Thread: Vanguard

Clearly a rating typically above 14-1500 is indicative of bravado in spades, Hm?

Originally Posted by CodeofMisconduct

I laugh at every joke I make, funny or not... figured that someone who knew me before many others on this server would remember how much of a laugh-junkie I am.

I know, that's the reason (well that and scoring me a kill on leon to rank to 8 way back when) that you'll always be my favorite champ. But that's also why lame stuff bothers me so much when it's done by people like you or meraithe, who I respect quite a bit.

I mean, if it was some random freep... whatever. But you guys are top notch players and genuinely cool people. You're better than that.

Originally Posted by Lookslegit

Clearly a rating typically above 14-1500 is indicative of bravado in spades, Hm?

4 hours up on CM like today will typically put me into the 1500-1600 range. Even when you die every 3rd fight up there, your rating tends to get into that range by the nature of the fighting (the rating of your opponents, etc).

Running with smeg in aussie time usually prunes me back down to 1200ish.

Running with BAOS had me up to 1800 over the weekend...

Glad to see these threads still exist.

@FF - I liked that name, and knowing the story makes it cooler.

Originally Posted by Lookslegit

Clearly a rating typically above 14-1500 is indicative of bravado in spades, Hm?

I refer to a similar line of thought when I base-jump above and into the Hoardale.

Originally Posted by CodeofMisconduct

@ Krista, it brings a smile to my pale girlish face that you never liked our old name. We subsist off of your misdirected QQ.

It kept me up at night man.

Originally Posted by PurebloodWorg

Spoiler: In a video game, leech on to some real ones

Originally Posted by CodeofMisconduct

I laugh at every joke I make, funny or not... figured that someone who knew me before many others on this server would remember how much of a laugh-junkie I am.

If there is hidden meaning here, I salute you. If there is not, carry on.

Originally Posted by Sezneg

But that's also why lame stuff bothers me so much when it's done by people like you or meraithe, who I respect quite a bit.

I don't find my compadres ones to "jump" at an opportunity without weighing all the risks and rewards prior to deciding.

Originally Posted by Sezneg

But you guys are top notch players and genuinely cool people.

Its just gear that makes us good and breasts that make us likeable.

Originally Posted by Odin_of_Freyr

I don't find my compadres ones to "jump" at an opportunity without weighing all the risks and rewards prior to deciding.

You should put yourselves into the shoes of a low to mid rank creep, who's died probably 4-5 times attempting to bring down a small fellowship sized Vangard group... finally has them in a position to maybe make 40 inf and some comms, only to have them all jump off a cliff at the last second. It is hugely disrespectful to the low ranked players in this environment to play point denial when they're basically forced to suicide into your groups in large numbers to make any sort of advancement out of pvp. They're at a huge disadvantage against average freeps, let alone an extremely well geared kin group used to playing as a team. It's not asking a lot of you to respect that they're willing to throw themselves at you and fill your yellow bar by returning the favor when they DO finally start to get kills, rather than completely denying them any points so that maybe you personally get 12 more points from the idiot who jumps after you.

Originally Posted by Odin_of_Freyr

If there is hidden meaning here, I salute you. If there is not, carry on.

This new warg to our server, back in book 6 moria, once asked me about freepside kinships for raiding/pvp since he wanted to transfer his champion over... I told him that the top notch group to try to join was FF. I'll let you guess who the warg was ;p

Originally Posted by Odin_of_Freyr

Its just gear that makes us good and breasts that make us likeable.

I giggled.

They need to fence off that area or give half the creep classes in-combat sprint abilities like freeps so they get a taste of their medicine.

Look at what Cliffdefense started..

Originally Posted by Sezneg

You should put yourselves into the shoes of a low to mid rank creep, who's died probably 4-5 times attempting to bring down a small fellowship sized Vangard group... finally has them in a position to maybe make 40 inf and some comms, only to have them all jump off a cliff at the last second.

Been there. I'm not foolish enough to step foot in a blender. If these lowbies are, that seems like their problem, not mine. If they want to jump first, that would solve their problem. They could deny me their renown while harvesting mine.

Originally Posted by Sezneg

It is hugely disrespectful to the low ranked players in this environment to play point denial when they're basically forced to suicide into your groups in large numbers to make any sort of advancement out of pvp. They're at a huge disadvantage against average freeps, let alone an extremely well geared kin group used to playing as a team.

Why should I respect those who aimlessly run into a brick wall? It doesn't sound deserving of respect to me.

Originally Posted by Sezneg

It's not asking a lot of you to respect that they're willing to throw themselves at you...

