Thread: PvMP map 'not on the road map'

Originally Posted by Elehir

Q: Will there be a new PVMP zone?
A: Not on the Road Map!


http://cstm.mymiddleearth.com/2012/0...-from-e3-2012/

I like how they said that with enthusiasm! The only thing that people have been asking for since the first expansion that we still haven't got. When will Turbine get a clue? Do they realize they can charge TP for it?

As much as a new map SOUNDS great in theory...we don't use 90% of the map we have. Perfect example of them expanding the ettens albeit filled with NPCs was the Delving. Look how much that got used (and honestly gets used next to never now unless you like going down there for the pots). It was exciting for a while but then things went back to the same old same old.

I'd love to see new developments in PvMP but I don't think a new map is the answer. It might bring a freshness but having too many places to go on a small server would get boring imo depending on where people choose to spend their time.

As far as the expansion, I've yet to see anything posted about it worth spending money on let alone 70 dollars. The greed is going to bury this game.

Reading that interview leaves me with two questions who came up with some of those questions and did the person they were interviewing even know what game they were talking about? It didn't seem like there was ANY information that came from that other than the answers I'm not the right person to be asking, not on the roadmap and in the future.

Originally Posted by Andared

I saw this on their site as well.

They could have at least removed the exclamation point so it didn't seem like they were happy to slap us in the face.

The interviewer added the exclamation marks. In fact, the answers posted were paraphrased and not direct quotes.

Originally Posted by Ames

Reading that interview leaves me with two questions who came up with some of those questions and did the person they were interviewing even know what game they were talking about? It didn't seem like there was ANY information that came from that other than the answers I'm not the right person to be asking, not on the roadmap and in the future.

The interviewer was from Kalamari Kastle, not CSTM. CSTM has permission to repost the article from the original source. According to the comment made when we were asked the questions, the questions came 'from the community'.

Originally Posted by Sapience

The interviewer added the exclamation marks. In fact, the answers posted were paraphrased and not direct quotes.

It'd be nice if we saw more direct quotes/recordings and less 'paraphrased' replies to these kind of questions. Much less room for misunderstandings that way.

Originally Posted by Sapience

The interviewer added the exclamation marks. In fact, the answers posted were paraphrased and not direct quotes.



The interviewer was from Kalamari Kastle, not CSTM. CSTM has permission to repost the article from the original source. According to the comment made when we were asked the questions, the questions came 'from the community'.

I would ask if your thoughts about PvP balance but I may as well jump off a cliff

Originally Posted by Sapience

The interviewer added the exclamation marks. In fact, the answers posted were paraphrased and not direct quotes.



The interviewer was from Kalamari Kastle, not CSTM. CSTM has permission to repost the article from the original source. According to the comment made when we were asked the questions, the questions came 'from the community'.

I was going to ask you what happened to the zone promised with RoI, but I know better than to waste my time, as the community team can only be bothered answering questions on punctuation, as opposed engaging with us directly, and talk about the lack of PvMP map, and what plans are going forward.

It's totally infuriating to get a response to a specific thread where the subject isn't tackled, and we get semantics on who said what to whom.

Sapience pvmp have "future" in Lotro ? Because many players are angry and leave/delete creeps. Afer this players Lotro leave next pvmp players who also raids(pve content). After them leave next riders becasue no instance cluster with RoR, no serius twek for pvmp, overpriced expansions etc and very bad comunication with Turbine ! With next months game can leave +-50% of old players and you as company not gain much new from Steam(Rift in promotion example cost 5$ not 15$). Game now with RoR pre order is the most expensive on market !

Is chance for open letter 2 us players with road map for next months( dev diary about full RoR content and next updates?) Some reaction from Turbine side ? plz save this game !

Im read many forums (most of post here)also talks with people in game/kins and almost all have bad fellings about Lotro. This all post on forum write only players who love and dont wana leave this game, but you made 2 many mistakes...


Sorry for my bad english and i have hope for some answer.

Originally Posted by Noromir

It's totally infuriating to get a response to a specific thread where the subject isn't tackled, and we get semantics on who said what to whom.

Hey, Im just suprised that a dev actually posted on the Monster Play forums. I have only heard of these events through legend and folk-tale....

http://www.lotro.com/news/pressrelea...se-of-isengard

Expanded Monster Play – LOTRO’s monster play system will get a major revamp including opening up the feature to all players, changes to monster player skills and advancement and a brand new region for players to battle for or against the forces of evil.

