I am Landrovas, officer of the Legends of the Rohirrim kinship on the Withywindle server. Besides being an active member in the kinship i am a very active member of the server comunity. And lately i have observed a trend that is very worrysome.
As you may know Withywindle is one of the 8 new servers created at the end of 2010 (i think that was the date). So it is quite young in comparison to others. And also as opposed to the 4 US ones and 2 german ones it didnt have in its inception acces to a huge player pool (we knoe both US servers and german server have very high populations). There have been other things that have plagued WW in its beginings that i cannot pass over here since those are just rumors and i cant test them.
Now because in teh start it was created when lotro went F2P the biggerst part of the population was F2P. The only VIPs here that had started with the server were players wanting a fresh start (so either bored with their server or worse bored with the game).
All went well i heard from veteran players just until some months before RoI. When i came to the server (maybe 1 year ago?) things were pretty well, things were active in global, kins were end-game raiding, even our small new kin grew into what is today.
But then changed to Ettens came. And the option to transfer more easily. WW population came to a plateau, VIP population was not enough to cater to the needs of Ettens. And as you may know Ettens is the main interest of end gamers besides Raiding.
So at first isolated peopel started to transfer. They always went out with a prophecy that WW is a dieing server. Then it came as a shock when full raiding kins transfered in search for better PvP. The first kin that transfered actually started a domino effect: less veteran VIPs, less ettens battles, less raids, worse economy in AH. That led to more kins transfering and more people transfering to.
So now we are at a point where we struggle to maintain our server into some sort of balance. But unhappines is here, since we know that other servers offer more oportunities. I personally made all the efforts to help the server: made server events, pushed people into Ettens, made publicity for the server....
But I am afraid that this is not enough. The snowball is tumbling and no matter how many new F2P players are pushed into WW (if it actually is ever a recomanded server) there are just not enough veteran players to maintain the balance and training needed. There is no way we can balance for the age handicap of the server, and adding the fact that the veteran player base has either left the game or transfered out of the server (not being willing to help the server grow, proven twice by the fact they left their original server to a fresh start and then just left WW to in search of who knows what) we are left with a disfunctional server.
And to add to the problem once in a while there are campains from other server to just recruit posible transfers from WW....talk about kicking a sick guy in his back.
So since this is not a self-pitty post i should proceed to why i posted :P
Has any other server experienced such a phenomenon? Did it find a solution for it? The larger servers probably had dificult times but clearly pulled through, so maybe there are some lessons to be learned from their experiences.
And finally is there anything that Turbine can do to strife to offer the new servers the chance to have the same game experience as the old and popular ones since clearly the population boom that came after F2P did not sustain a steady growth to succesfully balance a new european EN server.
I hope some constructive advice will come out of this, maybe even people will decide to come and roll a char in WW to help us build a sustainable server. We have such a nice social comunity here, its a shame it could go to waste because of sub-par PvP and end-game.
In my experience there are a few servers with active populations so small that it's virtually impossible to play in PvMP. If you see someone with real rank on those servers you know they have put many many many more hours than someone on a busy server, most of that time spent looking for someone to fight. It's also difficult to find people to run PvE instances/raids with unless you have a set group to run with.
As for a solution -- the only way out I see is for Trubine to merge server populations, or create a cross-server grouping functionality. Since we have no way of knowing whether they plan on doing either of those things, it's just an unfortunate truth that people who want raids and PvMP are going to keep moving to bigger servers, further fueling the problem.
Informed by Science, Inspired by Art
June 2013, no active characters. I'll return if the fun again outweighs the grind.
What I would do is shift my focus away from high end stuff to recruiting and education of new folks. If a newbie gets a solid foundation in how this game works and a reasonable amount of help along the way they will develop into the high end folks you want at the end.
Also don't discount the ultimate solo folks. They can do a great deal to help liven up the AH and the economy.
Right now group content is a problem for your server so think in terms of what can we do to
1. Get more people onto the server
2. support those people as they get rolling
3. Liven up the economy
4. Create endgamers farther down the road
Turbine can do MIRACLES putting a server on top of the list, unfortunately it looks like they forgot about EU servers and only put US servers on top.
Sapience said they have no intention to merge servers on another thread, today.
So why don't they put Whity (and Gilrain after it) on top of that list? I don't know and don't understand. But if I were you I would ask for it as loudly as I can.
Last edited by Lapislazzuli; Jun 14 2012 at 01:05 PM.
If my graph reading skills are good (and they are) i can say that the peaks are periods of server being recomanded. And its clear that not the least populated servers go to recomended (if that were the case WW would be perma recomanded). What is also aparent is that numbers are not very accurate but do hint the reality.
