Thread: What is the difference between character advancement and grinding?

oh ..and for those who feel that leveling is a grind in Lotro.. lol.. I just wish you had the opportunity to get to know EQ in the heyday ..

Grinding? LOL! I came over from PWI and you have no idea what grinding is. Try killing tens of thousands of Mothran Dazzlewings to level around 80th because the quest aren't a tenth of the XP you need for your next level. I'll take 320 whatevers ANY day!

So because there are more grindy experiences out there, that means LOTRO isn't grindy? Sorry I don't buy into that logic.

LOTRO has plenty of grind, and ways to avoid the grind -> Store. Convenience and P2W wrapped up in a nice little window in-game.

Leveling
Tasks
Quests
Deeds (Slayer/Quest/Location)
Virtues (x14)
LIs (relics/xp/legacies/legacy level/star lit crystals/3 tiers/two LIs/multiple LIs per alt)
Marks/Meds/Seals
Crafting
Faction Reputation
Crafting guild reputation
...umm...TP....are there any grinds that I'm missing?

Originally Posted by Yula_the_Mighty

When the activity becomes boring = Grind.

Pretty much

It becomes a grind when it becomes boring.

If there's a "do it faster" option in the store, you know it's a game mechanic officially designed to be a grind and a time-sink. It's not really subjective.

I think some players play MMO exclusively for so long, they no longer recognize the difference between "grind", "fun", and "achievement".

Originally Posted by Ghost_Archer

Grinding? LOL! I came over from PWI and you have no idea what grinding is. Try killing tens of thousands of Mothran Dazzlewings to level around 80th because the quest aren't a tenth of the XP you need for your next level. I'll take 320 whatevers ANY day!

Hah, yes! I concur, friend, to say nothing of endless FC--just for exp! To say nothing of crafting ><

Coming from there, advancing in lotro is an epic-level cake. I just can't see anything in lotro as a real grind. Running instances into oblivion, maybe, but hey, it could always be worse.

I listen to podcast while I play so for me: if time spent doing activity> one episode of This American Life then it's grinding.

Originally Posted by ScionofAngmar

What distinguishes the two in your opinion? This seems like a timely topic given the hullabaloo over the Star Light Crystals

Where is this hullabaloo? I can't find it anywhere. (I'm not being sarcastic, either--it's early and I just woke up from a dream where I couldn't find my friend's golf clubs anywhere. I must have been searching half the night, and I have no patience left.) I wanted to add my voice to anyone else saying that continuing to increase the LI grind (and selling the power in the LotRO store) is the worst decision since F2P. I'm starting to agree with the people who claim Turbine is killing their own game. All of my alts are dead now except one, and my RK can now DPS or Heal--but both poorly because those four LI's still need a lot of grinding that is no longer fun. I still haven't done an endgame dungeon.

For me, grind is some form of repetition that I find not fun. Some repetitive things I might find fun and some I don't. For the ones I don't, it doesn't necessarily have to be the exact same thing over and over. It can be as arbitrary as quest hub, level-up, move to next quest hub and repeat.

Unfortunately, I don't feel much character advancement these days simply because so much is tied to the gear now. Many people have stated this already and I would certainly like to see a bit of a change in that aspect.

Originally Posted by ScionofAngmar

At what point does an activity cross over from advancement into grinding?

When I'm doing something repeatedly, for long stretches of time, that isn't especially enjoyable.

Originally Posted by Chellcn

IMO, it depends on the individual.

Example: I've been trying to complete a bunch of deeds I let slip by the wayside. Currently working on the advanced orc slayer deed in Angmar. 300. I'm having fun, blowing through them like nothing and looting to my hearts content. Also, I run through Sarnur for a couple of hours every other days to farm rep items to post on the AH. I love doing both - believe it or not, it relaxes me.

My friend thinks I've lost what little sanity I had left.

It's all a matter of how the individual feels. I think when you get to that point of "Dang I have to do this AGAIN?!" is when it becomes a grind.

^^that

Expressed my perspective exactly.

For example, I am still running GAs every opportunity I have. Even though there is no reward there that I want. I already reached kindred with the Eglain and there is nothing in the barter vendor that I want. But I do that because I enjoy the challenges. I think they are fun and my experience is different with each new group I join. Some people would get crazy if they had to run an instance over and over again. I usually don't mind because even though it is the same instance, each group is different and the experience will be different.

By the way - Level 42 Hunter looking for GA group. Willing to travel. Promise not to kill any of the adds in the bosses' fights.