Please! As title, c'mon Sapience, with a certain high profile game going in to open beta this weekend why not keep us happy with a few teasers regarding U7... Maybe if you are feeling particulalry brave throw in one from RoR too!
I for one don't give a whistle in the wind what certain other game is doing beta or anything else.
I bet Turbine do though. No doubt there will be a cheapo big TP points bundle as a last ditch attempt to get some to stay, most won't be bought that easily
IMO the best teaser would be that the lag hitches/stutters that some of us are experiencing will be fixed. If they don't fix this, I can't see those experiencing them to stay.
I'm looking forward to new content, ROR, etc..., but if they don't fix the hitches, I'm really concerned about a premature decline in membership.
Please! As title, c'mon Sapience, with a certain high profile game going in to open beta this weekend why not keep us happy with a few teasers regarding U7... Maybe if you are feeling particulalry brave throw in one from RoR too!
ADHD is apparently becoming endemic. This so reminds me of the cell phone commercials and their "That's so 29 seconds ago".
I know, I said I quit, so why am I posting? 'Cause there ain't no Blogorette patch.
IMO the best teaser would be that the lag hitches/stutters that some of us are experiencing will be fixed. If they don't fix this, I can't see those experiencing them to stay.
I'm looking forward to new content, ROR, etc..., but if they don't fix the hitches, I'm really concerned about a premature decline in membership.
Yeah I agree with this. My stable rides are still freezing, and it has gotten to the point where I'm EXPECTING and WAITING for my horse to freeze.
Please! As title, c'mon Sapience, with a certain high profile game going in to open beta this weekend why not keep us happy with a few teasers regarding U7... Maybe if you are feeling particulalry brave throw in one from RoR too!
Ummm... There is still reason to expect an Update 6.2 before Update 7. Jumping the gun a bit, are we?
I bet Turbine do though. No doubt there will be a cheapo big TP points bundle as a last ditch attempt to get some to stay, most won't be bought that easily
This sort of "prediction" is made over *every* new game to come out. Yes, LoTRO will lose a few people, but other games will lose people who will come LoTRO. Some of those that jump to new games will come back. All in all, the claims of utter disaster because a new game is going into beta or launching unless Turbine DOES SOMETHING have failed to come to pass. What makes you think this time will be any different?
This sort of "prediction" is made over *every* new game to come out. Yes, LoTRO will lose a few people, but other games will lose people who will come LoTRO. Some of those that jump to new games will come back. All in all, the claims of utter disaster because a new game is going into beta or launching unless Turbine DOES SOMETHING have failed to come to pass. What makes you think this time will be any different?
--W. H. Heydt
Old Used Programmer
There's a difference between an utter disaster, and a kick to an already declining game. I'm sure GW2 won't finish lotro off, more likely just give it a nasty kick while it's already down.
But why is this different?
Because Lotro is currently bugged to hell. Because Ettens is already on life support on many servers. Because Arena net have already an established record of providing excellent PvP. Because the press has had universal praise for GW2, unlike all the recent previous MMOs. Because it's unlikely that the final product will have numerous game affecting bugs as AN have proved they can roll out a stable game. Because GW2 needs no sub unlike the recent MMOs so if far more likely to affect those who play Lotro because they can play without a sub. Because Arenanet have a good rep in the gaming community for looking after their players. And most importantly, because it's Guild Wars 2
There's a difference between an utter disaster, and a kick to an already declining game. I'm sure GW2 won't finish lotro off, more likely just give it a nasty kick while it's already down.
But why is this different?
Because Lotro is currently bugged to hell. Because Ettens is already on life support on many servers. Because Arena net have already an established record of providing excellent PvP. Because the press has had universal praise for GW2, unlike all the recent previous MMOs. Because it's unlikely that the final product will have numerous game affecting bugs as AN have proved they can roll out a stable game. Because GW2 needs no sub unlike the recent MMOs so if far more likely to affect those who play Lotro because they can play without a sub. Because Arenanet have a good rep in the gaming community for looking after their players. And most importantly, because it's Guild Wars 2
Also I think GW2 will have less emphasis on cashshop than LOTRO. It seems LOTRO is always reminding me of the cashshop.
