Thread: Freep Audacity vs Creep Audacity...What is the real outcome?

My main creep is a R6 BA, I recently got R7 Audacity. I think it's great as long as I am fighting freeps with 1-3 audacity. Once I fight a freep with R7 Audacity, game over. I dont have the screenshot but yesterday I hit someone with Revenge for 700 damage...I am damage traited. The skill normally is supposed do to ~1800 damage that's an 1100 difference. Piercing shot on a guard in OP hit for 250. If I were to sit there and just shoot him, it would take 5 mins to kill him as his ICMR would essentially mitigate a lot of my damage, not to mention I would run out of power. The incorporation of Audacity for freeps in my opinion is largely unnecessary and doesn't help solve the problem of creeps not being able to remotely come close to the DPS, healing, and CC output from freeps. I have yet to see where it takes 8-10 freeps to kill a single creep...Yet I see wardens, guards, minnies, champs, wardens, champs, wardens, champs....you get the idea; who are fighting 8-10 creeps and taking forever to go down. I wouldnt be so opposed to a freep that was hard to take down like a champ, warden, or guard, except for the fact if turbine is going to allow that they shouldnt also have the ability to hit AOE for 4-6k and heal, and bubble...not a single creep with those capabilities. Can someone say lopsided? I hate to imagine what the moors will be like when all the freeps (The usual players) have aud 7. I can think of a group of 6 freeps I know that could wipe out a raid of creeps if they had aud 7 plus normal buffs. Scary thought.

Anyways I wanna hear from the freeps about what their future vision will be, and what they have noticed with their audacity 7 and how it has impacted their gameplay in the moors. So, please reply to the thread, I am considering swiping the cobwebs off my cappie and getting his aud gear as well just for some fun and because I want the moors banner. lol
Thanks

Originally Posted by aadaboy19

My main creep is a R6 BA, I recently got R7 Audacity. I think it's great as long as I am fighting freeps with 1-3 audacity. Once I fight a freep with R7 Audacity, game over. I dont have the screenshot but yesterday I hit someone with Revenge for 700 damage...I am damage traited. The skill normally is supposed do to ~1800 damage that's an 1100 difference. Piercing shot on a guard in OP hit for 250. If I were to sit there and just shoot him, it would take 5 mins to kill him as his ICMR would essentially mitigate a lot of my damage, not to mention I would run out of power. The incorporation of Audacity for freeps in my opinion is largely unnecessary and doesn't help solve the problem of creeps not being able to remotely come close to the DPS, healing, and CC output from freeps. I have yet to see where it takes 8-10 freeps to kill a single creep...Yet I see wardens, guards, minnies, champs, wardens, champs, wardens, champs....you get the idea; who are fighting 8-10 creeps and taking forever to go down. I wouldnt be so opposed to a freep that was hard to take down like a champ, warden, or guard, except for the fact if turbine is going to allow that they shouldnt also have the ability to hit AOE for 4-6k and heal, and bubble...not a single creep with those capabilities. Can someone say lopsided? I hate to imagine what the moors will be like when all the freeps (The usual players) have aud 7. I can think of a group of 6 freeps I know that could wipe out a raid of creeps if they had aud 7 plus normal buffs. Scary thought.

Anyways I wanna hear from the freeps about what their future vision will be, and what they have noticed with their audacity 7 and how it has impacted their gameplay in the moors. So, please reply to the thread, I am considering swiping the cobwebs off my cappie and getting his aud gear as well just for some fun and because I want the moors banner. lol
Thanks

There are too many variables to consider when asking such open ended questions like these...

Champs are OP, we all know this.
Guards are the main tanking class, they should be allowed to have some survivability against 8-10 creeps. Now if they're getting kills while tanking that many creeps...it's a different story.
Wardens are....basically....stupid, but you can kill them if they're not doing they super huge healing/boss status thing...
Any class with an incombat sprint that negates slows....is a bit annoying to take down. Not sure why, but sprint seems to decrease damage taken a lot of the time....maybe it's harder for a lot of people to target someone moving faster then normal, idk.