So put EU servers on recomended rotation to for a while. Or even better recomend servers by the IP of the player. If its not already done so (would be dum to recomend a US server to a british player)
So: PUT WITHYWHINDLE ON RECOMANDED MORE OFTER (and gilrain to :P)
But I am afraid that this is not enough. The snowball is tumbling and no matter how many new F2P players are pushed into WW (if it actually is ever a recomanded server) there are just not enough veteran players to maintain the balance and training needed. There is no way we can balance for the age handicap of the server,
Every server was once in the position of having few or no veteran players. It doesn't necessarily matter to new players how many veteran players there are on the server. If there are people to answer questions in the global chat and advice channels, then that should be enough to get a wave of newbies off the ground. Right now it seems like there is an influx of new users (probably from Steam), and if WW spent some time as the recommended server for newbies then you could probably get a nice boost to population and nurture them to those higher levels. You may not have as many people running end-game content of PvMP, but if most of your users are newbies then they'll be working their way through the lower level content first.
That only works if there's any people left on the server. atm we're down to ~80 people on global on a normal day and ~120 on the busiest times... needless to say, THAT is not a lot of people
So put EU servers on recomended rotation to for a while. Or even better recomend servers by the IP of the player. If its not already done so (would be dum to recomend a US server to a british player)
Since Update 7.1 the german client shows german servers at the top of the list, the french client shows french servers at the top of the list and so on. They did not really check your IP to give you your special serverlist.
Every server was once in the position of having few or no veteran players. It doesn't necessarily matter to new players how many veteran players there are on the server. If there are people to answer questions in the global chat and advice channels, then that should be enough to get a wave of newbies off the ground. Right now it seems like there is an influx of new users (probably from Steam), and if WW spent some time as the recommended server for newbies then you could probably get a nice boost to population and nurture them to those higher levels. You may not have as many people running end-game content of PvMP, but if most of your users are newbies then they'll be working their way through the lower level content first.
When newbies reach level 30ish they start asking around about the server. And we have always had nay-sayers more than happy to trash our servers. And newbies go roll a char on another server. Ofc that doesnt happen everytime but still there is no steady influx of new level 75s. Not to mention that most are turning up casual. And a server rep is unfortunately not made up by cool events and nice people. But by the PvMP and raid progression threads. Else WW would be quite popular since we have had very nice server wide events.
When newbies reach level 30ish they start asking around about the server. And we have always had nay-sayers more than happy to trash our servers. And newbies go roll a char on another server. Ofc that doesnt happen everytime but still there is no steady influx of new level 75s. Not to mention that most are turning up casual. And a server rep is unfortunately not made up by cool events and nice people. But by the PvMP and raid progression threads. Else WW would be quite popular since we have had very nice server wide events.
Well the suggestions I have won't be easy.
Get them when they are lowbies, keep characters at lower levels so you can introduce them to dungeons/skirmishes as they level. By the time they reach higher level they might well have an interest developed for endgame group stuff.
Get the word out about your server wide events. Publicize them.
Accept that being casual is not a crime. Some people just do not have an interest in endgame. Accept them for what they are. They will still help the dead AH issue and the economy in general. They will still be bodies in the world to make it more alive. They can still be potential new friends.
When newbies reach level 30ish they start asking around about the server. And we have always had nay-sayers more than happy to trash our servers. And newbies go roll a char on another server. Ofc that doesnt happen everytime but still there is no steady influx of new level 75s. Not to mention that most are turning up casual. And a server rep is unfortunately not made up by cool events and nice people. But by the PvMP and raid progression threads. Else WW would be quite popular since we have had very nice server wide events.
Your very wrong about what makes up a servers rep. I have rarely seen people ask which server has the best PvMP. Landraval has completely built their reputation on cool events and nice people and it is the second highest population server. You may be looking for PvMP and end game raids but the vast majority of the player base does not set foot in either a t2 raid or the moors.
I understand that it can be hard to play on a sever with a low population when it does not support your play style. It may be time for you to look into rerolling on a server that does more to support the things you do. I dont think that having WW as the recomended server is going to suddenly make it a magnet for players that want to do PvMP and end game raiding. It will bring in more players but it takes time for a brand new player to get to the point where they can do those activities.
That only works if there's any people left on the server. atm we're down to ~80 people on global on a normal day and ~120 on the busiest times... needless to say, THAT is not a lot of people
That's the samething with gladden but we still have lots of PVP and PVe.
It does, but only with the US servers. It just doesn't put the original EU servers up there. The EU servers are always at the bottom of the list.
It would be nice if they did a better job of server recommends at sign-in/account creation. Even a little blurb that says "These servers are predominantly French-speaking, these servers are predominantly German-speaking, these servers are predominantly English-speaking Europeans, these servers are predominantly North American, etc. Either that or have more descriptive names (and I know that it's too late for that). That's one thing that UO did very well with their server names.
It would be nice if they did a better job of server recommends at sign-in/account creation. Even a little blurb that says "These servers are predominantly French-speaking, these servers are predominantly German-speaking, these servers are predominantly English-speaking Europeans, these servers are predominantly North American, etc. Either that or have more descriptive names (and I know that it's too late for that). That's one thing that UO did very well with their server names.
