Thread: Power

So almost all time in instances 3-6man I ran out of power really fast weither it's boss fight or trash pulls,yes I do keep glee on cd all time using subtitle stab but 20& is really low

So any advices how to keep power up

Thanks in advance

Check your local Auction House to see if they have any Lore-masters for sale.

Not to state the obvious, but does your gear include +ICPR? Since it's so easy to effectively "cap" agility now, there's plenty of room for +icpr and +fate.

What about your legendaries' relics? Also, although fate's ICPR suffers from diminishing returns heavily (square root), if you can get it without minimizing other things appreciably, it'll help. I don't typically need to eat ICPR food, but if there's a fight that benefits from it I certainly will (Fangorn's Edge comes to mind).

Do you have a Draigoch cloak yet? Glee I only use to compensate for crit hits, and subtle stab isn't in my rotation at all, unless I'm tanking.

The other thing, do your groups use FMs that include power return? In 3-mans we typically do GYB. Foundry we usually entertain ourselves with a straight of some type, but if particularly lazy, Chill the Bone, which all return plenty of power.

It's also handy to have the burg on blue, as can be done from range and offers a bit of a bonus to the juice.



"Sometimes survival comes down to not being hit. Actually, most times." -the chicken skill, Bob and Weave

Originally Posted by RJFerret

Not to state the obvious, but does your gear include +ICPR? Since it's so easy to effectively "cap" agility now, there's plenty of room for +icpr and +fate.

What about your legendaries' relics? Also, although fate's ICPR suffers from diminishing returns heavily (square root), if you can get it without minimizing other things appreciably, it'll help. I don't typically need to eat ICPR food, but if there's a fight that benefits from it I certainly will (Fangorn's Edge comes to mind).

Do you have a Draigoch cloak yet? Glee I only use to compensate for crit hits, and subtle stab isn't in my rotation at all, unless I'm tanking.

The other thing, do your groups use FMs that include power return? In 3-mans we typically do GYB. Foundry we usually entertain ourselves with a straight of some type, but if particularly lazy, Chill the Bone, which all return plenty of power.

It's also handy to have the burg on blue, as can be done from range and offers a bit of a bonus to the juice.



"Sometimes survival comes down to not being hit. Actually, most times." -the chicken skill, Bob and Weave

No not high icpr I got only 600 and use I do use drag cloak not really high in fate yea we cj for pwr but it run out really fast

My Burglar has similar problems with power. the last Draigoch run that my kin did, I spammed Subtle Stab and lucked out with almost 90% of my Mischievous Glee's also giving power yet while going dps crazy on the body, especially after the 12th FM where I was spamming every skill I had trying to kill the body I would run out of power. My burg has decent gear, and my ICPR is just over 1k, compared to my OCPR of just 1.5k.

Until I find a more effective method of managing my power, once I run out all I do is auto-attack, and do whatever I can to help the raid group do more damage (reveal weakness,Counter-defense, small snag)

PS; has much as it may bruise the ego (i know it bruised mine), asking a HoH captain to make you their song-brother for a bit can help boost your power. Just be sure that by having the captain switch song-brothers, the healer that it usually is on doesn't start reaching critically low levels of power.

captain + loremaster + pots = success

seriously, we really have huge power issues, but since the loremasters are bored most of the time, give them something to do.
I'm not a big fan of too much icpr since it will always be not enough and you'll always lose damage/morale in trade for it which is just not worth it imo.
with pots on cooldown (if there's no captain or there are no adds dieing) and maybe a glee proc now or then you'll be ok in normal instances. In raids you'll have a loremaster and since burgs and captains are pretty much the only ones that need constantly power (for most fights) that shouldn't be too big of a problem.

Just to speak as an LM, burgs are typically low on the list in terms of who should receive power so I would advise against relying on them for your power supply. Healers and tanks are first, then captains, then everyone else. It is also very expensive (in terms of power) for LMs to use "share the power" as well, so it is not something that can be thrown around constantly (and is why LMs have to prioritize who receives power and save it for those classes).

Originally Posted by ScionofAngmar

Just to speak as an LM, burgs are typically low on the list in terms of who should receive power so I would advise against relying on them for your power supply. Healers and tanks are first, then captains, then everyone else. It is also very expensive (in terms of power) for LMs to use "share the power" as well, so it is not something that can be thrown around constantly (and is why LMs have to prioritize who receives power and save it for those classes).