A group of 6 freeps that can wipe a raid of creeps? That's impossible....unless you're talking the most greeniest green of all creeps....24v6....nah, man. lol

I think the fundamental flaw with the moors right now, is that ranked creeps....aren't around. The average freep that steps to the moors has increased incredibly over the last couple years, while the average ranked creep has....slowly increased. Now rank doesn't truly mean much freepside, but Brands on small cooldowns, do. Brands make a world of difference in fights....i would pay real money to have more creeps have smaller cooldown'd brands. Most creeps i fight with are still below rank 7...it's the way the game works. Yet, most freeps are at LEAST rank 8.

The only exception, i'd say is wargs....windfola has a bazillion wargs that are ranked....not sure why, but they rarely group with me, anyway :P

Personally, I do think that audacity should have been a creep only skill, tied to rank, and not as potent. Alas, it wasn't so, and I think it's ridiculous how long it takes to kill a tank traited guard/warden if they're sporting their audacity gear. Unfortunately, thats how the moors is right now. I wouldn't say that the solution is to play your cappy, unless you really really want to. lol

You just need to charge into freeps, pray there's a warg around that will help you (90% of the time, that isn't the case), and hope that they'll pounce/silence/#### face of the freep you're targetting. That's what I do.

Or i just go on whatever Murhaaja's targetting...that seems to work pretty well, too

Originally Posted by Ryuc

You just need to charge into freeps, pray there's a warg around that will help you (90% of the time, that isn't the case), and hope that they'll pounce/silence/#### face of the freep you're targetting. That's what I do.

You hurt me Ryu....

Or am I in the 10%?

Originally Posted by aadaboy19

My main creep is a R6 BA, I recently got R7 Audacity. I think it's great as long as I am fighting freeps with 1-3 audacity. Once I fight a freep with R7 Audacity, game over.

I don't feel audacity has affected as much freepside as you might think. The hits most of us take in dps from putting on the gear (ie, going from 122 will/agi/might to 60) isn't always worth it. I'll end up wearing 4 audacity pieces because of one's 3-set bonus and the mits on the other. But considering each piece only reduces your incoming damage by ~3%, it's something, but not game changing when we're speaking in terms of a difference of a couple audacity.

The mechanic ultimately helps creeps a lot more than freeps. Creeps lose nothing while ranking up audacity, while freeps nerf their dps (in most cases). I actually like the way it is because it gives freeps options without making it such a vital mechanic that you can't even step foot in the moors without 7. I'm sure we'll see wardens at least wearing 6 pieces, but I'd be very surprised if we see hunters wearing more than one or two (partially due to ####e set bonuses).

Additionally, it helps creeps more in the regard of the cc duration subtraction. Creep cc, is, as we all know, a joke when it comes to stuns. Freeps on the other hand enjoy a class with a from stealth knock down, 3 with 6 second+ stuns, and almost all with at least 3 second stuns. Wargs and latent poison are really the only things creeps have that are particularly significant in this department. Therefore, when cc duration is decreased, it hurts freeps a lot more. I would go so far as to say my class has been the most adversely affected on either side because of this. My 3/5/6 second stuns on wargs and reavers are very soon going to start feeling a lot more like 1.5/2.5/3. It's going to be a whole new universe for me when I actually have to actively dot kite. But to be honest, I like the system.

As long as Turbine is careful about how then implement further updates to the mechanic, things should work out fairly well. But then again, I just used 'Turbine' and 'careful' in the same sentence in reference to pvp. We shall see.

A group of 6 freeps that can wipe a raid of creeps? That's impossible.[/QUOTE]

You are incorrect. Not only is it possible, but it isn't very difficult (assuming we aren't talking a full raid of 24. that takes a bit more effort).

Originally Posted by JDCass

I don't feel audacity has affected as much freepside as you might think. The hits most of us take in dps from putting on the gear (ie, going from 122 will/agi/might to 60) isn't always worth it. I'll end up wearing 4 audacity pieces because of one's 3-set bonus and the mits on the other. But considering each piece only reduces your incoming damage by ~3%, it's something, but not game changing when we're speaking in terms of a difference of a couple audacity.

The mechanic ultimately helps creeps a lot more than freeps. Creeps lose nothing while ranking up audacity, while freeps nerf their dps (in most cases). I actually like the way it is because it gives freeps options without making it such a vital mechanic that you can't even step foot in the moors without 7. I'm sure we'll see wardens at least wearing 6 pieces, but I'd be very surprised if we see hunters wearing more than one or two (partially due to ####e set bonuses).

