Thread: unfair currency

i belive the comedations are not working out, you have to do alot of work to get a single skill, enough to rank if your a lower rank, and getting new skins are nearly imposible. it would be nice if they where a little easier to get, or lower prices for certain things, espesialy skins. you cant even see what it looks like before you buy it, and once you do, you spent a weeks worth of playing about 5 hours a day to get it, pity on people who bought it and never liked what it looks like. hears hopeing somethings done about it.

I can help with the skins part,

http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.p...k-0-15-Highres

this thread shows all skins bought with comms

Originally Posted by kiiper13

i belive the comedations are not working out, you have to do alot of work to get a single skill, enough to rank if your a lower rank, and getting new skins are nearly imposible.

You and every single creep as well as a decent amount of freeps... Turbine don't

Everything in the Moors is unfair for creeps, and always will be. Turbine won't change that anytime soon.

Originally Posted by Squelcher

Everything in the Moors is unfair for creeps, and always will be. Turbine won't change that anytime soon.

Not sure if trolling?

I think Commendations are good and bad. It's a great system for ranked Creeps who already have their Audacity, you will never to PvE to get your pots and stuff again to continue PvPing. It is far superior to what the Delving was (although completely removing the relevance of the Delving is bad imo, had some great moments in there).

BUT. When it comes to new Creeps...or low ranked Creeps...you literally have to pull yourself up by your bootstraps. The things you need to buy Commendations...are needed to earn Commendations. If you don't have the Comms for Pots and Skills and Audacity...you will find it ABSURDLY difficult to get Comms...for Pots...Skills...and Audacity...

I think commendations are a good system, they just need a little tweaking. As stated above, its much easier for ranked creeps, my BA for instance, who was R8 at the time had no problem making enough comms for audacity, while spending a decent amount on pots and such at the same time. However, I recently started a newbie creep on another server, and found that to get the skills you need, questing is certainly going to be involved. So far I've ranked up to r5 off of nothing but questing, and I'm still working up comms for skills I unlocked at rank 3.

tl;dr- I think commendation cost for low rank (>r5 maybe?) skils should be decreased a bit, so they're easier to obtain for new players. Just some thoughts.


P.S: The cost of skins is ridiculous :/

Seconded!
123456

I have been playing freep side for a while time and want to try out creep side. I don't think commendation is a bad idea I just think the implication is bad. Low ranked creeps are so weak to begin with and putting high commendation on low rank skills and corruptions just makes it almost impossible to rank up. Really what they need to do is make the first few skills cost 150 instead of 1,500. There is no reason a rank 10 skill should cost the same as a rank 1.

Comms aren't too bad (speaking from a creep perspective) if they made some minor changes. Costs for low rank things (skills/traits/ect) need to have their cost tanked (look at other comm threads to find examples) and they need to make the delving have a purpose...

I may be wrong but in the back of my mind I think they have the lower ranked skill cost so high just to motivate lower ranked creeps to use the store its not all that hard to reach rank 5 depending on your class and playstyle so when you could use dp to buy them there was no motivation to buy any of those skills or corruptions from the store because if you actually worked on your maps you had more than enough dp to buy it when you ranked. Now if your looking at your class trainer and you do the math and figure out how many commies you need to buy what you have already unlocked by ranking it makes you consider your time to get them or just spend 5 bucks worth of tp to get them now

Originally Posted by Odin_of_Freyr

Not sure if trolling?

No, Im not. But actually, my statement does look like it is. I didnt mean literally EVERYTHING is unfair.

Commendations were made to encourage pvp over pve in moors.

So, how does that work for a new creep?
For rank 4 you need just a little under 6k inf? Which means, by the time that you reach r4 with pvp, you have earned 3k commendations? How many of the r0 and r1 skills/traits can you buy with that?

My highest ranked creep is r7, and I still find it a long grind to get audacity on 1 character ..

I would much rather go back to Destiny Points. I never understood why they made the switch.

Originally Posted by Trium

Commendations were made to encourage pvp over pve in moors.

So, how does that work for a new creep?
For rank 4 you need just a little under 6k inf? Which means, by the time that you reach r4 with pvp, you have earned 3k commendations? How many of the r0 and r1 skills/traits can you buy with that?

