Guardians Don't' suck, i like being a guardian......Hoverer.
I lose threat to a warden, and as to well geared dps such as RK/Hunters. I dont' know what to do, i thought i have the right Legacies and Relics on my LI's.
Please check my legacies and stats, and tell me what i need to improve on.
Also, my own Personal stats as well. I was told Vitality and Incoming healing are best to work on.
By the way, I'm sort of new, i don't have the good jewelry yet from the River or all the drops from skirmish raid.
You should also not feel too bad about not being able to keep aggro off a well equipped hunter. If they're in strength stance they deal out #### loads of damage and it is incredibly hard to keep threat off them as they just generate too much
I lose threat to a warden, and as to well geared dps such as RK/Hunters. I dont' know what to do, i thought i have the right Legacies and Relics on my LI's.
When I saw your belt I was wondering why you loose threat, because you have 5% bonus on it. My guardian has only 3% and I NEVER loose threat. Excepting if a warden leeches threat from me^^
Is there a rotation i should use?
As a guardian you wont get any clear rotation, because the most threat generating attacks can only be used if you block.
So you have 6.5k block what is actually not bad. But you should get the reputation bracelet of the riders with 92 vita and 600 block rating. In that way you haven't enough might. You should have at least 600 might for a maximum of parry and block.
What is also interesting for helping you, are your traits. Which class trait have you equipped?
Because there you can work on it, the legacies are not as bad, as you may think.
Although I am not a tank, my personal feeling is that if any ranged DPS grabs aggro from the tank, he wants to play tank, so let him...
Anyone grabbing aggro from the tank should check their rotation between mobs. There is NO need for any DPSer to focus that much damage on a single mob. Especially hunters in strength stance can easily attack two mobs at the same time, instead of focusing on a single mob.
The warden should also go easy on the threat generation skills. He should get into DPS mode, not into tank mode.
Last of all... everyone loses aggro at any time. It's not a problem, it just happens... don't feel bad about it. Improve your block and might and the rest is up to good team work
1. Regular tank spec, Guardian's Defence, mob aggro
2. Guardian's Threat, Challenge the Darkness, Selfless Defence
3. Overpower with 2100 Might
In all three scenarios the only way that I could get aggro was if I did an Engage or Challenge the Darkness. Even then it would be inenvitable for his Exhualtation of Battle to steal the aggro back since it is doing over 80k worth of damage threat to the target(s).
As it stands now, if a Warden really wants aggro, it's theirs to take.
It doesn't really matter to me. Right now it allows me to really cut loose with extreme Might builds for dps.
Your gear is not bad but you could use a lot of improvement, your MIGHT and AGI are very low.
First I would suggest to get the new Martyr jewellery set from Great River, will give you a nice boost to VIT and MIGHT.
Also I don't understand why people use those wrist items when you can easily get better ones with theod riders rep: one with 92 VIT 330 morale and 650 block raiting and I'd use the one with 92 might and 92 agi too.
There are a couple of legacies I would replace on your LIs, on your weapon +1% vexing blow damage and +5 warrior heart duration are quite useless better put a VIT and a MIGHT legacy there they will be more useful even at rank1, on your belt i'd also replace the +7% warrior heart heal with a stat legacy.
Threat generation has little to do with gear tho, it's more about traits and skills rotation.
Usually for better treat generation is used 4 blue/3 yellow so you get +28% threat from stance. Rotations depends much on the situation and how many mobs you are fightning. If you haven't already, read the stichy on this forums about threat skills and how different skills work (Litany Threat over time, WR steal aggro, Engage catch-up aggro, ecc) but best way to improve your tanking abilities is just experience, so go out and do many instances/skirms/raid
Many guardians oversee the usefulness of using whirling retaliation in favour of the 'regular' retaliation skill. Whirling's got a threat transfer component to it, leeching a bit of aggro from everyone in your group within a certain radius. While certainly not a game-changer, it adds up.
