Thread: Freeps come forth as I am in need of your opinions

so after some little touch discussion in the raid time thread from Sylidor, I wanted to make an official discussion thread regarding if the freeps would like a voice communication server...so here we go.

*Official Discussion Thread*

Babycaek and I had a long discussion the other evening after some raiding regarding getting freeps back into a primary voice chat server. I do have one available for you guys as of now, however I wanted opinions of all freeps prior to rolling it out. Both myself and Caek have spoken to a few of the full time freeps about having it and so far I do see a good amount of support.

The reason I feel like this is beneficial enough to divulge time into it is this.

1) How well do you know your fellow freeps on a vocal relational level?
-after the many conversations I have had with many many freeps in the moors, I know the majority of the people that play out there are awesome people and many which I am proud to call my friends. so Imagine if the freeps got together and were actually able to HEAR people talking to each other outside of having to group and not through text

2) the ability to allow multiple group to communicate with each other and not have to guess or type it out.
-there have been many times where medium sized groups having been running around no more than 100m from each other and due to no ability to quickly communicate, the groups got wiped cause they didn't know the other was there. Easy fix

3) Raid full?
- People in standby can hear movements and know the situation in the moors and not have to guess

4) able to mobilize and form up lightning fast.
-I know this would differ from freep to creep a bit being that people are out in a vast PVE land and not all rallied up in 1 zone. But think of how much more action you could get if you are able to form up and be ready to move out in 2-3 minutes instead of 10-15

5) General Socializing
-this IMO is the most important feature overall. To me, running around solo in the moors with people all around me doing the same thing and not being able to talk to anyone would just be lonely to me. I love having conversations with people. especially while playing. just farting around in the moors and being able to chit chat with people and not grouped is fun! it is like a little party. You can't imagine the random, idiotic banter that goes on during downtime in creep TS. Most of us end up laughing so hard that we have to map out cause we cant pay attention. its FUN!

6) New freeps coming in can be welcomed and initiated into the community quickly by meeting the players right out of the gate. Questions can be answered by the vets, ice can be broken, and then more players will become regular moors attendees. (one of the major points of E PVP)



There are many other great reasons why this can be beneficial. The kinks of the whole "Project" if you will have no been ironed out, but after Babycaek and I spoke to some of the freeps we thought we would go for it and see how you guys (Freeps) feel about it.


So. Thoughts, comments, I know there will probably be some flames and troll posts...But I want honest opinions.

Is this something you guys want? And are you ok having a couple creeps helping the freep community out? ( i come from a time when the freeps and creeps as a whole were all friends so I consider myself an E player. not a creep =])

The floor is yours.

Originally Posted by Delmore

5) General Socializing
-this IMO is the most important feature overall. To me, running around solo in the moors with people all around me doing the same thing and not being able to talk to anyone would just be lonely to me. I love having conversations with people. especially while playing. just farting around in the moors and being able to chit chat with people and not grouped is fun! it is like a little party. You can't imagine the random, idiotic banter that goes on during downtime in creep TS. Most of us end up laughing so hard that we have to map out cause we cant pay attention. its FUN!

I will add to this that this can also serve as great comedic relief. On the few occasions I logged in as a creep, I would listen in and be graced with hearing Wretcher talk about some random event. There have been times I nearly split a side laughing.

Originally Posted by Delmore

so after some little touch discussion in the raid time thread from Sylidor, I wanted to make an official discussion thread regarding if the freeps would like a voice communication server...so here we go.

*Official Discussion Thread*

Babycaek and I had a long discussion the other evening after some raiding regarding getting freeps back into a primary voice chat server. I do have one available for you guys as of now, however I wanted opinions of all freeps prior to rolling it out. Both myself and Caek have spoken to a few of the full time freeps about having it and so far I do see a good amount of support.

The reason I feel like this is beneficial enough to divulge time into it is this.

1) How well do you know your fellow freeps on a vocal relational level?

--I know the freeps generally well doesn't seem to be a whole lot of drama, they seem to want to work in a raid but isnt often one. If we had a chat room it would have to be monitored. I think the use of voice chats encourages unecissary call outs and that it would need moderators.

