Thread: Fate values as a heal crit multiplier

All credit to this thread goes to thebigmenace for coming up with this.

The following chart shows the crit modifier applied by fate. We have a base crit of .5 so the numbers you see is the multiplier minus the base. I was unable to get below 177fate due to stat tomes however a friend of mine was able to get near 100. I'll post those numbers later but his multiplier at that fate was around .15

All numbers are from muster courage secondary heals, crits and non crits. At all levels of fate the non-crits stayed at 165 so the crit values remain pure at all levels of fate.

Here it is submitted for your reference.



graph credit goes to http://www.onlinecharttool.com/

Heal examples. Lets say your base heal is 800
.16 = 128 (added morale on a crit)
.18 = 144
.20 = 160
.22 = 176
.24 = 192

I could not scale the fate evenly but it looks like you get .01 or 1% every 40 fate. Note that is a mathematical average and does not show DR.

Ok here are the numbers I got from a friend
107 Fate .14
129 Fate .15
151 Fate .15

Reserved 10char

Is this just healing, or healing and melee attacks?

Would be good to compare this to tactical mastery gains.

If you have RO traited and a 20% crit chance 1% increase to critical multiplier would be 0.2% increase to HPS (correct me if I'm wrong).

This means you would need 200 fate for a 1% increase to HPS. Mastery (and might for that matter) is inevitably cheaper and although there are DR's on tactical healing rating and the fact that tactical healing is ~50% effective to what it suggests I'm still sure that might outclasses this by a long shot.

200 might gives you 2k tactical mastery, which is something like a 4% increase to OGH, or 2% increase to HPS. It's also a hell of a lot easier to stack so fate would only be something a HoH captain would want after both crit and OGH are capped.

But then for 99% of the captains out there this went without saying.

Originally Posted by Almagnus1

Is this just healing, or healing and melee attacks?

Healing and our (lol) shouts.

Originally Posted by Almagnus1

Is this just healing, or healing and melee attacks?

What needless said is correct. Fate is a tactical crit modifier so it will effect the crit mod for all tactical based skills.

Originally Posted by Armitas

What needless said is correct. Fate is a tactical crit modifier so it will effect the crit mod for all tactical based skills.

Would I be correct in assuming agility is the physical crit modifier stat?

Originally Posted by Almagnus1

Would I be correct in assuming agility is the physical crit modifier stat?

I haven't tried it but I have read that it does not.

Well **** me, that's interesting. Gotta rethink.

This would support the assertion that might/fate would be the way to go for the captain class, provided the itemization supported the logic.

But alas, the itemization does not - which is yet another reason why I generally don't like fate, or fate heavy builds.

That would certainly explain why the Menestaid set has so much of it.

Originally Posted by Almagnus1

This would support the assertion that might/fate would be the way to go for the captain class, provided the itemization supported the logic.

But alas, the itemization does not - which is yet another reason why I generally don't like fate, or fate heavy builds.

Yeah, exactly. Outside of the Menestaid set, I think almost everything that has Fate on it is Will-centric, so we'd definitely be sacrificing our raw Outgoing Healing if we tried to stack Fate up to the 580 shown at the max end of this scale.

The chart shows that the multiplier is very slightly affected by fate and would need a high stacked amount to make a difference.
On a side note, didn't fate lose any connection to tactical critical multipliers with ROI?

Originally Posted by Despotis

The chart shows that the multiplier is very slightly affected by fate and would need a high stacked amount to make a difference.

If you jacked it up to 800 or so, that would work out to +20%, assuming the math is correct.

However, with that much fate, you will likely be far short of the 40% outgoing healing mark, so it's not a desirable build.

Strangely, this class is just haunted by itemization problems. This is also making a very strong case for mod gear.

Originally Posted by Despotis

On a side note, didn't fate lose any connection to tactical critical multipliers with ROI?

I thought so, but apparently it didn't. Perhaps this is a forgotten artifact from an older era?

Well that makes the crafted fate/tactmastery/crit relics look that much better for straight heals. And the Menestaid helm suddenly looks shinier. Too bad the Menestaid shoulders and boots have raw power.

I used to rock Iluin in Saruman primarily for the tact mit. I don't think I'll start wearing it again, but it looks even more appealing now.

This heavy armor looks slightly less inefficient now, but is still good only for when you're gearing up.

Originally Posted by Despotis

On a side note, didn't fate lose any connection to tactical critical multipliers with ROI?

That sounds familiar. Maybe being the little guy finally worked in our favor this time and they forgot to take it off for us.

Im sorry i can read the whole thread but fate applies TO ALL crit multiplier
Even melee crits. Try with cutting attack dot and check it when it crits

Use it on a same lvl mob with fate food and without
i tested and confirmed this many times

Fate increases ALL crit multiplier

Originally Posted by Tangaar

Im sorry i can read the whole thread but fate applies TO ALL crit multiplier
Even melee crits. Try with cutting attack dot and check it when it crits

Use it on a same lvl mob with fate food and without
i tested and confirmed this many times

Fate increases ALL crit multiplier

If you are right then this is a major fail of the current system which doesn't state this in fate tooltip and to be honest, I'm pretty sure the devpost with ROI announced changes to all stats including the crit multipliers which would no longer be affected by fate.

Originally Posted by Despotis

If you are right then this is a major fail of the current system which doesn't state this in fate tooltip and to be honest, I'm pretty sure the devpost with ROI announced changes to all stats including the crit multipliers which would no longer be affected by fate.

