them...we would have to run), but I understand what you're saying in some ways, as there are limits to the support creeps can give one another simply by class design - and certainly not in the same ways freeps can.
---
As for 7k heals...that's the exception, and not the rule. The only class able to burst heal like that is a healing RK when Glorious is up, unless the minstrel got a super crit on a Coda or a TS. It's just not happening otherwise, particularly in (really badly itemized) PvP gear.
♦ R13 Minstrel ♦ Guardians of the Dagorlad ♦ Jaiyne ♦
Your defilers had full power - and flies power drain is AoE (so yeah, we would lose any fight where all 6 of those defilers used them...we would have to run), but I understand what you're saying in some ways, as there are limits to the support creeps can give one another simply by class design - and certainly not in the same ways freeps can.
---
As for 7k heals...that's the exception, and not the rule. The only class able to burst heal like that is a healing RK when Glorious is up, unless the minstrel got a super crit on a Coda or a TS. It's just not happening otherwise, particularly in (really badly itemized) PvP gear.
*nods*
In the fight last night I will agree, things would have gone a bit better had a few more flies been used, But as stated before, flies outdoors are not as effective as they are in a keep. Most of the issues any of us face in the moors could be solved with some real game balance.
Pouncival-Rank 13-Leader of the Pouncing Pwny
We Pounce Because We Care
Your defilers had full power - and flies power drain is AoE (so yeah, we would lose any fight where all 6 of those defilers used them...we would have to run), but I understand what you're saying in some ways, as there are limits to the support creeps can give one another simply by class design - and certainly not in the same ways freeps can.
---
As for 7k heals...that's the exception, and not the rule. The only class able to burst heal like that is a healing RK when Glorious is up, unless the minstrel got a super crit on a Coda or a TS. It's just not happening otherwise, particularly in (really badly itemized) PvP gear.
The simple fact that 7k heals do and can happen is sickening. You know what I mean, exactly what I mean. Even 4k instant heals is beyond the redonkulous. Keep pveing guys. All you are doing in the moors is daily quests on your way to herodom. Im just waiting to leave.
"The freeps largeness disappears when they see Plok's largeness"
The simple fact that 7k heals do and can happen is sickening. You know what I mean, exactly what I mean. Even 4k instant heals is beyond the redonkulous. Keep pveing guys. All you are doing in the moors is daily quests on your way to herodom. Im just waiting to leave.
First of all, you need to make sense. PvP is not PvE. No one in that group is running around to PvE. I don't even know how you can say that. Were we PvEing and doing daily quests fighting your group last night 2x for extended fights? Were you? No. All of those freeps and creeps were all there to PvP - no NPCs, just tactics on both sides.
Secondly, personally, when I am grouped and we lose a fight, the first thing I think about it is, "how can we do that better?" "What mistakes did we make?" "Do we need someone to retrait or change stances?" etc. Do you do that? Do your teammates? Because last time there was a discussion of this based on the video Garny posted, several of your healers are shown never having a single HoT on themselves, but yet charging into an enemy keep when the freeps had the pop buff and are taking a lot less damage as a result. That would have been something I would have adjusted the next fight if I were a leader (which of course, I am not).
Sometimes there's nothing people can do - they're badly outnumbered, or have horrible class composition, inexperienced players, or whatever. But that's always the first question for me - so I can improve for next time. I don't see that from you at all. I see blame, and calling people exploiters. Still not sure why...
You are not alone in having frustrating encounters in the 'Moors. We ALL have them, but IMO, last night's fights were long engagements (5+ minutes both times) and enjoyable just for being longer than usual fights. Most of you guys didn't die in fact - you simply disengaged by choice.
♦ R13 Minstrel ♦ Guardians of the Dagorlad ♦ Jaiyne ♦
The simple fact that 7k heals do and can happen is sickening. You know what I mean, exactly what I mean. Even 4k instant heals is beyond the redonkulous. Keep pveing guys. All you are doing in the moors is daily quests on your way to herodom. Im just waiting to leave.
War leaders have 1 skill that can crit heal 9k, and one that crit heals 6k. Black Arrows also have the skill that can crit heal 6k. These skills are also AOE heals and can be instant cast on the move. The 9k War Leader one requires a crit to be instant cast, but almost restores a pretty large amount of power.
War leaders have 1 skill that can crit heal 9k, and one that crit heals 6k. Black Arrows also have the skill that can crit heal 6k. These skills are also AOE heals and can be instant cast on the move. The 9k War Leader one requires a crit to be instant cast, but almost restores a pretty large amount of power.
Have never seen a creep heal that big and trust me I been hit with plenty of heals from some of the best WL. Big crit heals are in the 3k range. I play a BA and since the heal was nerfed to hell you are lucky to get a 3500 out of it and it no longer crits. At least I have not seen it crit.
Last edited by oninoakuma; Jun 20 2012 at 02:33 PM.
"The freeps largeness disappears when they see Plok's largeness"
First of all, you need to make sense. PvP is not PvE. No one in that group is running around to PvE. I don't even know how you can say that. Were we PvEing and doing daily quests fighting your group last night 2x for extended fights? Were you? No. All of those freeps and creeps were all there to PvP - no NPCs, just tactics on both sides.
Secondly, personally, when I am grouped and we lose a fight, the first thing I think about it is, "how can we do that better?" "What mistakes did we make?" "Do we need someone to retrait or change stances?" etc. Do you do that? Do your teammates? Because last time there was a discussion of this based on the video Garny posted, several of your healers are shown never having a single HoT on themselves, but yet charging into an enemy keep when the freeps had the pop buff and are taking a lot less damage as a result. That would have been something I would have adjusted the next fight if I were a leader (which of course, I am not).