I would respect them more if they played tactfully and first respected themselves. Sometimes denying your enemy a kill is a victory in itself. Perhaps not always, but you're a vet. You know that.

A perfect defense for Cliffdefense and his followers, don't follow unless you know you can survive the fall.

Originally Posted by Odin_of_Freyr

Been there. I'm not foolish enough to step foot in a blender. If these lowbies are, that seems like their problem, not mine. If they want to jump first, that would solve their problem. They could deny me their renown while harvesting mine. Why should I respect those who aimlessly run into a brick wall? It doesn't sound deserving of respect to me.

Because every single one of those players, at the other end of of their network connection is in fact a person. That, by itself, should be enough to garner some form of respect. Even from you.

Beyond that, they were not simply throwing themselves into a brick wall. They were dying... 9k wargs with no audacity are going to die in droves regardless of tactics/skill. They were, however, actually fighting in a decently coordinated fashion. That's the reason the group "had to" jump in the first place.

Perhaps you personally would avoid a vanguard group on a low ranked creep entirely. I say this marks you as a rank coward, and I would much rather keep company with people who are willing to attempt to challenge a more powerful group than avoid it entirely (you simply would not last a single night creepside in aussie time with your sort of attitude).

Originally Posted by Odin_of_Freyr

I would respect them more if they played tactfully and first respected themselves. Sometimes denying your enemy a kill is a victory in itself. Perhaps not always, but you're a vet. You know that.

Then the result will be, as I've already told meraithe, raid curb-stomping of your kin groups.

That's what happened after the cliff jump; anywhere the group showed its face for the next hour and a half they were rolled by a coordinated group of 18 with sauron only knows how many tag-alongs. I think meraithe was dying before reaching 3 attunement half the time from the number of shadow stance wargs clawing her.

Is that fun for anyone? I doubt it. I much more enjoy engaging you guys with closer to equal numbers. But it's damned hard to justify that when the reward for people toughing out a fight with with more realistic numbers is kill denial because "it's a form of victory".

Originally Posted by Sezneg

Because every single one of those players, at the other end of of their network connection is in fact a person. That, by itself, should be enough to garner some form of respect.

I think you are confusing respect with disrespect. Because they are a person, based on a moral argument, I should not disrespect them. I get that point. And, I would never disrespect them. The CoC is in place for such crude behavior. However, I would argue that respect is earned, regardless of whether its virtual respect in a video game or pertaining to real life. If I overlooked something they did to earn my respect then, I'm all ears.

Originally Posted by Sezneg

Beyond that, they were not simply throwing themselves into a brick wall. They were dying... 9k wargs with no audacity are going to die in droves regardless of tactics/skill. They were, however, actually fighting in a decently coordinated fashion.

If they were dying in droves, consider your point well made. They were coordinating, just in a highly unsuccessful manner. I stand corrected.

Originally Posted by Sezneg

Perhaps you personally would avoid a vanguard group on a low ranked creep entirely. I say this marks you as a rank coward

I'm not sure if there is a difference between rank coward and coward, but either way, yea, you're right. It would seem cowardly if everyone else was just pushing. I'd rather be the smart coward than the fallen braveheart. At least I could respect myself for not getting farmed. Trust me, despite what alot of people think, charging berserker-style into a melee is not the only tactic available.

Originally Posted by Sezneg

I much more enjoy engaging you guys with closer to equal numbers. But it's damned hard to justify that when the reward for people toughing out a fight with with more realistic numbers is kill denial because "it's a form of victory".

We are in agreement. We like closer to equal numbers too.


If you believe a +infamy tick over your head is the only path to "victory", then we are at an impasse. Without question, my Moors highlights and "victories" come when two or three of us fight 2-5 creeps only to see you and the zerg called in on us. When that many people disregard all else, and assemble to come after a small few, we can only smile, phantom internet hi-five like the nerds we are, and rinse/repeat.

Originally Posted by Odin_of_Freyr

I think you are confusing respect with disrespect. Because they are a person, based on a moral argument, I should not disrespect them. I get that point. And, I would never disrespect them. The CoC is in place for such crude behavior. However, I would argue that respect is earned, regardless of whether its virtual respect in a video game or pertaining to real life. If I overlooked something they did to earn my respect then, I'm all ears.

Inability to confer a base level of respect upon your opponents for the very action of logging in, taking the risk of failure and serving as your opponent reflects very poorly on you.

Originally Posted by Odin_of_Freyr

If they were dying in droves, consider your point well made. They were coordinating, just in a highly unsuccessful manner. I stand corrected.