If aggro persists to be a major problem, start traiting 5 blues deep (my picks are generally Shield of Fire/Threatening Presence/Harasser(!)/Litany of Challenge/Grim Challenge, where grim challenge can be switched out for the Stamp CD reducer for interrupt-heavy instances. Trait the legendary blue capstone, Litany Master, and up your crit rating to anywhere between 3 and 6k unbuffed. Have captains critbuff you instead of the more common parry, and the amount of litanies you'll get off on targets is massive.
There's solid advice in the posts above me aswell!I might upload a pic of my build later, at work now though so I can't log on.
You should also not feel too bad about not being able to keep aggro off a well equipped hunter. If they're in strength stance they deal out #### loads of damage and it is incredibly hard to keep threat off them as they just generate too much
Can we please get rid of this outdated piece of knowledge for good? No hunter worth his salt currently switches to Strength Stance for maximum DPS while grouping. Precision Stance is the way to go since RoI.
So if you have a hunter using Strength Stance in your group, breathe a (little) sigh of relief, he is making it a bit easier for you.
There is NO need for any DPSer to focus that much damage on a single mob. Especially hunters in strength stance can easily attack two mobs at the same time, instead of focusing on a single mob.
Now I am not tank either, but this piece of advice strikes me as odd.
If I were tanking I would want every DPSer to focus on the RAT, so I can focus my threat generation on that one as well. Once every ranged randomly switches to other targets (and likely different ones if you have more than one in a group) that to me sounds like a sure fire way to get some unwanted attention.
Perhaps it's a minor note, but one main stat you might want to boost is Agility. Agility will reduce your miss chance (and with your Agility, you're looking at quite a few misses). If a threat skill misses, so does the threat it generates, so increasing Agility will help to boost your threat (as well as DPS as a bonus).
Here's my build, as promised. Using 2 agi/crit crafted relics, an agility legacy and some jewellery pieces to boost my agility (crit, parry/evade, miss chance(!)) as much as possible without losing too much survivability (read, vitality). Only buff I have at the mo is the 1600 parry buff from a cappy, usually parry sits around 4.8k unbuffed, 5.4k-ish in threat stance. I've hidden the offence tab as it's not very relevant, the other stats're more important, but as a sidenote, my crit sits on 2.5k in this build, I switch out jewellery and gear when I run routine instances (foundry, RoF) for more crit, more threat, so the group can go through faster without me struggling with aggro.
In terms of "improvement" in regards to keeping threat, you really don't have a lot of options available so I'll just go over what I can see from your pics, and have to make a couple of assumptions which can be corrected.
1. Legacies...you have all that is on offer - Threat Up and maxed too on a 2nd age!! Good! You now have done the maximum possible improvement to threat VIA legacy items (5% perceived on the belt passive is pretty tops too).
2. Gear - you can't gear for threat. So no worries there. That said...you can KINDA build for threat in the sense of having a good block rating RE: getting reactives open early and often (Litany of Defiance and Shield Taunt being some of our strongest threat skills). 6500 block is nice actually, before ward. If you really want to improve that, it has already been suggested the Bracelet of (?) Strength Remembered - kindred reputation from Theodred Riders.
Having more might would improve that further, but should be incidental to whatever gear you choose (i.e. having more might is good, but don't specifically aim to stack it). Some notable improvements are the Orthanc sets (3 pieces at least have might, the other 3 agility), various jewelry (Bracelet of the Unbent Knee from Draigoch = 122 vit, 61 might, 162 morale)
In fact there's a spreadsheet with plenty of stuff listed, but essentially a lot of strong pieces out there (along the lines of bracelet/ring/earring/pocket which are 122 vit, 61 might and morale/block/inc. healing).
3. Traiting - MAXIMUM threat is the blue line (defender of the free). If you are fine in regards to power and happy to lose some of the utility of say...the yellow line (fighter of shadow) - it could be worthwhile trying 5 blue traits with the Litany capstone legendary (level 58 class quest).
This is your "Threat stance becomes 28%", "more threat from various skills such as shield taunt, the damaging shield skills etc" and also the "critical hit litany" a stacking threat buff the same as regular Litany, but as said...stacks (on critical hits of some skills).
I mean other than that in relation to THREAT...not a lot you can do.
HOWEVER one of the best things a guard can do currently is make themselves more appealing as a tank, you are aiming for that just looking at your comments and your build, you are trying to make yourself be the "hey take THAT guy with us...I barely have to heal him until a boss" or just know your stuff.
