Thread: 5 Blue; What's the point?

Originally Posted by SirBeegus

LMs blue traited should be able to heal most 3-man content, yet still have a lot of cc skills and decent damage - you just have to accept that more of the damage comes from your pet.

For healing 3-mancontent 5 yellow or 5 red + imp Flanking and Light of Hope + eagle is better than 5 blue.
As an AM or MoNF you "heal" more than a KoA. Faster mobkilling= less damage taken.
Force of will= less damage taken.
There are 3(Healer, imp. Flanking, Light of Hope and maybe PAAI) really lovely Traits in the KoA-line, but more than 3... there is no use.(exception soloing old groupcontent) And for the 1083627633th time. Combatsummoning should be part of Noble Savage not the boglurker.

Combatsummoning should be available to every LM (but at the cost of a legendary trait). Though they are weak our pets are an important part of our healing and combat.

Originally Posted by Tatharil

For healing 3-mancontent 5 yellow or 5 red + imp Flanking and Light of Hope + eagle is better than 5 blue.
As an AM or MoNF you "heal" more than a KoA. Faster mobkilling= less damage taken.
Force of will= less damage taken.
There are 3(Healer, imp. Flanking, Light of Hope and maybe PAAI) really lovely Traits in the KoA-line, but more than 3... there is no use.(exception soloing old groupcontent) And for the 1083627633th time. Combatsummoning should be part of Noble Savage not the boglurker.

Combatsummoning should be available to every LM (but at the cost of a legendary trait). Though they are weak our pets are an important part of our healing and combat.

hmmm...good thoughts - I wonder which is better. I feel you get significant heals from the healing combo of imp flanking, light of hope and healer - improved inner flame is less great, but combined with healer and with less threat generation, it could be of use (though if I go blue, i typically pick PAAI and hardy companion to fill out the 5). The times i have healed with these three healing traits, people have been surprised with how much outgoing heals LMs have.

as for combat summoning - I agree - I think Noble Savage (with combat summoning) makes more sense and would be the more appropriate capstone for the keeper of animals line, at least insofar as the pet improvement aspects go. it's the healing stuff that just doesn't fit. it is what it is.

well guys it's easy ... just show your epic dps in a signle target or if you like in aoe combat ( skirmish it's increased ) where you have a fight with more than 2 min ... cause dps can't be real if you start with ent and avoid the induction when dps start

Well show the number ... and show how much dps you can do on a boss ... and i want see how many lore master have more than 1k on a boss

Lore master have a great dps aoe with long cd ... but can have a big burst in 10 second a champ it's more sustained and well ... show numbers

Originally Posted by Tatharil

Combatsummoning should be available to every LM (but at the cost of a legendary trait). Though they are weak our pets are an important part of our healing and combat.

But if Blue is weaker than the other lines, it needs some advantage.

One can't argue that blue sucks and then recommend that a cool blue-only talent should be given out to every LM.

Originally Posted by Guiwinner

well guys it's easy ... just show your epic dps in a signle target or if you like in aoe combat ( skirmish it's increased ) where you have a fight with more than 2 min ... cause dps can't be real if you start with ent and avoid the induction when dps start

Well show the number ... and show how much dps you can do on a boss ... and i want see how many lore master have more than 1k on a boss

Lore master have a great dps aoe with long cd ... but can have a big burst in 10 second a champ it's more sustained and well ... show numbers

If we could give a **** about our personal dps, which I for one couldn't.

It ain't my job.

Uldarion, Ancient Master

The issue with the blue line is very simple: Pets suck atm.

It's essentially a versatile, good solo and a good support line. Solo you've basically got the choice between Nuke-Red and CC-blue (Yellow is really wasted on solo play), while in groups you've got Buffing-Blue, Debuffing-Yellow and DPS-Red.

The only real issue is traiting blue adds two things: Healing and Pet DPS/Survivability. Pets do next to no DPS even traited and their buffs don't really scale well, so that's not much use. And 2 out of 3 of our Healing skills (including the main one, Imp. Flanking) depends on our pet A LOT... And none of these depend on the line but on individual traits, which makes it a lot more mix-and-matchable than the other 2 lines.

I like the blue line a lot myself, but rarely trait Friend of Nature... and then mostly for the in-combat summon when I'm supposed to be main-healing something and expect my Eagle to die along the way.

I use the lurker now and then, but I wouldn't complain if they made it a regular pet and replaced the blue capstone with AoE stun protection + AoE flank heals.

all pets need to be revamped and refocused,
bear should be able to tank properly solo(stun is a wasted skill) and tank maybe 1 mob in a group
raven needs to be focused on buffing(evade thign is useless late game)
lynx needs aoe turned into single target(to make rooom for saber)
eagle is good where its at
saber should inherit some from lynx(remove throat slash)
lurker's skills seem good but still could be repurposed for fms
limfrafrim is fine imo

Blue line is still the best for easy soloing Nemesis & Arch-Nemesis baddies imo. Red and yellow often just don't cut it there, unless ofc the baddies can be CC'd.

Are you kidding? Blue line is frickin AWESOME! For deeding, that is.

Buff up your pet, set it on aggressive in a high concentration of the type of mob you need to kill, and tab out of the game to read your e-mail. Just remember to tab in every once in awhile to make sure you don't auto-log.

Originally Posted by Cloudie-wan

Buff up your pet, set it on aggressive in a high concentration of the type of mob you need to kill, and tab out of the game to read your e-mail. Just remember to tab in every once in awhile to make sure you don't auto-log.

LOL - have to try that.