Huh? The current Fate tooltip says "Contributes X points to critical rating".

Originally Posted by RoI Developer Diary New Stat Updates

Critical Hit Rating – will replace the separate melee, ranged and tactical critical hit ratings previously appearing on items. Critical hit rating will enable all attacks to have an increased chance to critical hit.

Half of crit comes from agil and half from fate, and there is no distinction of types of crits, or crit rating affecting only a subset of things. (This was a boon for burglars who used to run out of power, as boosting their crit rating via fate also boosts ICPR.)



"Sometimes survival comes down to not being hit. Actually, most times." -the chicken skill, Bob and Weave

We aren't talking about crit hit chance.

Originally Posted by Tangaar

Im sorry i can read the whole thread but fate applies TO ALL crit multiplier
Even melee crits. Try with cutting attack dot and check it when it crits

Use it on a same lvl mob with fate food and without
i tested and confirmed this many times

Fate increases ALL crit multiplier

100% correct!

Originally Posted by Omen_Kaizer

We aren't talking about crit hit chance.

All crit ratings are affected by agility and fate. If you do not believe me, get your capt banner with agility out. Use it and you will see your melee and your tactical crit go up.

Originally Posted by mmogaming

All crit ratings are affected by agility and fate. If you do not believe me, get your capt banner with agility out. Use it and you will see your melee and your tactical crit go up.

We aren't talking about critical hit chance. We are talking about crit modifier. So.. not your chance to crit but the magnitude of that crit.

Very nice thread. Have I died and gone to Captain Heaven...and is there actually a thread I didn't start extolling the virtures of the Fate stat for Captains on this forum? Guess it just goes to show anything is possible.

Hopefully this will help quell some of this irrational hatred of Fate so many of the Captains on this forum have.

It's a very nice stat, especially for healing Captains. And maybe I can say that on this thread without being endlessly bashed for it lol

This is what makes this class so nice, all different types of setup.
Really fun to read bout this different ways of cappying.

Ofc. myself i am a 2h wielding might cappy going for DPS heals
But again go cappies



(irony mode on)
Ps. Jeremi ### is my transfer, waiting so i can beat you HoH fate cappy to pieces
(irony mode off)

Originally Posted by Tangaar

Im sorry i can read the whole thread but fate applies TO ALL crit multiplier
Even melee crits. Try with cutting attack dot and check it when it crits

Use it on a same lvl mob with fate food and without
i tested and confirmed this many times

Fate increases ALL crit multiplier

You inspired me to go test, and it looks like you're partially right. I wore 2 dagor, 3 perseverance and GC shoulders (122 might, no fate) and got CA crits of 166. Swapping to the menestaid shoulders (121 might, 67 fate) gave me 169 crits. So I'm with you so far. The difference in 10 mastery had no effect in this or later tests.

I decided to test the effects of fate on the crit magnitudes of other skills. With no fate I got def strike crits of 1466 and devs of 1885. Switching to the menestaid shoulders and eating +48 fate food (net gain of over 100 fate, with a negligible loss of 10 mastery) I got the astonishing crits of 1466 and devs of 1885.

So the fate affected crit magnitude of my CA bleeds (and I assume GW bleeds) but not the crit magnitude of defensive strike (and presumably most other skills EDIT: Shadow's Lament crit magnituded is not affected by fate). Very interesting. My mind is opened by this data.

EDIT: I just got a hunter kinmate to do a before/after fate food comparison of crits of a small selection of skills. Barbed Arrow crit bleed was the same after +48 fate, and so was Quick Shot crit. Looks like CA is an anomaly.

Tested and confirmed.
This is a major fail in my opinion, it's a good thing that the multiplier can be boosted through fate but the way it was introduced really made people think that fate had nothing to do with it anymore... including me.

Originally Posted by Omen_Kaizer

You inspired me to go test, and it looks like you're partially right. I wore 2 dagor, 3 perseverance and GC shoulders (122 might, no fate) and got CA crits of 166. Swapping to the menestaid shoulders (121 might, 67 fate) gave me 169 crits. So I'm with you so far. The difference in 10 mastery had no effect in this or later tests.

I decided to test the effects of fate on the crit magnitudes of other skills. With no fate I got def strike crits of 1466 and devs of 1885. Switching to the menestaid shoulders and eating +48 fate food (net gain of over 100 fate, with a negligible loss of 10 mastery) I got the astonishing crits of 1466 and devs of 1885.

So the fate affected crit magnitude of my CA bleeds (and I assume GW bleeds) but not the crit magnitude of defensive strike (and presumably most other skills EDIT: Shadow's Lament crit magnituded is not affected by fate). Very interesting. My mind is opened by this data.

EDIT: I just got a hunter kinmate to do a before/after fate food comparison of his crits. Barbed Arrow crit bleed was the same after +48 fate, and so was Quick Shot crit. Looks like CA is an anomaly.

Also tested and confirmed melee skills.
This doesn't make CA bleed an anomaly, just means that fate affects only tacticals crits,heals or damage.

This all got me curious, that CA is effected by fate.... Got me thinking so I tested with a friend and CA bleed is mitigated by tactical mitigation. Which explains why CA tactical mod is effected by fate while the others are not. Cutting attack bleed is somehow tactical damage. I'd still like someone to double check me though.

Wow this gets better and better.