Also I think GW2 will have less emphasis on cashshop than LOTRO. It seems LOTRO is always reminding me of the cashshop.
Indeed. Well they have a good rep with players for the cash shop in GW1, so I can't see why they would want to change a good thing. I think the only thing the GW2 store and the Lotro store will have in common is the name store. Time will tell, but ArenaNet have the history to backup their words at least.
But to get back on topic, Turbine are really going to have to start pulling their finger out with teasers, and good ones, if they want to keep up with the new kids on the block. Maybe of course they just don't have any teasers worth showing...
Last edited by RiceandPea; Apr 26 2012 at 01:37 PM.
Ummm... There is still reason to expect an Update 6.2 before Update 7. Jumping the gun a bit, are we? ...
U6.2 will be centered on fixes. U7 should be centered on new content. So, no.
Originally Posted by whheydt
... All in all, the claims of utter disaster because a new game is going into beta or launching unless Turbine DOES SOMETHING have failed to come to pass. What makes you think this time will be any different?...
Because GW2 has a good PvP reputation. GW2 will draw chunks of people away at least to get their PvP fix. Those that leave, AND those that are left, will feel a lot less incentive to be VIP even if they stay for PvE.
Add to that the players that are interested to leave for a game that has decent localisation, more modern tech, apparently a faster approach to bugfixing and is still set in a fantasy world, and you get a potentially quite severe drain of experienced, longstanding players with cash in their pockets.
Last edited by Vandervahn; Apr 26 2012 at 02:23 PM.
This sort of "prediction" is made over *every* new game to come out. Yes, LoTRO will lose a few people, but other games will lose people who will come LoTRO. Some of those that jump to new games will come back. All in all, the claims of utter disaster because a new game is going into beta or launching unless Turbine DOES SOMETHING have failed to come to pass. What makes you think this time will be any different?
--W. H. Heydt
Old Used Programmer
Can you remember the gaming press getting this excited over SWToR? Sure there was some hype, but even a lot of the gaming press were slating it before release. Not so with GW2. This isn't 'just another' MMO.
I love getting excited about stuff, and it's even more exciting when the developers are excited about it like sapience was at pax.
It's not really a future teaser, but it's a nice teaser of the past. It got me excited.. especially with all the nay saying that happens to every mmo when a new release comes out.
Ah, the good old days of Lotro. Weren't they wonderful Actually Steefel got a lot of flak in his time, but at least he seemed genuinely passionate about the game, unlike the new Sheriffs. Shame when you have to look at the past instead of the future for hope
Originally Posted by djheydt
Mphffff. + rep.
Now, my grandson doesn't understand the meaning of "wait," or "later," or "when it's ready." But he's four.
How quaint.
Waited an hour at restaurant for your food? It's coming when it's ready Sir.
Workman not turned up on time. Don't worry. He's coming later.
Game you bought 4 weeks late arriving. No panic, it'll turn up when it's ready.
What a wonderful world
Last edited by RiceandPea; Apr 26 2012 at 02:52 PM.
There's a difference between an utter disaster, and a kick to an already declining game. I'm sure GW2 won't finish lotro off, more likely just give it a nasty kick while it's already down.
But why is this different?
Because Lotro is currently bugged to hell. Because Ettens is already on life support on many servers. Because Arena net have already an established record of providing excellent PvP. Because the press has had universal praise for GW2, unlike all the recent previous MMOs. Because it's unlikely that the final product will have numerous game affecting bugs as AN have proved they can roll out a stable game. Because GW2 needs no sub unlike the recent MMOs so if far more likely to affect those who play Lotro because they can play without a sub. Because Arenanet have a good rep in the gaming community for looking after their players. And most importantly, because it's Guild Wars 2
Lotro was never intended to be big on PVP orientated content, They've always said so...
So i really don't understand why people make such a claim on Lotro's PVP compared to other games PVP...