-after the many conversations I have had with many many freeps in the moors, I know the majority of the people that play out there are awesome people and many which I am proud to call my friends. so Imagine if the freeps got together and were actually able to HEAR people talking to each other outside of having to group and not through text

--E is known for its communication and working together as a whole. I have a feeling many of us wouldnt mind being able to communicate and hear where the action is vs waiting for a response in ooc

2) the ability to allow multiple group to communicate with each other and not have to guess or type it out.
-there have been many times where medium sized groups having been running around no more than 100m from each other and due to no ability to quickly communicate, the groups got wiped cause they didn't know the other was there. Easy fix

3) Raid full?
- People in standby can hear movements and know the situation in the moors and not have to guess

--Would be nice to have my kin group able to help the moors more. I thought about opening up my kin vent to the public but I think a seperate one would be nice.

4) able to mobilize and form up lightning fast.
-I know this would differ from freep to creep a bit being that people are out in a vast PVE land and not all rallied up in 1 zone. But think of how much more action you could get if you are able to form up and be ready to move out in 2-3 minutes instead of 10-15

--I would like to encourage this to split up units instead of zerg balls working together in seperate fights but not everyone has to be in one place at one time. There is more renown/infamy to be had if ur fighting 5 vs 5 instead of 24 vs 5 etc vice versa.

5) General Socializing
-this IMO is the most important feature overall. To me, running around solo in the moors with people all around me doing the same thing and not being able to talk to anyone would just be lonely to me. I love having conversations with people. especially while playing. just farting around in the moors and being able to chit chat with people and not grouped is fun! it is like a little party. You can't imagine the random, idiotic banter that goes on during downtime in creep TS. Most of us end up laughing so hard that we have to map out cause we cant pay attention. its FUN!
6) New freeps coming in can be welcomed and initiated into the community quickly by meeting the players right out of the gate. Questions can be answered by the vets, ice can be broken, and then more players will become regular moors attendees. (one of the major points of E PVP)

--There should be a socalizing room for more fun, because if fighting commenses , its very hard to hear and command when there is a lot of excess chatter.



There are many other great reasons why this can be beneficial. The kinks of the whole "Project" if you will have no been ironed out, but after Babycaek and I spoke to some of the freeps we thought we would go for it and see how you guys (Freeps) feel about it.


So. Thoughts, comments, I know there will probably be some flames and troll posts...But I want honest opinions.

Is this something you guys want? And are you ok having a couple creeps helping the freep community out? ( i come from a time when the freeps and creeps as a whole were all friends so I consider myself an E player. not a creep =])

The floor is yours.

-- I think it would be beneficial but, needs moderators and also people need a general guide line to follow ie candy mountain. It is also a good way to see just how many people you are fighting against. Discourage call outs in it is a must and also try to work together in separate groups vs one big raid ball would be nice. Though a nice rvr would be nice but, freepside numbers are not what they used to be. It is a nice idea and very honorable of you yicky.

Just out of curiosity, why does no one use the E-Freep teamspeak? It is still up and active, Corv would probably be excited to see freeps back on it.

I personally am not installing another thing on my computer.

Originally Posted by Zalexia

I personally am not installing another thing on my computer.

I'm sure they will be relieved.

Originally Posted by lordsinner

Just out of curiosity, why does no one use the E-Freep teamspeak? It is still up and active, Corv would probably be excited to see freeps back on it.

Where have you been you nut job


and yes that is the one we are thinking of. But it has been sitting in moth balls for a while and Corv is currently away with some health issues. So in the mean time, myself and Lalliarian are currently holding on to it. We have to get it payed up, rebuilt a little, and I cannot admin it as I am a Creep Speak admin and it can create some conflict of interest. So Lalli is heading up the admin once it gets started as I can't be over there shuffling people in. But until it does, I want to make sure Sylidor, the other potential leaders, and the rest of the freeps want to use it so I know to make sure it is made all pretty for everyone.

Originally Posted by Zalexia

I personally am not installing another thing on my computer.

just do it you dork

Good post Yicky, I love that people are willing to help figure out how to make pvp better for BOTH sides, props to you.



What about people who can't use Vent/TS such as myself? Is there an alternative?

Originally Posted by RGilthanas

Good post Yicky, I love that people are willing to help figure out how to make pvp better for BOTH sides, props to you.



What about people who can't use Vent/TS such as myself? Is there an alternative?

I am not sure what there would be for you. I can look into it tho. are there any programs that you use that can translate incoming speech or anything?

