I've left lotro a few months back, it got boring and after the last few updates that I paid for I thought it was basically a waste of money.
Now we have the ROR update $40 min price, I'm certainly not going to pay that for a couple of weeks entertainment, I have better games on my ps3 to occupy my time.
How is Turbine going to tempt me back? Well make the update free, charge for all the extras they normally do but make the new area, quests, instances free. If it's free the likes of me will download play for a while, maybe buy the stuff they sell, maybe not but at least I'll be there along with many others. The market has changed.
Turbine you are pricing yourselves out of the market I'm afraid.
I've left lotro a few months back, it got boring and after the last few updates that I paid for I thought it was basically a waste of money.
Now we have the ROR update $40 min price, I'm certainly not going to pay that for a couple of weeks entertainment, I have better games on my ps3 to occupy my time.
How is Turbine going to tempt me back? Well make the update free, charge for all the extras they normally do but make the new area, quests, instances free. If it's free the likes of me will download play for a while, maybe buy the stuff they sell, maybe not but at least I'll be there along with many others. The market has changed.
Turbine you are pricing yourselves out of the market I'm afraid.
Seriously? Give you the content for free, and MAYBE you'll buy something?
Why do that when it appears that many people are already buying something: RoR.
I don't know maybe a lot of people are buying the update but for some, like myself it's just a too much.
Well, I certainly cant argue with that. $40 to $70 is a lot to part with, but from the number of riderless horses I see running around, lots of people have sprung for the $70 version.
I realize that some players cannot afford to spend that much. I doubt that I will upgrade both my accounts, unless RoR goes on sale.
Of course, the good news is you don't have to buy it. You can still explore Rohan, experience Mounted combat, kill beasties for XP, and do the Epic quests for free. In fact, Turbine has already given a great deal of the game away.
Last edited by Jiraiyaisnolia; Jun 19 2012 at 08:56 PM.
I'm sure they will hop right on that suggestion, right after they convince all their employees to work for free, you'd do that for your employer wouldn't you?
I'm sure they hop right on that suggestion, right after they convince all their employees to work for free, you'd do that for your employer wouldn't you?
No, but I am suggesting changing their business model. They have changed before and quite successfully. There are many FTP games out there mostly rubbish I'd admit but if Turbine want to keep players this may be the way to go.
I've left lotro a few months back, it got boring and after the last few updates that I paid for I thought it was basically a waste of money.
Now we have the ROR update $40 min price, I'm certainly not going to pay that for a couple of weeks entertainment, I have better games on my ps3 to occupy my time.
How is Turbine going to tempt me back? Well make the update free, charge for all the extras they normally do but make the new area, quests, instances free. If it's free the likes of me will download play for a while, maybe buy the stuff they sell, maybe not but at least I'll be there along with many others. The market has changed.
Turbine you are pricing yourselves out of the market I'm afraid.
Disagree. Targeting the fickle and bored game player demographic is not a compelling business proposition.
Turbine is looking for consumers with disposable entertainment funds coupled with an active brand affinity.
I want EVERYTHING for free and I want it NOW !!!11!!one!!
I don't think the OP is the kind of player that Turbine will build a business model around. Getting money to support the game from the likes of him is harder than extracting blood from a stone.
I want EVERYTHING for free and I want it NOW !!!11!!one!!
I don't think the OP is the kind of player that Turbine will build a business model around. Getting money to support the game from the likes of him is harder than extracting blood from a stone.
If it's free the likes of me will download play for a while, maybe buy the stuff they sell, maybe not but at least I'll be there along with many others.
The only problem with that is, you're basically advocating that they go further down the rabbit hole of microtransactions. To make not only the landscape and Epic free, but also the quests and instances. Which basically means that the vast majority of the game's actual content would be free. Which is nice in theory, but think of the implications.
Without the revenue from content pack purchases, Turbine would be left to rely on subscriptions and purchases of those "extras". Yet, if all that content was free to everyone, what would be the point of anyone paying a subscription? The value of a subscription would be greatly diminished, seeing as it would only unlock PvMP and various system components (bags, slots, etc.) Lots of people would probably just as soon join the freemium bandwagon. And assuming you were right, and it attracted this hypothetical swarm of people like yourself, that's even more people using the system, taking up data space and putting demand on servers, all while contributing rather unreliably to revenue.