Were they unsuccessful, your kinmates would have had no reason to jump. They were wiping, as in the creeps were in fact being successful. At a high cost, but perhaps if you actually fought a geared experienced group of freeps as a low rank/low audacity creep you'd understand that dying is part of the game.

Originally Posted by Odin_of_Freyr

I'm not sure if there is a difference between rank coward and coward, but either way, yea, you're right. It would seem cowardly if everyone else was just pushing. I'd rather be the smart coward than the fallen braveheart. At least I could respect myself for not getting farmed. Trust me, despite what alot of people think, charging berserker-style into a melee is not the only tactic available.

Only a fool would confuse choosing to engage in a fight with charging in beserker style, they are two very different actions.

Your choice would be not to engage at all, because when you weigh the fun of the fight and the chance of victory versus your concern with your own death in a game that has LITERALLY zero functional death penalty you are more concerned with the victory of "not dying", than with the victory of overcoming the odds and the enjoyment of a fight. This makes you extremely untrustworthy in a fight and frankly not someone I'd want to fight alongside.

I imagine you will find things very difficult in the future should your kinmates move on to a game that doesn't pit geared top of the line players vs extremely weak opposition who don't even have their entire skill set. Likely you'll simply stick to pve in guildwars 2, or continue playing here even after everyone else leaves.

Originally Posted by Odin_of_Freyr

We are in agreement. We like closer to equal numbers too.

And yet, when given this sort of enjoyable fight your kinmates choose point denial. If you enjoy a fun fight and wish it to remain enjoyable, respect your opposition enough to keep it that way.

Originally Posted by Odin_of_Freyr

If you believe a +infamy tick over your head is the only path to "victory", then we are at an impasse. Without question, my Moors highlights and "victories" come when two or three of us fight 2-5 creeps only to see you and the zerg called in on us. When that many people disregard all else, and assemble to come after a small few, we can only smile, phantom internet hi-five like the nerds we are, and rinse/repeat.

Ludicrous for you to claim anything like that. You personally are known to only show up without a large group when you are headed to CM covered in DP perks and consumable buffs. I'll leave it for another to field a screenshot. You have no credibility in this regard.

If you all think that denying kills is a victory, you should just do everyone in this forum a favor and declare absolute victory by no longer coming to the moors at all.

Following those fools to the cliffs is as pointless as fighting Kio

Waste of time

If you ain't ranking greenies, you're being disrepectful. You heard it here first.

God forbid making raid babies work a little and show a miniscule amount of skill to get their points.

All this talk about risking death from people who run in raids of 20+ while the opposition has the ON buff is quite impressive. "Despite attacking you at 20 to 1 odds and not being good enough to kill you immediately, I feel that you should give me your points without forcing me to risk an incredibly easy jump off a cliff - what if I die?"

Originally Posted by Kiddyfence

God forbid making raid babies work a little and show a miniscule amount of skill to get their points.

All this talk about risking death from people who run in raids of 20+ while the opposition has the ON buff is quite impressive. "Despite attacking you at 20 to 1 odds and not being good enough to kill you immediately, I feel that you should give me your points without forcing me to risk an incredibly easy jump off a cliff - what if I die?"

Except in this case it was 5 vs 8, mostly low to middling ranks (I was certainly the highest ranked creep there). The creeps DID in fact earn their points. They managed to coordinate and work through Rhuell and meraithe's collection of cooldowns and finally started to get kills. Meraithe died and was immediately brought back up, a lowbie reaver hit a PRO-timed disarm to prevent her from immediately getting back to high healing attunement and the vanguard response at that point was to jump the cliff.

I really don't care if a small group or solo cliff jumps to avoid a raid zerg. That's no biggie.

But if you claim want a smaller more interesting fight, and you get it... and THEN you cliff jump? Lame. You jumping a cliff to avoid 6+ chasing you is very different from say, Iolex jumping off the same cliff to avoid me solo. Confusing these sorts of situations is a weaksauce argument.

Imagine if the entire point (stay with me) was to generate forum tears? Boy you'd look silly then.

Originally Posted by Sezneg

They were wiping, as in the creeps were in fact being successful.

then why so mad?

Originally Posted by Sezneg

Your choice would be not to engage at all, because when you weigh the fun of the fight and the chance of victory versus your concern with your own death in a game that has LITERALLY zero functional death penalty you are more concerned with the victory of "not dying", than with the victory of overcoming the odds and the enjoyment of a fight. This makes you extremely untrustworthy in a fight and frankly not someone I'd want to fight alongside.

I actually hate dying because I miss out on KBs. rofl... srsly... I will retreat in the middle of big fights so i don't get 20 kills with no KBs even if it means I lose out on 500 renown or whatever.