I will do some research this week and see if I can find anything. Before you transferred IIRC you were constantly raiding with the group and were able to function as well as anyone else. With that in mind I am very sure that even if you aren't in TS, the leaders would work with you. But I will research and see if I can come up with something.

Great post Ricky!

I for one do miss the old days of both sides having a lot of fun. Those were some good days even though there was still drama. I believe that freeps would benefit completely to a voice server as Yicky has stated. The community in itself over on creepside (while still having a few that are well, not so nice) is actually pretty great! It is a breath of fresh air to come into TS and see all the old/new faces hanging around and just having fun. I believe that is what some people are missing when they do not have voice to use. The socialization of it all. I do hope it works out for those freeps who miss it as well! I know for one I would love to see Beruthqoc back out there in action!

I haven't been active in the moors since before Moria went live. With the changes that they made to the moors, IMO, the community fell apart and it has not been the same since. I hate going out there solo, it's no fun to just go get killed over and over again with no support from fellow freeps. When the whole attitude of folks changed to oly caring about ranking and not about fellowing at all, that really did it for me. If freeps would just take a look at the whole concept of pvp and rethink their mindset, things may change, but after being a fixture in the Moors for so long during SOA and with the changes that came with Moria, the community went from great to almost non existent. Wanna bring the community back, the first thing you need is a vent or TS server and get folks to actually sue it, get to know each other and not worry about getting killed in the Moors!

This is great Yicky! I must say, I LOVE logging into Creepspeak when I roll out my creep and hearing everyone cut up. It's such a nice change of pace. I already have it installed on all 3 of my computers thanks to my KupKake and Elyo! Raae, you don't need to hear us, you already know what everyone expects from you and that is an awesome fight! I really hope this gets going though Would be nice to put a voice with a name again!

Originally Posted by Delmore

just do it you dork

Stop trying to steal her 50 megabytes, Yicky. Not cool.

Originally Posted by Brayden

Stop trying to steal her 50 megabytes, Yicky. Not cool.

what in the hell is a megabyte?

We all know that we need an official freep vent/Ts server. That's obvious.

Thing is..

We've had a vent organised for a couple of weeks now. I havent mentioned it in any of the recent forum posts because I've been having problems with PTT, and it hasn't been resolved until now. Finchandir generously offered me to use his vent for leading (which has 50slots open), and I have been using it ever since until certain issues. Those resolved, I will be talking to Finch/any other kin officers from DoH and LoL as to whether we can extend the slots, open up a safe-haven for communication/socialising, and turn it into the permanent official freep vent.

Now, of course, there's a whole string of legalities attached to that idea. I don't actually know for sure yet whether that's the extent Finch was talking about - as I don't know how much he uses the server, and I certainly don't want a vent server to be 'taken over' - so I will be organising some time to talk with him and discuss.

The main reason being I would like to set-up the Freep vent server here more than anywhere else is Finch's contribution to us all - not to mention the founders are great people/mates - a great environment to start in.

Regardless, I will get back to you on this. Harg has also offered his Ts3 for use, which in contribution to your offer Yicky, basically assures us we can get this going. You know where I would prefer to set the vent up in the short term - but I don't care for the long run where it happens.

Sounds good Syl. Keep me updated and i would love to hear other people's opinions still. Glad to help out and hope this provides a benefit to you guys

Ok I think I got everything set up. soooo....

here is the teamspeak info that is available for all freeps that wish to use it.


ts.lotrofreeps.com:9997

currently there are two active admins. myself and Lalliarien who will both be willing to work any issues, concerns, comments, etc etc for you until more admins are selected and I can go back to my creeping ways

I really hope this helps the freeps out if anything just to become better friends and a tight community. enjoy it, behave, and good luck out there. have fun!!

For all this talk about wanting to fight freep raids, creeps seem to be surprisingly unwilling to fight a group of just 5-6 freeps, even in red keeps. Given the lack of resistance against a group of 6, despite there being quite a few creeps online, I could hardly imagine the lack of action if freeps dared venture out into the moors in a group as large as 9 or, god forbid, 12. Unless the goal is to fight raids of poorly geared, poorly played freeps rather than groups of slightly less poorly geared, but correctly played freeps, then mission (maybe?) accomplished.