Sometimes there's nothing people can do - they're badly outnumbered, or have horrible class composition, inexperienced players, or whatever. But that's always the first question for me - so I can improve for next time. I don't see that from you at all. I see blame, and calling people exploiters. Still not sure why...
You are not alone in having frustrating encounters in the 'Moors. We ALL have them, but IMO, last night's fights were long engagements (5+ minutes both times) and enjoyable just for being longer than usual fights. Most of you guys didn't die in fact - you simply disengaged by choice.
+rep, getting numbers will last for a short amount of time, learning how to work with your group better will last for many, many years.
Sometimes there's nothing people can do - they're badly outnumbered, or have horrible class composition, inexperienced players, or whatever. But that's always the first question for me - so I can improve for next time. I don't see that from you at all. I see blame, and calling people exploiters. Still not sure why...
QUOTE]
If you do not see how badly these game mechanics are broke, no amount of explanation will solve that problem for you. Exploiting does not only mean to cheat. It means to use every advantage afforded to you to win, no matter how broken or imbalanced as well. And that IS what that group does.
exploit - use or manipulate to one's advantage
Last edited by oninoakuma; Jun 20 2012 at 02:45 PM.
"The freeps largeness disappears when they see Plok's largeness"
No, what it proves is that those playing over powered, over geared against lesser endowed players will win 4 out of 5 times. Unless the numbers on the weaker side are two to three times larger. This is not pvp, this is a shooting gallery.
Your attitude and misconceptions are perfect examples of everything wrong in the moors. If you get outplayed then your opponents must be overpowered. The simple truth is that you got outskilled.
Your last comment is quite amusing, seeing as you (and many whom you play with) define pvp as "massive point gain". You may deny it, but the fact remains that you will call out a "good" fight as one where you make tons of points by going up against disorganized freeps with poor gear that lack basic competence.
This is true for both sides, and the reason as to why raids and solo zergs are the preferred form of play for both freeps and creeps.
Your attitude and misconceptions are perfect examples of everything wrong in the moors. If you get outplayed then your opponents must be overpowered. The simple truth is that you got outskilled.
Your last comment is quite amusing, seeing as you (and many whom you play with) define pvp as "massive point gain". You may deny it, but the fact remains that you will call out a "good" fight as one where you make tons of points by going up against disorganized freeps with poor gear that lack basic competence.
This is true for both sides, and the reason as to why raids and solo zergs are the preferred form of play for both freeps and creeps.
Please tell me one instance where a creep player is at the advantage just by being a creep player.
I can name a whole gang of them for freeps.
"The freeps largeness disappears when they see Plok's largeness"
War leaders have 1 skill that can crit heal 9k, and one that crit heals 6k. Black Arrows also have the skill that can crit heal 6k. These skills are also AOE heals and can be instant cast on the move. The 9k War Leader one requires a crit to be instant cast, but almost restores a pretty large amount of power.
the most that i have crit on my wl was 5.3k with the defilers hot for like 10% more healing or whatever it is and that was on only 1 person in my whole group just saying.
By Ploks definition of exploiting, he too is an exploiter. He once caught me by TA, I pulled him around to the norbogs north west of the keep to minimise the chance of getting interrupted, despite having the jump on me, I managed to make him use uruk heal, then when I was at about 1k health, and he was about 4k, he popped moving target and won the fight. No big deal, I have fights like that against BA's all the time. I retreated and returned quickly from lugs rez, saw Plok at TA west door, dismounted, hit him once, and he bailed into the keep. I followed, expecting him to stop and fight me once I had a few npc's on me, but no, he wasn't interested in fighting at all without his cd's and a guaranteed victory. He went straight up and into the tyrant room, without stopping or turning round to shoot me once. On my way out of the keep, with several npc's on me, 3 wargs jumped me and I died again.
Clearly, according to the new definition of exploiting, Plok is also an exploiter. He uses mechanics and skills to exploit others and have an unfair advantage, and if that advantage is not there, he will not fight.
Pot, meet kettle.
Sarcasm aside, exploiting is a bannable offence. If they are doing something that is considered an exploit, report it, they'll get banned. Admittedly, when used in full quota, the freep skill set, with all its buffs, debuffs, heals, emergency skills, burst dps etc. is far more powerful than the creep skill set.
It has always been the case that freep grouping potential was higher than creep grouping potential. However, in the past, high ranked creeps were more powerful than most freeps individually, and this made grouping the great equaliser.
Now, freeps are more powerful individually AND they still have much higher grouping potential. No-one is denying things are unbalanced.
We, freeps, creeps, all, can only play with the cards we're dealt with. Just because people play those cards, does not make it an exploit (so long as it's done in the intended way).
Calling people exploiters, i.e. cheaters, just because they are using everything at there disposal to be difficult to beat, even when outnumbered, is seriously bad form. It is petty, childish and frankly rather pathetic. Is the warg who maps to grams and waits for disappear/sprint cd's an exploiter too? It's annoying, it's unbalanced, it's many things, but it's not exploiting.
Exploiting is one of the most greivious accusations one can make of somebody in an MMO. It should not be thrown around lightly. The fact that someone can so easily brand such kind of accusations, simply based on their opinion on what skills should or should not be used in the moors, shows a serious lack of class and respect.
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Originally Posted by crl13107
"The freeps largeness disappears when they see Plok's largeness"
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