This guy is an amateur. I can pull every mob in the Gold Token attack instances, or every mob in between bosses in Foundry tier 1 solo, tier 2 in groups (haven't tried t2 solo yet ^^ ). I've soloed a raid skirmish, and pulled every mob and first two bosses in Tham Mirdain at lvl 75. We are faaaaaaaaaar more OP than you think
He is also using the broken EoB that stacked above ten, and still doing under level instances, he needs to go back to Warden skool mmmk?
Also he used power pots O.o Amateur ^^
Last edited by Bels_illuminati; Apr 19 2012 at 06:21 PM.
Lieutenant Belegardo the Veteran, Reaver-Foe, Stalker-Foe, Rank 10 Warden
This guy is an amateur. I can pull every mob in the Gold Token attack instances, or every mob in between bosses in Foundry tier 1 solo, tier 2 in groups (haven't tried t2 solo yet ^^ ). I've soloed a raid skirmish, and pulled every mob and first two bosses in Tham Mirdain at lvl 75. We are faaaaaaaaaar more OP than you think
He is also using the broken EoB that stacked above ten, and still doing under level instances, he needs to go back to Warden skool mmmk?
I don't really care if he's a noob, i am just sickend of how OP wardens are and can pull that many mobs and not go below 99% morale or below 70% power.........thats just a demonstration of how OP they are, those might be tier 1 or tier mobs i dont really give a rats @ss but the fact stiill remains their OP, you might also say their tier 1 mobs, but the same thing happend in EM when the entire creep raid was attacking izangi -_______- he was just kyting everyone for a good 5-10m, roughly 10 creeps attacking him the entire fight, in the end when freeps wiped he was only one left and he still managed to survive a good 2-3m longer after the rest of creep raid came to attack him.
I don't really care if he's a noob, i am just sickend of how OP wardens are and can pull that many mobs and not go below 99% morale or below 70% power.........thats just a demonstration of how OP they are, those might be tier 1 or tier mobs i dont really give a rats @ss but the fact stiill remains their OP, you might also say their tier 1 mobs, but the same thing happend in EM when the entire creep raid was attacking izangi -_______- he was just kyting everyone for a good 5-10m, roughly 10 creeps attacking him the entire fight, in the end when freeps wiped he was only one left and he still managed to survive a good 2-3m longer after the rest of creep raid came to attack him.
NERF WARDENS PLS
Awww bless you couldn't kill him 10v1? ^^
Wardens are god-mode for 30 seconds then any decent warg can get them killed pretty easily. While they are going survival mode they're not really much threat anyway, only by tanking silly creeps (like on WTAB earlier when you all insisted on attacking me for ages while freeps finally woke up and charged) or groups of mobs do wardens pose a threat (and then only as cover for others).
And why do you care bout what we can do in PvE?
Personally I know we're OP atm, but then we're OP in a far less offensive way than some freep classes. We don't do massive damage, we require ability to actually be effective in PvP and in PvE strong tanks are good for everyone.
We should lose some of our epic survivability in dps traits and gear, but then I'm finding the current Warden hilarious to play as I can just feel the creeps QQing during the raid v warden fights.
Lieutenant Belegardo the Veteran, Reaver-Foe, Stalker-Foe, Rank 10 Warden
Well I can do it by myself Peli on tank in this instance.
But Peli is right wardens are way 2 op atm in moors not single class can kill them solo 1vs1 if they shield traited wardens self heales are way to big and should be nerfed to minimum
U can Bele disaagre coz u playing warden but its a fact that wardens are god mode if they want
Ther eshould be not single class in lotor who can solo for example tyrant or skirm raid its just showing how other classes are behind and u cant dissagre hee.
but then I'm finding the current Warden hilarious to play as I can just feel the creeps QQing during the raid v warden fights.
To be honest I think that ship has sailed, essentially unkillable freeps has been the norm for quite some time, wardens are just the latest in a long line.
Wardens might be hard to kill but, it also depends who those nine other creeps are... Skilled creeps can get a warden down. We wardens can survive for a long time, but our DPS is low if you are shield traited.
Firstly shield traits are actually balanced in the sense that if we go for those our dps is utterly, utterly horrible. Its not like minis or champs where they can go massive dps AND survivability, we make a choice. If you see a shield warden nub in the moors just avoid them completely, they can't hurt you or your raid (remember to be survivable in shield we have to spam survivable gambits, which means no damage, no interrupt spamming, no decent length bleeds, no decent length aoe fears etc etc etc).