Additionally, it helps creeps more in the regard of the cc duration subtraction. Creep cc, is, as we all know, a joke when it comes to stuns. Freeps on the other hand enjoy a class with a from stealth knock down, 3 with 6 second+ stuns, and almost all with at least 3 second stuns. Wargs and latent poison are really the only things creeps have that are particularly significant in this department. Therefore, when cc duration is decreased, it hurts freeps a lot more. I would go so far as to say my class has been the most adversely affected on either side because of this. My 3/5/6 second stuns on wargs and reavers are very soon going to start feeling a lot more like 1.5/2.5/3. It's going to be a whole new universe for me when I actually have to actively dot kite. But to be honest, I like the system.

As long as Turbine is careful about how then implement further updates to the mechanic, things should work out fairly well. But then again, I just used 'Turbine' and 'careful' in the same sentence in reference to pvp. We shall see.

All I read in this was, "Freeps got nerfed from being insanely OP to still pretty OP since we don't even need full audacity to be OP."

[QUOTE=Ryuc;6081977]There are too many variables to consider when asking such open ended questions like these...


A group of 6 freeps that can wipe a raid of creeps? That's impossible....unless you're talking the most greeniest green of all creeps....24v6....nah, man. lol

Haha, I didnt mean a raid of 24....when was the last time you saw a raid of 24 out there? The largest average raid I have seen was between 10-14, occasionally higher, but mostly lower. As for my cappy, he is R7, almost 8. I just havent found a good way to go about setting my stuff up....due to the amount of grinding to level up weapons and the various ways to go about mooring. I think I will stick to pvp with my creep and pve with my cappy; except to hit R8 for the banner. I may just use commie points the next release for armor for my cappy due to the overwhelmingly monotonous grind that is inevitable for seals... anyways... With Aud 7 I am having a ton of fun with my pocket healer. <3 Love to Burz. Cya out there

Originally Posted by Arathain.o.

All I read in this was, "Freeps got nerfed from being insanely OP to still pretty OP since we don't even need full audacity to be OP."

Pretty much.

Audacity;

You all take 30% less damage
50% less duration from cc
25% less power costs.



I don't even know how many time's I've said it, but despite weaver and warg changes, nothing has changed in terms of balance.

Originally Posted by Untg99

I don't even know how many time's I've said it, but despite weaver and warg changes, nothing has changed in terms of balance.

So Turbine managed to make a balanced mechanic for an inbalanced system? Insanity.

Well, I'm going to point out what having audacity does in terms of real impact on play:

1. Incoming damage reduction means a slowing down of play in general, except in the situation of freeps choosing not to use it and freeps/creeps who don't have it. That means timers that have durations of impact (last stand, guard pledge, WL bubble and ba evade to name a few) are going to have less impact, and timers (or heals fit in here) of limited magnitude of impact (morale bubbles and self-heals come to mind) are going to have more. Lowbie freeps+creeps without it will suffer more as they'll be taken out of fights earlier for convenience and quicker benefit in a fight. Ranked freeps choosing not to use it (whether sensible or not, tbh) will have lessened effectiveness relatively as a result of falling below the playing-field for mitigation.

2. CC duration being shortened is going to benefit most those who take the most cc applications; melee because they're closest, then squishies and healers who're being removed from the fight for a time. Amusing that it depreciates the value of SI if an lm uses the audacity.. like he said; audacity might be worst of all for lm's.

3. Power costs being reduced benefits most those who have (or formerly had) power problems in the moors, and that's creeps in rvr and freepside.. guards are the only class that comes to mind.

So, the different parts of it impact various classes differently, but somewhat amusingly for me; the most benefited class either side from purely audacity, is probably guard. It feels like it's more than compensated for the way in which stat changes screwed guard dps, especially since the sets are on a par with the other freeps (guard sets used to be notoriously bad), but now you'll see even more invulnerable guards in (more or less) pointless shield-using spec's and op guards being more viable even with the introduction of a couple of things that hurt op guard play (warg flayer channel and reavers ignoring slows with resilience).

Oddly I think they might have released a stat that will bring about a closer balance in all, there might be specific exceptions like champs being even rougher now, or maybe lm's losing a lot of their playability, or even a return of puppies whining about me being unkillable... but the general impacts do work toward it.

