Thread: Coordination: Passive Ability For LMs, Please Implement This

For those of you who don't know what this does, whenever your pet lands a critical hit, your next induction skill has the induction reduced to 0. This can only come up every 10 seconds and you must wear 6 pieces of the feldskyn pvmp set to have this ability. Turn this bonus into a passive ability for ALL Lore-masters, from level 1. This should make pets much more useful, and many LMs would be happy with this. Please seriously consider this and I'm sure many people are going to agree that this would be a great, balanced addition to LMs.

Seriously that would be awesome.

eh. I suggested this and I earned it in PvP. I love it and I wear it almost always.


It's a lot of fun. Had it since it came out at 65 and I think it should be something earned =p


Still, it is awesome and every LM should experience it....

This is the best suggestion I've seen for a long time.

In the official classthread for RoR, I suggested LMs to get a similar skill to the one hunters have (needful haste). But I totally agree that this suggestion would hugely improve the LM-class greatly. We are just too outdated on our current induction-based skillset, and we really need a revamp or something like this post suggests to get the respect that we deserve.

Im an active EM-player and I know how 'vulnerable' we've become especially with the introduction of the audacity. I've been wearing my Feldskyn-set for many months now, and I'm sad to see it go away as I want one of the new sets.

Imo coordination was ok pre U6 , now it's just not enough .

Definitely not enough .

And if they're touching pets , I rather seeing them fixing them , not just giving them another situational buff .

With the new class ranged item of +crit for pet. My pets do crit a lot and I do get the Coordination buff a lot.


It's so fantastic in the moors to get off a lightening-quick lightening storm or ents or BE or what have you.....


And your DPS is upped a lot even in PvE when you can just suddenly, and sometimes quite unexpectadly, do an instance Cracked Earth or Gust of Wind for 1500 on 5 targets, then on to the next skill. It's beautiful.


Anyway, with the new terrible implementation of commendations where they're making us grind all over again, I think I'll be using it quite a while since I don't think audacity is a big deal and I don't like the new set bonuses. I really love the coordination buff and I do sorta wish there were even more ways to avoid interruptions since we are so induction based.

Parables, CotV, and Coordination make me a very scary LM in PvP. But sometimes, you really just can't get a skill off....

Agreed! Awesome!! one of the best ideas ever.
totally + rep!

Neat idea, i love it!!

Would love to see this implemented!

Excellent suggestion, +rep for you.

PvE: No. There isn't any need for it in PvE.
PvP: Yes. I agree, that it would be nice in EM

as long as they fix it so that it does not remove the induction on map skills. really lame when LM use this set to insta-map from a fight in the moors.

How about adding this to the Brooches instead of a passive ability.

Brooche of Rage:

+Pet Critical chance
Whenever your pet scores a critical hit, -100% induction on the next cast.
Cannot be triggered more than once every 10 seconds.


Brooche of Defence:
+Pet evade rating
Whenever your pet or your air-lore target evades an attack, active Beacon of Hope Cooldown is reduced by 10 seconds.
Cannot be triggered more than once every 10 seconds.

Originally Posted by grinko.at

How about adding this to the Brooches instead of a passive ability.

Brooche of Rage:

+Pet Critical chance
Whenever your pet scores a critical hit, -100% induction on the next cast.
Cannot be triggered more than once every 10 seconds.


Brooche of Defence:
+Pet evade rating
Whenever your pet or your air-lore target evades an attack, active Beacon of Hope Cooldown is reduced by 10 seconds.
Cannot be triggered more than once every 10 seconds.

You shouldn't need to have these items to have the passive ability, I want this to be like flanking. It should be something LMs always have.

Originally Posted by Souku

as long as they fix it so that it does not remove the induction on map skills. really lame when LM use this set to insta-map from a fight in the moors.

That's been fixed a while. It was fixed before any other LM on my server even had the set....

No offence to the people that love this. I like the ability to but it would be so OP if every LM could have this with out having to wear a suit that nerfs Will. This is the best dps/useful bonus LM suits have had for moors play.

