Thread: Will PJ kill off any of the dwarves in The hobbit part 1?

So as the title says, do you guys think PJ will kill of one of the dwarves in the hobbit part 1?,
We already know that the hobbit should end before the lake town, and as such there are no important deaths in that part.
PJ has already killed off a character that, from my knowledge did not die, Haldir.
I think he might, and that he might do it during
A. the Spider battle.
B. Goblin Town.

I would be surprised (and disappointed) if he did so. While he might kill off some that don't die in the book (unfortunately), I have a very hard time believing he does it before Battle of the Five Armies.

why should he? All dwarves play an essential part in the books.

The death of Haldir was introduced in the movies because Haldir wasn't mentioned in the books ever again, after the fellowship left Lothlorien. So it was easy cause it didn't change anything of the story afterwards....
A dying dwarf would however be an enormous break from the books... and I don't think PJ would risk another one (introducing two elves who doesn't appear in the books)

Is it likely? He clearly put effort into making them distinguishable. At the same time I am not sure if a death of one them would have a significant impact.

As far as Haldir is concerned - he killed him because he had put him in a place he wasn't supposed to be. Something like that is probably not happening to the Dwarves.

SPOILERS BASED ON THE VLOGS:

Footage from PJ:s vlogs have shown parts of the scene where the dwarves ride down the river in their barrels, having escaped Thranduil's halls, and I think you can make out all the dwarves during that segment, each in a barrel (though curiously, I don't think I ever saw Bilbo ). If the first movie ends before Lake-town, then any supposed deaths would have to happen during, or after, the barrel-riding, and, well...if he was going to kill any of the dwarves off, there were plenty of opportunities well before that (as you mention, Goblin-town, the spider battle); I can't see him inserting a new battle-scene just for the sake of killing one dwarf off at this point, and I certainly can't see him having dwarves drowning just after their escape.

That said, even if not for the vlog footage, I still would have considered it unlikely.

EDIT: Highlight to read the spoilers...there's more than the lone smiley

Originally Posted by Jimmy_Laessig

(introducing two elves who doesn't appear in the books)

Now, now, there have to be some other Elves beside Thranduil, none of which (Thranduil himself included) were given a name in the book.

Well that Vlog would clear my thoughts up.
I was worried because several dwarves could had been replaced. Bifur, Bofur, Dori, Nori, Ori, and Oin. All have parts that could be used by another dwarf and no one would think twice about it. Also from my studies of PJ, he likes to kill people off in his movies, and none of the good characters die in the first part of the hobbit.

I thought Part 1 would include the whole Hobbit story, while part 2 would be more the stuff between hobbit and lord of the rings?

Anyway, if you've read the books, you know a couple of the dwarves are gonna die anyway. Plus, unlike Haldir who isn't mentioned again in lord of the rings after Lothlorien (I believe, not 100% sure), the dwarves that are still alive are listed, so there is less chance PJ could kill any of them off.

Originally Posted by Reniannen

Now, now, there have to be some other Elves beside Thranduil, none of which (Thranduil himself included) were given a name in the book.

Well, there was Galion the butler. He was giving orders to the elves dropping the barrels into the gate stream.

Originally Posted by Jimmy_Laessig

why should he? All dwarves play an essential part in the books.

The death of Haldir was introduced in the movies because Haldir wasn't mentioned in the books ever again, after the fellowship left Lothlorien. So it was easy cause it didn't change anything of the story afterwards....
A dying dwarf would however be an enormous break from the books... and I don't think PJ would risk another one (introducing two elves who doesn't appear in the books)

This.

Plus there's already satisfying death to punctuate movie 2

edit: I predict movie one will use the ring discovery as it's big element, some lead off to why Gandalf departs, and then climax/cliff-hang with the spiders.

Not likely, and as for the 2 elves that were not mentioned in The Hobbit, it would be very disappointing to have only King Thranduil and Galion being the only names elves in the last Elven Kingdom. Though he did it with Rivendale.
There needs to be more named elves in Mirkwood as Bilbo is stuck there for weeks stealing food while he thinks up a way to free the dwarves.

Originally Posted by Jewl_of_the_lake

Not likely, and as for the 2 elves that were not mentioned in The Hobbit, it would be very disappointing to have only King Thranduil and Galion being the only names elves in the last Elven Kingdom. Though he did it with Rivendale.
There needs to be more named elves in Mirkwood as Bilbo is stuck there for weeks stealing food while he thinks up a way to free the dwarves.

There's an actress signed to play some female elf who's name I forget (likely because she's a PJ & Co. Invention). I suspect her role is someone for Bilbo to talk to and she likely helps him with the great escape. I can see why a film-maker would not want to have a long sequence of scenes where your main character has to stay invisible the entire time.