But finally...most importantly: Group game. Warden taking threat from you in a situation where they are not SUPPOSED to (e.g. Orthanc / other raids in which it is NOT smart for 1 person to take all mobs) - you tell them. You tell ANYONE doing this.
A guardian or warden should be SHOUTED at for trying to steal threat when it is not their turn or not their duty on whatever is being tanked. Especially shouted at if by doing so - mob turns around and whacks the group.
But equally - everyone ELSE should be shouted at for:
Going all out DPS from the very beginning (in Orthanc there is ONE boss where it is absolutely and undeniably necessary to do this - Shadow Tier 2 Challenge).
Not managing their own threat (almost everyone has utility to reduce or pass threat along)
Not giving you at least a SMALL portion of time to build some initial threat. As said, our strongest threat is gated. Ignore the Pain - our wound removal skill, IS a great opener for bosses and allows immediate use of Litany/Taunt, but still people can wait 10s.
Reason? Most important bosses in the game 'unlock' their abilities as the fight goes on, meaning most at the beginning are just turn based "I hit you, you hit me, how glorious!".
Probably missed a whole bunch of things I want to say, but man...at least you're trying. Tanking is an art and more than anything - situational awareness will be your strongest tool. Knowing when to kite or stay put, being ready to pick something up (off of someone else) if it tears off onto another person etc.
Listen and be willing to learn...oh wait you're doing that already. Excellent work - it'll only get easier from there.
(wardens are nice btw...I believe a guardian and a warden in the same raid as long as they play nice with each other is one of the strongest tanking combinations possible when both are playing to each other's strengths).
Puny metal sticks not stop Dargnahk!
Kinship: Neled Gwaith - Guardian/Burglar/Captain/Minstrel/Hunter 75. Champion, Lore-master 65 or above. Rune-Keeper (47), Warden (31).
Not sure about this 100%, but your melee "threat output" is too low (99dps only). This has to be max. out, then decide which legacy to upgrade. Also your shield rank is not at max. level, get this to max level so your shield skills do more threat/dps.
If you have the DL set, i suggest to make a 2nd set-belt + weapon just for this purpose. Add WF legacy, GW duration and CaB/WF hheals to it and switch between both belt/weapon on the fly when needed. Add to the DL set +5target legacy, this makes this set more usefull[good opener set, grab adds and switch to tanking belt/weapon].
burg provoke is weak but i dare say wardens do seem way tougher than my guard.. maybe because i pvp so much now... get 500+ agility those misses realy realy hurt try a more balanced build having 20k moral is not that important..
If you are using block-stance, experiment with threat stance (and trait for the 28% extra threat).
If you are using threat-stance, experiment using block-stance.
Essentially, it comes down to your playstyle, and your equipment. (you will want to have a guardians belt with as high passive threat as possible) and remember that dealing damage also = dealing threat; so it may help you if there is a little bit of damage output while tanking.
What you will want to do, is to start combat with a high threat skill, possibly Shield-blow, or even Challenge is the situation calls for it. Then you will want to make sure you keep the threat high, and you do so by keeping skills such as Litany of defiance up, Vexing blow regularly and Whirling retaliation towards the end of your rotation.
If you still have problems, try the following: perform a Whirling retaliation then follow up with Engage on the target who currently has aggro. This will A) reduce other peoples threat and B) make you the most threatening target. So that means, even after engage runs out, you should be on top of the aggro-management list.
You will only hold the aggro against a warden, if the warden does not want to get it.
This has nothing to do with broken EoB as someone has written before, since our EoB is already fixed.
Moreover we can generate a lot more threat, since in between our threat generation we build up our defense and heal ourself. If at any time a warden wants to gain the aggro lead, it's not a big deal to reach it.
So if you loose aggro against a warden, leave it to him, it was his intention. Your only option would be forced aggro and aggro set, to regain a mob from a warden. But after your 15s the warden can get it back easily, if he wants to.
Dunno that much about Guardians gear to tell if there is a major fault in there, but i'm pretty sure it shouldnt be much more difficult for a warden to steal the aggro if you are at maximum aggro generation or not.