So... what's your price? This is when we have to bribe you and convince you that the more power you give us, the less time we have to stand around letting the tank's face get beaten in by an overly grown beast of a boss and more time to stare at shiny loot!

I know captains can blow through power since I play one as well, but I didn't think minnie/rk healers would blow through whole power supply with their stacked power pools in this update.

Well I rarely need power from external sources, unless it's a long one that I forget to eat on. Just did Saruman, without a LM, without cappy power, without running out. (RKs had the most problems, DPS RK was lowest most the time.)

My ICPR is typically 1284. (Phys Mastery about 85% for those wondering. It was probably a bit lower in Saruman, as I traded out agil pieces for vit pieces to have 8500 morale w/cappy buffs. Yay for being able to survive a couple polarity hits!)

If you are asking a LM or cappy for power, I'd suggest your build is broken, and why would you want to lower your group's DPS by interrupting your LM? Your LM should be DPSing and so should you, instead of you waiting for him to draw power/waste time. Your cappy should be doing his job for others, rather than your burg being a drain on the group IMO.

Before RoI, you could reasonably argue burgs couldn't be power efficient, but when they made fate our second most important stat (along with vitality), they really resolved that situation for us! :-) Every month there used to be a new thread "fix our power please", well they DID! I've said it before in the class feedback thread, I'll say it again here, "thank you devs".

My ICPR used to be higher, until I got the armour set with -10% mêlée skill power cost, then I traded a couple ICPR pieces for +phys mastery (and agil) pieces.

(Yeah on CJ power not lasting long, I wish there was one with power over time like green FMs, instead of just a one shot power return.)

It also made me laugh that every other item I'd burgle in Dunland for a while was a power pot. Someone's looking out for us. ;-)



"Sometimes survival comes down to not being hit. Actually, most times." -the chicken skill, Bob and Weave

One good place to pick up some ICPR is your relics. They all come in versions with ~110-120 ICPR. Six of those will make a noticeable difference. You can also pick up crafted bracers with ~100 ICPR, if you prefer that instead. To get the ICPR relics you may have to give up your morale relics. It's all about finding the right balance. I'm sitting at ~1600 ICPR without food, ~2000 with food active. With power pots and Mischievious Delight I can pretty much keep on going without running out of power.

well, a good loremaster will do less than 10k damage a bossfight (Gust of Wind), the rest of the time he's debuffing, cc-ing, giving the raid stun immunity (for some fights) and sharing power.
A tank never ever needs power, since they can get it back so easily and the little supply from captains inspire is enough.
healers wont need much most of the time since they have ways to restore it and a huge powerpool. A dps runekeeper is a joke since he doesnt do any damage and still has over 8k power after half an hour infight.
So whats left are pretty much captains and damagedealers. Champs have insane icpr, hunters dont burn through their power as fast as burgs, so they will be the 2nd prioraty for the most times, at least we handle it that way in our raid and it worked out fairly well so far.
This allows the burgs to go all out all the time, doing ~2000-2500 dps constantly (sometimes more, depending on the encounter) which wouldnt be possible with focusing more on icpr without losing too much vitality/morale for the aoe damage in orthanc t2.

The more damage you have, the more power captains can provide you.
In a Saruman 6man for example our loremaster had to give me ~30k power in the last 3 phases (where you stay infight).
In a 12man afterwards he didnt need to give me power at all, since every add died in less than 30 seconds and the ~700 power from rallying call together with the powerhot from inspire are usually enough to keep you supplied. You just need the damage for it.
Every other fight except Saruman is just too short to run into power problems (lm has to share you power 2-3 times max) and most of the other classes wont need any since their power pool is big enough.

Overall, if you wanna get the best raiddps, supply the burgs :P

I used to build the burg on icpr before the roi update, since everything else was unnessesary, but now you're just losing either too much damage or too much morale for the current raids, so i changed my setup.