Which would mean the store would be pretty much the sole source of income. And if you think the store is pushed hard now, just wait until they have to rely that much more heavily on it. Ads in more places, ever more aggressive. More and more things being released to the store, or moved to it. After all, if they can't make their profit off the actual content, the quests and instances and landscape, then they'll have to make it off of everything else. Or perhaps they'll take a page from certain other MMOs, and turn to alternative revenue streams. Are you ready to see a Dominos Pizza NPC in game? Ads for Mountain Dew scrolling across the top of the screen? Would such things really be better?
All of this might sound hyperbolic, but it's the same sort of road other games have tried, and to similar ends. The point is, a business needs to make money if it's going to survive at all, let alone grow or expand. You can't just eliminate one revenue stream without making up for it somewhere. If you want the core of the game for free, what are you willing to pay for it? What will you buy, what will you endure, or what will you give up in exchange?
"Life is 10% what you make it, and 90% how you take it." - Irving Berlin Mirkwood ● Isengard ● LOTRO-Wiki
No, but I am suggesting changing their business model. They have changed before and quite successfully. There are many FTP games out there mostly rubbish I'd admit but if Turbine want to keep players this may be the way to go.
Turbine already has. You do not have to spend any dollars to get Riders of Rohan. If you want the expansion for free, you have to be willing to spend enough hours playing Lotro to earn the Turbine Points necessary to buy the expansion.
You must realize that a F2P game is not Free To Play for everyone. In order to make and operate these games, the owner is getting sufficient dollars out of the customer base. What is different between the various games is:
1) What the owner sells?
2) How much it costs?
3) What is given away to everyone without having to do anything?
4) What can a customer acquire by playing the game?
5) How much time does a customer have to spend playing the game to get something?
Unless stated otherwise, all content in this post is My Personal Opinion.
Turbine already has. You do not have to spend any dollars to get Riders of Rohan. If you want the expansion for free, you have to be willing to spend enough hours playing Lotro to earn the Turbine Points necessary to buy the expansion.
This. The expansion is free a long as you're willing to play the game long enough to earn 4350 TP - and only some of the extras are pre-order exclusives. I got myself RoI for free last year and see no reason why RoR would be different.
This. The expansion is free a long as you're willing to play the game long enough to earn 4350 TP - and only some of the extras are pre-order exclusives. I got myself RoI for free last year and see no reason why RoR would be different.
As a semantic quibble, I would consider earning 4350 TP from playing the game to pay for the expansion to be "getting the expansion for free" only if I felt that my time had zero value.
Others may feel differently.
"Sam thinks it a queer place, but I think he likes it, too." - Frodo
"If you're in advertising or marketing, kill yourself." - Bill Hicks
As a semantic quibble, I would consider earning 4350 TP from playing the game to pay for the expansion to be "getting the expansion for free" only if I felt that my time had zero value.
Others may feel differently.
Perhaps it should be described as "without out-of-pocket expenses." But, then, I ponied up $70 plus tax for each of 2 accounts...almost exactly $150, so I think I can claim to be supporting the game to some degree.
I've left lotro a few months back, it got boring and after the last few updates that I paid for I thought it was basically a waste of money.
Now we have the ROR update $40 min price, I'm certainly not going to pay that for a couple of weeks entertainment, I have better games on my ps3 to occupy my time.
How is Turbine going to tempt me back? Well make the update free, charge for all the extras they normally do but make the new area, quests, instances free. If it's free the likes of me will download play for a while, maybe buy the stuff they sell, maybe not but at least I'll be there along with many others. The market has changed.
Turbine you are pricing yourselves out of the market I'm afraid.
I've left lotro a few months back, it got boring and after the last few updates that I paid for I thought it was basically a waste of money.
Now we have the ROR update $40 min price, I'm certainly not going to pay that for a couple of weeks entertainment, I have better games on my ps3 to occupy my time.
How is Turbine going to tempt me back? Well make the update free, charge for all the extras they normally do but make the new area, quests, instances free. If it's free the likes of me will download play for a while, maybe buy the stuff they sell, maybe not but at least I'll be there along with many others. The market has changed.
