Although I am not one to normally raid, I found great pleasure in last nights action. Since there is a thread dedicated to 1v1 action, why not have one for RvR. Thanks to all the creeps and freeps for giving me a night of fun instead of just being steam rolled running solo.
As Grandmother stated. Thanks for recording those fights! There were awesome battles all throughout the night and those were definitely some of the highlights. Amazing healing on creepside as well as top notch coordination done by T.A.s
Freeps did great also. Thank you freeps for coming out in force. The TR save was awesome guys and keep up the great work.
Keep getting those new freeps out and get them grouped for some great times. I would love to see the outnumbered buff on creeps during prime time.
Thank you freep leaders, freep targetters, creep leaders, creep targetters, and everyone that makes E a great place.
I know that times are a little rough for freeps right now. You guys have been battered and broken over the years with different situations regarding leadership changes, voice communication, vets not coming out as much. The fact that in light of everything you guys can still come out and bring the pain has me holding you all in the highest respect.
...now take the fight clubs to Candy mountain guys
Yeah, shame you weren't able to record the fights we had 3 weeks ago Hipp, because that night definitly wasn't the best fighting we've had in recent times. Regardless, Yicky, pleasure as always to RvR you.
In light of what you said Yick, at the moment it was (and is) incredibly tough for some of (if not most) the players to adjust to the sea of changes confronting our side - it's been fairly shaky grounds in comparison to the awesome organisation/set-up over on creepside, and I think this, as well as other reasons, is affecting Raid play. At least, for players raiding with I, kudos to you all - I definitly don't get out enough for consistency to really take place.
But no matter, we'll be back out in the open field, with my wonderfully non-musical voice shouting, with us refining tactics, skills and pew pew rotations to knock you nasty creeps down. I can assure you of that
Derp, my bad! I'll make sure to use my telepathy next time, and the freep(s) will meet me there.
You know I will be there
I live for Fight Clubs
My name is Purebloodnakh, Chieftain of Saruman's Armies of the North, General of the Warg Legions, loyal servant to the true Lord, Sauron. And I will have my vengeance, in this life or the next.
Of course you record when the mighty Overlord is offline -.- Nice video though
meet me behind the big tent in grams, we'll make a video
Originally Posted by gimli4480
I love how the same people that are against fight clubs are the same people who want to reimplement the lock timer. PvP killers is what I call them.
hmm...i like the 1v1s "fight clubs" and imo the flip timers should be put back in place, going from freep to creep and creep to freep. it would solve the ohh freeps have the upper hand atm i'll go freep side and vice versa, granted freeps should be able to log in but be locked out of the moors for the same duration that you can't log creep side. I don't see it as killing pvp, it would rather keep the balance more often. I haven't become accustomed to all the different players on E yet, so i don't know those that like to flip to the winning side...that I consider very lame.
here's my thoughts on candy mountain, the terrain is terrible, therefore i choose to not fight up there often. if it so happens i get rolled over so be it (and it happens often), the random encounters around the map are my fun most of the time.
Last edited by crandomusernamel; May 07 2012 at 05:30 PM.
here's my thoughts on candy mountain, the terrain is terrible, therefore i choose to not fight up there often. if it so happens i get rolled over so be it (and it happens often), the random encounters around the map are my fun most of the time.
First complaint I have seen in years. however there are still many places much better than TR west for a fight club.
Anca Rock area, East of GG map in, Hell the area north of GTR...sitting at Tr West is the absolute highest traffic flow area on E. setting up a fight club there is just asking for a steam roll. People complaining that they are getting rolled over is even more baffling.
Isindar Altana the Warlord; R13 Elf Champion.
R7 weaver/R10 Reaver.
R7 Captain/R8 Burglar.
"Man, I don't have time for this. I'm a busy elf. I've got places to go, people to act superior to, and elder-than-thou attitudes to express."
here's my thoughts on candy mountain, the terrain is terrible, therefore i choose to not fight up there often. if it so happens i get rolled over so be it (and it happens often), the random encounters around the map are my fun most of the time.
First complaint I have seen in years. however there are still many places much better than TR west for a fight club.
Anca Rock area, East of GG map in, Hell the area north of GTR...sitting at Tr West is the absolute highest traffic flow area on E. setting up a fight club there is just asking for a steam roll. People complaining that they are getting rolled over is even more baffling.
CM not only has terrible terrain, but with the 3 or so server lines up there, causes lag/skill delays for a lot of people up there depending on where exactly they are fighting. The more you're up on CM the more you realize this and begin to hate fighting up there.