Originally Posted by Kiddyfence

For all this talk about wanting to fight freep raids, creeps seem to be surprisingly unwilling to fight a group of just 5-6 freeps, even in red keeps. Given the lack of resistance against a group of 6, despite there being quite a few creeps online, I could hardly imagine the lack of action if freeps dared venture out into the moors in a group as large as 9 or, god forbid, 12. Unless the goal is to fight raids of poorly geared, poorly played freeps rather than groups of slightly less poorly geared, but correctly played freeps, then mission (maybe?) accomplished.

It's exactly the same during Aus Prime Time when Peachhime/Spikerush etc. groups are out. If you're out while someone like Yicky has a group rolling, I'd bet anything he wouldn't leave, and would fight you, unless he needed to leave for RL reasons/etc. However, if you have a group of 5-6, but there is no creep leader out, no-one is going to want to go anywhere near you (despite creeps having double your numbers). I sure as hell wouldn't want to.. that's not hard to work out.

So group up, have fun as mates and absolutely dominate anything in your vacinaty due to high-playing ability/skill. But unless there's something organised on the other side, don't expect to face much resistance.

Originally Posted by Kiddyfence

For all this talk about wanting to fight freep raids, creeps seem to be surprisingly unwilling to fight a group of just 5-6 freeps, even in red keeps. Given the lack of resistance against a group of 6, despite there being quite a few creeps online, I could hardly imagine the lack of action if freeps dared venture out into the moors in a group as large as 9 or, god forbid, 12. Unless the goal is to fight raids of poorly geared, poorly played freeps rather than groups of slightly less poorly geared, but correctly played freeps, then mission (maybe?) accomplished.

Please lol...just take a look at the damage you and gala can do to a group of creeps. over and over. Now you want those same ungrouped creeps to take on your heal heavy group? I say no. Not your fault or anything; I understand you are trying to look for fair fights, as is the rest of anv i'd assume, but that won't work with a bunch of ungrouped players.

Originally Posted by Kiddyfence

For all this talk about wanting to fight freep raids, creeps seem to be surprisingly unwilling to fight a group of just 5-6 freeps, even in red keeps. Given the lack of resistance against a group of 6, despite there being quite a few creeps online, I could hardly imagine the lack of action if freeps dared venture out into the moors in a group as large as 9 or, god forbid, 12. Unless the goal is to fight raids of poorly geared, poorly played freeps rather than groups of slightly less poorly geared, but correctly played freeps, then mission (maybe?) accomplished.

The smug thickens.

People might ask why anyone would make a 5 man freep group, with more healers then DPS, to fight ungrounded opposition?

Then there is the small part about not wanting to fight a cheat....

From the Code of Conduct:

18. You may not create, post, use or distribute any utilities, emulators or other third party software tools without the express written permission of Turbine (including, without limitation, macroing programs, botting programs, server emulators, client hacks, map hacks, and data gathering utilities).

I invite people to watch this fella in particular when he's fighting. Watch as he changes from a two handed, to single handed weapons then instantly back to a two handed weapon again. Then check how his maximum power and moral pool jump about all over the place as he swaps armor and jewelry sets to maximise set bonuses. You can't use the in game UI to achieve this. He must be using a third party item like a programmable keyboard to get one click armor and weapon swaps tied to the skill they give the maximum effect to. Clearly against the COC, clearly an exploit.

Weigh this against all the advantages freeps have and the OP'ness of the classes that make up these 5 man groups and I'd say this Pker is just looking for another reason to toot his own horn.

Originally Posted by ksjock

......Then there is the small part about not wanting to fight a cheat....

He didn't cheat, you got outskilled.

Originally Posted by ksjock

The smug thickens.

People might ask why anyone would make a 5 man freep group, with more healers then DPS, to fight ungrounded opposition?

Then there is the small part about not wanting to fight a cheat....

From the Code of Conduct:

18. You may not create, post, use or distribute any utilities, emulators or other third party software tools without the express written permission of Turbine (including, without limitation, macroing programs, botting programs, server emulators, client hacks, map hacks, and data gathering utilities).

I invite people to watch this fella in particular when he's fighting. Watch as he changes from a two handed, to single handed weapons then instantly back to a two handed weapon again. Then check how his maximum power and moral pool jump about all over the place as he swaps armor and jewelry sets to maximise set bonuses. You can't use the in game UI to achieve this. He must be using a third party item like a programmable keyboard to get one click armor and weapon swaps tied to the skill they give the maximum effect to. Clearly against the COC, clearly an exploit.