Turbine you are pricing yourselves out of the market I'm afraid.
Charge for what? I didn't buy anything after RoI buying. Please explain how Turbine should earn money if even addons should be free.
And about marketing. Lotro is one of the most succesful f2p games. I don't think you'd teach them.
I've left lotro a few months back, it got boring and after the last few updates that I paid for I thought it was basically a waste of money.
Now we have the ROR update $40 min price, I'm certainly not going to pay that for a couple of weeks entertainment, I have better games on my ps3 to occupy my time...
Err really who cares?
You dont like Lotro? so play your PS3
I like Lotro so i play Lotro
See easy as that, why should they give away thousands of hours of work for free when you own a PS3?
(Even programmers need some wages)
-¤-¤-¤- Errare humanum est, ignoscere divinum est -¤-¤-¤-
Err really who cares?
You dont like Lotro? so play your PS3
I like Lotro so i play Lotro
See easy as that, why should they give away thousands of hours of work for free when you own a PS3?
(Even programmers need some wages)
Agree, If you are happy to pay $50 for a ps3 game that has a fraction of the game life of RoR, then all well and good - but please dont disturb us here.
Well make the update free, charge for all the extras they normally do but make the new area, quests, instances free. If it's free the likes of me will download play for a while, maybe buy the stuff they sell, maybe not but at least I'll be there along with many others.
I wonder if automakers would consider this sort of strategy? Give me the car for free and I'll pay for the non-standard add ons like leather seats and what have you. I'll even promise to have the car serviced at the dealers. At least I'll be driving their car instead of some other auto manufacturers.
Originally Posted by Jadzi
Are you ready to see a Dominos Pizza NPC in game? Ads for Mountain Dew scrolling across the top of the screen?
I've left lotro a few months back, it got boring and after the last few updates that I paid for I thought it was basically a waste of money.
Now we have the ROR update $40 min price, I'm certainly not going to pay that for a couple of weeks entertainment, I have better games on my ps3 to occupy my time.
How is Turbine going to tempt me back? Well make the update free, charge for all the extras they normally do but make the new area, quests, instances free. If it's free the likes of me will download play for a while, maybe buy the stuff they sell, maybe not but at least I'll be there along with many others. The market has changed.
Turbine you are pricing yourselves out of the market I'm afraid.
I suppose you work for free and live from random donations made by happy people excited from your work then?
Or is your mommy buying your PS3 games? Get real.
Others already pointed at your nonsense, I will just add this - Turbine do not have to tempt you back! They have to tempt people who are ready to spend some money for the content Turbine is creating to keep the game going. It is the content they are creating that have to appeal to you. If you dont want to buy the expantion and only want to hang out arround for free, it's still OK but no expantion content should be given for nothing. Either pay real money or grind free TPs. Your choice.
Disagree. I contend the consumer profile you are describing is not Turbine's target market. Turbine is looking for consumers with disposable entertainment funds coupled with an active brand affinity. Targeting the fickle and bored game player demographic is not a compelling proposition.
But targeting the fickle and bored game player demographic is exactly what Turbine did by going F2P in the first place. The idea being to give players more choice in how they played, but also to entice a whole lot players from other MMOs into trying LOTRO because it was "free".
So while I would say the Legendary edition of RoR is priced for the players with disposable income in specific, the other editions are priced too high for those gamers that came to the game specifically because of F2P. Perhaps Turbine would have been better served by treating RoR like Siege of Mirkwood, where it was free under certain conditions (buying a 90-day subscription, buying the $20 Adventure Pack, etc.). I think that would have gone over better than the base and Heroic editions of RoR have so far.
As a semantic quibble, I would consider earning 4350 TP from playing the game to pay for the expansion to be "getting the expansion for free" only if I felt that my time had zero value.
Others may feel differently.
This is not employment, it's entertainment.
How much money do you earn while watching TV? Or going to the Movies? Or attending a major sporting event? Or a live concert? Most people don't earn money doing these things. They PAY money.
Trying to say that earnign TP to get the content isn't free because they WORK for it is simply nonsense. You cannot equate playing a game to work unless you are employed by a gaming company. (You are reporting those TPs you earn to the IRS as income, aren't you?)
