Thread: Now that TOR influenced PvMP... will Turbine finally fix LI's too?

now that we will earn commendations in PvMP (just like TOR), and use Audacity (like TOR's Expertise) and since TOR has you use the same weapon at every character level in the game... do we finally have hope that Turbine will finally listen to it's customers about LIs after 4 years or complaints about having to replace our LIs every time we level up?

this insufferable grind must stop. this intolerable treadmill is not friendly. as a free person of middle earth, i feel like a slave. "Replace your weapon!" says my taskmaster. "earn scroll of extra-greater empowerment! destroy your old weapon just to make me rich! just so you know that i am your master and you are my slave!"

there is a reason why 2 million people subscribed to TOR so quickly. it's truly casual friendly. the LI grind has never been casual friendly, and only ever rewards only the most dedicated slaves, nay! doesn't reward them with anything new or better. but "rewards" then with essentially the same exact weapon they had 20 levels ago! no improvement (except higher DPS proportionate to the higher levels) no more legacies, no more points to spend, no more abilities. just an exact replica of the weapon used 20 levels ago.

at least with the skirmish soldier system, more skill slots are unlocked at higher levels, more training slots, more personal slots. up to a point. (we really should earn more slots with the raise to level 75) and on a related note, we should also earn more virtue slots as well. we levelled up 10 levels and we're exactly the same character we were at 65, but with bigger numbers floating over our heads against mobs that (surprise) have bigger numbers to DPS through.

since you're following in the footsteps of TOR in PvMP, whether intended or not, please follow their footsteps with LIs, so we never have to replace them anymore. let them automatically grow more powerful as our characters level up... and give us new ways to improve them (like more legacies and more points... demoralize could easily be a legacy some would want on their LI, for example)

and besides, you still haven't given us the second half of the LI revamp that you promised us way back when.

I thought the reason 2 mil subbed is because of Bioware/EAs super duper hyping and PR campaign, plus the Star Wars setting?

Regarding LIs, I would love to be able to keep my items, but it probably won't happen. To make them stay with you would likely(I am no MMO coder, so don't take this as fact) require the Devs to start from scratch, which besides the immense technical work involved, you can only imagine the rage that would stem from people losing their hard earned stuff.

P.S. I really wish people would stop regarding anything Turbine says it wants to do as a 'promise'.

Edit: May have sounded hostile in retrospect, I truly would like for them to do this, I just have my doubts that they will go back and tear out the old system is all.

IMHO - The probability is near zero. Turbine has monetized the Legendary Item system via the store. Turbine needs the grind and the destruction of existing items to drive people into the Lotro Store.

SWTOR is not going to having any impact on Turbine in this area. There is no mass exodus of players because of the SWTOR implementation. People will leave but Turbine is expecting that.

Rift allows free character transfers. Both Blizzard = WoW and Turbine - Lotro charge 25 dollars for a single transfer. There is been no mass exodus to Rift over the free character transfers. Blizzard and Turbine have ignored the situation.

The current business model for Lotro has moved in the direction of get the mark into the product. Mine their wallet during the heavy addiction phase 3-6 months before they get bored. It is no longer the old style P2P game time model where you sink your needle into a vein drain a little bit of blood every month for years if you can.

You are a customer at level 65 with a full set of maxed out legendary items. Turbine is thinking the only money get can get from the Yula Bunny is 30, 40 or 50 dollars for Rise of Isengard. Yula is a lifer. He got all the content. We really don't want him playing and not paying for a year. Similar issue with a Premium player. VIPs since they get five doilars of Turbine Points a month, they are not very profitable unless Turbine can get them to buy Turbine Point packs. Turbine needs store items to sell to them.

I know it will never happen. I would to see their detailed financials for Lotro. I has seen this kind of information for some products and some companies. It is an eye opening fascinating read. There are real suprises for the naive. Things that make many dolalrs than you expect. You get to the must be joking - It costs what??? to do this.

Originally Posted by Yula_the_Mighty

I know it will never happen. I would to see their detailed financials for Lotro. I has seen this kind of information for some products and some companies. It is an eye opening fascinating read. There are real suprises for the naive. Things that make many dolalrs than you expect. You get to the must be joking - It costs what??? to do this.

check out the the LOTRO store... best sellers... Scrolls of Greater Empowerment will definately be near or at the top of the list.

there are still ways they can make money off the LI system if they change it to what we expected when Jeffrey Steefel first lied about it, er i mean, told us about it before Mines of Moria. it's way too stale. especially for those of us with muliple level-capped characters.

i honestly think they won't address any further changes to LIs until after Rider's of ROhan launches, so they get plenty of feedback on the new mount system (where i'm afraid they'll probably use as an excuse for another cash grab even worse than SoGE) and then possibly change the LI system based that feedback... however, i'm not holding my breath.

One of the complaints I've heard a lot about TOR is its weapon & armour system - Once you get a modifiable weapon (Immediately) and armour (Random loot drop?) thats it for equipment, it takes all the fun out of rewards...