I support coordination as a passive skill ! =D

Not only PvP would be better for LMs, but PvE too because no inductions = higher DPS if the class is soloing or doing damage in a group

Originally Posted by Wilantuk

No offence to the people that love this. I like the ability to but it would be so OP if every LM could have this with out having to wear a suit that nerfs Will. This is the best dps/useful bonus LM suits have had for moors play.

I could probably change your opinion on this.
1. Pvpwise, think about all of the past updates since the cap was 60. LMs have slowly but surely been getting weaker as a class in the moors. They used to be one of the most feared classes. We're now nearly as easy a target as hunters, but we don't have anything to make up for this squishiness. We cannot kite, our debuffs are pottable, our cc lasts milliseconds, our aoes arent devastating anymore. Yellow line is useless for pvp, blue line is useless for both pvp and pve. On top of all this, we have one reliable self heal on a long cd and can't even get our skills off. We need some love.

2. The few people that have this set will not wear it now that we're forced to wear the audacity gear.

3. If you read my first post, you would see that this effect is not a very potent one. Not only does your pet have to crit, but you can only get the bonus every 10 seconds. But this is good because LMs would start using other pets instead of the raven, lynx, and spirit ball. The tiger, eagle, and bog lurker would be the best pets to try to obtain the coordination effect. But ravens and lynxes would still be good pet choices.

4. There is no reason a LM should have to nerf their will to have this ability. I don't even have to explain this. This ability just adds more depth and interest to the class. It works for healing skills and sticky tar as well.

Overall I think LMs need much more than just having coordination as a passive ability, but this would be a great start. As people have stated in other threads, the class needs a revamp. It hasn't gotten any love in a long time.

Since you asked, I kindly decline. What little challenge is left in skill execution and between the odd stun, extra mob or whatever upsets the combat, I personally enjoy the challenge. Inductions have been reduced, skills have been combined, strengenthed and even "perma-switched ON" (heightened Will).
With a little planning and the right pet/trait combo, crits are more frequent anyway.

And besides, isn't the effect your suggestion a result of having achieved certain armour? Wouldn't that negate the effort it took to get that armour combo? I don't PvP, but wouldn't folks complain if we all got the same result?

Cheers.

supporting...i think

Let me change your opinion. A every 10 sec insta cast is extremely OP. It adds more burst to a class that already can burst for crazy damage. I have a rank 7 lm i have pvped on a lm at least alittle bit. A good lm with this bonus should have a very hard time losing a 1 v 1. If they even do lose them.

Originally Posted by Wilantuk

No offence to the people that love this. I like the ability to but it would be so OP if every LM could have this with out having to wear a suit that nerfs Will. This is the best dps/useful bonus LM suits have had for moors play.

Isn't an offence ... really looking on loremaster pet and after try to tell more about us !!!

In pve isn't really important the induction of 1 sec or 1,5 sec or become istant ... anyway you will have the animation time ... ( every skill after cast have another 0,5 of animation befor you can do aniting )

Now try to use your pet versus an enemy level 76 or more ... and tell me how many time will miss ...

In etten is the same. The hit of the per are really weak a lot of time will miss and every pet are really slow before they can hit an enemy !!!

At last ... if this skill become a skill passive or in a legendary or whatever ... don't e worry !!! Every creep can kill your pet with 3 hit and you will forget you OP !

Originally Posted by Wilantuk

Let me change your opinion. A every 10 sec insta cast is extremely OP. It adds more burst to a class that already can burst for crazy damage.

The set bonus doesn't give you an instant cast every ten seconds. It gives you an instant cast when your pet crits, which isn't as often as you'd think because in pvp there is movement, critical defense, misses and avoidances. I've had 1v1's when it only procs once, others where it never proc'ed. Don't get me wrong, the instant casts are great and its a good set bonus, but it's not nearly as OP you make it out to be. Also, the set is now extremely easy to get. If it were that OP, you'd see every LM out there using it.

Also, for the record, my champ/minnnie/RK burst for a lot more than my LM

And, like anything that procs, you can't be married to it.

That is, you can't just buy time hoping it happens. You have to keep playing and it happening is a nice bonus.


I say this because I see too many LMs are married to flanks or, in this case, a pet crit for coordination. If I'm PvPing a 3v1 or a hard 1v1, a coordination for a tar, ents, lightening storm, or slow/stun can certainly win the day. But you can't rely on it. Just like you can't rely on flanks. Pay attention, and if it happens, great. If not, you gotta be good without it.