Lotro has no PVP :P Monster Play is a funny "Mini-Game" so to say to the MMO
Can you remember the gaming press getting this excited over SWToR? Sure there was some hype, but even a lot of the gaming press were slating it before release. Not so with GW2. This isn't 'just another' MMO.
Funny. People were saying very VERY similar things about TOR leading up to its launch and I recall seeing all sorts of threads about TOR was going to hurt (or kill) LOTRO and how it was going to 'revolutionize MMOs' and it wasn't 'just another MMO' and blah, blah, blah.
The hype for it was HUGE. I recall reading a few articles about and yes, the gaming press did seem that excited over TOR.
Funny. People were saying very VERY similar things about TOR leading up to its launch and I recall seeing all sorts of threads about TOR was going to hurt (or kill) LOTRO and how it was going to 'revolutionize MMOs' and it wasn't 'just another MMO' and blah, blah, blah.
The hype for it was HUGE. I recall reading a few articles about and yes, the gaming press did seem that excited over TOR.
Agreed. I also recall the hype for Rift before that, a number of posts on here decreed that it would be 'the end of LOTRO'. And from what I've gathered this happens every. Single. Time.
Now I'm sure GW2 will do well for itself. It may well carve out its place amongst the other main MMOs and gain a sizeable playerbase. But kill LOTRO? Topple WoW? Change the nature of MMOs forever? Nope, I don't believe that for one second.
Lotro was never intended to be big on PVP orientated content, They've always said so...
So i really don't understand why people make such a claim on Lotro's PVP compared to other games PVP...
Because there are some people for whom Pv[any kind of]P is the most important part of a game. And they're very vocal -- or "vocal" isn't the right word; they post a lot.
When I was young, people who smoked assumed *everybody* smoked. Even back then, they were a minority, but they didn't realize it. Now they're an even smaller minority, but they are extremely vocal/whateveryouwanttocallit about how no-smoking zones violate their civil rights.
In a similar way, the ones who say "If PvMP doesn't get [whatever it is they want] all the players will quit and go somewhere else" are really saying "If PvMP doesn't get [whatever], me and all my buddies will quit and go somewhere else." And they don't realize that this would not affect total player population very much.
Indeed, we might get a few more players in who hate the very idea of PvP (yes, even more than another minority of us who are already playing, do) and start playing.
Funny. People were saying very VERY similar things about TOR leading up to its launch and I recall seeing all sorts of threads about TOR was going to hurt (or kill) LOTRO and how it was going to 'revolutionize MMOs' and it wasn't 'just another MMO' and blah, blah, blah.
The hype for it was HUGE. I recall reading a few articles about and yes, the gaming press did seem that excited over TOR.
Well I'll respectfully disagree. I was originally going to buy it until I read the reviews in the gaming press before release.
Originally Posted by djheydt
"If PvMP doesn't get [whatever], me and all my buddies will quit and go somewhere else." And they don't realize that this would not affect total player population very much.
As someone wisely pointed out earlier ( Vandervahn ), many of those people who PvP are VIPs. Why haven't Turbine opened PvP to freeps for TP? Because they know that they would take a large hit to their VIP subs. Those are the people who will be leaving first.
Personally I don't care about PvP, it's been #### since Moria, and I never liked it much then. But I know many long term players who only stick around now for the PvP. It's easy to write GW2 off as purely a PvP game, but that's not the truth. It's just PvP hasn't been stuck on like a gimped leg like in Lotro. To think it's only the Lotro players who PvP who will be buying GW2 is very naive.
Last edited by RiceandPea; Apr 26 2012 at 04:08 PM.
...
so 6.2 can still be new Content on top of the Fix... don't exclude it just yet..
I didnt.
Originally Posted by DuroNL
Lotro was never intended to be big on PVP orientated content, They've always said so...
So i really don't understand why people make such a claim on Lotro's PVP compared to other games PVP...
Lotro has no PVP :P Monster Play is a funny "Mini-Game" so to say to the MMO
Originally Posted by RiceandPea
Shhh, if the PvP crowd hear you say that, you'll be swinging from a pole outside the prancing pony
Cutesy, but besides the point.
