Discussion: Update 7 Bugs

We are now unable to "refresh" our buffs. They bounce right off and continue to maintain the original countdown.

Until it's fixed you can switch buffs then reapply. Ex crit parry crit.

I forgot to bug it in game so when you see it yourself bug it.

Yes, this is on the Known Issues list and has been since they posted it.

The bullroar list...? Please tell me they didn't release U7 while knowing how frustrating this would be for us...

Envoyé par Armitas

The bullroar list...? Please tell me they didn't release U7 while knowing how frustrating this would be for us...

Well they di....

I won't tell you if you don't want me to tell you =)

Ever get the feeling you're not important?

Our cappy dev should have spoken up for us and said. "Hey! you can't release this part right now...it's going to screw my peoples!"

If he did speak up and they ignored him then you can really see where we stand on things.

TBH I only remember to apply buffs when there are none. So not gonna be a huge deal for me atm.

I can totally see it being frustrating though

Great. They managed to make the most mindnumbing activity in the game (Captain buffing/refeshing buffs) even worse. I´m actually a bit impressed.

Envoyé par Armitas

Ever get the feeling you're not important?

Our cappy dev should have spoken up for us and said. "Hey! you can't release this part right now...it's going to screw my peoples!"

If he did speak up and they ignored him then you can really see where we stand on things.

I agree. I don't see how such an obvious problem made it through development without being fixed. Makes you wander if anyone over there at Turbine is even playing this class.

This is extremely frustratining, and they can't fix it fast enough. Part of the skill in playing Captain was re-applying buffs during lulls in the combat so you can keep everyone buffed up and ready to go. This "bug" has completely done away with this - and it's a real problem.

Envoyé par Armitas

The bullroar list...? Please tell me they didn't release U7 while knowing how frustrating this would be for us...

The Known Issues list.

http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.p...67#post6167967

It makes me wonder what our class dev is even for. Last time I remember hearing from him was back when Rise of Isengard was being released and they wanted our input (read: praise) on the new brother skills. I can't even recall when the last time was before that. There has always been some pretty glaring bugs and design flaws that have effected the Captain class over the years, so many that for most I've almost given up hope that they will ever be fixed.

The stealth change to allow Captains to apply tactics while mounted, which is marvelous for moors play, gave me a glimmer of hope that we wouldn't always be ignored. Unfortunately, that change wasn't applied to Motivating Speech, which means I still have to dismount in order to throw up all my buffs... I feel like that makes the whole change almost pointless.

Envoyé par Uron

TBH I only remember to apply buffs when there are none. So not gonna be a huge deal for me atm.

While it may not be a huge deal, our inability to refresh buffs is going to be a huge pain when facing longer fights. Saruman immediately comes to mind, as I frequently take advantage of the down time between phases to rebuff/refresh my fellows. Buffing on the fly is tricky enough, but with the way instances are designed these days it has become become an integral part of our responsibilities, and this adds a whole new level of frustration to that task.

My question is: With such glaring bugs present and identified over on Bullroarer, why was Update 7 so quickly streamlined onto the live servers? In the past, Bullroarer was usually up for at least two weeks, if not a month, before it ever touched down on the live servers. This gave the developers an ample amount of time to discover, identify, and correct possible bugs. However, Update 7 was up for a little more than a week on the test/preview server before it officially launched. I guess I just fail to see what purpose this served, especially considering that they seem to have broken more things than they've added.

While not apologizing for the lack of communication, sometime in software development, the deadline takes priority, and code gets thrown out to the wild with known issues such as this.

I doubt that our captain dev would have had much traction to halt the update when the producer says "we're shipping this now".

Yeah, especially for what is, if we're being honest here, a pretty minor bug. It inconveniences us, but it doesn't break the class. That's never going to take priority over pushing out a significant content update. Just say it out loud and see how silly it sounds: "Hey, guys, we need to delay launch of the new skirmish and the Moria and Fornost revamps! Captains will have to wait until their buffs expire before reapplying them, and we just can't have that!"

Envoyé par furtim

That's never going to take priority over pushing out a significant content update. Just say it out loud and see how silly it sounds: "Hey, guys, we need to delay launch of the new skirmish and the Moria and Fornost revamps! Captains will have to wait until their buffs expire before reapplying them, and we just can't have that!"

no no
What I'm saying is that they should have left the captains out of that update not that they should push the release of U7 further back.