Aer

Originally Posted by Arathain

All I read in this was, "Freeps got nerfed from being insanely OP to still pretty OP since we don't even need full audacity to be OP."

Nicely Done.

Elendilmir you say ^^

Originally Posted by DSBoomer

Nicely Done.

Elendilmir you say ^^

Yep. It's pretty cool logging into the moors and not being the only person on.

Originally Posted by Arathain.o.

Yep. It's pretty cool logging into the moors and not being the only person on.

One thing cool about windy though is that soloers (not that there's all that many) are actually respected to be PvPers.

All the Zerg babies are something I am certainly not looking forward to.

Originally Posted by Untg99

One thing cool about windy though is that soloers (not that there's all that many) are actually respected to be PvPers.

All the Zerg babies are something I am certainly not looking forward to.

I'm not quite sure I understand. You are saying the soloers on Elendilmir are not respected as such? You will need to clarify, so when you do I can tell you that you are incorrect.

Also, there is nothing cool about Windy. You would do well to remember this.

Originally Posted by Arathain.o.

I'm not quite sure I understand. You are saying the soloers on Elendilmir are not respected as such? You will need to clarify, so when you do I can tell you that you are incorrect.

Also, there is nothing cool about Windy. You would do well to remember this.

Methinks Cons doth ooze sarcasm in his post.

If Windy respects solo'ers (and this coming from someone who solo's a fair bit, but is more often in small groups and rarely in raids - no matter what you may think), I'm a rabbit in a bikini.

Originally Posted by CirdalvalSilnuviel

If Windy respects solo'ers (and this coming from someone who solo's a fair bit, but is more often in small groups and rarely in raids - no matter what you may think), I'm a rabbit in a bikini.

Hmmm.

Originally Posted by CirdalvalSilnuviel

If Windy respects solo'ers (...), I'm a rabbit in a bikini.

QFT, the norm isn't to try the challenge and try to play your toon to full potential on windy.

Originally Posted by Grusk

QFT, the norm isn't to try the challenge and try to play your toon to full potential on windy.

Idk, zerging is pretty challenging when one uses their mouse to move and click skills at the same time.

Originally Posted by Arathain.o.

I'm not quite sure I understand. You are saying the soloers on Elendilmir are not respected as such? You will need to clarify, so when you do I can tell you that you are incorrect.

Also, there is nothing cool about Windy. You would do well to remember this.

They never respected my burg as much as Ongburz Skirmisher respects my warden.

Originally Posted by JDCass

I don't feel audacity has affected as much freepside as you might think. The hits most of us take in dps from putting on the gear (ie, going from 122 will/agi/might to 60) isn't always worth it. I'll end up wearing 4 audacity pieces because of one's 3-set bonus and the mits on the other. But considering each piece only reduces your incoming damage by ~3%, it's something, but not game changing when we're speaking in terms of a difference of a couple audacity.

The mechanic ultimately helps creeps a lot more than freeps. Creeps lose nothing while ranking up audacity, while freeps nerf their dps (in most cases). I actually like the way it is because it gives freeps options without making it such a vital mechanic that you can't even step foot in the moors without 7. I'm sure we'll see wardens at least wearing 6 pieces, but I'd be very surprised if we see hunters wearing more than one or two (partially due to ####e set bonuses).

Additionally, it helps creeps more in the regard of the cc duration subtraction. Creep cc, is, as we all know, a joke when it comes to stuns. Freeps on the other hand enjoy a class with a from stealth knock down, 3 with 6 second+ stuns, and almost all with at least 3 second stuns. Wargs and latent poison are really the only things creeps have that are particularly significant in this department. Therefore, when cc duration is decreased, it hurts freeps a lot more. I would go so far as to say my class has been the most adversely affected on either side because of this. My 3/5/6 second stuns on wargs and reavers are very soon going to start feeling a lot more like 1.5/2.5/3. It's going to be a whole new universe for me when I actually have to actively dot kite. But to be honest, I like the system.

As long as Turbine is careful about how then implement further updates to the mechanic, things should work out fairly well. But then again, I just used 'Turbine' and 'careful' in the same sentence in reference to pvp. We shall see.