The 1v1 "fight clubs" if you will, have always popped up and have always been "told" to go take it to CM by the same group of players. Yes, while CM is the agreed upon safe 1v1 area, I think the majority of those, at least those that solo and/or 1v1 will respect the "fight clubs" that randomly pop up, for the most part. Most treat it just like CM and will kill the gankers that try to ruin the fight clubs.
As for the fight club the other day, the freeps were toggling the pop buff, so not many out. I actually think the majority of the freeps out at the time were in the fight club area participating. Didn't think the zerg of it at the end was needed, but wasn't surprised by it either.
I take it for what it is, and am not surprised if/when they get zerged, as it is bound to happen, generally lasts long enough that people can get some quality fights in though.
As for Hippi's thread, I think a RvR thread could be a good idea, as long as it doesn't turn into one of those nice zerg freeps, or nice zerg creeps, kind of thread, which in the end, it probably would, just like the old 1v1 thread. Again, I take that for what it is.
CM not only has terrible terrain, but with the 3 or so server lines up there, causes lag/skill delays for a lot of people up there depending on where exactly they are fighting. The more you're up on CM the more you realize this and begin to hate fighting up there.
The 1v1 "fight clubs" if you will, have always popped up and have always been "told" to go take it to CM by the same group of players. Yes, while CM is the agreed upon safe 1v1 area, I think the majority of those, at least those that solo and/or 1v1 will respect the "fight clubs" that randomly pop up, for the most part. Most treat it just like CM and will kill the gankers that try to ruin the fight clubs.
As for the fight club the other day, the freeps were toggling the pop buff, so not many out. I actually think the majority of the freeps out at the time were in the fight club area participating. Didn't think the zerg of it at the end was needed, but wasn't surprised by it either.
I take it for what it is, and am not surprised if/when they get zerged, as it is bound to happen, generally lasts long enough that people can get some quality fights in though.
As for Hippi's thread, I think a RvR thread could be a good idea, as long as it doesn't turn into one of those nice zerg freeps, or nice zerg creeps, kind of thread, which in the end, it probably would, just like the old 1v1 thread. Again, I take that for what it is.
so server lines and poor terrain. That makes sense. I dont know why it wasnt brought up before...so.
Resolution. There has GOT to be an area that is away from the highly pop traffic flow that is good for fight clubs. Where you guys can go and not have to worry about being slammed every 5-10 minutes and where us small groupers or just random soloers dont get ganked for being near it... (funny how they talk about respect but i map in to check it out twice and get rolled over) So...anyway...Needs to be accessable by both sides...but away from the main flow... My best suggestions would be in the snowy areas near Poor isen...The open field east of Good grim map in....or the area north of TR in that little alcove sop that is surrounded by bears (as log as they are far enough away that you guys dont get aggro) other than that...there are places that are a little further away like behind river OP or just east of Anca Rock.
My worry is this. People sitting right at TR west for fight clubs does nothing but create drama. It pisses off the freeps that are trying to 1v1...it pisses off the creeps that are 1v1ing...and it pisses off the freeps and creeps that are passing through looking for small group or solo fights in the area. I mean jeez with all the fight clubs going on right now it is a wonder that more Euro's dont transfer here cause we are turning into snowbourn. There is too much un-needed drama all ready on both sides without creating more un-needed drama between freeps and creeps. Best course of action is to find an alternative spot, away from the main travel routes that people can recognize as a fight club spot if they are there. Are you still going to get jerks that will break it up on purpose? probably. but you will probably get less break ups from people that are beyond frustrated that it is directly in line with a staging point for keep takes.
so server lines and poor terrain. That makes sense. I dont know why it wasnt brought up before...so. Resolution. There has GOT to be an area that is away from the highly pop traffic flow that is good for fight clubs. Where you guys can go and not have to worry about being slammed every 5-10 minutes and where us small groupers or just random soloers dont get ganked for being near it... (funny how they talk about respect but i map in to check it out twice and get rolled over) So...anyway...Needs to be accessable by both sides...but away from the main flow... My best suggestions would be in the snowy areas near Poor isen...The open field east of Good grim map in....or the area north of TR in that little alcove sop that is surrounded by bears (as log as they are far enough away that you guys dont get aggro) other than that...there are places that are a little further away like behind river OP or just east of Anca Rock. My worry is this. People sitting right at TR west for fight clubs does nothing but create drama. It pisses off the freeps that are trying to 1v1...it pisses off the creeps that are 1v1ing...and it pisses off the freeps and creeps that are passing through looking for small group or solo fights in the area. I mean jeez with all the fight clubs going on right now it is a wonder that more Euro's dont transfer here cause we are turning into snowbourn. There is too much un-needed drama all ready on both sides without creating more un-needed drama between freeps and creeps. Best course of action is to find an alternative spot, away from the main travel routes that people can recognize as a fight club spot if they are there. Are you still going to get jerks that will break it up on purpose? probably. but you will probably get less break ups from people that are beyond frustrated that it is directly in line with a staging point for keep takes.
