Throughout Update 6 and Update 7, we will be modifying the economy of the Ettenmoors by replacing Destiny with a new capped currency called “Commendations”. Commendations will be the primary currency for both Freeps and Creeps, requiring a re-costing of all barter vendors and skill trainers in PvMP. Read more in today's Developer Diary from Jared "Kelsan" Pruett and post your comments here!
Are commendations replacing all stones, sigils, seals, brooches, crests, tokens of valor-- there are a lot of barter items in the moors. Which ones are being replaced?
Looks interesting. I guess this is also a way for even low ranked creeps to get access to all the various skills and traits without having to grind for months to get to a high rank?
Edit: Did I see mention of a season? And a new PvMP stat? Any info on what that will entail?
Make PvMP combat the primary source of Commendations, reducing the need to PvE for PvMP advancement.
Im really baffled because its either turbine dosent read the forums or they are very stupid.
1.Its being developed by Kelsen. He dosent have the trust of creeps for numerous valid reasons. That ship has sailed, you’re now putting forth a currency change led by him? Should have had the new guy write it. Again, do you not understand creep players don’t trust this guy? Do you care?
2.Combat as the primary source, have you not read the forums about the incredible disparity in damage? Is there going to be an update to creeps to compensate for the freep damage output before this is implemented?
Its always 2 steps forward, 2 steps back with you people you really don’t seem to understand the portion of your player base who does PvP. Currency isnt the problem, you’re wasting development resources, fix the imbalance you created with the uncapping of stats for the PvE expansion ROI.
Unbelievable. Lol And yes Sapience I read the whole thing.
Looks interesting. I guess this is also a way for even low ranked creeps to get access to all the various skills and traits without having to grind for months to get to a high rank?
No:
A prime example: Ensuring that at cap a Creep can purchase all skills, racial traits, and corruptions available at their current rank.
You still have to meet the rank requirements. If anything this just holds you back and forces you to get kills to buy skills rather than farm slugs to get them. It's another hurdle.
edit: If you want to be REALLY angry about it look at it this way: you already have the currency required to buy your skills(destiny), turbine is saying, nah you have too much of that, you need a new thing now, those other points are just for perks. But don't worry you can still buy skills in the store if you can't kill anything to earn commendations.
So since DP is going to be awarded for leveling only, one can assume that the DP perks used by many raiders are on a direct path to Store-only acquisition... how quaint.
Are the available DP perks being modified?
As in, those of us with 300K+ Destiny that only use it for non-Moors PvE (raiding and such) - what will be different? Will we lose our DP? Are the DP perks getting nerfed into uselessness?
Commendations sound pretty good for PvMP, I like that change.
Here is my concern however: how are we supposed to acquire the current destiny point perks we get currently? Are we just supposed to rely on the measly DP we get for leveling, and then (once again) go to the Store and buy the rest? That's the part that I absolutely hate. By all means, remove DP as part of a very messy pvmp advancement system, but removing it entirely and not providing an in-game alternative to access some of the other perks DP can provide is just going too far.
Ghost Bear see problem. Nice peoples looking at Horse mouth. Ghost bear look at Horse belly. Horse make good snack!
I have 709,000 destiny points.. the only way I can use them is buy creep advancements.
This is utter nonsense, so instead of have poeple easily grind destiny points, you will remake ALL of us grind something else!!!!!!!
Wish I could report this announcement as harrasment. Becuase clearly instead of doing something contructive, you are forcing us to regrind something. That should be bannable offense to the dev who thought of this!
Just unbelievable!
I pretty much have not been playing at all in the moors, once a 52 hunter critted me for 1.5 while I critted him for 900 something..
Im sure my warleader will have like 30 k morale by end of the year and still hit for 900, while guardians will have 22k morale and hit twice as hard.
I give up. My favorite part was the whole , to get people to fight. You know what will get people to fight? fixing our classes, giving us instanced zones that rewarded both sides to enter and fight each other.
So since DP is going to be awarded for leveling only, one can assume that the DP perks used by many raiders are on a direct path to Store-only acquisition... how quaint.
This was exactly what I was thinking after reading this article, seems like a BS way to get people to spend more money on DP perks, something a lot of people already do.
Honestly I don't think this change appeals to anyone, sounds like a pretty stupid idea.
So since DP is going to be awarded for leveling only, one can assume that the DP perks used by many raiders are on a direct path to Store-only acquisition... how quaint.