I basically fully agree with what cirone put here. The audacity gear for freeps, well for hunters I know for sure sucks imo. I wouldnt wear but one or two pieces. Now on the other hand my warg will have full audacity soon with the loss of absolutely nothing at all besides comms wich come and go pretty quickly. I think the audacity system was a great addition to the moors.

Freeps lose DPS on the surface, (only relevant if the freeps couldn't consistently hit for over 1.5-2k) but I think it also depends on what type of build they are going for. Not to mention any losses can be gained via Perks, Jewelry, buffs (Yes, this means you would have to group), food (Freeps have many options, creeps...not so much), set bonuses, legendary weapons;items (and their ability to switch them at any time during a fight), virtues, class traiting set bonuses....so...no damage output not an issue. So what if it takes you 5 seconds to kill something instead of 2?

would be nice if creeps could have something like this. I think it would be possible with a bit of additional thought if they used corruptions with this... example would be if you trait 4 mitigations you gain additional resistance rating or mitigation...if you trait 3+ phys mastery you gain additional % damage with a different type of damage..shadow, fire, etc... and completely do away with the traiting of damage type...freeps dont have to trait damage type, we shouldn't have to waste a trait slot either.

When all is said and done I still stand by my initial statement that freeps don't need audacity. I have been out in the moors on my freep with 1 audacity and it is much harder to kill a ranked creep now...especially when getting pounced by a pack of wargs (Still love the warg buddies) The other reason they dont need it currently is because of the potting options. I loved being out there on my freep and potting the fire, potting the disease, potting the poison... my creep on the other hand sucks because I cannot pot fire, cannot pot wounds, or tactical slows... not going to brand just to get a slow off me. There are creep pots you can buy with commie points that make you immune to slows, fire, poison, ccs, etc... but you have to be out of combat to use it. I can see only a couple of classes that might use this, but if you are ranged and doing damage then you get zerged, there is no way to use the benefit of the pot, you get slowed by an RK at range and next thing you know big mushroom cloud.

Thanks

Originally Posted by aadaboy19

Freeps lose DPS on the surface, (only relevant if the freeps couldn't consistently hit for over 1.5-2k) but I think it also depends on what type of build they are going for. Not to mention any losses can be gained via Perks, Jewelry, buffs (Yes, this means you would have to group), food (Freeps have many options, creeps...not so much), set bonuses, legendary weapons;items (and their ability to switch them at any time during a fight), virtues, class traiting set bonuses....so...no damage output not an issue. So what if it takes you 5 seconds to kill something instead of 2?

I must say, ^this.

I can't talk about freepside with any first-hand knowledge, just what I've been subjected to on my BA. And while the warg and weaver changes help those two classes, in no way do I see any shift of the balance (not counting the fact that this server is such a warg-fest) towards neutral. Turbine has indeed slowed down the fights somewhat, but equal Audacity on a freep-creep pair, imo (again, not counting the classes that saw sea changes), => same result as before the update, just longer fights than before.

For instance, Thomas was able to destroy me in 1v1's couple days ago w/o blowing bubbles or Sprint, apart from one bout where a couple of his Hamstring's missed. Rain annihilated me in 8-10 fights no matter how he was geared and no matter what I tried (short of popping MT), which could even be seen as a nerf to the BA (as I choose to see it; the hunter was the one class a decent BA could reasonably hope to beat), considering we were 50-50 in 1v1's before that, even with his 1Ager.

That being said (and I know I'm going to get stick for the following), I like that cappy and LM DPS seems to have been decreased a bit. I base this off of 1v1's with Amanda, Dagwulf and Bj, but the balance seems to have shifted in my favor ever so slightly. I simply wish to remind anyone thinking of telling me this is a bad thing that, seeing as I am (was?) theoretically one of the DPS classes on creepside, I do believe I should have a slight advantage over the support classes of freepside. But then, seeing as the out-and-out DPS freep classes put out so much damage (I've been HS'd for 8k with R4 Audacity, and I'm told someone EC'd for about 8k too...), I suppose it stands to reason an LM or cappy can do as much damage as me, if not more.

Finally, to anyone that wants to argue that judging balance off of 1v1's is dumb: fix the part, and you go some way towards fixing the whole. If the 1v1's are reasonably balanced, balance on the macroscopic scale will follow.