Sidenote: dont tank 17m near a warden, thats our EoB range. With that thing we still generate high theat. If the warden is in your group, increase the distance to 26m so our aggro leaches don't reach you. Actually the warden shouldnt be in your group if it's not intended to switch aggro and good wardens care about their guardian mates.
When a dps guy reaches the aggro lead, use your aggro set skill and tell the guy to slow down a bit. The damage has increased a lot, but not the threat generation. Even a warden has problems to get everything done (threat,defense,heal) on those dämmätsch-dudes. So if those guys like to tank then let em tank.
Last edited by llRaidenll; May 03 2012 at 04:17 AM.
In the months since the release of the expansion threat has become a major isssue for guardians. Whereas at the start of the expansion it was easy to keep threat we now have the follwing from DPS classes:
1) 1st age weapons
2) Classes reaching the crit cap with buffs/food and the new crafted relics.
3) DPS with 35k+ offence rating.
Sure, guardians mitigations and morale have improved but our ability to generate threat has hardly changed. Simply put we are unable to generate threat to overcome the increases in DPS.
Some of the suggestions in here may help a bit but with DPS as potent as it is now our threat skills are simply not up to the job.
What you will want to do, is to start combat with a high threat skill, possibly Shield-blow, or even Challenge is the situation calls for it.
Be sure to realize that while Challenge has it's uses during the opening phase of combat it is not a great threat builder. You'll have aggro for 10-13 seconds, but after that aggro will go back to being calculated from the threat list.
If you like using Shield-blow to build threat check out the ToO set that grants a ToT for Shield-blow. Very handy.
Originally Posted by lutemaster
If you still have problems, try the following: perform a Whirling retaliation then follow up with Engage on the target who currently has aggro. This will A) reduce other peoples threat and B) make you the most threatening target.
This I would not recommend. If you do choose to perform these skills this way at least reverse the order. That way you'll be copying the highest value of threat prior to depressing it with WR. Also note that WR will only transfer threat from other players within 10m of you and that it's a "small amount" of threat. In raids it's much more powerful if you're performing WR next to 11 other players. In fellowships it's utility is diminished next to other skills you might be using instead, but certainly not useless. If you're trying to max out your AoE threat I'd still work it in, particularly if you have the legacy for it.
One minor nit: you use Engage on mobs, not players who have aggro.
Originally Posted by lutemaster
So that means, even after engage runs out, you should be on top of the aggro-management list.
Engage running out? What does that mean? As far as I'm aware the only aspect to Engage that "runs out" is the movement speed debuff, but that doesn't seem to be what you're talking about.
This I would not recommend. If you do choose to perform these skills this way at least reverse the order. That way you'll be copying the highest value of threat prior to depressing it with WR.
I myself use ebbing ire the moment I get aggro (there has been a thread in the champs forum if its better to use ebbing ire regularly or only as an emergency skill), but as much as I understood from other posts, if you compete with a champion about aggro, best thing would be for you first to copy the aggro, and then the champ using ebbing ire on you, reducing his own threat.
But that kind of communication is something that probably wont happen in a pug
I myself use ebbing ire the moment I get aggro (there has been a thread in the champs forum if its better to use ebbing ire regularly or only as an emergency skill), but as much as I understood from other posts, if you compete with a champion about aggro, best thing would be for you first to copy the aggro, and then the champ using ebbing ire on you, reducing his own threat.
But that kind of communication is something that probably wont happen in a pug
Yay for Ebbing Ire! There are pros and cons to using Ebbing Ire proactively vs re-actively and I'm sure they have been covered in the Champion forums ad nauseum.
If the penalty is negligible then waiting to use Ebbing Ire (assuming the champ is the one at the top of the raw threat list) until the moment you pull aggro gives the tank more threat per use of Ebbing Ire. Doing so soon after Engage, as you mentioned, gives the champ not only the best threat margin possible from the tank by Ebbing Ire, but also gives the tank the most threat benefit for the entire group by Ebbing Ire. It's also simpler for the champ to just keep it in their pocket until they pull aggro.