^^Yes. Considering that the bug most likely results from Turbines tinkering with the refreshing mechanism of buffs... they should probably just have rolled back the whole change.

As it is, it is of course not game breaking. But it increases The Suck of an already stupid task of Captains by 200%

This is a very minor bug but with very major consequences. There is absolutely no good reason why this wasn't fixed before the update went live. A couple of hours to find the chink in the code and fix it is all it would have taken...


So while it may not "break the class" as one apologetic poster said, it does annoy and aggravate your customers - and that's not a good thing.

Sure, the inability to refresh is an annoyance, but it has almost no real impact. We currently have one fight in the game (Draigoch) with the potential to last longer than 30 minutes, and that's it. The idea that this is going to hamper the ability to refresh buffs in combat, while true, is basically a non-issue. Any refreshing of buffs is going to be done out of combat anyway, so now our buff refresh time will be 15-20 seconds per fellowship instead of 8-10? I think we'll survive.

(I'm not making excuses for the bug's existence, but compared to some of the bugs that other classes are dealing with, this has got to be one of, if not the, most minor of all. I'm glad that it's been brought to our attention, we should all bug it, and then move on with our lives.)

Envoyé par Lestache

Sure, the inability to refresh is an annoyance, but it has almost no real impact. We currently have one fight in the game (Draigoch) with the potential to last longer than 30 minutes, and that's it. The idea that this is going to hamper the ability to refresh buffs in combat, while true, is basically a non-issue. Any refreshing of buffs is going to be done out of combat anyway, so now our buff refresh time will be 15-20 seconds per fellowship instead of 8-10? I think we'll survive.

(I'm not making excuses for the bug's existence, but compared to some of the bugs that other classes are dealing with, this has got to be one of, if not the, most minor of all. I'm glad that it's been brought to our attention, we should all bug it, and then move on with our lives.)

Yes, but we can still QQ like no other about it and demonize devs.

/grabsPitchfork

Envoyé par Lestache

Sure, the inability to refresh is an annoyance, but it has almost no real impact. We currently have one fight in the game (Draigoch) with the potential to last longer than 30 minutes, and that's it. The idea that this is going to hamper the ability to refresh buffs in combat, while true, is basically a non-issue. Any refreshing of buffs is going to be done out of combat anyway, so now our buff refresh time will be 15-20 seconds per fellowship instead of 8-10? I think we'll survive.

(I'm not making excuses for the bug's existence, but compared to some of the bugs that other classes are dealing with, this has got to be one of, if not the, most minor of all. I'm glad that it's been brought to our attention, we should all bug it, and then move on with our lives.)

I just don't agree with this at all. None-Issue my ____

It's a fairly significant issue, as it eats up a ton of time having to cast an incorrect buff on someone than having to re-apply it with the buff you actually want. So basically it will take you twice as long to re-apply your buffs as it did before - and that's a pretty big deal. Time spent buffing is time spent out of the fight.

Also, far as you talking about not many fights that lasts longer than 30 minutes cept Draigoch. Well, I don't agree as Saruman to name one is deffinitely longer than 30 minutes... least when I do it - but besides, that's an irrelevant point anyway.

It really doesn't matter how long any single fight takes - that's not the issue. The issue is it makes it take twice as long to re-apply your buffs, and that's a huge inconvience. So to refresh buffs you will be forced to tell your group to wait forever inbetween fights, or basically pull your hair out while trying to do it during a fight. Neither option is really acceptable, least not to me.

And that's not QQing. Just the facts jack - to quote one of my favorite movies.

And to the person who said I and others were "demonizing" the devs. Please... if you think that's "demonizing" you have lived a sheltered life indeed lol Holding the developers responsible when they become lazy or sloppy isn't "demonizing". It's being a responsible customer, and holding them to a very reasonable standard. Such an obvious and easily corrected bug should have never made it through development - and they deffinitely need to put someone on their staff on Captain duty.

It's probably going to have other impacts too, i.e., some folks will show up in group already buffed, and we'll have to make the effort to be aware of that when we put our initial buff on them or their existing buff will time-out and we may not notice it.