Originally Posted by Sezneg

I imagine you will find things very difficult in the future should your kinmates move on to a game that doesn't pit geared top of the line players vs extremely weak opposition who don't even have their entire skill set.

why so mad lol? I don't want easy, I want competition.

Originally Posted by Sezneg

And yet, when given this sort of enjoyable fight your kinmates choose point denial.

You're right we should just roll over and die. Free points for all.

Originally Posted by Sezneg

You personally are known to only show up without a large group when you are headed to CM covered in DP perks and consumable buffs. I'll leave it for another to field a screenshot. You have no credibility in this regard.

for srs? again, you want me to try less hard? DP perks? no, I have alot of clickies. I do my best to be the best I can. If you want me to not use resources that I have at my disposal, then that's fine. As for only showing up in large groups. I'm confused there. I really dislike big groups. I rarely will group with more than 2 or 3 unless its a kin night.


Maybe we just seem bigger than we are?


Glad to know our small groups still feel like this to you:

Originally Posted by Sezneg

Except in this case it was 5 vs 8, mostly low to middling ranks (I was certainly the highest ranked creep there). The creeps DID in fact earn their points.

There were only 4 of us. Myself, Mer, Blae, and Tae. The fight started at the rez. It was our group of 4 vs. 5-6 creeps, and yes, one or two were lowbies. Once I saw the second group show up I called for us to move up to the cliff. During the fight on top of the cliff there were at least 10 creeps. And no, you were not the only high ranked creep. You clearly forgot about Sniz, and Worgnot. I also counted 4 WL's whose ranks I don't remember. But there were several banners down the entire fight so either they purchased skills making them the equivalent to a ranked creep or they were ranked. Grizlark might be able to clear up the numbers issue. I remember him watching the fight from the sidelines and then joining in towards the end.

The deciding factor for me to jump was a collection of the creeps running away as soon as they were targeted (5 healers, lol) and more creeps coming to help, as I'm sure we were called out. We only managed 8-10 creep kills, which yes is a lot, but considering how OP freeps are it was an average fight. You act like we curb stomped you, which is not the case at all, both Blae and Mer died in that fight and were rezzed, we all burned every single CD we had just to stay alive. And had you not called us out so more creeps came I would have stayed to die, I give credit where credit is due, but running away/calling in reinforcements to a fight that you were definitely going to win in the long run is what did it for me.

Next time you're in that situation and feel you and your fellow creeps deserve infamy, all you have to do is jump with us.

~Rhuell

Originally Posted by Commish

They need to fence off that area or give half the creep classes in-combat sprint abilities like freeps so they get a taste of their medicine.

Look at what Cliffdefense started..

Good old Illy has been cliff jumping wayyyy longer.

http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.p...Creeps-zerg-TR

Originally Posted by Rhuell17

There were only 4 of us. Myself, Mer, Blae, and Tae. The fight started at the rez. It was our group of 4 vs. 5-6 creeps, and yes, one or two were lowbies. Once I saw the second group show up I called for us to move up to the cliff. During the fight on top of the cliff there were at least 10 creeps. And no, you were not the only high ranked creep. You clearly forgot about Sniz, and Worgnot. I also counted 4 WL's whose ranks I don't remember. But there were several banners down the entire fight so either they purchased skills making them the equivalent to a ranked creep or they were ranked. Grizlark might be able to clear up the numbers issue. I remember him watching the fight from the sidelines and then joining in towards the end.

The deciding factor for me to jump was a collection of the creeps running away as soon as they were targeted (5 healers, lol) and more creeps coming to help, as I'm sure we were called out. We only managed 8-10 creep kills, which yes is a lot, but considering how OP freeps are it was an average fight. You act like we curb stomped you, which is not the case at all, both Blae and Mer died in that fight and were rezzed, we all burned every single CD we had just to stay alive. And had you not called us out so more creeps came I would have stayed to die, I give credit where credit is due, but running away/calling in reinforcements to a fight that you were definitely going to win in the long run is what did it for me.

Next time you're in that situation and feel you and your fellow creeps deserve infamy, all you have to do is jump with us.

~Rhuell

I never ran away, and I certainly didn't call in any reinforcements. As you said, we were holding our own. I certainly don't remember a second group running in, merely our own dead returning from the res.

Banner is only rank 3, so most WLs are going to have that (rank 5 to place in combat, but most of those WL were running back from the res when they placed it).

Perhaps the 5th I remember being there was an ungrouped we picked off before you all ran to the cliff.

On an unrelated note, that was a pretty nice move on CM when you doubled back to break catch-prey range. Sad spider face was made at that point.