Weigh this against all the advantages freeps have and the OP'ness of the classes that make up these 5 man groups and I'd say this Pker is just looking for another reason to toot his own horn.

Your posts always make my day.

It's funny to see peeps assuming Kiddy macro gear swap.
However, I will keep this topic on track.

I have been playing alot this week and logging on different timing during AUS or US prime.
Lack of focus fire is the problem. Can someone tell me why 7 minnies in the raid still get roflstomped by smeg group?

If you're one of the creeps fighting Anv'ers during Lug/TR keep take for the past 2 days, you would realise while the main healer was dead, the group was pretty much wiped. Focus fire and send the wargs to the healer I would say even though you're solo.

What is the difference solo BAs and Wargs can focus fire good at TR rez area but have difficulty to encounter 5-6 grouped freeps at their own keep with the help of NPC?

Just my 2 cents

Originally Posted by Daybreak

[FONT=franklin gothic medium]It's funny to see peeps assuming Kiddy macro gear swap.

Originally Posted by Kiddyfence

Some skills are better with dual wield. Some skills are better with a 2h. Decide which is better for each skill. Swap accordingly.

If he's doing it manually, I'm impressed, because that's a lot of extra key presses.

Anyway, hope the TS effort goes well, Yicky. Organized groups are generally harder to take down and provide better competition.

Originally Posted by Ragnazh

Please lol...just take a look at the damage you and gala can do to a group of creeps. over and over. Now you want those same ungrouped creeps to take on your heal heavy group? I say no. Not your fault or anything; I understand you are trying to look for fair fights, as is the rest of anv i'd assume, but that won't work with a bunch of ungrouped players.

This may have to do with creeps pointlessly chasing around the champ and not maintaining dots/cc/debuffs on the target you should be focusing on. There is a reason the champ is all over someone who pokes the captain a couple times.

Kinda like freeps not bringing down WLs/defilers first. Sure you can take out that lower mit/morale warg that is chewing on you (as you just stand in one spot I might add) but the WL will just pick them back up or they will map back in. The mechanics of this game are quite simple and haven't changed much and people still haven't learned. When ANV brings down wave after wave of creeps it is because the creeps were outplayed.

Originally Posted by Daybreak

Can someone tell me why 7 minnies in the raid still get roflstomped by smeg group?

Might also have something to do with minis not knowing how to heal in the moors /shrug.

Originally Posted by Daybreak

Can someone tell me why 7 minnies in the raid still get roflstomped by smeg group?

Bryter summed this up well on the first page of http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.php?461769-RvR-Times . In short, many freeps do not know how to play their class. The freeps are the strongest when grouped with their classes playing their respective rolls. However, the freeps are the least likely to play their respective roles.

-Syn

Originally Posted by ksjock

The smug thickens.

People might ask why anyone would make a 5 man freep group, with more healers then DPS, to fight ungrounded opposition?

Then there is the small part about not wanting to fight a cheat....

From the Code of Conduct:

18. You may not create, post, use or distribute any utilities, emulators or other third party software tools without the express written permission of Turbine (including, without limitation, macroing programs, botting programs, server emulators, client hacks, map hacks, and data gathering utilities).

I invite people to watch this fella in particular when he's fighting. Watch as he changes from a two handed, to single handed weapons then instantly back to a two handed weapon again. Then check how his maximum power and moral pool jump about all over the place as he swaps armor and jewelry sets to maximise set bonuses. You can't use the in game UI to achieve this. He must be using a third party item like a programmable keyboard to get one click armor and weapon swaps tied to the skill they give the maximum effect to. Clearly against the COC, clearly an exploit.

Weigh this against all the advantages freeps have and the OP'ness of the classes that make up these 5 man groups and I'd say this Pker is just looking for another reason to toot his own horn.

Hahahahhahahahahaha

Originally Posted by ksjock

The smug thickens.

People might ask why anyone would make a 5 man freep group, with more healers then DPS, to fight ungrounded opposition?

Then there is the small part about not wanting to fight a cheat....

From the Code of Conduct:

18. You may not create, post, use or distribute any utilities, emulators or other third party software tools without the express written permission of Turbine (including, without limitation, macroing programs, botting programs, server emulators, client hacks, map hacks, and data gathering utilities).