There are probably more situations, though, where proactively Ebbing Ire is a better use. As a tanking guard I don't mind if the DPS snaps aggro for a moment as long as the penalty for doing so is negligible. In some raid encounters snapping aggro, even for a moment, can result in a wipe. There's also the situations where the champ is not the one who's snapping aggro but proactively Ebbing Ire would have prevented someone else from doing so (or at least staved it off for a while). The downside is the champ has to have a good feel for the threat generation of the tank vs themselves and ensure they do not outpace the tank before Ebbing Ire is available again.
Chat with your tank before attempting this, but one trick is to Rise off whomever has the most raw threat and then Ebb onto the tank. This might cause a quick aggro transition, which is why you should discuss with the tank/group before performing this, but once you Ebb back onto the tank the tank then has a whole lot more raw threat than just a moment ago. And if the tank was a guard they didn't even have to use Engage to do it! EDIT: Ignore this. It is no longer viable due to the updates to Rising/Ebbing Ire.
Every group is different. In my opinion, as a general rule a champ playing for the benefit of the group might consider proactively Ebbing Ire. It's just good medicine; it shows in the amount of control/DPS available during an encounter. And a controlled encounter is usually met with a higher rate of success.
Yay for Ebbing Ire! There are pros and cons to using Ebbing Ire proactively vs re-actively and I'm sure they have been covered in the Champion forums ad nauseum.
If the penalty is negligible then waiting to use Ebbing Ire (assuming the champ is the one at the top of the raw threat list) until the moment you pull aggro gives the tank more threat per use of Ebbing Ire. Doing so soon after Engage, as you mentioned, gives the champ not only the best threat margin possible from the tank by Ebbing Ire, but also gives the tank the most threat benefit for the entire group by Ebbing Ire. It's also simpler for the champ to just keep it in their pocket until they pull aggro.
There are probably more situations, though, where proactively Ebbing Ire is a better use. As a tanking guard I don't mind if the DPS snaps aggro for a moment as long as the penalty for doing so is negligible. In some raid encounters snapping aggro, even for a moment, can result in a wipe. There's also the situations where the champ is not the one who's snapping aggro but proactively Ebbing Ire would have prevented someone else from doing so (or at least staved it off for a while). The downside is the champ has to have a good feel for the threat generation of the tank vs themselves and ensure they do not outpace the tank before Ebbing Ire is available again.
Chat with your tank before attempting this, but one trick is to Rise off whomever has the most raw threat and then Ebb onto the tank. This might cause a quick aggro transition, which is why you should discuss with the tank/group before performing this, but once you Ebb back onto the tank the tank then has a whole lot more raw threat than just a moment ago. And if the tank was a guard they didn't even have to use Engage to do it!
Every group is different. In my opinion, as a general rule a champ playing for the benefit of the group might consider proactively Ebbing Ire. It's just good medicine; it shows in the amount of control/DPS available during an encounter. And a controlled encounter is usually met with a higher rate of success.
I KNEW its worth it to lurk in other classes' forums, thanks for the additional insight
I don't think you can Rise then Ebb quickly enough. They are one skill now, with effect determined by your stance. I imagine switching stances will not reset the cooldown.
A spaceship from another star / They ask me where all the people are
I tell them I'm the only one / There was a war, but I must have won
I don't think you can Rise then Ebb quickly enough. They are one skill now, with effect determined by your stance. I imagine switching stances will not reset the cooldown.
This is a quote from someone else, but I think it generally applies:
All things being equal, if the tank is dying, it is the healers fault. If the healer is dying, it is the tanks fault. And if DPS is dying, it is their own fault.
Ok it is a generalization and not always true, but close enough. If any tank could always hold aggro regardless of what other people do, there would be no point in having an aggro system. WIth an aggro system, DPS players should only DPS right to the edge of the aggro their tank can hold.
One of probably many exceptions to the generalization above is: if DPS is right at the edge, and your group still can't take something down before the healer runs out of PoW and the tank drops, then that is another thing. If DPS still has power when that happens, the tank needs more defense to survive longer.
Again all very generalized I know. But I find many DPS players panic (or try to show off) and do too much burst damage early.