I say this because of how rare coordination is and because I see a lot of threads about 'What pets flank more' and it just sorta makes me chuckle. Take advantage of it if it happens; but don't let yourself get spoiled by it or relying on it.

Now that they've made the set bonus so easy to get. Those of you who haven't PvPd in your life can now get it. Just get to r7 and get it!

As far as making it just a default passive for LMs? No thanks. The class is challenging, with a lot of skills. I don't like inductions just as much as the next guy, but keep our class unique and challenging. We don't need a bunch of Coordination-based LM babies out there

This is the closest idea I've seen to a good one since everyone got on this "LM with no inductions" kick people seem to be on. However, I think as a passive it would be way too OP. There's a reason you couldn't unlock the bonus until R9 for the armour.

I think having it on the brooches is actually a spectacular idea, but as it only requires one piece of gear instead of six, and doesn't require you losing any other stats, perhaps nerf the actual effect. (Make it every 30 seconds maybe?) I think it's a good base idea but needs some tweaking in order to keep us balanced.

become overpower for a proc with 10 sec cd for every crit of your pet for have istant ?!?!

The cd of the skill is the same ... you cannot use ent every 10 sec istant ... your burning embers atm in ettens if give a damage like 800 is a good point !!!

Really have cast istant is OP !?!? After a crit of a pet ? well looking on the induction of the other light armor and tell me how much induction/damage have

A BA can send me istant skill for 1k damage while jumping like a rabbit !!!
RK running in a circle for hit you with more fast and great damage ...
Ministrell well no comment running for play song give damage and can heal him self for that ...

I can't belive in a so OP skill if proc coordination it's only way atm for doing damage in etten !! Cause if you have 1 or 2 warg with a good rank on you tell me how many time youneed for use a simple burning ember ... stun or root can be removed after become useless ... if you wanna try to slow your enemy while they slow you istant ( burning need 1,1 sec and have anoter 0,2 of animation too ) i can't belive lore master can become OP !!!!

Originally Posted by Guiwinner

A BA can send me istant skill for 1k damage while jumping like a rabbit !!!

If you're 1v1 BAs and consistantly losing, you're doing something wrong.

Originally Posted by TinDragon

If you're 1v1 BAs and consistantly losing, you're doing something wrong.

He didn't say he was losing to BAs (I have no idea how a LM could ever lose to a ba anyway lol), he was just saying that pretty much every induction class in this game BUT LMs has some kind of on the move dps skill. BA punctured target used to be a 2s induction skill that would root you in place, and had a 10 second cooldown. Now it has a 5 second cooldown and is usable on the move, to in a way match the hunter skill penetrating shot. And also BAs can now move during their animations after their inductions.

Lol dont talk at me like i havent a clue how an LM works. You have stun immunitity ONLY class in the game that gets this. You have the best debuffs- even dps traited. You have pets that can almost guarantee a crit. Stacking BE does 1k dmg every 5 secs without casting anything else. You have tar to kite people through. You have an Aoe insta stun and root. Gimme a break a good LM is a sight to behold in the moors as it destroys things along its path. All that being said i would rather play my champ because i do think champs are in better shape. However an lm is far from nerfed and would be quite OP with way higher will and a insta every 10 secs or so. That buff stays on you for a little bit to its not like you gotta insta cast your next skill you can use that buff when it is most advantageous to do so.

Originally Posted by Wilantuk

Lol dont talk at me like i havent a clue how an LM works. You have stun immunitity ONLY class in the game that gets this. You have the best debuffs- even dps traited. You have pets that can almost guarantee a crit. Stacking BE does 1k dmg every 5 secs without casting anything else. You have tar to kite people through. You have an Aoe insta stun and root. Gimme a break a good LM is a sight to behold in the moors as it destroys things along its path. All that being said i would rather play my champ because i do think champs are in better shape. However an lm is far from nerfed and would be quite OP with way higher will and a insta every 10 secs or so. That buff stays on you for a little bit to its not like you gotta insta cast your next skill you can use that buff when it is most advantageous to do so.