The Ettenmoors is like a fish bowl with dirty water. Then we hear about the above quote......

THEN, we hear "not on the roadmap"

Lame

Epic Fail

Originally Posted by angrolas

Hey, Im just suprised that a dev actually posted on the Monster Play forums. I have only heard of these events through legend and folk-tale....

You are correct. They seem to dance around the elephant in the room. The elephant being the topic of this new map/zone/area.
Even though we got our answer of "not on road map". How does it come to that after coming out with a statement about it on their behalf?

What does not on road map mean exactly? Not now? Not in the future? Never?

PvP play needs the attention that it deserves. Our waiting has historically been longer then that of PvE'ers.

We want our zone/map/area.
We want our revisions.
We want it in a timely fashion.

Is that too much to ask for when you are paying a subscription? /facepalm

Originally Posted by Sapience

In fact, the answers posted were paraphrased and not direct quotes.

Paraphrased or not, the answer is the same, you're still taking the same old completely apathetic approach to PVMP. That attitude is now spreading to your PVE content as RoR shows.

You can't get away with ignoring us forever and hoping the problem will go away.

Chances are you will ignore this post, and PVMP will remain direly imbalanced and uncared for. You are only hurting yourselves.

Originally Posted by Sapience

The interviewer added the exclamation marks. In fact, the answers posted were paraphrased and not direct quotes.



The interviewer was from Kalamari Kastle, not CSTM. CSTM has permission to repost the article from the original source. According to the comment made when we were asked the questions, the questions came 'from the community'.

Sapience: a new PVP map was originally claimed to be happening with moria... it went moribund with mirkwood and was then claimed to be happening with RoI... it has since become a deceased parrot with RoI and will certainly not happen with RoR. I think you owe the PvP community... I don't know what but they are owed something.

Originally Posted by Sapience

The interviewer added the exclamation marks. In fact, the answers posted were paraphrased and not direct quotes.



The interviewer was from Kalamari Kastle, not CSTM. CSTM has permission to repost the article from the original source. According to the comment made when we were asked the questions, the questions came 'from the community'.

You best run Sapience I think I hear a mob with torches and pitchforks coming!!!!!

Originally Posted by Squelcher

Paraphrased or not, the answer is the same, you're still taking the same old completely apathetic approach to PVMP. That attitude is now spreading to your PVE content as RoR shows.

You can't get away with ignoring us forever and hoping the problem will go away.

Chances are you will ignore this post, and PVMP will remain direly imbalanced and uncared for. You are only hurting yourselves.

Not ignored. However, the answer given was accurate.

Originally Posted by Bhoris_they_spider

Sapience: a new PVP map was originally claimed to be happening with moria... it went moribund with mirkwood and was then claimed to be happening with RoI... it has since become a deceased parrot with RoI and will certainly not happen with RoR. I think you owe the PvP community... I don't know what but they are owed something.

We did too, that's why the answer was given directly, clearly, and very honestly. Rather than do as we had in the past where we put a map on our long term road map with the best of intentions to produce one and hope we were able to get to it only to then, due to the realities of time and money, scale back and remove it later, we were very upfront with the current roadmap and what it did not contain.

Also, to clarify a point. Some believe there is a PvMP map floating out there that we just need to plug into the game. This is not the case. The feature was cut in the past before any development began. So there is not a 'just put it in' option.

I can appreciate the answer is unpopular, but it was and is honest. If a bit blunt.

Originally Posted by Sapience

Not ignored. However, the answer given was accurate.



We did too, that's why the answer was given directly, clearly, and very honestly. Rather than do as we had in the past where we put a map on our long term road map with the best of intentions to produce one and hope we were able to get to it only to then, due to the realities of time and money, scale back and remove it later, we were very upfront with the current roadmap and what it did not contain.

Also, to clarify a point. Some believe there is a PvMP map floating out there that we just need to plug into the game. This is not the case. The feature was cut in the past before any development began. So there is not a 'just put it in' option.

I can appreciate the answer is unpopular, but it was and is honest. If a bit blunt.

Firstly, thanks for some interaction with the pvp community on the forums. We're not the friendliest of environments I can imagine

Personally other then the appeal of looking at new trees, a new map wasn't really going to change anything in the moors, especially if designing/implementing said map takes dev resources away from mechanic/balance adjustments, which for me are the more pressing issues with the moors. Along those lines do you care to share any information on the road map with respect to faction/class "balance" issues and where they stand and are going? The pvp community would likely appreciate blunt responses to this aspect of the game design as well.