With Destiny Points gone, permanent unlocks from one month VIP and 1.5 years of TP farming useable for quest packs now, PvP IS the only big "system seller" left for recurring subscriptions. If people wander off for PvP, that IS a loss of revenue with nothing to make up for it.
Not to mention the "brain drain" as this will include many experienced people. And with no monthly subscription in GW, the barriers are lower to stay there jsut for novelty, even if it does not turn out to tbe the ultimate experience for the hopeful masses.
Last edited by Vandervahn; Apr 26 2012 at 04:09 PM.
Cutesy, but besides the point.
With Destiny Points gone, permanent unlocks from one month VIP and 1.5 years of TP farming useable for quest packs now, PvP IS the only big "system seller" left for recurring subscriptions. If people wander off for PvP, that IS a loss of revenue with nothing to make up for it.
Not to mention the "brain drain" as this will include many experienced people. And with no monthly subscription in GW, the barriers are lower to stay there jsut for novelty, even if it does not turn out to tbe the ultimate experience for the hopeful masses.
No, that is besides the point...
There is no focus on PVP and there never will be, people that want to play this game for PVP are choosing the wrong MMO... it is like comparing a football game to a Race game... *shrugs* both sports game, though an entirely different type...
If people would leave because of the PvE value of GW2 it would be an entire different discussion.
Funny. People were saying very VERY similar things about TOR leading up to its launch and I recall seeing all sorts of threads about TOR was going to hurt (or kill) LOTRO and how it was going to 'revolutionize MMOs' and it wasn't 'just another MMO' and blah, blah, blah.
The hype for it was HUGE. I recall reading a few articles about and yes, the gaming press did seem that excited over TOR.
Haven't spent a dime on LOTRO since SWTOR came out. Considering the previous year I spent around 300 Dollars on LOTRO it has been a big change. I consider my departure minuscule in the grand scheme of things though. A couple of my friends are in the same boat. Others will leave for GW2 or other games. I had almost zero incentive left to stay VIP and haven't had a reason to resub. RoR I'll sub for a month and play the new content. LOTRO has become a backup MMO to me, for many reasons.
U7 prediction - tier 9 relics (store only - for best) - no mention of LI revamp even though we're back at the t9 threshold.
This sort of "prediction" is made over *every* new game to come out. Yes, LoTRO will lose a few people, but other games will lose people who will come LoTRO. Some of those that jump to new games will come back. All in all, the claims of utter disaster because a new game is going into beta or launching unless Turbine DOES SOMETHING have failed to come to pass. What makes you think this time will be any different?
--W. H. Heydt
Old Used Programmer
youre reading too much into what he wrote and jumping to a conclusion. dude's only "prediction" was that turbine's marketing dept will do some kind of point-push.
the point was that their marketing dept is well aware of what their competition is up to. not the doom-and-gloom of the community. that point is very valid.
"I am always serious; I am never serious." -Me
"I make the most outrageous and exaggerated statements of any man to ever live, has ever lived, or that will ever live." -Me
As someone wisely pointed out earlier ( Vandervahn ), many of those people who PvP are VIPs. Why haven't Turbine opened PvP to freeps for TP? Because they know that they would take a large hit to their VIP subs. Those are the people who will be leaving first.
Wait a minute ... Vandervahn said "many of the people who PvP are VIPs," right? Isn't being VIP the only way, at present, that you can get a freep into PvMP? Please correct me if I'm wrong.
Now, "many of the people who PvP are VIPs" is not the same as "many VIPs PvP." There are other reasons for paying that monthly subscription, such as having access to all the new areas as soon as they open and not having to figure out WHICH of howevermany packages you have to buy with money and/or TPs to get the region or other possibilities you want. Is it still ten bucks a month? That's less than you'd pay for going to two movies per month.
It's easy to write GW2 off as purely a PvP game, but that's not the truth. It's just PvP hasn't been stuck on like a gimped leg like in Lotro.
Now, that is very true. PvMP was suddenly announced about six months before launch, to the distress of many of us in the beta forums. It *was* an add-on, added by I-don't-know-whom in the hopes of attracting a few more players. And that's what it attracted.