Based on the way PJ likes to make things up out of thin air that have nothing to do with LOTR, I would assume he'll kill off Balin at some point ignoring the huge gap in the Lore if he never goes to Moria. You know, kind of like Elves who have never gotten along well with the Rohirrim helping at Helms Deep, or Elrond riding all over Middle Earth with a reforged sword trying to find Aragorn before he goes into the paths of the undead.

Originally Posted by Widoch

Based on the way PJ likes to make things up out of thin air that have nothing to do with LOTR, I would assume he'll kill off Balin at some point ignoring the huge gap in the Lore if he never goes to Moria. You know, kind of like Elves who have never gotten along well with the Rohirrim helping at Helms Deep, or Elrond riding all over Middle Earth with a reforged sword trying to find Aragorn before he goes into the paths of the undead.

Dang. It almost shames me to admit that my line between book and movie has become so blurred, but I'd forgotten that elves don't come in the books. I thought they came, just not with Haldir. Time to not watch the movies for a good while and read the book a half dozen times over. >.>

Originally Posted by Isilmacil

I thought Part 1 would include the whole Hobbit story, while part 2 would be more the stuff between hobbit and lord of the rings?

That was the initial plan I guess, but it is going to be just a two-part Hobbit with added stuff such as the White Council/Dol Guldur storyline. And of course unlike Bilbo we are going to see the battle

Originally Posted by Widoch

Based on the way PJ likes to make things up out of thin air that have nothing to do with LOTR, I would assume he'll kill off Balin at some point ignoring the huge gap in the Lore if he never goes to Moria. You know, kind of like Elves who have never gotten along well with the Rohirrim helping at Helms Deep, or Elrond riding all over Middle Earth with a reforged sword trying to find Aragorn before he goes into the paths of the undead.

While he can be creative I don't think he would go as far as contradicting his own movies.

Originally Posted by Aralt

PJ has already killed off a character that, from my knowledge did not die, Haldir.

That's Haldir's fault for going where he did not belong!

No, I don't think the screenwriters will kill off any dwarves until the Battle of the Five Armies. What might be more interesting to speculate about is whether Bilbo participates in the battle as he did not in Tolkien's book.

Originally Posted by tuor66

There's an actress signed to play some female elf who's name I forget (likely because she's a PJ & Co. Invention).

Evangine Lilly of 'Lost' fame. Her character's name is Tauriel (‘Forest Maiden’).

Originally Posted by Widoch

Based on the way PJ likes to make things up out of thin air that have nothing to do with LOTR, I would assume he'll kill off Balin at some point ignoring the huge gap in the Lore if he never goes to Moria. You know, kind of like Elves who have never gotten along well with the Rohirrim helping at Helms Deep, or Elrond riding all over Middle Earth with a reforged sword trying to find Aragorn before he goes into the paths of the undead.

One thing is a progression of the story using different means, and the other is creating gaps within the lore. The Elves coming to Helms Deep; Elrond going to Dunharrow; The King of the Dead coming to Pelannor... all of these things have no huge impact on the story itself. The example you've used has never come up in the LOTR films.

One thing is not liking the books because of 'x' and 'y' and the other is completley discrediting PJ and making up ludicrous notions on how he handles the lore.

Originally Posted by Reniannen

Now, now, there have to be some other Elves beside Thranduil, none of which (Thranduil himself included) were given a name in the book.

These two elves will have some major/minor involvement with the plot. I think they'll probably help Bilbo and co get out of prison. Or they'll just be a side story.

The Hobbit shouldn't leave too much out though, it's plot structure is way simpler to film than LOTR, and it's much shorter too.

I thought they all lived until the battle of the five armies? About half of them died there, iirc.

Originally Posted by Moejo

I thought they all lived until the battle of the five armies? About half of them died there, iirc.

That's in the Rankin-Bass animated movie only, where we get to see Bombur dying, Thorin deliver his last speech, and Gandalf going "oh yeah, those five other guys also died." In the book, only three die.

About the elves - no, there were no named characters in the books other than Galion (not even Thranduil got his name until Lord of the Rings, I believe), but why is everyone obsessing over the presence of Legolas and Tauriel. Legolas at any rate has a good reason to be there, being Thranduil's son, and Tauriel, well - they need a counterpart to all the testosterone other than Galadriel. It may not be in the lore, but it's nowhere near as outside the realm of possibilities as Haldir and his army showing up at Helm's Deep at the behest of Elrond.

It's not terribly unlikely that one of the dwarves will die in the first movie, though. Not any of the main fellowship, but Thrain in the (dungeons of?) Dol Guldur. The trailer already showed Gandalf being attacked by him, so I could imagine the filmmakers showing his death just to up the stakes or the pathos, depending at what point in the movie they insert that sequence.