Originally Posted by Sapience

Not ignored. However, the answer given was accurate.



We did too, that's why the answer was given directly, clearly, and very honestly. Rather than do as we had in the past where we put a map on our long term road map with the best of intentions to produce one and hope we were able to get to it only to then, due to the realities of time and money, scale back and remove it later, we were very upfront with the current roadmap and what it did not contain.

Also, to clarify a point. Some believe there is a PvMP map floating out there that we just need to plug into the game. This is not the case. The feature was cut in the past before any development began. So there is not a 'just put it in' option.

I can appreciate the answer is unpopular, but it was and is honest. If a bit blunt.

Firstly, thank you for the honest answer, it is appreciated. In that case, I think it is necessary to let people know how far in to the future the road map projects. I understand all things are subject to change etc. etc. but is it realistic to thing that 'not on the road map' means not within the next X months? I have no idea what the value of 'x' is but I would suspect it means more than 12 months less than 24... care to correct me?

Thanks for the honesty.

PvMP had a good run but I think a long break is in order!

The next logical question to Sapience would be...

What can the Ettenmoor's look forward to?









and thanks for replying to us.

Originally Posted by Bhoris_they_spider

Firstly, thank you for the honest answer, it is appreciated. In that case, I think it is necessary to let people know how far in to the future the road map projects. I understand all things are subject to change etc. etc. but is it realistic to thing that 'not on the road map' means not within the next X months? I have no idea what the value of 'x' is but I would suspect it means more than 12 months less than 24... care to correct me?

Even giving a answer along these lines is not a good idea. You have people who will hang on that time frame & if nothing happens by then all hell will break loose on the forums.

Originally Posted by Sapience

Not ignored. However, the answer given was accurate.



We did too, that's why the answer was given directly, clearly, and very honestly. Rather than do as we had in the past where we put a map on our long term road map with the best of intentions to produce one and hope we were able to get to it only to then, due to the realities of time and money, scale back and remove it later, we were very upfront with the current roadmap and what it did not contain.

Also, to clarify a point. Some believe there is a PvMP map floating out there that we just need to plug into the game. This is not the case. The feature was cut in the past before any development began. So there is not a 'just put it in' option.

I can appreciate the answer is unpopular, but it was and is honest. If a bit blunt.

Can you also say that because of time & money is the reason for no revamp to housing? If that's the case it be nice to give us something even being able to purchase extra hooks & storage via the store.

Sorry for intruding on the pvp forum. teehee

Thanks for the response Sapience. As long as we recieve regular updates to the Moors, I really don't think we even need a new map.

Originally Posted by Stevo6

I would ask if your thoughts about PvP balance but I may as well jump off a cliff

If you did that you wouldn't be able to hear my answer.

Balance is a hard thing. It's always a moving target and human nature being what it is, perception of ones own ability to win (regardless of skill, intention, or anything else) tends to skew the discussion.ANy change made makes for many many impacts across the board. Intended and unintended. I appreciate this may sound like I'm walking around the topic, but you did ask for MY thoughts.

Originally Posted by chrisCML

Firstly, thanks for some interaction with the pvp community on the forums. We're not the friendliest of environments I can imagine

Personally other then the appeal of looking at new trees, a new map wasn't really going to change anything in the moors, especially if designing/implementing said map takes dev resources away from mechanic/balance adjustments, which for me are the more pressing issues with the moors. Along those lines do you care to share any information on the road map with respect to faction/class "balance" issues and where they stand and are going? The pvp community would likely appreciate blunt responses to this aspect of the game design as well.

Originally Posted by Bhoris_they_spider

Firstly, thank you for the honest answer, it is appreciated. In that case, I think it is necessary to let people know how far in to the future the road map projects. I understand all things are subject to change etc. etc. but is it realistic to thing that 'not on the road map' means not within the next X months? I have no idea what the value of 'x' is but I would suspect it means more than 12 months less than 24... care to correct me?

Going to have to give an "I'll have to ask" on this one. Usually my focus is on what is the next Update or Expansion. So within that sphere of knowlege I can honestly say not between now and September 5 when Rohan launches or with Rohan. Beyond that, again, I can ask.

Originally Posted by Wilfrum

The next logical question to Sapience would be...

What can the Ettenmoor's look forward to?


and thanks for replying to us.

