Thread: incoming healing

im new to playing a guard and have read many posts about how to build and play one. i cant seem to find a thread that says anything about incoming healing and what i should aim for in a pure tank build...also any tips on the best 6 man content to play to get ready for end game tanking.

thnks

Most guards i know shoot for at least 20%.

I am not sure about Incoming Heal rating... still in the gearing process but 20% seems like a good number, I thinkk I am at about 17-18 right now.

As far as what 6-man content to help with end-game... as far as I know, we currently only have 2 "end-game" 6-man instances at the moment, Foundry and Roots of Fanghorn. Running both of these at T2 difficulty would be good help, and would probably be enough to get you somewhat ready for T1 Tower of Orthanc raid. The jump from T1 - T2 ToO is HUGE and, IMO, T1 in no way helps prepare you for T2 except for maybe being familiar with the layout of the instances and mobs, and maybe partially with strat...

I would actually suggest running 12-man raid skirmishes with 6 people and see how that fares for ya. Some instances are harder than other (such as Moria is normally on the harder side while Mirkwood is on the easier side, IMO).

Good luck!

I have 23% incoming healing. With buffs, scrolls... and in-combat (with guard's ward and other incombat buff from other class like RK) i can max mitigation and block (in threat stance), and ~20k morale. So that's a pure tank build for T2 ToO, where "trash" mobs can do massive damage.

Getting close to 20% is a nice general goal, but do NOT forsake block/parry/evades to get to that magical number. It is a much more difficult math problem than you might think. ToO trash mobs can hit for over 1k with standard attacks and you will often have more than one on you. This damage is often common and can be blocked etc. 1 block can represent 1.2k+ damage that never happens, plus leads to block responses etc. So, when you are doing your build you must look at your bpe, mits, and incoming healing all at once. It is not worth it to sacrifice 1% block to get 1% incoming healing in most cases, mostly because your healers don't need it if you block the attack and could heal you anyway. Incoming healing is a great thing to have, but you MUST look at your build overall and as painful as it may seem you may actually need to do some math to determine if losing 600 rating from block=the gain from 600 more to your incoming healing for the build you have.

Originally Posted by Djasi

Getting close to 20% is a nice general goal, but do NOT forsake block/parry/evades to get to that magical number. It is a much more difficult math problem than you might think. ToO trash mobs can hit for over 1k with standard attacks and you will often have more than one on you. This damage is often common and can be blocked etc. 1 block can represent 1.2k+ damage that never happens, plus leads to block responses etc. So, when you are doing your build you must look at your bpe, mits, and incoming healing all at once. It is not worth it to sacrifice 1% block to get 1% incoming healing in most cases, mostly because your healers don't need it if you block the attack and could heal you anyway. Incoming healing is a great thing to have, but you MUST look at your build overall and as painful as it may seem you may actually need to do some math to determine if losing 600 rating from block=the gain from 600 more to your incoming healing for the build you have.

Using your own value of 1.2k per hit, 1% block = an average of 12 damage mitigated per hit (assuming all damage taken is BPEable, which is not even close to true for most endgame fights). You can't tell people they need to use maths to compare stats then proceed to use only anecdotes to explain why 1% block is apparently better than 1% inc healing.

Tarenius, please read carefully. Words matter. "can", "often", "most" are words that imply something is possible or even probable. Anecdotes is another word you should look up again. I gave none. Also, saying I can't post something that I already have does not make sense. Please understand that what I said was that every tank should look at their build and use reason to determine if 1% incomming healing is going to matter more for them than 1% BPE. By the way, this post was meant to be nothing more than a fun reply to you. I think you are right in that if anyone said that 1% block is better than 1% incoming healing for everyone, they would of course likely be be mistaken.

I maxed incoming healing right after maxing mitigations, and before looking into B/P/E and max morale. The main reason is that relics with incoming healing are much more potent than relics with B/P/E. Besides, with all the HoTs available in a raid, +25% incoming healing means much more than four heals from the minstrel instead of five.

Say with 0% additional incoming healing, 40% of your heals are coming from HoTs, and 60% from the minstrel (pulled those numbers from thin air). With 25% incoming healing, HoTs will cover 50% of your heal needs, and the minstrel will only have to heal 40% before the bonus incoming healing is factored in. So he will feel as if he had a third of his job done already, thanks to your incoming healing value.

Good instances to learn/practice tanking start at level 20 with Great Barrows Maze. You have limited threat skills, now is the time to learn to use them to keep all those various MOBs glued to you. Also GB Maze is a great instance to increase situational awareness to pick up and keep adds off others (healers).

When you get to Moria, the first instance that becomes available is Forgotten Treasury. You'll take everything you learned in GBs and Fornost runs and add working with another tank/off tank. You'll also learn to apply those newer threat skills you've gotten.