Might this also effect fly-by buffing? If I see someone with a ticking-down buff on them, I'll often refresh it for them. I'm probably not going to do this if it means I've got to buff them twice to get the job done

Edit: definitely no pitchforks required, but I do hope they fix this in the next patch rather than 2 years from now.

Envoyé par Jeremi

I just don't agree with this at all. None-Issue my ____

It's a fairly significant issue, as it eats up a ton of time having to cast an incorrect buff on someone than having to re-apply it with the buff you actually want. So basically it will take you twice as long to re-apply your buffs as it did before - and that's a pretty big deal. Time spent buffing is time spent out of the fight.

Also, far as you talking about not many fights that lasts longer than 30 minutes cept Draigoch. Well, I don't agree as Saruman to name one is deffinitely longer than 30 minutes... least when I do it - but besides, that's an irrelevant point anyway.

It really doesn't matter how long any single fight takes - that's not the issue. The issue is it makes it take twice as long to re-apply your buffs, and that's a huge inconvience. So to refresh buffs you will be forced to tell your group to wait forever inbetween fights, or basically pull your hair out while trying to do it during a fight. Neither option is really acceptable, least not to me.

And that's not QQing. Just the facts jack - to quote one of my favorite movies.

And to the person who said I and others were "demonizing" the devs. Please... if you think that's "demonizing" you have lived a sheltered life indeed lol Holding the developers responsible when they become lazy or sloppy isn't "demonizing". It's being a responsible customer, and holding them to a very reasonable standard. Such an obvious and easily corrected bug should have never made it through development - and they deffinitely need to put someone on their staff on Captain duty.

I take it that Saruman T1 has no time limit, then? T2 Saruman wipes the group at the 30 minute mark.

And at the risk of paraphrasing myself from an unrelated thread: if something like buffing taking twice as long can be considered a "huge inconvenience" and a "pretty big deal", then I'd say that you have a pretty good life.

I think some people are over-reacting to this. I mean, really, it is a minor bug, and has a workaround already (buff with something else, then buff again). It is not game breaking. There would be absolutely no way any producer would stop the roll out of FREE CONTENT to everyone over such a minor bug.

Envoyé par Lestache

I take it that Saruman T1 has no time limit, then? T2 Saruman wipes the group at the 30 minute mark.

And at the risk of paraphrasing myself from an unrelated thread: if something like buffing taking twice as long can be considered a "huge inconvenience" and a "pretty big deal", then I'd say that you have a pretty good life.

In the CONTEXT OF THE GAME Lestache it is a significant annoyance. That's what I meant. This is a GAME FORUM after-all.

Of course if you want to branch out into a real-life context then yes, this entire game is meaningless and not important lol But that's a cop-out for the developers.

Envoyé par Vociferus

I think some people are over-reacting to this. I mean, really, it is a minor bug, and has a workaround already (buff with something else, then buff again). It is not game breaking. There would be absolutely no way any producer would stop the roll out of FREE CONTENT to everyone over such a minor bug.

How is anyone exagerating? Nobody has said it is "game-breaking"

And this bug should take a couple of hours to fix max. There is no good reason this annoying bug made it through development un-fixed.

Envoyé par Jeremi

How is anyone exagerating? Nobody has said it is "game-breaking"

And this bug should take a couple of hours to fix max. There is no good reason this annoying bug made it through development un-fixed.

As if you have any fraking clue what it means to be a software developer...

This is really going to be frustrating in a pvp raid.

T2 Saruman? Has someone beat it yet (legitimately)? (crosses fingers) If you're beating T2 wings in 30 min you're in the minority. Most of us are going to take longer if for nothing more than afks, and retraits for final boss. Pug anything is over 30min.

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It is inconvenient, frustrating and entirely unnecessary in it's current form, thats all it is. I don't think anyone has tried to make it into anything more than that... or am I mistaken?

Envoyé par Armitas

T2 Saruman? Has someone beat it yet (legitimately)? (crosses fingers)

Saruman T2 CM beaten (likely world first)

Nice. They make it look almost easy. Couple of close calls though.

Have you heard whether or not FnF T2CM has been beaten yet?

Not that I know of, but the only reason I saw the video I posted was because someone posted it on reddit.

Envoyé par Armitas

This is really going to be frustrating in a pvp raid.