Going to have to give an honest answer here and admit I don't know much more than what Rowan posted in his Q&A.

Will there be any changes to PvMP, and if so, what kinds?

PvMP is getting a pretty substantial content update; we're reworking the Ettenmoors capture mechanics to focus your rewards around killing other players – not killing NPCs.

http://www.lotro.com/gameinfo/featur...owanq-campbell

I think what a lot of people want to know is: Do our opinions matter? The vast majority of the community thinks Audacity as it was implemented is a complete failure, these opinions have been voiced all over the place, yet there has been no interaction between the dev team and players on the issue.

1 year of playing this game, this is the first blue post on PVP forum i've seen. (well, unless your closing a forum) thanks sapience, I hope that even without map there are still soem changes to try and flesh out some balance, even if its not perfect and polished, i think the idea that you are trying just might blow some minds.

Reavers need some updates, commendations as well, some classes need a bit more umph, theres always the issue of a tactical creep, creep healing needs to be improved aswell

P.S. not attacking you or anytihng its just that in the year ive been here the only good ive seen done for creepside, is dirving more people to play wargs cause they are the only class that can so much as scratch an enemy.

"PvMP is getting a pretty substantial content update; we're reworking the Ettenmoors capture mechanics to focus your rewards around killing other players – not killing NPCs"


I'm sorry, that statement just scares the begebus out of me frankly.

I take that to mean you are going to take away the comendation rewards for doing quests and only give them for killing other players. Do you have any idea how incredibly hard that is going to make it for greenie creeps to get skills/coruptions etc.? It's bad enough now, that would just make it next to impossibe because greenies are nothing more than cannon fodder to freeps currently.

3 blue name respones on the same pvp forum? Woah
Now that we have his attention.......What color am I thinking of?

Originally Posted by angrolas

3 blue name respones on the same pvp forum? Woah
Now that we have his attention.......What color am I thinking of?

I was going to say Orange, but then I realized, you're all about the Mauve.

Originally Posted by Sapience

I was going to say Orange, but then I realized, you're all about the Mauve.

Mauve is sexy

Originally Posted by Sapience

Not ignored. However, the answer given was accurate.



We did too, that's why the answer was given directly, clearly, and very honestly. Rather than do as we had in the past where we put a map on our long term road map with the best of intentions to produce one and hope we were able to get to it only to then, due to the realities of time and money, scale back and remove it later, we were very upfront with the current roadmap and what it did not contain.

Also, to clarify a point. Some believe there is a PvMP map floating out there that we just need to plug into the game. This is not the case. The feature was cut in the past before any development began. So there is not a 'just put it in' option.

I can appreciate the answer is unpopular, but it was and is honest. If a bit blunt.

Thanks for posting, and actually continuing the dialog. A little of this every once and a while would go a long way to put to rest a lot of the anger towards the developers and turbine staff.

We appreciate the responses Sapience. Just stay in touch with the PvMP community
And do talk to the developers about the map.

Four dev responses on the Monster Play subforum and only to shush us .

Amusing .

Now that we have your attention, can you talk to the dev's about Commedations, its really tough for new creeps to get their skills. Re-introducing destiny points will be a great start.
You can still keep commedations for skins/items, w/e but skills... ehh :/

Originally Posted by Sapience

Not ignored. However, the answer given was accurate.

Also, to clarify a point. Some believe there is a PvMP map floating out there that we just need to plug into the game. This is not the case. The feature was cut in the past before any development began. So there is not a 'just put it in' option.

Even so, if the development of a new map requires large scale resource why is it not possible to use an existing already functioning map.. lets take the north downs as an example... and duplicate that; the development then is to add control points home bases and npcs? Ok its work, but its a fraction of the work to generate a brand new bug ridden map.

Originally Posted by Sapience

Not ignored. However, the answer given was accurate.



We did too, that's why the answer was given directly, clearly, and very honestly. Rather than do as we had in the past where we put a map on our long term road map with the best of intentions to produce one and hope we were able to get to it only to then, due to the realities of time and money, scale back and remove it later, we were very upfront with the current roadmap and what it did not contain.

Also, to clarify a point. Some believe there is a PvMP map floating out there that we just need to plug into the game. This is not the case. The feature was cut in the past before any development began. So there is not a 'just put it in' option.

I can appreciate the answer is unpopular, but it was and is honest. If a bit blunt.