If you worked at Turbine, how much do you think it's worth? ie how much would you work for?
Yea, obviously something, how much they think is up to them, not saying you are wrong, just that it's unlikely that 0 is it. I can't believe I am about to defend the invisible hand, but here, it works.
I've left lotro a few months back, it got boring and after the last few updates that I paid for I thought it was basically a waste of money.
Now we have the ROR update $40 min price, I'm certainly not going to pay that for a couple of weeks entertainment, I have better games on my ps3 to occupy my time.
How is Turbine going to tempt me back? Well make the update free, charge for all the extras they normally do but make the new area, quests, instances free. If it's free the likes of me will download play for a while, maybe buy the stuff they sell, maybe not but at least I'll be there along with many others. The market has changed.
Turbine you are pricing yourselves out of the market I'm afraid.
Sorry mate, but I have to disagree with you one this one..
I got the legendary edition of RoR for almost the same price as I would have paid for a nomal pc game, and a lot cheaper than what I would have to pay for a Xbox360 or PS3, and I'm pretty sure RoR will keep me happy for another year, whereas a game on Xbox360 or PS3 can't keep my interest for more than a few hours.
So for me its a good deal.
Its a free world out there, you don't have do to anything you don't want to, Turbine doesn't have to tempt you back, you can come back if you want to and stay away if you don't want.
You don't have to buy RoR to see the area, the epic story is still free, but you'll miss out on the quests and the instances.
I've been F2P/ Premuim for a while now. Bought VIP once and to be honest its not a bad price ether. Those $10 can be saved from drinks and boom. I bought Rohan without even reading forums because Lotro will always be one of the best online games (actually best game ever). Yes they want money but who do you think pays for all the GMs, Devs, Landscapers ,etc? Take money away and then we have no GMs, no developers for new content that you WANT FREELY.
I just think mate you should stick off those Joints for a while cause you are totally out your head I'd rather spend a bit of money + use hours getting TP (which in fact can come mainly from deeding for Virtues so two birds with one stone) and have an amazing game and amazing Devs and so on. Yes not everything is loved but when have you ever been able to please everybody?
So get a part time job and I rate you will make enough money for ROR within the first few hours.
Originally Posted by Haue
Sorry mate, but I have to disagree with you one this one..
I got the legendary edition of RoR for almost the same price as I would have paid for a nomal pc game, and a lot cheaper than what I would have to pay for a Xbox360 or PS3, and I'm pretty sure RoR will keep me happy for another year, whereas a game on Xbox360 or PS3 can't keep my interest for more than a few hours.
AGREED!
I got VIP the same time that i bought Alan Wake + Battlefield (lets just say the stored messed up and boom I got both games for the price of one) I havnt touched Battlefield and played the first few levels of Alan Wake. Lets just say I spend most afternoons on lotro so the price is worth it. I'd pay three times the price for ROR (IF I HAD THE CASH) Those are my two cents...
Last edited by Reylin; Jun 20 2012 at 10:49 AM.
Reason: Way more things to say...
How much money do you earn while watching TV? Or going to the Movies? Or attending a major sporting event? Or a live concert? Most people don't earn money doing these things. They PAY money.
Trying to say that earnign TP to get the content isn't free because they WORK for it is simply nonsense. You cannot equate playing a game to work unless you are employed by a gaming company. (You are reporting those TPs you earn to the IRS as income, aren't you?)
While it's true that people generally don't earn money doing those things, that's not really related because there's no system that I'm aware of by which one can get access to those things by using a fake currency created by the TV networks, sports teams, musicians, or movie studios.
I'm looking at it simply from a time = money perspective. If someone is playing the game specifically to earn 4350 TP rather than spend the x number of hours (or minutes, in some cases) it would take to earn the cash equivalent needed to buy the expansion, then that person is saying that their time has very little value. Even at a probably-impossible-to-reach 100 TP/hour, that person is basically saying that their time is worth about $1/hour.
Of course, if someone is enjoying every second they spend earning those 4350 TP, then that's great for them - I certainly don't know how to put a value on enjoyment (although I'm sure that some Freakonomics types can).