T2 Saruman? Has someone beat it yet (legitimately)? (crosses fingers) If you're beating T2 wings in 30 min you're in the minority. Most of us are going to take longer if for nothing more than afks, and retraits for final boss. Pug anything is over 30min.

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It is inconvenient, frustrating and entirely unnecessary in it's current form, thats all it is. I don't think anyone has tried to make it into anything more than that... or am I mistaken?

I was saying that the fights themselves are less than 30 minutes. If you're taking afks and retraiting before bosses, that's probably when you're rebuffing as well. Even if you're not taking a break between the last trash pull and the boss, you're likely taking a minute or so to make sure that everybody knows what they're doing, has eaten food, scrolls and tokens have been applied, and so forth. Again, more than enough time to rebuff - even if it does require hitting each person with two buffs instead of one for the time being.

And yeah, about 5-6 kins have beaten T2 Saruman legitimately since the patch on Monday, and 2-3 of those were Challenge mode. I suspect that at least one more kin may have done so as well, but they requested to not have their achievements tracked in the Raid Progression thread.

As for F&F Challenge... right now it seems harder than Saruman T2C. :P

ive only skimmed...

are some of you suggesting the entire update put on hold for an (albeit annoying) issue that is minor and has an easy work-around?

i freaking hate this bug, but its not game-breaking.


there are other bugs that should have held up the update. no argument there!

Envoyé par SapienChavez

ive only skimmed...

are some of you suggesting the entire update put on hold for an (albeit annoying) issue that is minor and has an easy work-around?

i freaking hate this bug, but its not game-breaking.


there are other bugs that should have held up the update. no argument there!

Sapien, like I said in an earlier post - this bug would have taken a couple of hours to fix max. Fixing it shoudn't have held up anything.

It may not be "game-breaking". But NO ONE on this forum ever said it was. So why people keep bringing up this "game-breaking" thing I don't know. It is however annoying as heck, and needs to be fixed pronto.

Envoyé par Almagnus1

As if you have any fraking clue what it means to be a software developer...

Aren't you the guy who supposedly ignored me like a month ago? ...lol

So funny to me how you accuse me of being a "troll" yet continusouly on these forums you desperately seek my attention and try to start arguments with me by responding to my posts with your annoying little personal attacks.

Let me put something bluntly to you. You have no idea what I have a clue about. In fact, you know absolutely NOTHING about me.

Now go find someone else to harass and give up this childish vendetta you have against me.

Envoyé par Jeremi

It may not be "game-breaking". But NO ONE on this forum ever said it was. So why people keep bringing up this "game-breaking" thing I don't know. It is however annoying as heck, and needs to be fixed pronto.

Yes, at least for me more annoying than the bug. It happens in a lot of threads. 1 person sensationalizes 1 thing then all the TLDR's find a way to only read it and comment. They cascade till you have layers of comments that are based on an erroneous conclusion yet the whole system continues to draw posters into it's trap. It's WAI for those who use sensationalism and hyperbole.

You can't stop it either. If this thread goes on it will happen again.

Envoyé par Armitas

Yes, at least for me more annoying than the bug. It happens in a lot of threads. 1 person sensationalizes 1 thing then all the TLDR's find a way to only read it and comment. They cascade till you have layers of comments that are based on an erroneous conclusion yet the whole system continues to draw posters into it's trap. It's WAI for those who use sensationalism and hyperbole.

You can't stop it either. If this thread goes on it will happen again.

It is weird how that snowball effect can occur based off something that was never said to begin with.

just fyi you can work around the bug simply by giving someone a different type of buff (like icpr) and then going back to the original tactic. Not sure if anyone posted that yet.

Envoyé par DuneBug

just fyi you can work around the bug simply by giving someone a different type of buff (like icpr) and then going back to the original tactic. Not sure if anyone posted that yet.

It says that in the OP.

I don't know about other cappies but I am known to sometimes drive-by buff while chasing after/healing a tank on a dragon head, making buffing harder does chap my hide.

Envoyé par Armitas

We are now unable to "refresh" our buffs. They bounce right off and continue to maintain the original countdown.

Until it's fixed you can switch buffs then reapply. Ex crit parry crit.

I forgot to bug it in game so when you see it yourself bug it.

fixed finally.