My highest ranked creep is r7, and I still find it a long grind to get audacity on 1 character ..

It very much discourages "casual" play. You want to creep, you either need to grind hard or -- presumably the point here -- use turbine points.

I tried out a warg to see how the other half lives. Even once my captain is fully set up (5/6 armor pieces as of now), I can't see spending the commendations on my warg. It is just too expensive. AT THE LEAST, they should make the lower level skills cheap to get you going and "hooked" on playing. The starting barrier to making a playable creep is too high for any but the most dedicated seems to me...

The implementation is bad but the idea is good, i can agree on that. Anyone else remembering the dev diary where they said Ensuring that at cap a Creep can purchase all skills, racial traits, and corruptions available at their current rank. I call bs on that statement since we haven't seen anything adressing this issue (yes, it is an issue if you get your first skill/corruption as r3 and still don't have what you need at r5

[QUOTE=...There is no reason a rank 10 skill should cost the same as a rank 1.[/QUOTE]

Holly &*$% don't say that, or we will find our rank 10 skills costing 10,250.

The cost in comms needs to be low enough so that by the time you've ranked, you have enough to buy the skills/corruptions for that rank. Maybe not all the available corruptions, but one or 2 per rank. Any price point higher than that is a very thinly veiled marketing ploy (go buy skills in the store).

Yeah prices are so high I have almost given up on playing creep again.

I do not suppose that someone from the turbine responds, but I'll ask anyway.
It would be really so difficult to change the currency in which to buy new abilities? I mean, of course, gold, silver, copper. Let commentadions as they are, just do not force players to spend incredible amount of Commendations for the capabilities that opponent gets basically free.
In short: Commendations = audacity, better potions, better food, the tracking talismans.
gold, silver, copper = new capabilities, appearance, basic food, basic potions and so on and so forth.
Should this one after all occurred (hope dies last) I think that many people would be attracted to ettenmoors and pvp in general.

As a newbie to the moors, I agree that the experience is very hard for new creeps. I've rolled a Defiler, and without commenting about the class, it's pretty grim looking at the number of commendations needed to pick up some basic skills and traits. I've joined some groups for PvP which has been enjoyable and has got me to rank 1, though not without a few casualties. It takes about 5 secs for a champ or burg to take me down, so honestly they would be stupid not to target me.

Soloing PvE is not exactly easy and seems pretty time consuming with my limited skill, dps and ability to survive. I don't resent the challenge, but it seems strange to me that it should be so hard to start the road upwards. The fact that I need so many commendations to get anything and that they are account bound means that the only sensible thing is to roll a warg (or use a freep, if I had one at lvl75) who can actually do some of the solo quests, and can occasionally escape when ambushed - which is what I did. Surely this cannot be working as intended?

I understand why people would say it's all a cynical attempt to make us pay turbine points for our skills/traits. I honestly hope this isn't that case, as it would be mistaking the freemium model - I'm already a VIP paying for an experience that is less demanding on my time, and quite frankly I'm not getting that. The incentive to pay for me (and I suspect most VIPs) is not having to jump through the same hoops as F2Pers, but if Turbine treats everyone the same, I don't see any good reason to keep paying my subscription. If this is the general case, it can't be any better for Turbine than it is for the players.

Originally Posted by Koroeth

I do not suppose that someone from the turbine responds, but I'll ask anyway.
It would be really so difficult to change the currency in which to buy new abilities? I mean, of course, gold, silver, copper. Let commentadions as they are, just do not force players to spend incredible amount of Commendations for the capabilities that opponent gets basically free.
In short: Commendations = audacity, better potions, better food, the tracking talismans.
gold, silver, copper = new capabilities, appearance, basic food, basic potions and so on and so forth.
Should this one after all occurred (hope dies last) I think that many people would be attracted to ettenmoors and pvp in general.

Bolded line is truth. Most of the skills and traits a creep needs can be bought for tp. Except maybe the most important one, audacity, which costs tons of comms. Way too many comms if you asked me, 6k for first rank? Should've started at maybe 1k(or even less) and gotten progressively higher per rank, imo.