To think it's only the Lotro players who PvP who will be buying GW2 is very naive.
Let's try dividing the player base not by people who PvMP and people who don't, but by people who, every time a new game is announced, jump off and play it because it's new; and those who stick with one (or two or three) favorite games because they like it/them and there are only 24 hours in the day. Certainly some people, PvP or non-, will go off to whatever the new game is. And some of them will come back again once the newness wears off. This happens all the time. It's been happening for five years. I expect it to go on happening.
Let's try dividing the player base not by people who PvMP and people who don't, but by people who, every time a new game is announced, jump off and play it because it's new; and those who stick with one (or two or three) favorite games because they like it/them and there are only 24 hours in the day. Certainly some people, PvP or non-, will go off to whatever the new game is. And some of them will come back again once the newness wears off. This happens all the time. It's been happening for five years. I expect it to go on happening.
All the other MMOs up till now have followed the same formula, almost exactly. GW2 doesn't, infact they have gone out of their way to make sure it is very different, both from a grind and combat perspective. It may fall flat on its face, but so far everyone seems to love it. At least they have tried to be innovative, and from all the reviews, it seems to be a big hit with press and players. If it was a cookie cutter game like Rift, I'd agree with you. But GW2 has set out to rewrite the MMO rulebook. If they succeed, it could be a gamechanger. None of the previous MMOs have set out to be anything other than traditional MMOs, dressed up with different environments.
The social interaction is just one way GW2 is different, while many MMos encourage people to be selfish, GW2 encourages the opposite - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iXdcJDRPZuU
Last edited by RiceandPea; Apr 26 2012 at 05:43 PM.
You keep shilling for GW2. Why are you even bothering to post in the *LoTRO* forums if you think GW2 is so great? Why didn't you get yourself invited to their closed beta and spend your time there if it's so great?
(And, by the way, if it is as "innovative" as you say, some people will love and some will hate it. Being "innovative" isn't a panacea.)
That's as ridiculous as me saying to you, if Lotro is so great, why are you asking me questions about GW2 instead of playing the game if it's so good? As there don't seem to be any Lotro teasers about the place, we may as well have some fun. I'm simply replying to the questions you asked me about GW2. Maybe some people will hate it, certainly no-one in the press seems to do up till now.
Oh and I am in the closed beta because I pre-ordered, don't worry about that. Starts tomorrow
Last edited by RiceandPea; Apr 26 2012 at 06:38 PM.
Wait a minute ... Vandervahn said "many of the people who PvP are VIPs," right? Isn't being VIP the only way, at present, that you can get a freep into PvMP? Please correct me if I'm wrong.
I dont know where you read that I spoke of freepside only. The fact remains: in various ways, the value of a subscription has been eroded to the point where its not economically feasible to be a permanent subscriber UNLESS you want to freep-PvP. It doesnt matter if it is comparatively cheap when the return on investment is not right.
Alas, this topic is not about PvP; PvP is just the immediate symptom. The greater subtext is: what can we await from LotrO in the near future that makes me hold out IN the game, and possibly IN subscription. This is not only about PvP, or buggy instances, or the lack of sideshows. There are clear issues in the likes of clunky mechanics, obsolete content, character development, housing, VIP benefits, translations etc. that are simply insufficient to broken because nothing has been done about them - instead we got lootboxes.
So, if you look at it neither through the doom-and-gloom nor the rose-tinted glasses: The customer wants to make an informed decision about what to do in the near future. Now, it might be understandable that Turbine continues its "Trust us, this year will be great" schtick because it makes sense for THEM. But we´re pretty much sitting here and just waiting for breadcrumbs of information to fall from the table. In fact, we wouldnt know a single thing about Update7 if Fornost hadnt been closed, and some Orthanc fixes. I as a customer want to make informed decisions, and with little information from Turbine and a bad habit to release woefully unfinished systems lately, other options ARE attractive.
Last edited by Vandervahn; Apr 30 2012 at 06:43 PM.