All I'm saying is that it's a poor economic decision (or a declaration that one's time is worthless) to grind TP for the sole purpose of not spending cash on the game. In even the poorest communities (caveat: in the U.S.), one can earn $40 with a day or two of work as a day laborer or temp of some sort, yet I sincerely doubt that a day or two is all it'd take to earn over 4k TP.
"Sam thinks it a queer place, but I think he likes it, too." - Frodo
"If you're in advertising or marketing, kill yourself." - Bill Hicks
While it's true that people generally don't earn money doing those things, that's not really related because there's no system that I'm aware of by which one can get access to those things by using a fake currency created by the TV networks, sports teams, musicians, or movie studios..
In these cases, the Fake currency is advertising, and the time you spend watching them.
For Movies, it's product placement. For sporting events and concerts, it's sponsorship and advertising space in their respective venues. I realize that it's a stretch, but it can be thought of that way.
Originally Posted by Lestache
I'm looking at it simply from a time = money perspective. If someone is playing the game specifically to earn 4350 TP rather than spend the x number of hours (or minutes, in some cases) it would take to earn the cash equivalent needed to buy the expansion, then that person is saying that their time has very little value. Even at a probably-impossible-to-reach 100 TP/hour, that person is basically saying that their time is worth about $1/hour..
You're missing the point. The Time / Money perspective isn't an issue here. You have a job to earn money to buy the necessities of life and to pay for the leisure activities that you enjoy. You do the leisure things, like playing games, because you enjoy doing them, not because of the potential time/value benefits you get from them. If everyone tried to justify their leisure activities on a purely ecomonic basis, then there wouldn't be any leisure activities at all. And the world would be a very boring place.
Originally Posted by Lestache
Of course, if someone is enjoying every second they spend earning those 4350 TP, then that's great for them - I certainly don't know how to put a value on enjoyment (although I'm sure that some Freakonomics types can).
But that is exactly what you’re doing in your post. In your previous statement, you say that you can’t put a value on enjoyment, and in the next statement, you proceed to do so.
Originally Posted by Lestache
All I'm saying is that it's a poor economic decision (or a declaration that one's time is worthless) to grind TP for the sole purpose of not spending cash on the game. In even the poorest communities (caveat: in the U.S.), one can earn $40 with a day or two of work as a day laborer or temp of some sort, yet I sincerely doubt that a day or two is all it'd take to earn over 4k TP.
Essentially, you’re implying that Work is the same as play because you link them with a common factor (time spent doing each one). This is like saying that apples are the same as oranges because they’re both fruits that grow on trees. Just because you spend time doing both does not mean that they have the same economic value. Think about a person that has two jobs that pay a different amount per hour, or two different people doing the same job but get paid different amounts.
Turbine has never claimed that getting the content for free would be quick or easy. You make it sound like playing LOTRO is a chore. If you’re not enjoying the time you spend playing LOTRO, then you may need to find another way to fill your spare time.
Last edited by Jiraiyaisnolia; Jun 20 2012 at 04:37 PM.
You must have cheap tastes in games....and restaurants.
--W. H. Heydt
Old Used Programmer
LOL! True. And isn't it $70, not $80? The going price for new games seems to be around $60, and the remaining $10 wouldn't even get you two value meals at Mcdonalds...
The question is why would turbine even want the OP back? He only wants things that are free, which they already offer. A person that wants everything free means no company.
i am sure the Turbine folks had a great laugh at that post.
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Originally Posted by Lwio
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All of this might sound hyperbolic, but it's the same sort of road other games have tried, and to similar ends. The point is, a business needs to make money if it's going to survive at all, let alone grow or expand. You can't just eliminate one revenue stream without making up for it somewhere. If you want the core of the game for free, what are you willing to pay for it? What will you buy, what will you endure, or what will you give up in exchange?
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Err really who cares?
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but no expantion content should be given for nothing. Either pay real money or grind free TPs. Your choice.
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I'd rather spend a bit of money + use hours getting TP (which in fact can come mainly from deeding for Virtues so two birds with one stone) and have an amazing game and amazing Devs and so on. Yes not everything is loved but when have you ever been able to please everybody?
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