Originally Posted by GoldenusG

One of the complaints I've heard a lot about TOR is its weapon & armour system - Once you get a modifiable weapon (Immediately) and armour (Random loot drop?) thats it for equipment, it takes all the fun out of rewards...

you got that wrong ...

the modable weapon is just a shell, you have to fill with items you get as reward, buy or craft ...

theres always one component that dtermines the level of such shell-item, for swords its the heft,
for body armor parts its the armarment-mod ...

apart from that core-item a shell-item can have 3 to 4 additonal so called modification items
so you not only have a great variation in combining all different kinds of modifications, stat and bonus wise
you also have much more to wrap your mind around and think about ...

in fact every part of gear is a legendary item in swtor, every piece of equipment can be a shell-item
filled with up to 5 additionel items ...

so you have 5 armor parts, up to two weapons, and three slots for implants and stuff ...
makes 10 parts of equipment multiplied by up to 5 ...

if turbine would do a same system with modifications sold in the store ... oh boy ...

they could have made the LIs shell items right from the start, its hard to believe
they cant do it cause of technical limitations ... I dont know ...

but the fact that LIs are so un-legendary is the most downing part about them
next to the anyoing glow wich takes away all the beauty of the artworks ...

Originally Posted by GoldenusG

One of the complaints I've heard a lot about TOR is its weapon & armour system - Once you get a modifiable weapon (Immediately) and armour (Random loot drop?) thats it for equipment, it takes all the fun out of rewards...

This really is an issue because it does feel like you have nothing to look forward to at times. Also, the grind is still there. Have you seen some of the prices on top notch mods? They can be very expensive.

Now that Audacity is being added to the game I have no desire to attempt PvMP/MPvP. They say that they want to slow down the pace of combat, yet this means that CC that breaks will be of increased uselessness. In some cases this is needed to counter high ranked players. The worst case scenario I envision is not that the playing field will get closer, but rather that the higher ranked players will not be stoppable.

EDIT to be back on topic.

I loved the mod system! It let me run around in the slave bikini on my Shadow tank for 40% Damage Reduction and 10% expertise. Quite a lot of the endgame SWTOR looked too much like a stuffy bathrobe. Personally I'd kill for the ability to change some of the glowing baseball bats (clubs) that LoTRO legendaries are to something that doesn't look like it's been saran-wrapped and dipped in glitter.

WTB Morrowind Improved No Glow, price negotiable

A reasonable middle ground would be to have the weapons glow when danger is near aka in combat.

http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.p...ob!&highlight=

We understand that Turbine have to make money...but the point I am trying to make is that they need to take at least a little bit of the grind away...afterall, there wont be much more money coming in after people finally get fed up of the work load...as I have said before, they can take away even a little bit of the grind and still make money whilst keeping us loyal (for now) players happy...come on Turbine, stop tryin to bleed the new guys dry as quickly as possible and think more long term.


Signed

Loyal to LOTRO from the start (but for how much longer...?)

Originally Posted by Nyrion

you can only imagine the rage that would stem from people losing their hard earned stuff.

Don't need to imagine it, we see it every time the level cap goes up.

Originally Posted by Forgotten_Legend

now that we will earn commendations in PvMP (just like TOR), and use Audacity (like TOR's Expertise) and since TOR has you use the same weapon at every character level in the game... do we finally have hope that Turbine will finally listen to it's customers about LIs after 4 years or complaints about having to replace our LIs every time we level up?

With all due respect ...

Claiming that all changes happening right now have all been influenced sole by TOR is just as silly as the countless "TOR will kill Lotro" we had just a few months ago.

Hi everyone!

Just figured I'd pop my head in here because I haven't jumped in on a good old LoTRO bashing thread in a while. And, seeing as how some think my every desire in life is to shoot down any new game that comes out or is about to come out, and defend LOTRO blindly, I'd hate to disappoint.

First and formost, when a new game comes out and has some good features to it, most MMOs will take a look at what's working for those new games and pick up a few ideas for their own game.

So, if LOTRO did copy TOR with the PvP accolades, good. A good game should always seek to improve, using any source of influence available. Score one for TOR and LOTRO if this system makes PvP/PvMP better.

That does not mean that LOTRO will or even should implement every good feature from every new game. If LOTRO takes a look at, say, a leveled weapons system from another game and decides not to copy it, there are probably many reasons, and yes some of those will be motivated by financial considerations, workflow, etc etc.

So, just because your pet game has a weapon system you prefer to the LI system, does not mean it can or will get added to LOTRO. In fact, as some suggest, if it did there would be massive complaints. Although many people believe the LI system needs to be fixed, very few are advocating a global reset or a complete redesign unless players are somehow allowed to transfer all the work they have put into their LIs into this supposed new supersystem.

In closing, an accolades system is pretty easy to tack on to PvMP. Porting LIs into a completely new system would be difficult and potentially fatal if it fails to address players wants.

And just to say it, TOR isn't really breaking any new ground and neither will Guild Wars 2. They are different, sure. But nothing they do or propose will alter the MMO landscape.