You may now tell me I'm a noob, and that my conclusions are as erroneous as ever.

Your a nub Shap.

Ineedarez is right

I like this guy



Captains are fun as hell to play

hehehe



God im bored.

Originally Posted by CirdalvalSilnuviel

Stuff

I disagree entirely about the balancing of 1v1s having an effect on actual PvP. Also, this update changed balance tremendously by shifting class paradigms significantly; more noticably in group fights than 1v1s.

Originally Posted by MaroonDragoon

I disagree entirely about the balancing of 1v1s having an effect on actual PvP. Also, this update changed balance tremendously by shifting class paradigms significantly; more noticably in group fights than 1v1s.

If they did balance 1v1's accordingly for every class, it would have a very significant and might I say, positive overall effect on total PvP balance. There wouldn't be one class that couldn't not put up with another.

However, if they balanced skillsets for 1v1's without changing the incentive for solo/raid (Currently zerg orientated incentive almost entirely), that's when it would create big problems.

As it is, solo's get zerged all the time already, everywhere, and balancing the classes for 1v1's would make it hopeless for solo's unless they changed the incentive.

I'd say that overall Audacity favors creeps, but I wouldn't say that it balanced the moors. Creeps basically are given Audacity with no tradeoff; since it's passive it can only improve your character. On the flip side, there's an interesting decision freeps have to make - to either take a hit on DPS or take a hit on survivability. Unlike creeps, freeps cannot perform at their pre-U6 level while equipping full audacity. How much of a hit varies depending on the class and how nice of set bonuses they got.

However, it didn't make a huge difference overall, and most people (myself included) can't see past the massive grind anyway, especially if you like to PvP on multiple characters. What ever happened to PvPing for PvP rewards? /sigh...

Originally Posted by MaroonDragoon

I disagree entirely about the balancing of 1v1s having an effect on actual PvP. Also, this update changed balance tremendously by shifting class paradigms significantly; more noticably in group fights than 1v1s.

I'm going to just agree with Naegling, because he used big words in his argument .

PS - Shap, you're a noob.

I know many classes actually gained things with the new sets when they pick the right pieces. I know Cons has been gaining DPS capabilities and survivability. Minstrels gain a lot with the right pieces too.

Only real complaints about less DPS I have heard has been from hunters and their Orthanc set bonuses.

EDIT: Made sure to have my facts straight, change that to ALL freep classes.

Come on everyone just get creative We know that you really cant get creative with a creep, we are extremely limited to the choices we have with setting up our creeps. Now with audacity the freeps have plus their inherent ability to nuke almost anything solo, it makes corruption traiting have even a lower impact IMO. I have traited both for damage as I am a BA (I should be able to dps significantly...although we all know that is garbo...shaps right we hit less than captain's do, especially our crits.I should know my cappy crit Shadow's Lament on a creep yesterday for 2900... I have never got close to that with revenge or VT even damage traited.) and mitigation/resistance traited. No matter what I do, without a healer I cannot stay alive long enough to kill 2 decent freeps. If they are light armour I may get one of them, but at the same time their damage output is rediculous and the other one usually gets me, if they are heavy armor and have aud gear it takes a year to kill one and they both get me while I am still trying to get the first guy. So you will usually see me with my brother (R7 BA) and Burz together.. Pretty formidable with that group.

Now on freep side..stop whining about losing dps.. really?! As I said before you get all sorts of food, drink, buffs, virtues, class trait bonuses (creeps dont have but should). Get creative You can make up what you lost usually with jewelry, there are many ways to compensate and make things better given the situation. If you are only thinking about damage output, then your play style is very simple and to me would become boring very quickly. For instance on my cappy, I am basically setup almost all might and little VIT, I have over 26000 Physical Mastery and can hit like a train when Traited Red. However my health with a hope banner is ~9,000... With the wargs being crazy strong now, I lose 4-6 k before I recover and die shortly after. With Aud gear I would survive better but at the same time I dont want to lose my damage output either since cappy damage output is inherently slow. So what have I determined to be the solution?? Well let me tell you... I got creative. I am going to use the Damage output Aud Armor, but change 5 pieces of jewelry (+pocket) to VIT based, and leave the other 2 Might based. My Legendary Weapon and Legendary Item will help support damage and survivability, while traiting red, and wearing red I will survive longer to dps longer with an increase to mits. Which in the long run allows me to actually deal MORE damage. I understand this particular setup wont work with everyone, but hey I am not going to think for all of you, you can figure it out. Besides, it seems to me that the freeps can still drop a bomb on almost any creep.
Also free samples on store are brands and insignias so make sure you get them.