I've tried GW and it did not appeal to me, it was too over the top in the graphics. Steroid ridden males and bikini warrior mages, yeah no thanks. Lotro has problems it needs to fix but I do love this game, I hope they will get the funding or whatever it is they need to make these issues smoother and not so focused on little money making schemes like keys and that other junk. I pay a sub, I would like to keep paying it until we reach the gates of Mordor. Please listen to us Turbine, we love this world, we just want to love it even more.
It was inevitable that people will view Guild Wars 2 as another MMO but one only has to read up on its design to realise it is nothing like any game out there. Here are some of the reasons I am going to play it.
Abandoning the questing paradigm - Quests are a good idea to a certain point but at the stage we're at now they lack meaning and importance. Killing 10 orcs outside Galtrev might be a quest objective but once you complete it, what does it do? What impact does it have? In the dynamic events in Guild Wars 2, clearing enemies near a pond would let villages gather water from the pond and you will see this direct impact from your action. In quests you are given text telling you a village is under attack but orcs are just standing around in the village. In dynamic events, orcs are actually attacking villagers and you act on what you see not on what you read. Your actions affect the world in a persistent way.
Co-operative play - Grouping is actually a big barrier a lot of the time. It is no fun waiting for players or the right classes to join in order to do an instance and for some instances it is almost impossible. You know there is a problem when people have to resort to player made channels to form groups, in fact if we didn't have globallff, people might have resorted to IRC. It is ridiculous that there is content that can't be done naturally, it is ridiculus that raids need scheduling on kin websites. These are all player solutions to in game problems and are unacceptable. Imagine if there was no auction house but someone makes a functioning and popular auction website for the game, is this acceptable? In GW2 teamwork is adhoc, we play in teams by acting as a team not by inviting people into the group. I can play with someone but not have to explicitly group with them and the dynamic events will always scale in difficulty to the number of people in it. No more waiting for a group to do content, you simply go there and participate. A polymorphic form of content that is neither solo nor group content but adjusts itself to accommodate for all.
Self-sufficient classes - However you look at it, in this game we need some for of tank, healing, support and damage. There are a few exceptions but in the majority of cases that is the structure. Jon Peters has stated he hates the trinity because it only creates dependencies among players and he is correct. With self-sufficient classes, you can tackle content even with 5 rangers. You wouldn't dream of doing Foundry with 6 champions. This also means you don't have to wait for that healer or tank to join in order to start doing stuff. Wait to play is NOT fun.
Waited an hour at restaurant for your food? It's coming when it's ready Sir.
Workman not turned up on time. Don't worry. He's coming later.
Game you bought 4 weeks late arriving. No panic, it'll turn up when it's ready.
There is a BIG difference between that and "we need to know the next update even though the last one was just a week or two ago! CODE FASTER! Stop sleeping and eating, and IMPROVE MY GAME!"
It's ridiculous. And it's very pandemic, in the age of "everyone learns about new games about five seconds before the developer thinks of them because of the Internet". The topic creator is asking for things that PROBABLY AREN'T EVEN THOUGHT OF YET. They went straight from 6.1 to working on the festivities.
Yeah, I hear GW2 is just GW1 with different skins, exactly the same game otherwise. I can't understand why everyone is so excited
Anyone who told you that hasn't been paying attention. The game's gone persistent-world now. No longer instanced (except, of course, in certain quests that will make instances - even LOTRO has those). The skill system is... extremely revamped; it's to the point where the different classes actually play differently, something that I wouldn't really say to any great extent about GW1 (much as I like that game).
Will it 'kill' LOTRO? Probably not. But it's very different from its own predecessor, and should not be judged by experience with the first game. Certain game sites were able to participate in the last closed beta, so you can find accounts of their experience, and even screens and videos. Judge GW2 based on GW2, not GW1.
(Yes, I admit I have prepurchased GW2, and will be spending the coming weekend engrossed in its beta.... although, I see no reason to leave LOTRO just because I'm going to play GW2. There's room enough for both.)
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Originally Posted by djheydt
I'm the gigalo with the most below.
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Actually Steefel got a lot of flak in his time, but at least he seemed genuinely passionate about the game, unlike the new Sheriffs. Shame when you have to look at the past instead of the future for hope 
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