Thread: So I rolled a BA today...

Bought the "Skirmisher Stance" skill and spammed 4 skills with no induction and almost no cooldown.

Killed more freeps in 5 minutes than I ever did in this game.

I guess I don't need any more skills.

Nice "convenience" if you ask me.

No wonder there's so many BA's in the Moors.

Were they all hunters?

Wasn't really paying attention, honestly.

But my Hunter sure would love to have a similar stance.

Originally Posted by Elderban

But my Hunter sure would love to have a similar stance.

Fleetness stance + Burn Hot + Needful Haste with the trait for no knockbacks on induction skills > Skirmisher stance.

Skirmisher stance only has a 20m range, your hunter has a 40m range. And if you trait mostly blues you can almost spam Penetrating Shot. You can also use Intent Concentration to increase focus in combat for more spammage, and a focus pot for even more focus and increased dev crit damage.

You're hunter should be able to get off a hinder and a swiftbow before the BA can even get in range, from there Pen shot spam, end of story.

Revenge crits for 1.5+ right out of the box on a green BA, imagine how funny it would be if vt was on the store.

Originally Posted by Sulfur

Revenge crits for 1.5+ right out of the box on a green BA, imagine how funny it would be if vt was on the store.

I still can't figure out why it's not on the store. Turbine wants money, people would buy VT, VT in store = more money. More pewpew for creeps = more pvmp balance. More pvmp balance = less pvmp balance complaints(ok that one might be a stretch). It's win-win.

Originally Posted by Moejo

I still can't figure out why it's not on the store. Turbine wants money, people would buy VT, VT in store = more money. More pewpew for creeps = more pvmp balance. More pvmp balance = less pvmp balance complaints(ok that one might be a stretch). It's win-win.

I'ma go ahead and say it had something to do with people having 2 VTs.

Originally Posted by turleg

Fleetness stance + Burn Hot + Needful Haste with the trait for no knockbacks on induction skills > Skirmisher stance.

Skirmisher stance only has a 20m range, your hunter has a 40m range. And if you trait mostly blues you can almost spam Penetrating Shot. You can also use Intent Concentration to increase focus in combat for more spammage, and a focus pot for even more focus and increased dev crit damage.

You're hunter should be able to get off a hinder and a swiftbow before the BA can even get in range, from there Pen shot spam, end of story.

Big difference is Fleetness Stance lasts 15 seconds with a 30 second cooldown not to forget Burn Hot has a 5 minute cooldown and Needful Haste is around 1.5 minutes for a cooldown.

Skirmisher Stances lasts....forever. On top of that, the skills associated with it have very little cooldown (Strong Pull has practically none whatsoever).

And while you were hitting those skills, the BA probably killed you spamming Strong Pull over and over again while his 30 second evade was being used.

Finesse kills the evasion from the 30 second evade, but good try.

Originally Posted by Elyske

Finesse kills the evasion from the 30 second evade, but good try.

I guarantee you any r6+ BA will have higher finesse than 95% of the freeps. So that 50% melee and 75% range evade + the evade food pots is still more than those actual numbers.

50% evade + whatever base evade is on a ranked BA + evade pot is probably around 65% evade.

Finesse comes nowhere near killing the evasion on the 30 second evade.

Originally Posted by Elyske

Finesse kills the evasion from the 30 second evade, but good try.

Yeah, i often hear of freeps stacking 20k finesse.

Originally Posted by Elyske

Finesse kills the evasion from the 30 second evade, but good try.

Nope, additionally I'm not sure anyone can even stack it high enough to where it negates their base evade (not even including MT itself)

Originally Posted by Elderban

Big difference is Fleetness Stance lasts 15 seconds with a 30 second cooldown not to forget Burn Hot has a 5 minute cooldown and Needful Haste is around 1.5 minutes for a cooldown.

Skirmisher Stances lasts....forever. On top of that, the skills associated with it have very little cooldown (Strong Pull has practically none whatsoever).

And while you were hitting those skills, the BA probably killed you spamming Strong Pull over and over again while his 30 second evade was being used.

regular fleetness is all but worthless really. improved fleetness is the one im going to assume people are talking about as its the version of it that isnt absolute ####. it CAN be kept up constantly(30 sec duration, 30 sec CD), and gives -15% bow inductions, +10% run speed, +1 focus every 5 seconds, and no focus lose on movement(honestly this is probably the most helpful part).

yes, skirm stance lasts forever, but it reduces your range by half. and while strong pull has no CD, neither does and pen shot. and its soooo soo easy to keep focus up on a hunter, you can basically spam it, while doing 3X the damage.

If you're getting more kills on a BA than a Hunter then you're playing your hunter wrong.

Originally Posted by Elderban

Bought the "Skirmisher Stance" skill and spammed 4 skills with no induction and almost no cooldown.