Personally the issue with wardens for me right now if there is one is survivability in dps traits, which mainly comes from being able to slot one trait that gives +2 heals and stance dancing. I am happily tanking tyrants etc in dps traits and could probably solo them easily like this. Which leads on to the next point however:
Solo ability. If you create a tank which has far worse mitigations than (your arai) guardian then there has to be a compensatory factor. Our self heals have to be as they are in pve otherwise they aren't worth using (as we saw after RoI). The trouble also with a warden is that 99% of players that use them have sadly no idea what they're doing, especially while tanking. This has led to the current situation of OPness which I confess to and have been saying over and over again on the warden forums ever since U6.
However if you read the forums apparently most players still aren't OP, with the latest trend being players that have no idea how to hold aggro without a broken aggro gambit ^^. So now what, do we get buffed more making the few of us even more OP and frankly even more bored? I hope not.
Anyway for the moors we aren't actually much better than we were per RoI in dps traits IMO. It's just now we have a god mode for 30 secs skill which people notice and there are more new wardens rolling shield that creeps aren't used to dealing with. Arai in full tank mode is nigh on impossible to kill, plus he has an escape skill which wardens still don't, let's not forget that. At least both tanks make a choice of survivability or damage in pvp unlike some others (wargs, minis, chumps).
If a warden ever uses never surrender or DC or is traited shield in a spar just ignore him from now on, problem solved.
A quick look at what we be actually lost in dps pvp with U6 changes, just to show it s not all buffs and for those that don't know. Weve lost:
The ability to trait for 10% more javelin damage and key 15secs cool down reduction on jav skills.
The ability to self heal in dps stance, thus losing dps and time in order to heal now.
We lost our only hard hitting melee skill (WT took a big nerf) in favour of longer bleeds which are less efficient with audacity.
Our set bonuses to help boost this lack of upfront dps are still broken.
Our dps is actually now lower than it was preU6 on anything other than a boss with huge morale suitable for bleed stacking.
So basically our burst damage took a big hit, and our survivability in dps traits is more awkward than it was and we can no longer trait to buff jav skills as we used to. I actually preferred the pre RoI warden in pvp and find it far harder to get renown now.
Last edited by Bels_illuminati; Apr 20 2012 at 03:38 AM.
Lieutenant Belegardo the Veteran, Reaver-Foe, Stalker-Foe, Rank 10 Warden
Wardens might be hard to kill but, it also depends who those nine other creeps are... Skilled creeps can get a warden down. We wardens can survive for a long time, but our DPS is low if you are shield traited.
Other nine creeps? wow lol.......NO CLASS in the ENTIRE MOORS should need more than 1 or 2 creeps/freeps to take it down.......
Other nine creeps? wow lol.......NO CLASS in the ENTIRE MOORS should need more than 1 or 2 creeps/freeps to take it down.......
You we're talking about 10 creeps... A warden in god mode have lots of survivability but, what do you think it is doing except to survive? A 400 damage every 3 - 5 seconds? Wow you're so screwed.. Like Bele said, a warden in god mode (shield traited and spamming heals) is no threat at all, it only try's to survive. If you don't hit that shield-traited warden, that warden will be sad soon enough and swap to DPS or ragequit the game (problem solved).
Everytime I am on my creep (not playing on freep atm), I see like 10 creeps attacking Bele/Iza/Other wardens and while you all are doing that, I'm face palming myself everytime again and again.
Ask a creep (a decent one of course) to spar a spear-traited warden. You'll see how that ends up. the Fist-Spear-Shield line of the warden is the only good healing line while spear-traited. On a one versus one fight, it is useless as it needs more creeps in line to heal more. Of course a shield-traited warden in a one versus one is not killable but, it will take him/her ages to take you down. Ignore a shield-traited warden and fight the skilled ones.
Creeps are making theirselfs cry and make the god mode warden laugh. Its just like Bele said in his last post.
Like others have said. Just walk away if you ever encounter a shield warden :P He wont do you any harm And if you're solo, remember that a shield warden+1 freep = 1 freep. Get your kill, and walk away :P He doesn't have a shield wall
The "only" annoying thing about wardens is that they now have a few win buttons, DC and NS. I "expect" a warden to not use them in a 1v1, and will hips/sprint if they do :P (If they switch to shield.... walk away, and take your time )
Apart from stating the obvious and walking away from wardens, just the the fact that they can absoarb all damage possible and heal up and return no damage, doesnt mean they are harmless, just imagine if wardens were to use that on npc's, litterally pull all npc's in a keep to one corner and absoarb all damage possible and just keep them there, it would completely turn the tide of a battle each night when creeps get outnumbered........ i dont care if you think they are harmless, truth is their even more harmfull in shield traited. Wardens need to get hit with nerf bat out of the stadium.