Turbine is useing the ettenmorres as a gold farm. here is how i see it from the perspective of a rank 3 reaver who hasn't bought a thing because i need another 3k coms to get the first rank of aducity.
You get and average of less than 50 coms per quest. the cheapest thing you can buy from your trainer is a corruption for 1000 coms. that means on average you will have to do 20 quests every time you want just a corruption. this means inorder to get aducity rank 2 you must do about 120 quests before you will even be strong enough to stand a chance aginst a freep. or you can buy skills to make you stronger from the store which means you need to buy turbine points. standard currency is next to useless for a creep. and the delving drops very few creep items. so creeps are disined to make you pay turbine to make them stronger or suffer for weeks to be able to afford the skills.
turbine needs to treat us creeps fairly, here are some ways they could do that.
1 make the delving drop some creep useful items.
2 either make skills avalible for standard currency, or reduce low level skill prices.
3 either increase the amount of coms you get on average per quest, or reduce the cost of important things such as skills and aducity.
4 let us preview skins before we go ahead and buy them. and reduce the cost of said skins.
of course turbine will never do any of these things because they enjoy takeing advantage of us, and cheating us out of our money.(but we can dream can't we?)

As far as skins, every rank and gift skin is on the monster manual in my sig. Just look up the particular class and go to the bottom of the page

As I just tried my hand on PvMP for the first time last night, I have to agree that the first ranks to the skills are amazingly expensive. Running the fast and easy quests on two toons got me a "whopping" 600ish Commendations in about 6-7 hours, which indicates that I need to be playing the 6 toons every day to equip one of them with skills in even vaguely reasonable pace.

Even if the first ranks of the skills were only 10% of the price they are now, it wouldn't make buying everything easy. On the PvE side there is no way one can be without enough money for skills from just running around and killing mobs. Possibly even the quest rewards alone make the skills buyable.

Anyway, I have just only started, and maybe it is easier to level a new creep after one of mine is higher rank and "skilled up". Until then, I will have to revert to rolling new creeps (in my case Wargs, so I won't have to run back all the time when someone notices me, and if I do, I still have a small chance of escaping) to an "empty" (safe) server and deleting them after the first stack of Commendations.

Edit: After checking, the Commendations are not account wide, but server. This means, that I will have to keep rerolling my favourite creep until I have enough Commendations to make it even remotely viable in the first place... If I could only roll another Warg on the same server...

Originally Posted by Stryder_lan

Holly &*$% don't say that, or we will find our rank 10 skills costing 10,250.

It wont matter, people will eventually get sick of the added grind coming and them no r10s + will play :-(

Comms was a huge mistake, removing the lock out timer was a huge mistake, everythign turbine seem to do moors wise is a mistake.

Originally Posted by Odin_of_Freyr

Not sure if trolling?

Definitely not trolling...

Just an update of my experiences as a new creep player:

I have now rolled and deleted 6 toons, and have 3 more that I will probably keep leveling up (only able to buy any skills at all for one of them). Total commendations from running the "go here and there, you Maggot!" is 2700ish (which would actually buy one rank of Audacity from gear for a new freep, if I remember the prices for armour right...). So far my Warg is rank 2, and was just able to buy Shadow stance (after getting the +stealth level/movement speed). That's one rank 0 and one rank 1 skill total for a rank 2 toon. I will probably be way beyond rank 6 before I can afford Audacity at all.

If I hadn't made any of those extra toons, I would be able to buy Shadow stance probably at rank 3 the earliest. Considering that those two skills are vital to make the Warg to be able to actually contribute to anything in any way, it does feel quite steep.

This all has taken me 4 nights now, and I am left with 1 toon that is able to actually escape from a badly played Burglar or a Hunter. The other 2 toons (Black Arrow and a Weaver) have had variable success (BA has 6 shared kills, Weaver 2), where the Weaver was actually able to kill a Burglar (yes, that one was horrible!) who I jumped at (lots of kiting, he probably didn't know how to use pots) when he was trying to farm his WL...

I'm still set to make my stand in PvMP, but the curve is very steep. If there won't be any new creeps, I wouldn't be surprised at all after my own experiences.