Yicky, I appreciate what you are trying to do. However the simple fact is that fight clubs spring up in places like GTA, TRW, OCHS for precisely the reason it frustrates a lot of people, that is, its a high traffic area. Basically its where you run into people you are interested in fighting, stop, and fight them. A few people decide to watch on both sides and suddenly there is a 1v1 circle.
There isn't a collaboration of people seeking to annoy the raid, they just do what the raids do, and go where there are people to fight, on the scale of battle people are looking for.
I personally get bored with 1v1 circles very quickly, however after doing a few laps of the moors without finding anything above rank 2 or 3s solo or in groups of 3 or less (or the high ranked creep groups) I tend to stroll back to the circles (completely my own fault for not wanting to group often).
CM has seriously problems that nearly all the 1v1'ers recognize, however being as it is a multi-server area for 1v1s nominating another spot wont help unfortunately. I am 100% for the concept of moving 1v1s out of the way of the main fights going on, I just don't see an effective way to do this consistently.
Last edited by Apocatequil; May 08 2012 at 01:53 AM.
Votan | Xeyila | Grisburnakh
Retired - Thanks for the fun and the fights
Fully agree Yicky. Some of the places they pop up are less than ideal for sure. However, it's not too hard to spot a 1v1 area going on, especially for players on both sides that have been around for any extended length of time. The plus side to having them near a map in and/or high traffic area is that it makes for, generally, easy returns for the side that doesn't hold the near rez. Not saying that it's the best option, but there are times on a full red map when pTR is the best place to have them; less freeps out, not going to flip TR, etc. Higher traffic areas make for easier times, at times, for Freeps or Creeps to return to the area generally freely, again not always the case.
I understand how it can get annoying when the only thing going on is 1v1 fight clubs when either side is wanting to run a bigger group. Each time they pop up, I'm sure it's under different circumstances, and you know just as well as I do, that getting both sides to move to an agreed upon location isn't the easiest thing to do. Even if there was a new established CM area there's still no really easy way to convey that to both sides fully; there's even people that still gank on CM after all these years.
If they pop up when it's a Raid v. Raid out, which I haven't seen them do so lately while I've been out there, but then again I tend to avoid the bigger fights as of late, I don't think they'd pop up in the higher traffic areas, but I could be mistaken.
While I enjoy when I am solo and such, I personally avoid fight clubs and candy mountain. Too much politics. I enjoy fighting rvr even if i'm not in one or am leading one or in syls. I miss the raids when leon was here opposition fought and it was work to keep my raids up. Leon is missed.
1vs1 circles screw up the playing field and eventually one team or the other gets bored and rolls over everything. I do wish how ever opposition would last longer when it is an organized raid. Seems fighting always ends early.
alzie rank 14 mini
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"kill fast , run faster!"
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As for the fight club the other day, the freeps were toggling the pop buff
Freeps line up at Fight Club when they have the Buff
My name is Purebloodnakh, Chieftain of Saruman's Armies of the North, General of the Warg Legions, loyal servant to the true Lord, Sauron. And I will have my vengeance, in this life or the next.
My 2p.... years ago when CM was agreed on for the 1v1 area, I personally thought that any designated 1v1 area was pretty stupid and would cause drama. But (unless you're running away from us and go up there), I have respected that area as that's what the community agreed on.
That said.... it's common knowledge that CM is the place that 1v1's is generally (I use that term loosely) honored and most creep raid leaders won't go up there to interrupt (we've transited through a few times on our way to the Isen OP where freep raids tend to go). But anywhere else isn't and will not be honored by me as a fight club/1v1 area. You all know that those are dangerous grounds to be 1v1'ing in so don't complain if you get rolled over.
My 2p.... years ago when CM was agreed on for the 1v1 area, I personally thought that any designated 1v1 area was pretty stupid and would cause drama. But (unless you're running away from us and go up there), I have respected that area as that's what the community agreed on.