Thanks,

Originally Posted by Untg99

I know many classes actually gained things with the new sets when they pick the right pieces. I know Cons has been gaining DPS capabilities and survivability. Minstrels gain a lot with the right pieces too.

Only real complaints about less DPS I have heard has been from hunters and their Orthanc set bonuses.

EDIT: Made sure to have my facts straight, change that to ALL freep classes.

I'll admit I'm not familiar with all classes and their set bonuses. However, if you put the set bonuses aside, it was my understanding that the stats on the audacity gear are lower than PvE gear in order to make room for audacity. It's a tradeoff of hard stats for audacity. You're right that some set bonuses are really nice, but I'm unsure if they make up for the lack of stats. It all depends on the particular class and set bonus.

Originally Posted by aadaboy19

Now on freep side..stop whining about losing dps.. really?! As I said before you get all sorts of food, drink, buffs, virtues, class trait bonuses (creeps dont have but should). Get creative You can make up what you lost usually with jewelry, there are many ways to compensate and make things better given the situation. If you are only thinking about damage output, then your play style is very simple and to me would become boring very quickly. For instance on my cappy, I am basically setup almost all might and little VIT, I have over 26000 Physical Mastery and can hit like a train when Traited Red. However my health with a hope banner is ~9,000... With the wargs being crazy strong now, I lose 4-6 k before I recover and die shortly after. With Aud gear I would survive better but at the same time I dont want to lose my damage output either since cappy damage output is inherently slow. So what have I determined to be the solution?? Well let me tell you... I got creative. I am going to use the Damage output Aud Armor, but change 5 pieces of jewelry (+pocket) to VIT based, and leave the other 2 Might based. My Legendary Weapon and Legendary Item will help support damage and survivability, while traiting red, and wearing red I will survive longer to dps longer with an increase to mits. Which in the long run allows me to actually deal MORE damage. I understand this particular setup wont work with everyone, but hey I am not going to think for all of you, you can figure it out. Besides, it seems to me that the freeps can still drop a bomb on almost any creep.
Also free samples on store are brands and insignias so make sure you get them.

Thanks,

I'm not complaining about freep loss of DPS, and I agree that being creative with jewellery, traits, etc. can help make up for the hit in other stats. However, that doesn't change the fact that you've lost stats, it's just softening the blow from losing them.

With all that being said, the biggest thing Audacity brought to the table in my opinion was slower and more interesting fights, not balance. Its effect on balance seems to be pretty minimal.

Originally Posted by CirdalvalSilnuviel

I like that cappy and LM DPS seems to have been decreased a bit. I base this off of 1v1's with Amanda, Dagwulf and Bj, but the balance seems to have shifted in my favor ever so slightly.

Other than Audacity mitigating my damage, I have been doing MORE damage than ever before. In fact, I have been doing so much damage, that I had to stop healing (even with Revealing Mark) in 1v1s altogether. That being said, I'm going to assume these Captains went for the Make Haste set, which means you shouldn't base anything off of these fights anyway.

Here is Turbine's balance....

Ygaer scored a devastating hit with a melee attack on Finmeister for 818 Beleriand damage to Morale.

*I have Audacity 3 for anyone wondering.

Never has been, never will be balanced. Just gotta deal with it.

Have fun out there, thats the key

Originally Posted by jfindlay

Here is Turbine's balance....

Ygaer scored a devastating hit with a melee attack on Finmeister for 818 Beleriand damage to Morale.

*I have Audacity 3 for anyone wondering.

Never has been, never will be balanced. Just gotta deal with it.

Have fun out there, thats the key

At least we can all safely assume that was not done solo.

Originally Posted by Arathain.o.

At least we can all safely assume that was not done solo.

He used his dwarf stealth to sneak up on me while I was killing a hunter

Originally Posted by Arathain.o.

At least we can all safely assume that was not done solo.