Killed more freeps in 5 minutes than I ever did in this game.

I guess I don't need any more skills.

Nice "convenience" if you ask me.

No wonder there's so many BA's in the Moors.

then you've met bad players.
people keep saying how easy it is to be a BA, but then again those BAs are star huggers & zerglings. If you meet a skilled player you will most likely lose.

Originally Posted by Elyske

Finesse kills the evasion from the 30 second evade, but good try.

Okay let us do the math!

Your base evade will be around 15% I guess, right?
Add 50% evade from moving target!
Add another 25% evade for the additional ranged evasion!

This will grant you around 90% of evade against ranged attacks.

Now let me subtract my finesse. MY finesse is relatively high I believe with around 6k or, I believe -17% B/PE. So after all it might well be true that you have no base B/P/E against me BUT will still stay at around 75% ranged evade. I am not even sure whether finesse subtracts from straight percentages granted from skills either or just from ratings.

Now additionally you could use a pot adding +2500 evade. Creeps with full audacity usually have it running all the time. I guess this adds 10% again to your evade.

Originally Posted by Witch0King

then you've met bad players.
people keep saying how easy it is to be a BA, but then again those BAs are star huggers & zerglings. If you meet a skilled player you will most likely lose.

I agree. Right now the BA turned from a pure zerg char to quite a complex character, considering that you need to learn to move now as well handle you decreased range. Well that makes it way more complex than the hunter right now and way more potent too.

Though I might add, that I do not know where to draw the line where it becomes impossible for a hunter to beat a ba with moving target.

Originally Posted by VincentVanPort

Now additionally you could use a pot adding +2500 evade. Creeps with full audacity usually have it running all the time. I guess this adds 10% again to your evade.

Someone is bad at math.

Then again, you believe hunters need buffs. So I'd expect that from you.

And you are?

So would you care to tell what the exact percentage is added by the evasion pot? Or would you like to remain silent and unprofitable towards this discussion?

And as stated I said it was a guess. I did not look it up.

Originally Posted by OnevsOneGod

Someone is bad at math.

Then again, you believe hunters need buffs. So I'd expect that from you.

I hate to defend a freep but he's right. Although I think the exact percentage is around 6-8%.

Originally Posted by Stevo6

I hate to defend a freep but he's right. Although I think the exact percentage is around 6-8%.

Right about what? The pot is 8.1%, not 10. You think he's right about hunters needing buffs? Lawl k, let's make them even godlier dps classes AND harder to kill, because at least 8k morale buffed isn't enough.

Silly Stevo, the one post that you don't mention GW2 as if it's the second coming and you're wrong!

Originally Posted by Stevo6

I hate to defend a freep but he's right. Although I think the exact percentage is around 6-8%.

The whole finesse system in the moors is borked from my point of view. What is the point of B/P/E if you can not avoid anything due to your opponent's stat? Also here score classes that have skills that increase B/P/E by flat percentages and not the classes that have a natural high B/P/E. What I am seeing frequently though is partially evaded damage, so I wonder if finesse applies there as well.

Originally Posted by OnevsOneGod

Right about what? The pot is 8.1%, not 10. You think he's right about hunters needing buffs? Lawl k, let's make them even godlier dps classes AND harder to kill, because at least 8k morale buffed isn't enough.

Silly Stevo, the one post that you don't mention GW2 as if it's the second coming and you're wrong!

So you behave like this because my GUESS was 1,9% off? I hope you are that annoyed because of something in your life and not solely my post.
http://www.dict.cc/?s=guess
Always helpful...

Originally Posted by OnevsOneGod

Right about what? The pot is 8.1%, not 10. You think he's right about hunters needing buffs? Lawl k, let's make them even godlier dps classes AND harder to kill, because at least 8k morale buffed isn't enough.

Silly Stevo, the one post that you don't mention GW2 as if it's the second coming and you're wrong!

Damm, 0.1% off

Originally Posted by VincentVanPort

So you behave like this because my GUESS was 1,9% off? I hope you are that annoyed because of something in your life and not solely my post.
http://www.dict.cc/?s=guess
Always helpful...

No, I am annoyed because a hunter that's rank 12 thinks he needs buffing for PvP.

Originally Posted by OnevsOneGod

No, I am annoyed because a hunter that's rank 12 thinks he needs buffing for PvP.

Hunters don't need a buff, but rather, they need to have their DPS lowered and survivability increased. It doesn't take long for me, you, or any other weavers to burn them down. However, it doesn't take long for them to burn down us too.

If I had the ability to burn down opponents in a matter of seconds I wouldn't be complaining.

Originally Posted by Daec

I'ma go ahead and say it had something to do with people having 2 VTs.