See you in the Ettenmoors, where I will be running around from the rezpad, over and over again to tag my dailies... :-)

Our whining has never brought or done anything. They still bring good pve content so costumors will keep coming everyday. They don't care 1 veteran leaves when 2 kids with rich parents come and buy up the whole store. It's tiresome how much TB SUCKS at doing anything good for pvmp.

Edit: I agree Commendations is a good idea, but let me show you the feelings of about 95% of creeps logging in after they implemented it.
*Random creep reading forums*
"New barter system, hmmm looking good." "Main income through pvp, hmmm not bad not bad."
*Logs into creep after update*
"2000 Commendations for a freaking r0 skill! lvl 68 Champs coming to EM owning everything in their way"
*Creep logs off*
*Creep (and many freeps for that matter) log onto forum to cry about this* <-- been like this since Commendations was implemented.
*Turbine does nothing and fails to communicate so badly you'd think they're socially impaired*
*GW2*

Complete your map deeds, the three kill any combo of players deeds, and the first tier of slay enemies deed and you already have 16k comms. 2 weeks or so with buying 3 skills and getting about an 1/8th of my comms on my champ and my warg has r6, 7 audacity and almost all skills. I play a lot but that's still a lot less than what it took to level my champ to moors and get all his audacity gear.

Originally Posted by avengingbananaslug

Complete your map deeds, the three kill any combo of players deeds, and the first tier of slay enemies deed and you already have 16k comms. 2 weeks or so with buying 3 skills and getting about an 1/8th of my comms on my champ and my warg has r6, 7 audacity and almost all skills. I play a lot but that's still a lot less than what it took to level my champ to moors and get all his audacity gear.

i don't know what world you live in bub. but that dosn't work for real. that works on paper.

The ettenmoors has been too hard for me to log on anytime for more than like 5 minutes. My Blackarrow is too pathetic to be of any use to raids (the only worthwhile thing in moors), to get the comms to get the stuff to be acceptable in raids to get the comms to get the stuff to be acceptable-- wait, i think i've said that before, havent i? to quote the paradox from swkotor 2:
"To be powerful, one must have an army, to have an army, one must be powerful." that is exactly what they're doing in moors. And Turbine isn't making people buy stuff from the store. No, not at all. They are chasing away the masses of people who can't/won't pay money for subscription or for storebought skills and stuff. what happens is, tons of people stop playing that cant afford that stuff. the people who can, stop because the numbers are too sadly low to really bother. What i imagined with PvMP was a decent challenge besides the AI's (stands for "artificial idiots", by the way). Instead of that, i get a position where i am walking along, minding my own business, doing quest while looking for a good raid, and get massacred by some show-off burglar who kills me in record time. Now i don't even bother with moors until i can get some decent armor for my guard and send him off in there to mass kill the poor, poor, sadly neglected, creeps. With a game with so badly constructed PvP, no one will even bother wasting money trying to make their creep worthy of making the freeps pay through the nose when killing said creep. Instead, they will go to those PvP based games that everyone talks about. I am not saying that the game is terrible because of the PvP. I am saying this one factor within the game is terrible. what happens is, Turbine shuts down PvP, and we can play around with the AI's (see description above) all we want, not even shedding a single tear that PvP is gone.

Originally Posted by avengingbananaslug

Complete your map deeds, the three kill any combo of players deeds, and the first tier of slay enemies deed and you already have 16k comms. 2 weeks or so with buying 3 skills and getting about an 1/8th of my comms on my champ and my warg has r6, 7 audacity and almost all skills. I play a lot but that's still a lot less than what it took to level my champ to moors and get all his audacity gear.

Not sure if I find this sad or amusing .

lor rank skill definetly cost to much. It's absurd. You only get up to speed with skills when you get to the midle of r7.

Would be interesting if the tabels were turned and every freep should pay for their active skill from lvl 10 upwards 400s and pasive 200s. I guess not all freeps would be happy.

Originally Posted by Athrod

lor rank skill definetly cost to much. It's absurd. You only get up to speed with skills when you get to the midle of r7.

Would be interesting if the tabels were turned and every freep should pay for their active skill from lvl 10 upwards 400s and pasive 200s. I guess not all freeps would be happy.

If the currency cap was 2g shared for all toons on that server, then it would be the same. ;-)