PS: atm i have ~2300 agi unbuffed and ~700 icpr without food, works for me, thank god for the moors pots

Originally Posted by Netron

So almost all time in instances 3-6man I ran out of power really fast weither it's boss fight or trash pulls,yes I do keep glee on cd all time using subtitle stab but 20& is really low

So any advices how to keep power up

Thanks in advance

Originally Posted by Netron

No not high icpr I got only 600 and use I do use drag cloak not really high in fate yea we cj for pwr but it run out really fast

600 ICPR is extremely low. You want to be in the 1.4k range.

For 3/6-man and even some raids, CJs are about your only reliable self-help power returns.

MD is good for morale return, but you should not be spamming it for power if you do not need the morale. The power return part of it is unreliable and luck-based, and you use up power for both trick and MD for nothing in return when it doesn't proc.

Originally Posted by ScionofAngmar

Just to speak as an LM, burgs are typically low on the list in terms of who should receive power so I would advise against relying on them for your power supply. Healers and tanks are first, then captains, then everyone else. It is also very expensive (in terms of power) for LMs to use "share the power" as well, so it is not something that can be thrown around constantly (and is why LMs have to prioritize who receives power and save it for those classes).

Just to speak as an LM, if you aren't restoring power to whoever needs it, regardless of class, you should probably reconsider your priorities.

Captains are awesome for fellowship power maintainance with their brother skills. Wardens are self-sufficient with the restrictions on their power gambit removed. Minstrels are typically self-sufficient with their power return coda, except in extremely tight healing situations when they can't afford to time to re-tier ballads. Guardians are usually low maintainance and don't need much help at all except in unique situations.

These are your "healers and tanks are first, then captains", which doesn't leave many classes that need help.

There are a few classes that can maintain a zero-sum game with power consumption, but the burglar is not one of them. At least, not without CJs. Where other classes have received revisions to their power management utilities in recent updates, burglars and hunters have stayed the same, and they - along with healer RKs now that ZC nerfed PtH in U6 - need those power shots in long fights.

In regards to LM's should be dpsing, that's not true at all. I know this is off the path of this thread but the LM skill rotation for any fight should ALWAYS start with debuffs, then a DoT, debuffs the buff our damage, power management, then dps until our debuffs need reapplied/power management. For LM dps to really spike, it takes time to set up our sticky tar/warding circles which usually comes after the debuffs to protect the fellowship. In this time, I know that my burglar can easily run out of power if I don't plan out my rotation carefully. I won't disagree that the burglar class isn't capable of power self management, I've had multiple runs where the burglar asked me afterwards if I shared power with them while I am on my LM and in all honestly usually it was no, but it does take some forethought as to which stat you want to trade out to manage your power.

Back to the thread discussion, one method to ease sorrows is the trait Overwhelming Odds. This buffs the burglar depending on the FM that was completed. So let's say in a Foundry run, the leader says some along the lines of "lets try something interesting" and throws up a 6-length straight, upon completing that FM you'll have #1 reduced power costs, #2 improved MG healing (don't know if this carries over to MD healing), #3 your melee damage is improved by 10% so you can kill the mob faster and thus give a chance to recoup, and lastly, if all else fails, your CA and WPS will have almost/if not more than DOUBLED bleed durations. So spamming CA/WPS and Sutble Stab can let you still do some damage, all awhile trying to restore your power. I use this trait in Draigoch specifically for the added bleeds and melee damage after the FMs.

Originally Posted by MrJaZn

So... what's your price? .

To answer this question, on my LM which is geared fairly decently, the skill cost is right around 900, while giving at max about 1200-1300. This is with a 40% outgoing healing+the Healer trait.

Usually, if I give power to a burg, their power pool is topped off, which is usefull, but (situationally) if preceded by sharing with a mini/rk which takes 2 or 3 skill uses, my LM is now out of power. Also note that the 2 ways LM's get power are from Flanks! (which require us to get into melee fray, and give up a self heal) and from our power sap (which currently steals just enough power to be instantly used the first sharing).

Originally Posted by Tamiya

600 ICPR is extremely low. You want to be in the 1.4k range.

For 3/6-man and even some raids, CJs are about your only reliable self-help power returns.

MD is good for morale return, but you should not be spamming it for power if you do not need the morale. The power return part of it is unreliable and luck-based, and you use up power for both trick and MD for nothing in return when it doesn't proc.
.

Well not spamming it all the whole fight I do when I ran out of pwr trick MD till I get pwr,but yeah I guess need high icpr

Thanks