Thread: Anyone tested Element of Surprise in Shadow Stance?

Originally Posted by stoffi

Higher crit rate = higher dps rate, so why not?

Well, it depends, if this is against a training dummy where it doesn't move and you're always behind it, then ya, you can look at the dps.

However, if this is a freep, they are more than likely moving around, coming in and out of your range (allowing you to get less hits off in the same time), not putting their backs towards you (again, less dps since you don't get the bonus), and other things. Each fight is different, you may be able to stay behind one freep the entire time, but not another. All of these differences give you different dps. It may be 1k in one fight, but only 200 in the next. DPS is not a reliable way to check your crit chance since it is variable.

None of those changes affect crit chance though. The freep has a certain set crit resist and you have a certain set crit chance. It doesn't matter if you get 5 attack off or 50, whether they're at the freep's back or not, your crit chance will always be approximately the same (probably about a 5% variance).

If you are using a plugin such as combat analysis, you can see this by comparing different fight's dps and crit chance meters.

Originally Posted by MaroonDragoon

It most certainly works.

And being disrespectful to people who actually have an 'inclination to learn' isn't really doing you any favours.

1) The other folks in this thread (even those who were off topic) have been way more helpful than you are being. They are at least relating their experiences with the trait or tests that they have run.

2) I was disrespectful to nobody. I responded that I had seen the initial response which was simply "Yes it works" when I had others say "No it doesn't". I had hoped that someone who knew how to use combat analyzing add-ons (as I don't know how) had done a test of the trait and was simply asking that if they had that they share their results so we could all have a definitive answer that wasn't anecdotal.

3) Thanks to the people who actually stayed on topic and who shared their test results or at least their experiences with the trait.

Here are the exact numbers of a test that I just ran against the Kelsen training dummy in grams:

With Element of Surprise slotted:
DPS: 851.1
Crits: 29.4%
Dev Crits: 2.2%
-----------------------------------
DPS: 739.3
Crits: 23.4%
Dev Crits: 2.5%

Without Element of Surprise slotted:
DPS: 866.9
Crits: 23%
Dev Crits: 4.3%
-----------------------------------
DPS: 837.9
Crits: 22.3%
Dev Crits: 1.1%

Ok, I change my mind.... it appears that if it does make a difference, it's only very small (aka ~5%). Idk if this was changed in a recent patch (it was definitely working right after U6) or something, but atm, I'd say that it's not working and it's not worth the slot....

Bear in mind though that this was against a training dummy so it might actually do something against a freep, I can't be certain.

For the love of Sauron can we get some accurate testing

We have Wargs posting a 30% REDUCTION in Crits/DPS with the trait slotted

If you consistently get those types of numbers I'd say that it had been working before and was stealth nerfed in one of the last two quick update Tuesdays after the freeps cried about it.

Possibly. I'm going to do some tests against freeps to see if I still get the same crit rates to make sure it wasn't something to do with my target being a training dummy. TBH, I wouldn't doubt that they nerfed it. They already nerfed the shadow wargs in some way (not 100% sure how, but they lowered our dps somehow) immediately after U6 and with the amount of qq from the freeps, a nerf was bound to happen...