Thread: Price for Pots bought with Comms doubling in update 7 for creeps only

HEY!


don't mess with Dom Deluise

Originally Posted by Stevo6

I'm seriouslly confused. What's this thread about?

pie.... i think

I always enjoy these consumable debates. I like to gear/supply myself the best I can when it comes to PvP. I also appreciate it when my opponents do the same. I know some people like to consider themselves more noble for not using pots. I get that.


I can tell you one thing though. Getting all the consumables ready on my hunter is much more work than on my warg. Plus, I have to spend time outside of the potential-PvP zone for a large majority of the time. At least when I'm getting pots for my warg I have the potential to find a freep derping around away from the zerg.


I have 21 normal consumables (not just pots, but consumables) on my hunter. Yep, 21, I counted. Its 23 if I count the fireworks and Lure Traps (scarecrow traps) I put out for old vets, good 1v1s, or the greenest of greenies. Of those 21, only 4 of them are vendor purchased 100% of the time. This doesn't count DP buffs, clickies, or anything from the store.


Hunter is probably a special case, but I can only speak to my own experiences. Its a helluva lot easier on my warg to get a full ..... full compliment of pots to use.



Resist food
Agility food
Tick food
Bow Chants
Fire oil
Trip wires
Triple Traps
Quick Traps
Fear pots (defiler type)
Wound pots
Disease pots
Poison pots
Fear pots (regular)
Root pots
Stun pots
Morale pots
Power pots
Focus pots
Token
Damage scroll
Defense scroll

Originally Posted by apb8808

Then I guess I wasn't as detailed in my example I should have specified that neither thought much of food and that the only reason the reaver got buff pots was to try and bring certain stats closer to the freep. This is neither here nor there and far from the main point which I highlighted at the end. The scenario was simply a means to an end to discuss the economic implications.

Your example unless i'm mistaken was to demonstrate that the commendation price for creep was far more than freep. Your example is skewed in the fact that the creep got extra buffs from the pots he spent his commendations on while the freep bought only CC curing pots. Perhaps if the creep bought CC curing pots like the freep did, he'd be in better shape?

Now if both sides wanted the entire spectrum of buffs and pots, both will have to invest more time and currency (in different forms) to gain everything they want.

Creeps seem quick to throw a tantrum every time they have to pve for something (see lootboxes and new skins), but will just as quickly point fingers at freeps and say they can go get it via pve. Sure there is a difference, but no pvper wants to run off to pve on either side.

Originally Posted by Daec

Your example unless i'm mistaken was to demonstrate that the commendation price for creep was far more than freep. Your example is skewed in the fact that the creep got extra buffs from the pots he spent his commendations on while the freep bought only CC curing pots. Perhaps if the creep bought CC curing pots like the freep did, he'd be in better shape?

Now if both sides wanted the entire spectrum of buffs and pots, both will have to invest more time and currency (in different forms) to gain everything they want.

Creeps seem quick to throw a tantrum every time they have to pve for something (see lootboxes and new skins), but will just as quickly point fingers at freeps and say they can go get it via pve. Sure there is a difference, but no pvper wants to run off to pve on either side.

First off, thanks for the feedback, I appreciate a healthy discussion.

Your got the general gist of it, but I wanted to use a story instead of getting technical and it seems that the message was lost along the way and we are stuck on this Back to the Future II-esq tangent. I'm not sure your going to understand because I'm not sure I can articulate it clearly without being lost in semantics again... Ignore the pots for the time being. Commendations were implemented as they were to drive creeps to the store. Creep comm prices are far higher than Freeps. And even more so for newer creeps (this is where I'm focusing) That's my main point, and its not about being a victim it is a product of the way Creep side is built. The value I'm talking about is opportunity cost.

What I was going for basically was if a creep wants certain buffs of a certain magnitude they NEED to spend Comms, while freeps CAN spend gold. But I want to dive in more overall. Haha gunna get far away from just pots.. I'm really talking about scarcity and choice. And. Here.We.Go.

Each time a creep barters for one thing, he is giving up the chance of potentially bartering for corruptions, skins, audacity, food, brand, skills, other types of pots, class traits. Depending on rank. This actively factors into decision making and how the creep will spend his comms. Now freeps have this decision too but the opportunity cost is much lower because there are fewer forgone alternatives. Translation: freeps don't have to barter for skills/class traits for example.

Now quickly back to the pots example, Having equivalent substitutes means "Why spend 125 comms on 1400 morale pots when I can buy equivalents for cheaper with less SCARCE currency? Besides 125 for 5? What a rip-off."(Gold, crafting mats are easier to acquire, and are at the discretion of when the player wants, and other players factor much smaller in the acquisition) This factors in to how you value your commendations. Because Creeps can't obtain equivalent pots, the pots are automatically more VALUABLE. "Dang it, if I want the best morale pots I NEED to spend my comms. 125 for 5. No other choice." You save your SCARCE commendations as a freep toward acquiring Audacity(more on that in a sec) and you can still acquire EQUAL boosts with gold( A more common currency) that the opposing side needs to give up SCARCE commendations for. It's called "Having one's cake and eating it too"

Commendations are SCARCE to start as a new player on either side, but more so for creep side. Why? Because how they are awarded for PvP, the system is based off of damage. Your ability to do damage or to "take a larger piece of the pie" is severely limited until r7 or so on creepside depending on class.(Ignore the store for now) And some even after that, maybe Warg and Ba earlier ranks. Freepside? It all comes down to the LI. Regardless of rank or audacity you can acquire comendations EASIER because you can do more damage. Of course some classes quicker than others and it comes down to player skill as well. Or you can just zerg . And because freeps don't have to barter for class skills/traits/virtues or the best consumables, they save their comms toward acquiring Audacity which reduces damage taken from creeps. See the issue here?

So Creeps do low damage, slow comms acquisition. Freep gets audacity, Creep does less damage than before, even slower acquisition. Freeps do High damage. quicker comms acquisition. Creep gets new skills to try and do more damage(Increase his acquisition rate!), ignores audacity. Freep still does high damage, quicker comms acquisition.

If you followed thus far, Low ranked Creeps have a slower rate of Comm Acquisition.. and they have greater options they have to give up each time they spend comms. 125 Creep comms=/= 125 Freep comms. Scarcity and choice! How to get around it? Spend REAL money!

(Note: Ignored all PvE in the moors as a large portion of it is dependent on other players. And it is a fixed number, based off of quest availability and your current rank. I.E. You can do harder quests higher you are. (map color, availability of help on quests, whether or not you will be killed doing quests) Coundn't make the assumption freeps and creeps will always been able to share comms, large portion of creepside is F2P. And none of this takes into account other imbalances... just the commendations. If you've read all this you deserve a pat on the back.)

I freep and creep, I find creepside more enjoyable and a breath of fresh air from the constant PvE grind on freepside. I want the PvP to grow in this game, and wish there were more new Creep side dedicated players. The barriers to competitiveness are simply too high, if I had to start now I never would have played creepside. (Nevermind the hundreds of other problems with pvp in this game )