The rest of Moria instances will teach you further skills, such as moving the boss to an area where he takes damage (Fil Gashan's final boss being a great example of this).

The end game instances are useless for any of that, Roots is nothing but simple tank and spanks, no other mechanics involved. Foundry has a bit of Fil Gashan in the first boss fight, but the rest is fairly mindless tank and spanking.



"Sometimes survival comes down to not being hit. Actually, most times." -the chicken skill, Bob and Weave

An interesting question, if a bit of a derail from the thread: what's more useful in general for guardians, +incoming heal% or +block%? I've always thought higher mitigation/avoidance were better than higher incoming heals. I like the idea that less damage taken generally means less healing threat being issued, less power is being spent by the healer(s), and less time spent healing.

Going from 20% incoming heals to 21% incoming heals means a 1k hit would go from requiring an 834 heal to an 827 heal, a difference of 7 morale.

Going from 20% block to 21% block means a 1k hit would, over the very long term, result in an average 1k hit damage reduction change from 800 to 790, a difference of 10 morale. Note this is also purely based on block chance alone. The additional partial block effect from a 1% rise in block chance means you'd go from a 6.9% partial block chance to a 7.3% partial block chance. Thus, over the very long term see a further overall damage reduction change on the order of 0.3% * your partial block mitigation.

As already noted, the amount of damage being taken that can actually be BPE'd is only a subset of the damage which can be offset by incoming healing, so the emphasis on which stat might prove to be more beneficial for you depends on the content you're running.

As demonstrated above avoidance has its strengths but in general a balanced build should be what you're looking for. A ballpark 20% incoming healing modifier sounds like a reasonable and balanced target to go for when you're gearing out. Like Djasi said, though, while chasing your incoming healing don't forsake your BPE and mitigation.

As far as which instances you should run to prepare for end-game instances, run as many as you can. The variety of group makeups and instances you'll encounter will help provide you with experience to hit the ground running when you get to 75.

Have to agree with Othrandir building for high mitigations is the best way to go, less damage = less heals required. I have built mine that way, currently buffed in raids without the raven and with GW active i have the following:

70% tactical and physical mitigation
25% block in threat stance
27.4% inc healing (benefits of being human and without the bonus inc healing from the captain set)

unbuffed morale 17k

Would love to be able to cap the inc healing to 30% i still could replace a rune with the block/inc healing on my weapon instead of the old T9 with crit def.

As for preparing for end game raiding, i would suggest if you're just starting out then go with the 3 mans, 6 mans, T1 ToO first before plunging straight in to T2. Good luck and have fun

You won't come across that many items with +inc healing to begin with, so it will frequently be worth it to use the ones you do find. While leveling your heavy shield will likely be one of your biggest sources. For some reason you frequently find it on gloves as well.

Once you get legendary items relics become a huge part of it as well . You can get +ICHR Runes early on and eventually get it on Melded Settings as well. My ICHR is currently 6507 (17%) and 4584 of that comes from my relics!

Beyond my Shield, gloves and relics the only other ICHR I have is on my Orthanc necklace.

I could pick up about another 2% if I pick up a 4th piece of Laingarth armour from the set bonus, but I'm happy with my current 3/3 armor mix.

If you're hitting 23+% incoming healing as a tank you should be fine. Maxing mits (keep them just low enough to cap with scrolls) is probably #1, inc healing is #2, getting b/p/e up to a combined 45+% (not the actual probability of avoidance) is #3. Morale of over 15k unbuffed should come naturally.

Also best place to get a +incoming healing stat from is usually a rune relic on your belt and weapon

Hey,

Henny Penny is correct in the recommendations of GB etc.

Really any content that you can tank in. The more you tank the better you will get, regardless of the content. Sometimes the lower content is fun, letting folks go buckwild while in no stance to maintain threat.

In terms of IHR, 20% is a good goal and definately achievable with relics on LI's without saccrifice to b/p/e.

I couldn't tell from the OP but are you man? If so you get that 5% race bonus. If not you have to earn it like the rest of us.

I run with Huranc and relics for IHR on my LI's to gets mah dwarf cheeks to 20% flat.

In response to what is better, block or IHR, imo, depends on how your built. It's easy for us to get to 20-25% block with no buffs. At that point you take the IHR, but if not at those numbers I'd definately take the +block. It is a balancing act but eventually we get there.

Don't know if I babbled or helped.

Syn

Originally Posted by Hiritier

I have 23% incoming healing. With buffs, scrolls... and in-combat (with guard's ward and other incombat buff from other class like RK) i can max mitigation and block (in threat stance), and ~20k morale. So that's a pure tank build for T2 ToO, where "trash" mobs can do massive damage.

What is block cap again. After realizing I had my physical mit way over cap I've been retooling. Have physical mit at cap while getting pre buffs, pre group, pre scrolls my block up to 23% and Incoming healing up to 23.2%.

Will this get me close to capped after buffs?