I invite people to watch this fella in particular when he's fighting. Watch as he changes from a two handed, to single handed weapons then instantly back to a two handed weapon again. Then check how his maximum power and moral pool jump about all over the place as he swaps armor and jewelry sets to maximise set bonuses. You can't use the in game UI to achieve this. He must be using a third party item like a programmable keyboard to get one click armor and weapon swaps tied to the skill they give the maximum effect to. Clearly against the COC, clearly an exploit.

Weigh this against all the advantages freeps have and the OP'ness of the classes that make up these 5 man groups and I'd say this Pker is just looking for another reason to toot his own horn.

you are aware players are able to press sequences of buttons to rotate gear, yes? Or does your inability to do so, or at least comprehend so, distinguish such an act as cheating? I swapped gear and rotated 2h and 1h strictly through buttons. So your point, whatever exactly that point was, is irrelevant.

Originally Posted by ksjock

The smug thickens.

People might ask why anyone would make a 5 man freep group, with more healers then DPS, to fight ungrounded opposition?

Then there is the small part about not wanting to fight a cheat....

From the Code of Conduct:

18. You may not create, post, use or distribute any utilities, emulators or other third party software tools without the express written permission of Turbine (including, without limitation, macroing programs, botting programs, server emulators, client hacks, map hacks, and data gathering utilities).

I invite people to watch this fella in particular when he's fighting. Watch as he changes from a two handed, to single handed weapons then instantly back to a two handed weapon again. Then check how his maximum power and moral pool jump about all over the place as he swaps armor and jewelry sets to maximise set bonuses. You can't use the in game UI to achieve this. He must be using a third party item like a programmable keyboard to get one click armor and weapon swaps tied to the skill they give the maximum effect to. Clearly against the COC, clearly an exploit.

Weigh this against all the advantages freeps have and the OP'ness of the classes that make up these 5 man groups and I'd say this Pker is just looking for another reason to toot his own horn.

LOL, yeah cause manual swaps are impossible....please refrain yourself from posting again

Originally Posted by Kiddyfence

For all this talk about wanting to fight freep raids, creeps seem to be surprisingly unwilling to fight a group of just 5-6 freeps, even in red keeps. Given the lack of resistance against a group of 6, despite there being quite a few creeps online, I could hardly imagine the lack of action if freeps dared venture out into the moors in a group as large as 9 or, god forbid, 12. Unless the goal is to fight raids of poorly geared, poorly played freeps rather than groups of slightly less poorly geared, but correctly played freeps, then mission (maybe?) accomplished.

I wasn't around for that. I would gladly go up against a 5-6 group. Now someone mentioned a stack of minis with you. If that is indeed the case then I could see why creeps would back off after a couple fights as a captain, champ, and 3 minis would be unkillable without a huge group. So small group vs small group I would try. but If I can't bring down a stacked mini group then I will admit defeat and not push again. Always depends on group makeup on if a creep group can take something down. When a group rolls out and is heal heavy...you are not going to get a lot of fights to be honest cause of the healing imbalance

Originally Posted by Lestache

If he's doing it manually, I'm impressed, because that's a lot of extra key presses.

Anyway, hope the TS effort goes well, Yicky. Organized groups are generally harder to take down and provide better competition.

This is what I want. among other things. The freep community is a group of great people. This is just to provide an outlet that is Social, enjoyable, and tactical for them as well. If people dont want to log into it, by all means, dont. But I know sitting in teamspeak having stupidly hilarious conversations or even serious conversations while soloing out there makes it more fun and lightens the mood a bit. It adds a personality to the person you are playing next to that you have never heard or spoken to.

Originally Posted by synfin

Bryter summed this up well on the first page of http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.php?461769-RvR-Times . In short, many freeps do not know how to play their class. The freeps are the strongest when grouped with their classes playing their respective rolls. However, the freeps are the least likely to play their respective roles.

-Syn

Be a teacher. Another nice thing about having a voice chat server is the ablity to vocally answer questions and make recommendations to people that may not be using their classes full potential. One thing I do every major update is I go in and spend about a week completely rewriting the weaver section of the monster manual and then let people know it is done, then spend about another week answering questions that people have and run around with newer spiders or even older spiders that ask If I would do so.

For those people that know their classes inside and out, offer guidance and devotion to help the newer players that come out. One of my biggest pet peeves on creepside is when a day 1 player asks a question and the vets give some BS A-hole answer. Forgetting that 4-5 years ago they probably asked the same question.