For god's sake you have a complete map already, DOF is sitting abandoned... there is no reason to go there for freeps or creeps.. why not put some time into an already existing spot? I love the areas there bridges, lava, plenty of LOS zones. Sure it will take some thought, maybe build in some keep like structures, hotspots RANDOM spawns of friendly, enemy and hostile to everyone npcs.

We are at the point where we have been ignored... lied to ... yes promised and then told over and over that we would be getting this area for YEARS now.. and now you basically are saying we are not worth the time or the effort. While revamping the Delving would take some doing you have the map completed, most of the art and all you would need to do is decide what to add to it. At least look into it and let us know if it would be possible.

Tydalmir

/sneaks in a question to sapience.

Sup about hunters brah?

Er, /trollface off, When, if ever are we going see fixes for class issues, and address balance on both sides?

I'd for once like to see some actual fixes fixing things without adding typos in tooltips and incorrect values ... (see warden as example)

I mean, like an actual update update. Not pushing silly small stuff like new shineys or changes which are purely cosmetic (I'm looking at you, mr red flashy new item in inventory.)

Because while it's nice to get somethin' new, it's better to be able to use our own abilities better and more precisely.

Although you said things weren't being ignored apparently in regards to balance... I feel as though, we should have present issues resolved before looking at changing things around. Please don't procrastinate on necessary basics.

I'll probably get a lot of negative rep for this post, given how I opened it, lol. There is actual content above though, or so I think.

Originally Posted by Dinara

"PvMP is getting a pretty substantial content update; we're reworking the Ettenmoors capture mechanics to focus your rewards around killing other players – not killing NPCs"


I'm sorry, that statement just scares the begebus out of me frankly.

I take that to mean you are going to take away the comendation rewards for doing quests and only give them for killing other players. Do you have any idea how incredibly hard that is going to make it for greenie creeps to get skills/coruptions etc.? It's bad enough now, that would just make it next to impossibe because greenies are nothing more than cannon fodder to freeps currently.

Yeah and no, somehow it's strange that you can get PvP rewards by purely doing PvE, having more focus on PvP in the moors as basis is not bad in my eyes.

Originally Posted by Louvre

Four dev responses on the Monster Play subforum and only to shush us .

Amusing .

What's more amusing on how everyone says "thanks sapience" after a few posts, even though it will change nothing.

Originally Posted by Sapience

If you did that you wouldn't be able to hear my answer.

Oooo, we got a smart one.

Originally Posted by Sapience

Balance is a hard thing. It's always a moving target and human nature being what it is, perception of ones own ability to win (regardless of skill, intention, or anything else) tends to skew the discussion.ANy change made makes for many many impacts across the board. Intended and unintended. I appreciate this may sound like I'm walking around the topic, but you did ask for MY thoughts.

You are walking around the topic. Creeps are underpowered. The forums have been saying that for quite some time, but none of you so-called devs respond to it. This is the first blue response I've seen on the forums, other than kelsan with the upcoming changes, that helped us so much LOL. The creep community have been ignored for so long.

So, what do you say about the total lack of dev attention to PvP? Try rolling a rank 0 reaver. In fact, auto level it to rank 15, and you'll still get farmed like all the rest.

Originally Posted by Sapience

Not ignored. However, the answer given was accurate.



We did too, that's why the answer was given directly, clearly, and very honestly. Rather than do as we had in the past where we put a map on our long term road map with the best of intentions to produce one and hope we were able to get to it only to then, due to the realities of time and money, scale back and remove it later, we were very upfront with the current roadmap and what it did not contain.

Also, to clarify a point. Some believe there is a PvMP map floating out there that we just need to plug into the game. This is not the case. The feature was cut in the past before any development began. So there is not a 'just put it in' option.

I can appreciate the answer is unpopular, but it was and is honest. If a bit blunt.

Thanks for coming on the forums and being honest enough to tell us that you (Turbine) has no interest in changing/improving pvp for the players.

What was also interesting is that you came on here and basically told us nothing except to shut up and deal with the fact that you don't want to change it. Instead you guys want to just let it rot away.

Originally Posted by HalProudFoot

Thanks for coming on the forums and being honest enough to tell us that you (Turbine) has no interest in changing/improving pvp for the players.

What was also interesting is that you came on here and basically told us nothing except to shut up and deal with the fact that you don't want to change it. Instead you guys want to just let it rot away.

And lastly you're flat out lying,pvmp is being ignored. You could atleast be honest about that.

And posts like this is exactly why they don't respond here.