Really? I was playing when RoI was released and I don't recall ever seeing it on the store. But if it was, and it was causing BA's to have 2 VT's, why didn't they fix the bug properly instead of lazily taking it out of the store?

Originally Posted by Moejo

Really? I was playing when RoI was released and I don't recall ever seeing it on the store. But if it was, and it was causing BA's to have 2 VT's, why didn't they fix the bug properly instead of lazily taking it out of the store?

It's Turbine. Do you really think they would fix a bug rather than finding an alternate lazy option?

Originally Posted by OnevsOneGod

No, I am annoyed because a hunter that's rank 12 thinks he needs buffing for PvP.

So why do you not comment on that topic in a thread where I or other hunters posted. Constructive criticism is always welcome. Being an angry kid, is not. By the way it is R13. And here Time equals Experience equals Wisdom.

So VT was in the store causing r9 BAs to have two of them on separate CDs? Crazy I wonder if they offered a refund when they took it away. Though the impact on having a 5 minute skill twice is debatable. Still I do not see why this has still not been offered in the store since it is quite a powerful skill. Every BA would want it.

Originally Posted by VincentVanPort

So why do you not comment on that topic in a thread where I or other hunters posted. Constructive criticism is always welcome. Being an angry kid, is not. By the way it is R13. And here Time equals Experience equals Wisdom.

So VT was in the store causing r9 BAs to have two of them on separate CDs? Crazy I wonder if they offered a refund when they took it away. Though the impact on having a 5 minute skill twice is debatable. Still I do not see why this has still not been offered in the store since it is quite a powerful skill. Every BA would want it.

They should not offer a refund.

Minstrel, RK, LM, Champ, Warden should all beat a BA regardless of CDs.

With MT burnt add in Hunter and Burglar (and the best burgs will just wait out MT anyway).

Guards and Cappies can be kited but put the kettle on...


...I would say immediately after RoI I could kill all classes on my BA apart from the best Minstrels and lucky crit RKs... times have a changed though.

...and the threads defending Minnies make me laugh. No ofc don't nerf individual classes... hmmm Revenge... ok correction... please don't nerf individual freep classes.

I regularly see 20% crit rates against me on Combat Analysis, even with Crit Prot slotted. No creep class has it easy right now. The best equipped to solo are probably weaver and warg and weaver DPS and CC are so toned down against r7 audacity most freeps will just run to NPCs before they would die. A solo BA wouldn't scare me at all.

Originally Posted by Daec

Yeah, i often hear of freeps stacking 20k finesse.

I'd +rep you, but have to spread before i can give again.

Originally Posted by Stevo6

Hunters don't need a buff, but rather, they need to have their DPS lowered and survivability increased. It doesn't take long for me, you, or any other weavers to burn them down. However, it doesn't take long for them to burn down us too.

No no no, hunters need more mobility like skirm stance. If we choose, we can get huge survivability, & if we choose we can have huge DPS. Arguably we can't have both at the same time, but hunter /whines and /cries concerning survivability and DPS are off base. Its all about having to stand still, trying to get an induction off, while getting beat on. Heck forget even getting hit. Its not easy for the average hunter to kite via induction-based skills either.

Let be honest, hunters rarely get to pew pew at 40m. If they could keep their enemies at 40m permanently, hunter would be absolutely unbeatable except by BAs. The worst part about a hunter is their immobility. I can't stand listening to all the creeps who spout "omg running pen shot perma spam!!!!" You'll get 4-5 on average. Anyone who says they can spam them continually are off base and make about as much sense as the 5k morale hunter who whines about a 3500 VT followed by a 3300 Revenge. How often does that happen? 1 in 100? 1 in 200? Far far far too many people on freep and creep take the worst possible situations and make them into the norm.

3 pages in 2 days?

A+ Troll thread

Originally Posted by Odin_of_Freyr

No no no, hunters need more mobility like skirm stance. If we choose, we can get huge survivability, & if we choose we can have huge DPS. Arguably we can't have both at the same time, but hunter /whines and /cries concerning survivability and DPS are off base. Its all about having to stand still, trying to get an induction off, while getting beat on. Heck forget even getting hit. Its not easy for the average hunter to kite via induction-based skills either.

Let be honest, hunters rarely get to pew pew at 40m. If they could keep their enemies at 40m permanently, hunter would be absolutely unbeatable except by BAs. The worst part about a hunter is their immobility. I can't stand listening to all the creeps who spout "omg running pen shot perma spam!!!!" You'll get 4-5 on average. Anyone who says they can spam them continually are off base and make about as much sense as the 5k morale hunter who whines about a 3500 VT followed by a 3300 Revenge. How often does that happen? 1 in 100? 1 in 200? Far far far too many people on freep and creep take the worst possible situations and make them into the norm.

So, you don't RvR much do you?