Apart from stating the obvious and walking away from wardens, just the the fact that they can absoarb all damage possible and heal up and return no damage, doesnt mean they are harmless, just imagine if wardens were to use that on npc's, litterally pull all npc's in a keep to one corner and absoarb all damage possible and just keep them there, it would completely turn the tide of a battle each night when creeps get outnumbered........ i dont care if you think they are harmless, truth is their even more harmfull in shield traited. Wardens need to get hit with nerf bat out of the stadium.
Nerfing the Shield-Traited Warden will be back to the start of RoI again, it will make everyone wanting a guardian for their raids and Warden's will be the useless tank again.
I do have to say it is OP if you can pull all NPC's and survive but, only a few warden's would be able to pull a entire keep and survive it. Especially the trolls are our biggest enemy's with their stuns. The creeps also have a bonus if a Warden pulls a entire keep, they can easily kill that Warden and reset those NPC's making the NPC's running back to their old position where the freeps are and whipe out the raid.
Nerfing the Shield-Traited Warden will be back to the start of RoI again, it will make everyone wanting a guardian for their raids and Warden's will be the useless tank again.
No1 want wardens u guys have to face it.
No place in middleearth for ya
Sad truth it is.
From a tank`s(a real that is, guardian) perspective, I cannot figure out why they introduced Wardens.
They are a mockery of the Guardian. Like trolls are to ents.
Rule number 1 for tanks: We have a heavy shield
Rule number 2 for tanks: We have heavy armour
Whats wrong with the good old guardian that they had to make a Warden?
Whats wrong with the good old guardian that they had to make a Warden?
Nothing wrong with a GRD, far from it Ape. GRD's still rule! Just a pity Turbine never developed the class.
To be honest (and factual), GRD's never got any proper attention aimed to develop the class after SoA Book 12 Update (when they introduced the Overpower stance, Force Opening, Stagger, Shield Wall, Fray the Edge, Engage and Charge skill).
Maybe the Take Heart and Brutal Assault skills with MoM, but apart from that all we really got since then was just Skill Tooltip updates/corrections
Since the introduction of the Warden, GRD's development has been 0.
Last edited by Smartbean; Apr 20 2012 at 01:37 PM.
Nothing wrong with a GRD, far from it Ape. GRD's still rule! Just a pity Turbine never developed the class.
To be honest (and factual), GRD's never got any proper attention aimed to develop the class after SoA Book 12 Update (when they introduced the Overpower stance, Force Opening, Stagger, Shield Wall, Fray the Edge, Engage and Charge skill).
Maybe the Take Heart and Brutal Assault skills with MoM, but apart from that all we really got since then was just Skill Tooltip updates/corrections
Since the introduction of the Warden, GRD's development has been 0.
I know we rock. Love my guardian. I rock a bit more than you though
I think Overpower stance and all the other stances ruined lotro in a way. One-handed and shield is the way for the tank. Say no to stances!
It used to be each class had their role in the fs/raid. Now every class can switch roles with the many different stances.
Too many choices is not often the best way, just like too much information.
to be a warden and pulling a whole keep whould need some audacity armor, warden experience and a few pots.
when I play my warden there are things that's realy ruining my gambits...
-% attack duration.
power drains (Yes Wardens can restore it easy but this will result in more time to utilize power restoring gambit).
Disarm
Disarm + silence
Knock
Daze
Fear
And Wardens worst enemies is hard hitters.
So a warden that has pulled a whole keep and have a few creeps at him/her will go down pretty easy.
Though I can agree with this pulling a whole keep story is just idiotic... I remembered when I whined about reavers pulling Keeps and EC and rest of the creep raid whiped us.
I don't think wardens need a nerf because that would hurt their PvE play but change the mechanic how NPC's aggroes in EM.
and until then I think Wardens should stop pulling TA and running round and round and round...
Well if we are outnumbered like yesterday... that wouldn't be hard to stop (though few creeps showed up).
to be a warden and pulling a whole keep whould need some audacity armor, warden experience and a few pots.
when I play my warden there are things that's realy ruining my gambits...
-% attack duration.
power drains (Yes Wardens can restore it easy but this will result in more time to utilize power restoring gambit).