Yeah, some description on the servers would be nice. Would prevent people from accidentally rolling on a server not suited to them. Sure, they could do some server research beforehand. I know I didn't , and rerolling on a different server because of that won't always leave the best impression.
They probably didn't change whatever program that selects the recommended server because of the language differences of the former EU servers. Something has to be changed now though, I wouldn't want to see my server shrivel up around me.
"Aurë Entuluva!" (Day shall come again!) - Húrin Thalion
Turbine doesn't release population numbers but we have weekly logins and WW is by far the server with less logins per week. Vilya has more than twice its logins for example. Half of the EU servers have less logins than Vilya.
Even though people may not agree with this ...how about if Turbine IP blocks certain servers...forcing people into a list best for them ...obviously people who are for example US on a European server ...should be given free transfers ...
If european IPs and US ips arent checked and distributed to acording servers than the issue is quite big, since then the time zone doesnt match the schedule of teh respective player. Before the merge the things were simple. You were from US u got the US client and so did EU. Sometimes mistakes were made even then. But now EU servers have no tag whatsoever, except the RP ones which state they are EN (which may lead to the asumption they are for england for say.... a kid?).
And even if there should in theory be no difference between EU and US servers in reality people look for servers that have peak times acording to the local time of their home. No use for me to roll a char on Brandy if when ill be online ill just be alone since US is at work or sleeping.
So the issue is a bit more complex than just WW with ramifications that affect player satifaction.
But still WW has way smaller daily logins that any other server. And not by a little. But by alot. And its also caught in a vicious circle of people leaving scared by the statistics thus deepning the problem even further. I have the feeling it all started with a group of players disgruntled by their lack of succes that started the apocaliptic prophecy that WW will die ( i can actually remember the inception of those talks back when WW was on a good track even for its age). And as with all superstitions there are many who would try and make them true.
I would consider rolling an alt there. I actually like underpopulated realms. BUT I am a casual player and a solo person so I get the feeling you are not interested in my kind.
Even though people may not agree with this ...how about if Turbine IP blocks certain servers...forcing people into a list best for them ...obviously people who are for example US on a European server ...should be given free transfers ...
Not a good idea. Transfers between US-EU servers are not available at the moment and many US servers have ppl coming from all over the world, Elendimir for example has a huge oceanic population and Brandywine is more a world wide server, I play there and I'm from Italy, I've met a lot of people from different places, USA, China, New zeland, and so on. No one should ever be forced to change his own server or restricted from rolling a new toon wherever he wants.
Adding an EU label would be a good idea but the choice must be ours.
I don't think WW problem is player's fault. People say lotro is dying everyday but it doesn't. On the other hand WW's population was going down and down and it was less and less a good server for group play. And that's why players left, not because of the ones saying it was dying, because they didn't like it. You either need 20$ per char or the will to reroll all of them to change server, it's not something you do unless you really dislike your current server.
I did it myself, used to play on Nimrodel, not a good server for my timezone, it was not fun anymore. And that's why I did a fresh start on Brandywine a year ago.
WW needs to be recommended, it would bring A LOT of new players, may require time but they will cap someday.
If i saw an influx of baby players out of the blue ill make it a priority to help them, heck ill even roll low level alts for them to play GB with . And hello little hobbit Ausera
If i saw an influx of baby players out of the blue ill make it a priority to help them, heck ill even roll low level alts for them to play GB with . And hello little hobbit Ausera
It would be nice if they did a better job of server recommends at sign-in/account creation. Even a little blurb that says "These servers are predominantly French-speaking, these servers are predominantly German-speaking, these servers are predominantly English-speaking Europeans, these servers are predominantly North American, etc. Either that or have more descriptive names (and I know that it's too late for that). That's one thing that UO did very well with their server names.
Indeed that would nice. If I should have looked up which servers are what/where (I know it's my own bad ), then i wouldnt have chosen the server i am on. Nothing wrong with the people, and i dont mind the US server, if there only would have been european kinships (and more europeans with me)....feel free to reroll your kinship here Landrovas....
So yes Turbine should change that so people know in advance.
........I'm not online....it's just your imagination.........
Grand Member Online status:
Reputation:
Poster of Note Online status:
Senior Member Online status:
Dream as if you'll live forever, live as if you'll die today
I <3 LOTRO! Online status:
Poster of Note Online status:
Originally Posted by Landrovas
Grand Member Online status:
Senior Member Online status:
Poster of Note Online status:
Grand Member Online status:
Member Online status:
), then i wouldnt have chosen the server i am on. Nothing wrong with the people, and i dont mind the US server, if there only would have been european kinships (and more europeans with me)....feel free to reroll your kinship here Landrovas.... 
Reply With Quote
Posting Permissions