Unless you're some sort of hand-eye co-ordination übermensch I'd suggest that insinuating anything along the lines of cheating sorta just makes you look like either sour grapes or mentally handicapped grapes
Jus sayin

Originally Posted by Delmore

I wasn't around for that. I would gladly go up against a 5-6 group. Now someone mentioned a stack of minis with you. If that is indeed the case then I could see why creeps would back off after a couple fights as a captain, champ, and 3 minis would be unkillable without a huge group. So small group vs small group I would try. but If I can't bring down a stacked mini group then I will admit defeat and not push again. Always depends on group makeup on if a creep group can take something down. When a group rolls out and is heal heavy...you are not going to get a lot of fights to be honest cause of the healing imbalance

Anv only have 1 minny

Originally Posted by Daybreak

Anv only have 1 minny

then sorry I missed it. hopefully I will catch you next time. my evenings are eaten up until roughly 1am EST as I am in class over the summer. :/

Actual grouping/support > semi psuedo coordination via TS/trade.

^I assume this is prolly the underlying rational for ANVs, and also Smeg's success.

On creepside in particular, outside zerg situations, lazy focus fire alone will generally not succeed versus coordinated and skilled opposition.

Originally Posted by ksjock

The smug thickens.

People might ask why anyone would make a 5 man freep group, with more healers then DPS, to fight ungrounded opposition?

In our group of 6, we had 1 minstrel and 1 captain. I'll assume (and hope) that you felt we had more healers than dps and others thought we had a multiple minstrels due to Amily's and Galareion's abilities rather than a serious lack of understanding in mathematics and counting (i.e. 2 is in fact less than 4).

And numbers should not have been an issue. There were at least 15 creeps, depending on exactly how many wargs, just around TR res alone before we grouped up. And the moment we left the moors, freeps had the outnumbered buff.

On both sides, outside of a few groups, there seems to be an unwillingness to fight without having overwhelming numbers. The way I see it, if your group/raid isn't wiping on a regular basis then you probably aren't looking for difficult enough fights or your group/raid is too big. When creeps defend their keeps we wipe almost every time.

Originally Posted by ksjock

Then there is the small part about not wanting to fight a cheat....

I hadn't responded to the macroing comments because I thought they were funny, but this is an opportunity I can't pass up. Being able to gear/wep swap manually through key binds is, or at least should be, considered basic competence. All it takes is using 60-70 key binds, since the game allows for up to 72 key binds. Your inability to understand how it even occurs suggest that basic competence may be lacking.

For your sake, I have made a short vid showing how it's done. To be frank, if you aren't capable of using 60+ key binds at a reasonably high APM on a class that needs it, then you're just a terrible player and not at our standards.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PNahtFGBJf4

Originally Posted by Kiddyfence

I hadn't responded to the macroing comments because I thought they were funny, but this is an opportunity I can't pass up. Being able to gear/wep swap manually through key binds is, or at least should be, considered basic competence. All it takes is using 60-70 key binds, since the game allows for up to 72 key binds. Your inability to understand how it even occurs suggest that basic competence may be lacking.

For your sake, I have made a short vid showing how it's done. To be frank, if you aren't capable of using 60+ key binds at a reasonably high APM on a class that needs it, then you're just a terrible player and not at our standards.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PNahtFGBJf4

And, as promised, I am impressed.

Well done, dude.

Originally Posted by Daybreak

Anv only have 1 minny

We have 3 but zef and docgreenthumb don't play anymore.

Pretty amusing how stuff gets elaborated.
Our groups are barely coordinated lol. We don't use voice or chat comm's (incombat for chat).
Alot of people tend to do their own thing every so often. Which leads to wipes.
But having good players who know their role and can easily enough see whats going on around them, you don't need to much coordination. Just listen to music and grape.


Nice vid kid. Your fingers must be tough, how much do you finger bench?

Originally Posted by FKing

We have 3 but zef and docgreenthumb don't play anymore.

Pretty amusing how stuff gets elaborated.
Our groups are barely coordinated lol. We don't use voice or chat comm's (incombat for chat).
Alot of people tend to do their own thing every so often. Which leads to wipes.
But having good players who know their role and can easily enough see whats going on around them, you don't need to much coordination. Just listen to music and grape.


Nice vid kid. Your fingers must be tough, how much do you finger bench?

Finger level = Asian