"Lol dont talk at me like i havent a clue how an LM works."
After reading your post it seems that you do have no clue how an LM works.

"You have stun immunitity ONLY class in the game that gets this."
Yes, LMs have a unique skill... Your point? And champs are the ONLY class that has a 45 second sprint, so what? And minstrels are the ONLY class that can run 'n gun, burst dps for harder than LMs, while self healing for more than creeps can dps, CCing their target, and staying at full power. Please don't talk like SoP:R is so amazing. Yes it is a pretty useful skill but I am not going to settle for my class being a power sharing SI bot.

"You have the best debuffs- even dps traited."
Yes, LMs do have some of the best debuffs. That is the main role of the LM class. The skills don't just magically disappear when you trait dps. Just like burgs have some of the best debuffs and survivability while traited dps.

"You have pets that can almost guarantee a crit."
Okay? Lol.

"Stacking BE does 1k dmg every 5 secs without casting anything else."
Ha? You are going off base damage. Once you count in audacity and mitigations, that number drops down drastically even with ancient craft and benediction. And by the way, benediction requires a raven pet to use which does not crit much at all, so the LM would not be having coordination proc often. Plus good luck even getting three burning embers off on something that is attacking you without stunning them to get in a couple seconds to get off some of the inductions. Oh wait... Nevermind... Can't do that, stuns last 0.5 seconds and dazes last 0.1 seconds, and STILL can be potted.

"You have tar to kite people through."
Well, tar was only ever good for kiting reavers and debuffing fire mit. And now resilience gives a 10 second in combat brand, hamstring is -35% traited, blade toss -40% (and hits hard), so I'm not sure how a LM could kite a decent reaver. I sure know I can't be kited on my reaver.

"You have an Aoe insta stun and root"
And while using these skills they actually root the LM in place for longer than it CCs the creep, LOLOL.

"Gimme a break a good LM is a sight to behold in the moors as it destroys things along its path."
I'm a good LM, easily the best on my server. Yes I do often destroy things along my path (if I don't get zerged) because they are far from my skill level. Is this your point? That LMs are still powerful in the moors because a good LM can wreck a bad to average player? Because that's a pretty fail argument. In the current state of the moors, a good LM would ALWAYS lose to a warg, reaver, or defiler with equal skill level if both players had high audacity. Even an average flayer warg has a much higher chance than not to kill me because of the stupid brutal raking claw skill that has a 100% chance to proc a debuff that auto interrupts your inductions every 4 seconds for 16 seconds on a 1 second cooldown.

"All that being said i would rather play my champ because i do think champs are in better shape."
I won't argue with this. I definitely agree, champs are in much better shape than LMs. Hence I did level one to 75 but haven't played him much after getting a second age, don't want to take the easy way out.

"However an lm is far from nerfed and would be quite OP with way higher will and a insta every 10 secs or so."
How would it be op that a LM could have no induction every once in awhile? You don't even explain this, probably because there is NO way this would really be overpowered. So what if a LM could get off a skill once in awhile, instead of running around hitting staff strikes that are being either bpe'd or hitting 350s, and spamming SoB: Wizards fire doing hardly any damage? The LM still cannot move and has to perform the long animation of the skill when they get a no induction cast. Look at minstrels and rks, they have much higher dps, self healing, just as good CC (CC is so nerfed that a class with just one stun and a few mezes is just as effective CC-wise as a class with 6 stuns, 2 roots, and a mez), and are able to run and gun while doing it.

Originally Posted by Wilantuk

Lol dont talk at me like i havent a clue how an LM works.

- It seems that the problem is you think you have a clue.

Originally Posted by Wilantuk

You have stun immunitity ONLY class in the game that gets this.

- Wrong. Champions have a stun immunity skill. (and to a lesser degree burglars and wardens.)

lol champ stun immunity is quite a cost i wouldnt even compare it to SoP

Babaju you talk that your the best lm on your server? Man that server must have some really ###### lm if you play anything like ya talk.

Nothing i said was untrue even with mitigations Audacity may change the 1k dmg every 5 secs just for a secondary effect of a skill but i havent fought anyone with full audacity. You guys speak like stuns arent around anymore all they are is reduced. You still get your stuns to get your distance.
Edit: I am counting wizards fire dot in that 1k damage my apologies i didnt make that clear in the original post.