While most of the advice in this thread is good - it is very general. For some advice on what kind of rotations are good for max threat and what skills generate the most threat for you I suggest you take a look at these three posts:
I read the first few post and this wasn't mentioned so I might be repeating.
Early in the game I noticed that I would loose agro on mobs others were attacking. The reason is they are doing so much damage. One solution is the spam AoE threat skills, and to switch targets but what do you do about that DPSer that just keeps pulling aggro? Do you hit engage to or challenge to get it back, focus on them for a bit or what? I found myself chasing after mobs only when they were being attacked by someone else and then I would loose someone to healing agro and everyone would die.
Solution: When I run in groups we use a Main Assist or off tank. We pick a Champion or Captain or Warden or another Guard to put in the assist window (sometimes a Hunter). This person just picks one target and attacks it until it is dead. Then everyone in the group tries to attack that one target. If we get serious that person will call out "new target" when they switch to a new target so someone isn't left drawing aggro because they are the only one attacking it. With a little work from the rest of the fellowship keeping aggro off everyone but the Main Assist is pretty easy. I also give permission for the healer to heal the Main Assist sometimes because I'm not going to worry about getting aggro back from the target the whole fellowship is working to bring to a quick end. AoE attacks can cause problems but if the group holds off those for a bit it usually isn't a problem. I found that using this method lets me focus on the healer and saves my good aggro skills for when I loose threat to the healer. I can also switch targets at will and not worry about some lame hunter targeting through me and drawing aggro from the guy I hit one skill on just to keep ahead of the healer. (An added bonus is that the healer is then left to focus heals on two primary targets, the Tank and the Main Assist, and themselves if needed.)
Losing aggro is not always the Tanks fault. Loosing aggro to the Healer is a problem, loosing it to a Hunter is not a problem.
When I tank with this system I can only be blamed for loosing aggro to the healer. If AoE's are drawing threat that person needs to lay off them.
What most guards don't realise is our Legendary Trait, Litany Master. On crit vexing blow, sweeping cut, shield-smash (if traited) and shield-swipe apply a stacking version of litany of defiance on target. You can stack about 20% crit with relentless (plus shield-spikes) with sacrificing some mits/morale/bpe and I guarantee you you will never lose aggro. You can stack up to 8 I think litany of defiances on target which is VAST amount of aggro, not to mention other skills like shield-blow, fray the edge, shield-taunt etc etc. I started working on such a build (never finished it though - bored and there wasn't an actual need). the lvl 72 crafted bracelets are ideal for this build ( 57 vit, 257 morale, +567 crit), I also used the dev relics, the block gems (to maintain some block), I have the old morale runes (+200 morale, +100 power, +200 i think crit defense) plus the crafted might relics. The block clasp necklace, dragon cloak, 5 pieces of the threat ToO gear, 1 DPS piece (Gloves i think that give crit/morale). Like I said, i didn't really finish my build, but I remember doing the numbers and the outcome was kinda like: 16% crit, 16k morale, 21% block, 10% parry, 3% evade, 15% inc heal, and like 64% mits with guards ward (unbuffed stats). This is more of a crazy aggro production build for runs like acid t2c where you need to nuke down the boss in 90 seconds, it lacks some survivability though (kinda low morale/parry/evade). Note: Litany master is considered our AOE threat generation skill, but just like I stated above, you can use it for single target too and it works really fine since skills like sweeping cut/shield-swipe are consisted of 2 attacks and having such a big amount of crit (plus counter-defense on target if you got a burg) one of them 2 attacks will crit which means you will get a litany of defiance on target every time you hit those skills.
But please, don't tell me that guards have limited threat generation, i mean really guys.......... And say you get unlucky alright. No crits/misses/target bpes your attacks/resists, guards still have OH SHIZ skills like challenge/engage/challenge the darkness, skills that are more than enough to counter the bad luck factor.
thanks, feel free to comment/agree/disagree w/e
Last edited by Therealmvp; Jul 03 2012 at 01:57 PM.
Courage and honor are the two greatest qualities of mind.
Aristotle
Yeah what's your point? This is the most common strat because it takes away the noob factor (ie: Oh I lagged and hit the pool, oh sorry guys I didn't see the pool, oh dam my bad guys let's do this again etc etc).