I personally don't condone "cliff jumping" and don't look to practice it myself, I admit I was the first to slide off but it was by a mistake. I had every intention of staying and healing myself until I got CCed enough to die as I normally do, but in re-positioning myself I hit a slope and fell. It happens.

That said, "cliff jumping" is not an exploit or a "ban-able" offense, it's quite literally something a person does to annoy the other party and obviously it works out well. So I don't mind that people do it, I just don't personally care for it. To me it's just like when people run to the one shots to make an obvious outcome happen much quicker, as you can see the kin group (with friends) outnumbers the creep raid so the creeps did what they had to do. Crying about it won't do anything but make people wish to grief you more.

As I am one who likes to add screenshots to my pvp collection, I did take a few from the day that this 'outrageous and rage inducing' event occurred. Looking at time stamps, it seems that this one was a screenshot of the group we were fighting originally, before we were pushed up the hill and towards the cliff. If you can't count the number of creeps in here, (you originally stated 6?) I did it for you here. Also you were in that fight somewhere since I see you in the combat spam, only I don't know where you were so you can add another creep to that count. Now let's play a game and count the number of defilers and warleaders here. I spy.. well, you get the picture. Anyway. Then a few minutes later, and Stickeez you can confirm this since your spider baby is named "Herp" here, this is what began to hunt us after that event and continued to do so even after our group of four started to grow smaller and this group grew bigger. Numbers don't get to me, I know I can keep my group up just fine against twice my group's numbers since I am a freep healer here, but I'm just making a point, Stickeez, that you seem to be off a bit with your story. These people look well ranked to me. Even the ones in the first screenshot I posted. And also, those said people were the ones in my first screenshot that ran to the one shots over a similar incident. It happens on both sides, just put it to rest.

Also, if you wish to speak about respect then here's an interesting detail you failed to mention. I do recall seeing a little red and gold spider baby named 'LameVangardXgots' wandering about in my screenshots. Never expected to see something like that from you, I thought you were a bit older than 12 years of age.

Originally Posted by distillered

Also, if you wish to speak about respect then here's an interesting detail you failed to mention. I do recall seeing a little red and gold spider baby named 'LameVangardXgots' wandering about in my screenshots. Never expected to see something like that from you, I thought you were a bit older than 12 years of age.

To quote Ornaith, Mer - "report, don't retort".

If someone wants to give his spider baby an ignorant and homophobic name like that, he's free to. Just be sure that you do your part to try to keep this (allegedly) adult community adult, and report him for the violation. Everyone enjoys vacations.

Don't explain yourselves with such earnest, my fellow Kinmates.

Originally Posted by Lestache

To quote Ornaith, Mer - "report, don't retort".

If someone wants to give his spider baby an ignorant and homophobic name like that, he's free to. Just be sure that you do your part to try to keep this (allegedly) adult community adult, and report him for the violation. Everyone enjoys vacations.

For all you know, that could say maggots. ;p

Indeed; I agree. All cliff jumpers should be punished considerably. Take away their children, burn their houses, leave none alive.

Creeps are c0nts. l0l0l

Originally Posted by distillered

I personally don't condone "cliff jumping" and don't look to practice it myself, I admit I was the first to slide off but it was by a mistake. I had every intention of staying and healing myself until I got CCed enough to die as I normally do, but in re-positioning myself I hit a slope and fell. It happens.

Nice try Meraithe but this isnt our first BBQ

Originally Posted by Sezneg
Because making fun of handicapped people is sure to prove how tough/funny/interesting you are on the internet.
+1 Stickiez

Some people just go too far.

Quoted for teh lulz

Originally Posted by Rhuell17

The deciding factor for me to jump was...
~Rhuell

What is the deciding factor for you to Stun Turn ?

Meraith, only 2 hotkeys? I guess that's why Blaeloch dps's and you heal, hehehe.

Originally Posted by Commish

Meraith, only 2 hotkeys? I guess that's why Blaeloch dps's and you heal, hehehe.

Always said I'm a clicker when I heal!

I use my number keys for dps and I dps rarely.

Originally Posted by Champtain

All cliff jumpers should be punished considerably. Take away their children

Did Illy and his partner adopt?





I miss Real Gala

The vast ammount of QQ coming from stickeez isnt surprising l0l0l0l


Go cry me a river.

Remember Vanguard "no drama"

Eaola will not approve

Originally Posted by Lestache

If someone wants to give his spider baby an ignorant and homophobic name like that, he's free to. Just be sure that you do your part to try to keep this (allegedly) adult community adult, and report him for the violation. Everyone enjoys vacations.

I make it my duty to make this server as immature as possible.

I'm watching this thread while eating lunch.