I haven't been trolled in a while, thanks Ara! Even if you troll everyone, it still makes me feel a little special!

Originally Posted by Ellery01

I haven't been trolled in a while, thanks Ara! Even if you troll everyone, it still makes me feel a little special!

I was bored and couldn't pass up the opportunity.

Originally Posted by aadaboy19

shaps right we hit less than captain's do, especially our crits.I should know my cappy crit Shadow's Lament on a creep yesterday for 2900... I have never got close to that with revenge or VT even damage traited.

To clarify, my issue with the status quo isn't that I can't hit as hard as a freep. I've dev'd VT for 3.5-4k, and Revenge for 3.2k pre-U6, 2.9k after (I might have hit harder, but these are the highest numbers I've noted). The problem lies in the fact that while I have two skills with that kind of damage output, hunters, champs, RK's, burgs, mini's etc. have multiple skills that can hit there or thereabouts. Also, at least some of those classes - if not all - can spam those skills: I know champs certainly can, 'cause the cooldowns on Remorseless and Brutal Strikes are mere seconds, and it takes very little time to build up the Fervor needed to pop them repeatedly. All the morale I have counts for nothing when I can be hit by three or four consecutive hits for upwards of 2.5k by half the freep classes.

Also, auto-crits. I don't know of a single creep class with the ability to assure themselves a guaranteed crit or dev on the next application of a particular skill (Seeking Blades and Aim come to mind). Also, hunters have Burn Hot which, as I understand it, massively increases the damage dealt by the next crit(s?). I know nothing about the warg changes (my feelings about stealth classes is, I believe, well-known), but it is hardly fair neither reavers nor BA's get similar abilities.

Then comes SI. No creep class has a similar skill, although WL's do have the ability to remove CC from their group with Purge and Snap Out of It! The ability to spam what amounts to a brand that lasts a minute, has a minuscule cooldown and can be popped in combat... And people rail against "paytowin" brands? Hypocrisy, mayhaps?

Originally Posted by Arathain.o.

Other than Audacity mitigating my damage, I have been doing MORE damage than ever before. In fact, I have been doing so much damage, that I had to stop healing (even with Revealing Mark) in 1v1s altogether. That being said, I'm going to assume these Captains went for the Make Haste set, which means you shouldn't base anything off of these fights anyway.

That could well be true, I have no idea, Ara. I don't think Bj's changed his gear at all in a while, but Dag did have some Aud gear on. 'Course, if there's different versions of even the PvP sets, then you might be right.

Originally Posted by CirdalvalSilnuviel

To clarify, my issue with the status quo isn't that I can't hit as hard as a freep. I've dev'd VT for 3.5-4k, and Revenge for 3.2k pre-U6, 2.9k after (I might have hit harder, but these are the highest numbers I've noted). The problem lies in the fact that while I have two skills with that kind of damage output, hunters, champs, RK's, burgs, mini's etc. have multiple skills that can hit there or thereabouts. Also, at least some of those classes - if not all - can spam those skills: I know champs certainly can, 'cause the cooldowns on Remorseless and Brutal Strikes are mere seconds, and it takes very little time to build up the Fervor needed to pop them repeatedly. All the morale I have counts for nothing when I can be hit by three or four consecutive hits for upwards of 2.5k by half the freep classes.

Also, auto-crits. I don't know of a single creep class with the ability to assure themselves a guaranteed crit or dev on the next application of a particular skill (Seeking Blades and Aim come to mind). Also, hunters have Burn Hot which, as I understand it, massively increases the damage dealt by the next crit(s?). I know nothing about the warg changes (my feelings about stealth classes is, I believe, well-known), but it is hardly fair neither reavers nor BA's get similar abilities.

Then comes SI. No creep class has a similar skill, although WL's do have the ability to remove CC from their group with Purge and Snap Out of It! The ability to spam what amounts to a brand that lasts a minute, has a minuscule cooldown and can be popped in combat... And people rail against "paytowin" brands? Hypocrisy, mayhaps?



That could well be true, I have no idea, Ara. I don't think Bj's changed his gear at all in a while, but Dag did have some Aud gear on. 'Course, if there's different versions of even the PvP sets, then you might be right.

I am always right about everything forever.

Originally Posted by Arathain.o.

I am always right about everything forever.

Except when I'm right, and you disagree.