That said.... it's common knowledge that CM is the place that 1v1's is generally (I use that term loosely) honored and most creep raid leaders won't go up there to interrupt (we've transited through a few times on our way to the Isen OP where freep raids tend to go). But anywhere else isn't and will not be honored by me as a fight club/1v1 area. You all know that those are dangerous grounds to be 1v1'ing in so don't complain if you get rolled over.
Vyxe and Yicky, I respect both of you as raid leaders, as players, and as all around friendly people but, quite frankly, this excuse is getting old and tired.
The truth is as a solo player there is NOTHING I can do to disadvantage or force the opposition to fight on equal footing. Literally, it cannot be done. Grouped players, whether they be truly grouped or simple a zerg, CAN and do force solo players to either group up or leave. I have had many raiders throw out the sickening "don't tell me how to play" argument but they are awfully quick to tell solo people how to play.
It takes less than a second to tell a fight club or a 1v1 apart. Stop pretending to be all high and mighty with the "sanctioned" style of play and have some respect for the individuals playing, hmm? I have had raids (raids that you were leading, Vyxe) chase me from TRW to HH, was this about dispersing 1v1s? Do you feel it takes a whole raid to kill me? I doubt it. If one of your little babies wants to chase me and try to get a kill, let them. In my experience they will all turn right back around and either run for the raid or call the raid in on me. Quality pvp.
In the end what I really want is for people to stop claiming there are politics or motivations behind rolling fight clubs or 1v1s and just admit to the community and themselves that they want the easy points. Why else would you run over solos? I don't mind dying but I despise excuses from people who should be better than that. I don't care if you interrupt my 1v1s and kill me, I will just release and find another fight. However, you are ultimately disrespecting the player I am fighting as you deny them the potential for full infamy and commendations as well as a kb. 90% of the people I fight choose to fight me, I rarely start a fight or even attack first. You take that choice away from people.
Cmalberg - Elendilmir
-Stickygritz, Gritzwarr, and all those Gritz. Greblam
The number of people who pure solo (and I mean they stay away from zergs, looking for 1v1's) I can count with both of my hands. Everyone else I have seen in groups/raids and... you know what... at that point i'm not going to deny my team infamy. You're going to die if you're not a pure solo'er.
Yup, back to "my opinion+excuses>your opinion+excuses."
By the way, that is exactly what I meant. As a raid leader you get to call the shots based on some arbitrary system of rules that you and you alone get to decide upon. PvP at its best, congratulations.
Last edited by cmal; May 08 2012 at 12:31 PM.
Cmalberg - Elendilmir
-Stickygritz, Gritzwarr, and all those Gritz. Greblam
Yes, it is important to destroy the pvp before you pve so that your pve is not interrupted by pvp.
In my opinion...It isn't PVE if there are freeps in it. At that point it becomes PVP in a keep.
Originally Posted by Kiddyfence
That is, without a doubt, a reasonable reason to break up 1v1 circles. After all, as per the game mechanics, once a player dies in the moors, they must spend days, if not weeks, leveling up their account again before partaking in any combat in the moors. It's not as if they could literally walk back to where they died in 30 seconds, but this time with a slightly stronger inclination to prevent the keep take. Yes. Clearly.
This is quite a good line of thought. Players who have gone out of their way to avoid any raid v raid action are nevertheless a threat to stop a keep take just from their presence. Those that 1v1 regularly could benefit from similar ideas. When a player that regularly raids approaches a 1v1 circle, whether it be on CM or in a random location, those in the circle would do well to take the precaution of killing the raider on sight. While in the previous example with the keep take, it was clearly best to break up the 1v1 circle despite them showing no interest in interfering, in this case, the raider has shown a proclivity in the past to zerging targets and fights. Rather than the near infinite patience and kindness shown by 1v1ers to raiders in the past despite being ganked by them consistently, with this logic, it would be far more pragmatic to simply gank raiders out of any 1v1 circles as a precaution.
With that said, tears about 1v1 circles usually come from those not in it. Most that partake in 1v1 circles are quite accustomed to dying and one more death makes no real difference. However, those that attempt to break up the circles, whether it be solo, in a group, or in a raid, generally aren't accustomed to fighting without overwhelming numbers on their side. As a result, they tend to shed a few tears while their fellow creeps or freeps stand by watching them get curb stomped by players who actually know how to play.
If I knew for a fact that the 1v1ers would stay in their circle...It may be a different story. But the 1 time I let them be and my raid walked by them...as soon as I pushed into the keep(that had a raid in it), the 1v1ers B-lined it for my rear line. Making my fight a 22 front and 10 behind dual front fight. So for assurance...I took out the 1v1 circle on the next push. I'd rather them come from the rez...If they decide to come back. It isn't 50 meters from my rear line and tactfully, having a group pushing into my defense line which is not at V-Rock and further north gives me more of an idea of where the freeps are.