Disarm
Disarm + silence
Knock
Daze
Fear
And Wardens worst enemies is hard hitters.
So a warden that has pulled a whole keep and have a few creeps at him/her will go down pretty easy.
Though I can agree with this pulling a whole keep story is just idiotic... I remembered when I whined about reavers pulling Keeps and EC and rest of the creep raid whiped us.
I don't think wardens need a nerf because that would hurt their PvE play but change the mechanic how NPC's aggroes in EM.
and until then I think Wardens should stop pulling TA and running round and round and round...
Well if we are outnumbered like yesterday... that wouldn't be hard to stop (though few creeps showed up).
Yesterday there was a little sneaky Defiler annoying me 24/7 with his/her powerdrain ally. It was hard for me to keep it up but I did managed it with pots & DBD. Even the rest of the group ran out of power.
But ehh.. Ssssh, you are now telling every creep how to defeat a Warden..
Same with Defilers for me when I was on Burg; not a single Defiler was ever solo-ed by me.
Originally Posted by Pelious
Both curable.
What is the CD on a pot?
Warden pots out of Power Drain, hit him with a Silence, if needs be hit him with a Stun.
How long is he going to last holding aggro on a keep?
If those don't work try something else, rather than 10+ Creeps trying to DPS down a class that, Shield Traited, can't easily be DPS-ed down.
Not singling you out Pels, but the moment a class is changed and the old tactics no longer work people seem to find it easier to cry 'Nerf' than to figure out a way to deal with the changes. I'm not arguing that Wardens aren't OP in Ettens, never brought one in but from the stories I've heard since the patch it seems that the only tactic Creeps have for them is straight-out DPS; maybe that just ain't gonna work?
Only one is curable then we're screwed for the cd.
Be proactive and either ignore them altogether or get the CC in early before we build our HoTs.
You say you don't have the CC options but you're complaining about Wardens tanking creep raids... makes no sense unless it's a raid of WLs.
Basically stop QQing and play more, you might learn how to counter us. It really isnt difficult.
Lieutenant Belegardo the Veteran, Reaver-Foe, Stalker-Foe, Rank 10 Warden
Only one is curable then we're screwed for the cd.
Be proactive and either ignore them altogether or get the CC in early before we build our HoTs.
You say you don't have the CC options but you're complaining about Wardens tanking creep raids... makes no sense unless it's a raid of WLs.
Basically stop QQing and play more, you might learn how to counter us. It really isnt difficult.
I saw Izanagi earlier today fighting maybe 15 creeps including myself. His morale was at max pretty much the whole fight until something turned and he started dropping, lasting 1.5 minutes. I did 15k dmg to him alone in shadow, I'm guessing many of the others did the same. I stunned, silenced and debuffed as well. His morale just wouldn't drop from max, he had a bunch of heal buffs on him, filling out at least one row.
I question any creep who says he's beaten a warden solo when 15 creeps together used 1.5 minutes to kill him. That warden sure as hell wasn't izanagi.
Nerf. ^^
Leader of the Warg Supremacy Foundation. Retired since RoR came.
I saw Izanagi earlier today fighting maybe 15 creeps including myself. His morale was at max pretty much the whole fight until something turned and he started dropping, lasting 1.5 minutes. I did 15k dmg to him alone in shadow, I'm guessing many of the others did the same. I stunned, silenced and debuffed as well. His morale just wouldn't drop from max, he had a bunch of heal buffs on him, filling out at least one row.
I question any creep who says he's beaten a warden solo when 15 creeps together used 1.5 minutes to kill him. That warden sure as hell wasn't izanagi.
Nerf. ^^
Firstly the reason we can heal so much during those fights is due to leeching from creeps and NPCs. One on one those heals aren't viable. Although in full shield traits we are unkillable one v one, mind you we always were.
Second Iza was traited full tank with gear as well, which of course makes him harder to kill. In the same way a Guardian in full tank stuff is hard to kill.
From personal experience if I brand and then run in I am immortal for 1 min from the brand (even in DPS traits gear). I then pop DC which gives 90% mitigation. After that we're screwed as soon as a double silence or disarm etc takes place. Anyway I've had my fun with raid tanking, I'm back to focusing on getting a kill before I die now rather than just trolling the creeps.
In pvp terms there is one new reason to nerf Wardens which I would actually agree with, but I doubt anyone really notices.
Last edited by Bels_illuminati; Apr 21 2012 at 09:12 AM.
Lieutenant Belegardo the Veteran, Reaver-Foe, Stalker-Foe, Rank 10 Warden
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