I ran blue a lot back when I did solo skirmishes. Bog lurker, Warrior and me - a small FS with everything needed. Ranged and melee dps, cc, debuffs and heals - must be like how Warden feels, except more dps (I think :P)

I agree that the blue traitline is more hazy than yellow and red, which have a clear purpose but I wouldn't call it useless even though i do not trait it a lot. Now and again for fun because I really like the Lurker pet and when I experiment with 3 man healing setups.

The only really legitimate use I currently see for the Blue line is in a 3 man group where the LM gets stuck having to heal. In that case, there's at least 3 blue traits that will be a significant help to healing (Light of Hope, Healer, Improved Flanking) and the frequent flanks of the Bog-Lurker would help too (although the Eagle is very nearly as good).

Other than that I don't think I would ever slot 5 Blue besides just to mess around showing off the Bog Lurker.

yea blue trait line is pointless in my opinion except for maby 2 traits. The knowledge of cures is great because it works on all fellowship members, and the improved inner flame is also really good because it heals all fellowship members around you. These 2 traits definetly make the LM a better healer. Right now I am running a DPS build with 5 red, 1 blue, and 1 yellow. The yellow of course is improved sign of power command, because that is one of our best debuff skills and when traited it is even better

I would love pets to be revamped, I personally played LM as I thought it would be able to heal ...semi-well :S and because it was pet class, I always trait Lurker and I love him, I dare not try RED though ...as I know it will put him to shame

Originally Posted by Kraggy_Eldar

Blue is fine, makes LM soloing probably the easiest class to level in the game.

I buy that. I tried red for a couple weeks when soloing and while damage is nice it comes with severe drawbacks of losing your CC control and having weak pets. I don't really understand why so many players obsess with maxing out DPS. I've got 9 classes and they don't all have to be max DPS. Blue gets your pet tough enough and with enough damage that it can off tank for you, at least for awhile. With read my pets never once pulled any aggro off me. So no off-tank and no mezzing means squishy.

I tried yellow for a awhile too but it's like blue but with weak pets. Nice debuffs though

And just because blue isn't best for raids doesn't mean useless when grouping. There are lots of places where you can group outside of t2 raids. Again, too many players point to raids or pvp as the ultimate reason to do something with a class.

And besides you need blue to get bog lurker, and you need bog lurker to get angry bees. And what's better than angry bees?

Originally Posted by Mithithil

I'm sure its been said before, blue line is basically what LMs were before traitlines were invented and builds became so specific. They have a little bit of everything and emphasis how dependant on your pet you used to be, and remind you just how

Before trait lines most of my characters were 3/3/1 or 3/2/2, LM included.

Originally Posted by Uldarion1

I used to be 5 blue with lurker, but found it too much of a pain to force the bog lurker into melee range for flanks in instances.

It flanks at range though, or am I mistaken? It flanks as well as raven and doesn't waste time flying out to the enemy first before doing damage (eagle may flank well too but I haven't used it much when soloing).

Originally Posted by anteku

I agree that debuffs are unappreciated, but don't let ignorant players dissuade you from your contributions.

It's a part of being a support class. Other players can't quite figure out exactly what you do but they've learned that having a support class makes tough content seem easy.

Originally Posted by Lohi

It [bog-lurker] flanks at range though, or am I mistaken? It flanks as well as raven and doesn't waste time flying out to the enemy first before doing damage (eagle may flank well too but I haven't used it much when soloing).

It flanks a lot less frequently at range than it does when in melee.

This is not particularly noticeable when soloing, because if you let the lurker get aggro, the mob will run into melee range with it.

It is very noticeable in instances, because the mob will stay with the tank and the lurker will not move into melee range.

So you have to put it on passive and follow, run into melee range with it, tell it to attack, then run back out of melee range yourself if you want to attack from range.

This is a PITA, so I usually use either Eagle (for flanks, rez and interrupts) or Nature Spirit (for its various healing effects and lack of tendency to die) in instances.

Originally Posted by hisoka-thorongil

It seems to me that going 5 blue is rather pointless. I'm not even entirely sure what real job blue line services. It's 1/3 sub par healing, 1/3 animal related, and 1/3 essential CC, like Dunadan-Learning. In raids, 5 yellow is simply the way to go. To an extent as well, but mostly for solo, Red is hard to walk outside without, considering the substantial DPS drop leaving it entails.

Going deep into blue just doesn't really have any positives, at least from where I stand. As I said, some of the CC traits are good, and I almost always have at least two 2 blue, regardless of whether I slot 5 red or 5 yellow. But then, I find myself looking at utterly superfluous traits like Hardy Companion. Who on earth actually slots that in? Of course, we also have those couple of "meh" healing traits I eluded to earlier, which of course, only become worthwhile with heavy spending into a couple LI legacies, which in the long run, is not worth it.

All in all, I really see no point in going deep into blue. Blue, in my humble opinion, needs to become a stronger avenue for healing and pet usage, whilst shifting around the current CC skills into yellow. Yellow and red could also use some worthwhile swaps, but that's besides the point.

What say you, fellow Lore Masters? Rework the blue line, or keep it as is?

Bog-lurker got the highest flanking rate you almost gain flanking one after each other, so more healing on the air-lore target aswell as yourself.
also Bug-lurker can trigger CJ.
also bog-lurker is a range pet so more survival change in boss fight.

and if things go bad... you got also combat summoning along with the bog-lurker.

also with combat summoning, you can go with an eagle and self rez yourself and resummon eagle in combat.

It's just a gameplay style and taste, some like it some don't, but it's viable and useful.

Apparently I need to run into more of you while I'm out and about. Most LM's I run into don't know 25% of what their skils can do. So for those saying blue line is &&&&, have you tried solo'ing 3-man content? I could solo lvl 65 school and library on level with blue line equiped.

It's so disheartening to look at a boss's debuff line and see practically nothing on it cause the loremaster is so busy staring at ISG and waiting for it to come off cooldown.