Maybe dont be the same ol #### lms and learn to be better ones instead of asking for a completly OP passive skill such as this threads about.

Can Lms faceroll creeps now? probably not it doesnt mean they need a huge update lol

Now now Derlan you are basing your theory LM's are fine by a small percentage of the population. If the moors was balanced off of that they would never have buffed wargs and spiders or BA's for that matter. This set bonus would be a viable addition to the LM arsenal. However, I don't think it should be given as a passive trait to all LM's. It should replace a trait in the MoNF line that way we have to decide on something to lose out to gain for it.

Originally Posted by Wilantuk

lol champ stun immunity is quite a cost i wouldnt even compare it to SoP

Babaju you talk that your the best lm on your server? Man that server must have some really ###### lm if you play anything like ya talk.

Nothing i said was untrue even with mitigations Audacity may change the 1k dmg every 5 secs just for a secondary effect of a skill but i havent fought anyone with full audacity. You guys speak like stuns arent around anymore all they are is reduced. You still get your stuns to get your distance.
Edit: I am counting wizards fire dot in that 1k damage my apologies i didnt make that clear in the original post.

Maybe dont be the same ol #### lms and learn to be better ones instead of asking for a completly OP passive skill such as this threads about.

Can Lms faceroll creeps now? probably not it doesnt mean they need a huge update lol

"Maybe dont be the same ol #### lms and learn to be better ones instead of asking for a completely OP passive skill such as this threads about.

Get off my thread, troll. This the last response you are getting from me because you will be on my ignore list. You have absolutely nothing constructive to say. You obviously do not play this class. You said we still have our stuns? TROLOLOL! If you are insulting my skill, without having ever pvped on my server just GET OFF MY THREAD. You are a complete joke and one of the biggest trolls I have seen lately. You said it yourself. You don't play a LM because champs are OPed. You have not made a single valid point in any of your posts. Here's a valid point for you to chew on: I play a rank 10 reaver and have ranked every other creep class to 6, BA to 8. Most creep classes can faceroll LMs. Can they faceroll me? No. Can they faceroll any other LM? Obviously.

Originally Posted by crowthorne

Now now Derlan you are basing your theory LM's are fine by a small percentage of the population. If the moors was balanced off of that they would never have buffed wargs and spiders or BA's for that matter. This set bonus would be a viable addition to the LM arsenal. However, I don't think it should be given as a passive trait to all LM's. It should replace a trait in the MoNF line that way we have to decide on something to lose out to gain for it.

Maybe this. Replace knowledge of the past for it.

if it's a pet-related skill it would probably end up in the blue line. i would rather see something like this as a legendary trait though, maybe they could replace the eagle trait with it and make the eagle a normal skill.

tbh if i do some error with lore master i will die for sure :S
It's hard for me running away from the enemy and self healing is only one.
very creep atm have a good snare and usually i give less damage then i take.
The debuff are good, sure but the problem is the time you lose for animation of that. And if will be resist you have lose a lot of time for die with a full heal creep !

If i miss my cd is hard kill a creep and tbh a BA can kill me if i can't go fast in melee ( atm i have only 3 audacity )
If BA have buff and a good rank can give me a devastate every 3 hit -.- i don't remmeber a devastate on a burning in etten :P

Originally Posted by Guiwinner

tbh if i do some error with lore master i will die for sure :S
It's hard for me running away from the enemy and self healing is only one.
very creep atm have a good snare and usually i give less damage then i take.
The debuff are good, sure but the problem is the time you lose for animation of that. And if will be resist you have lose a lot of time for die with a full heal creep !

If i miss my cd is hard kill a creep and tbh a BA can kill me if i can't go fast in melee ( atm i have only 3 audacity )
If BA have buff and a good rank can give me a devastate every 3 hit -.- i don't remmeber a devastate on a burning in etten :P

Late response- I agree, the debuff animations are long enough that some of the debuffs just take too long (EX: Putting fire-lore on a group of creeps already attacking you, or using storm-lore). Should've have to be rooted in place for these IMO, would be nice to see the animations for these changed up.