So yeah...If you are going to be "out of the way" of the raid v raid...is being near both of the raids a good thing? probably not.
I made the suggestion to move it away from the traffic area. You guys thought it wasn't a good idea. The only other alternative is to realize that E is not and has never been a 1v1 server. It houses small groups, 1v1s, AND raids. The 1v1 servers are out there if you don't want to worry about the raids. Otherwise, you know the risks.
Yup, back to "my opinion+excuses>your opinion+excuses."
By the way, that is exactly what I meant. As a raid leader you get to call the shots based on some arbitrary system of rules that you and you alone get to decide upon. PvP at its best, congratulations.
^ This. Alienating soloers and 1v1'ers to terrible real estate as if we are some sort of segregated minority is pretty much just bad sportsmanship. Just because you have more guns than we do doesn't mean you have to use them all the time. We have as much of a right to play how we do as anyone else, but judging from some of these posts, it seems people disagree. I'm not saying there's anything wrong with zerging the fight clubs if that's how you want to go about starting the action, but don't try to throw around excuses trying to say that we ruin your gameplay any more than you ruin ours.
There are 2 types of people in the moors, those who rely and numbers and those who rely on skill.
One group will complain about 1v1s and zerg them when they have enough tribemates log in, the other group will participate.
One group responds to being zerged by bringing more numbers, the other group will put themselves in that situation again.
One group will complain about dps and healing numbers, the other group will adapt.
One group gets 100 infamy waiting for a fight, the other group gets 500 infamy looking for a fight.
Unfortunately, based on current tribe membership numbers, ones that like easy infamy vastly outnumber the ones that like good fights. It is what it is.
Unfortunately, based on current tribe membership numbers, ones that like easy infamy vastly outnumber the ones that like good fights. It is what it is.
^ This. Alienating soloers and 1v1'ers to terrible real estate as if we are some sort of segregated minority is pretty much just bad sportsmanship. Just because you have more guns than we do doesn't mean you have to use them all the time. We have as much of a right to play how we do as anyone else, but judging from some of these posts, it seems people disagree. I'm not saying there's anything wrong with zerging the fight clubs if that's how you want to go about starting the action, but don't try to throw around excuses trying to say that we ruin your gameplay any more than you ruin ours.
So sitting in line of a keep take is ideal? When I am doing a push on TR, I am going to make sure the resistance is taken care of. When you are sitting at V rock and I am pushing a blue keep, you become a liability. What is to say that when I make a pull you dont bum rush in behind us? It has happened before. So at that point, I am going to run over the 1v1 circle to avoid any additional freeps that are "not a part of the moors fights"
What I think Bill was trying to say was that while its not either 1v1ers or Raiders by themselves who create problems, its the way people choose to go about their chosen play style.
I have a high amount of respect for quite a few skilled raiders in PvP, they play PvP in lotro for the companionship and hell, just for fun, while still being skillful. However, there are raiders who are terrible in their skill set, and they never advance because they don't play outside of raids.
You tend not to see people who just want numbers in 1v1 circles as most of these (as an oversimplification) will not get the points from a 1v1 circle due to a lack of skill (with the exception of Champs/Minnies on freepside now and CD popping flayer wargs).
Just play the way you want to have fun, ignore the renown/infamy it doesn't really matter anyway (I hate that commendations has made getting a certain amount of renown/infamy necessary to be competitive though).
Votan | Xeyila | Grisburnakh
Retired - Thanks for the fun and the fights
The number of people who pure solo (and I mean they stay away from zergs, looking for 1v1's) I can count with both of my hands. Everyone else I have seen in groups/raids and... you know what... at that point i'm not going to deny my team infamy. You're going to die if you're not a pure solo'er.
There is definitely more soloers on this server then that. The soloers just end up joining out of frustration of constantly getting zerged. Plenty enjoy doing small groups as well. Not that you would know any of that. I've been of groups of 3 or 4 that attempt to escape a zerg yet we end up getting chased accross the map for the prospect of less than 50 infamy when they could be going after the raid for a better fight and more infamy.
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Originally Posted by Delmore
...now take the fight clubs to Candy mountain guys
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Isindar Altana the Warlord; R13 Elf Champion.
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My name is Purebloodnakh, Chieftain of Saruman's Armies of the North, General of the Warg Legions, loyal servant to the true Lord, Sauron. And I will have my vengeance, in this life or the next.
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