We' re talking about guard's threat here, not discussing strats for acid t2c.
Last edited by Therealmvp; Jul 03 2012 at 03:46 PM.
Courage and honor are the two greatest qualities of mind.
Aristotle
Even if you do the 90 sec tactics, you have the tools to keep boss on you for 90 seconds. You don't need the blue legendary skill. The stacking damage over time could be useful for longer fights. But in the longer fights usually there is no huge burst of dps on boss so less chance someone will pull aggro. So the blue legendary is not really needed.
Traiting 4 blues and 3 yellows is a good build, it gives a little bit more survivability, but if you want to maximise threat you go 5 blues and stack some crit. As for those long fights you are mentioning, there are not any long fights atm. ToO tier 2, most part of it is a DPS race (except the trash pulls for example or Saruman tier 2), you need aggro, the DPS goes crazy, i'm not talking about foundry which you can tank in overpower. As for having the tools to keep the boss on you for 90 seconds, if you are refering on force-taunt locking the boss (challenge, engage, challenge, challenge the darkness, challenge, engage, challenge) in theory it is possible, but the thing is, the DPS goes that crazy that when you engage you will lose aggro in a few seconds because the boss is melting, some hunter friends have devastated the boss with pen shot for 7.5k, champs doing an overall of 12k ish damage with brutal clobber etc etc), you need to keep up threatwise and save your oh shiz skills as a backup. This is the only run in RoI where there is a challenge on being a guard to keep aggro. Just think about how much extra aggro you produce with 18-20% crit chance, PLUS stacking litany of defiance on target like crazy, as for losing 300 crit defense, 10% shield damage, big deal, I trait 5 blues and 2 yellows (Stoic and the +900 block trait or protection depending on the run). I don't know what people you' re running with, but the people i'm running with go CRAZY when it comes to DPS, so i go CRAZY in threat.
Courage and honor are the two greatest qualities of mind.
Aristotle
I trait either 4 yellows 3 blues or 5 yellows 2 blues. So only 20% percieved threat in GT. I don't use any legendary cap, always running with GT, CtD and Shield Smash.
I usually trait Selfless Defence and put Protection on the highest hitting hunter. Champs use Ebbing ire whenever it's off cd. Burg uses provoke. So no big problem to hold aggro most of the time.
In Orthanc, on Lightning T2C I never have aggro problems when solo tanking it. On Acid T2C I have never tanked boss, I always tank adds, so can't say. And we do it the normal way, not the 90 sec nuke. Fire and Frost I have never done challenge, but we did T2 with nuking 1st boss fast (not as fast as challenge though) and I don't have aggro problems, as I always ask for highest DPS people in my group so I can use whirling retaliation.
Shadow T2C, there might be problem sometimes on start if some skills miss/are resisted. I usually run in with Pledge to get as many block and parry responses on start, I build up as much threat as I can and after 10-15 sec I use challenge. Around this time 1st shadow pool is down and I move the boss. Before Challenge expires I hit engage and continue building threat. If no skill misses/gets resisted, it's OK. If not, hunter probably will pull aggro and I use Challenge the Darkness immediately. After 1st wave of adds comes, it's impossible to lose aggro.
Anyway, traiting Litany Master might be useful, but I don't really want to sacrifice survivability just to build up crit rating. Without crit rating, it's useless.
Last edited by Gomar_Eldar; Jul 03 2012 at 07:22 PM.
Century Member Online status:
Reputation:
Guardians Sucks [pic]
. I dont' know what to do, i thought i have the right Legacies and Relics on my LI's. 
Senior Member Online status:
Member Online status:
Just Got Here Online status:
Senior Member Online status:
Member Online status:
Senior Member Online status:
Originally Posted by Spasmistic
Senior Member Online status:
Grand Member Online status:
Senior Member Online status:
Senior Member Online status:
Senior Member Online status:
Member Online status:
Senior Member Online status:
Poster of Note Online status:
Junior Member Online status:
Senior Member Online status:
Senior Member Online status:
Senior Member Online status:
Reply With Quote
Posting Permissions