Are the available DP perks being modified?
As in, those of us with 300K+ Destiny that only use it for non-Moors PvE (raiding and such) - what will be different? Will we lose our DP? Are the DP perks getting nerfed into uselessness?
So since DP is going to be awarded for leveling only, one can assume that the DP perks used by many raiders are on a direct path to Store-only acquisition... how quaint.
Are the available DP perks being modified?
As in, those of us with 300K+ Destiny that only use it for non-Moors PvE (raiding and such) - what will be different? Will we lose our DP? Are the DP perks getting nerfed into uselessness?
Originally Posted by nolins12
This was exactly what I was thinking after reading this article, seems like a BS way to get people to spend more money on DP perks, something a lot of people already do.
Originally Posted by RicardoFurriel
This. Some answers would be nice
Yep. Looks like I'll be very conservative about using DP for the time being.
A related question: will the instance quests that give DP still give DP after the Update? Stoneheight, Northcotton Farms, the Moria instances? Or will the sole source of DP truly be through leveling (which would give us what... 15k DP per new level 75?)?
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Oh look, another nerf to creeps. The only way to acquire DP is by leveling? So once creeps' supply of DP runs out they will no longer be able to buy buffs unless they play freep? Please stop ruining PvP worse than it already is.
Yep. Looks like I'll be very conservative about using DP for the time being.
A related question: will the instance quests that give DP still give DP after the Update? Stoneheight, Northcotton Farms, the Moria instances? Or will the sole source of DP truly be through leveling (which would give us what... 15k DP per new level 75?)?
Good question. That would effectively cap DP for a PvE player unless they want to grind it on alts like TP. Is that part of the intent?
You still have to meet the rank requirements. If anything this just holds you back and forces you to get kills to buy skills rather than farm slugs to get them. It's another hurdle.
edit: If you want to be REALLY angry about it look at it this way: you already have the currency required to buy your skills(destiny), turbine is saying, nah you have too much of that, you need a new thing now, those other points are just for perks. But don't worry you can still buy skills in the store if you can't kill anything to earn commendations.
Wishful thinking: Maybe they'll lower the rank requirement on many of the creep skills?
The rediculous of amount of time you have to spend playing a creep is the main reason I don't spend much time out there. It just takes so long to feel any real advancement, all of which is tied to getting an insane amount of infamy.
I mean, if they are making it so Freeps don't need a certain rank to get PvMP armor, they should give a similar bonus to Creeps.
PvP players can earn two types of Commendations: Warzone Commendations from Warzones and Mercenary Commendations from open world which can be used for buying high level PvP gear with PvP Stats.
Don't understand the defeat within 60s of retreat thing... Maybe you could elaborate a little bit. Seems way more complicated than it needs to be.
I kind of like the rank removal on pvmp gear. Hopefully the "seasonal" gear that's rumored will be comparable to pve instance gear - for those of us who quit playing the game for pve.
Oh look, another nerf to creeps. The only way to acquire DP is by leveling? So once creeps' supply of DP runs out they will no longer be able to buy buffs unless they play freep? Please stop ruining PvP worse than it already is.
They don’t get it dude, sadly I truly believe now it’s a waste of time even trying to be constructive. I mean this is what this guy kelsen has been working on? Are you kidding me? Make sure you go and read the update carefully, these parts in particular:
Earning Commendations Commendations earned via questing (both PvE and PvMP) · PvMP quests that previously gave Destiny will give Commendations. Quests will reward players with 20-100 Commendations per quest.
Commendations earned via player defeat · Defeating an opposing player will provide roughly 50 Commendations. · For launch, Commendations awarded by defeating other players will use the existing contribution system (all players in group receive the full Commendation value of the target, assuming they are within range). · The current Diminishing Return system will remain in place for Commendations.
LAUNCHING POST-UPDATE 6 Commendations earned via player defeat · The awarded Commendations will be divided equally between all contributing players. Contributing Players are classified as any player that does damage to the target or heals a player that damaged the target.
Examples: If there is only a single contributor that player receives 200 Commendations If there are 2 contributors, each receives 100 Commendations If there are 6+ contributors each receives 30 Commendations.
· Diminishing Returns are applied each time a player is defeated within 60s of retreating. Each defeat within 60s of retreating reduces that player’s Commendation value by 20% with a maximum reduction of 90%.
Example: Player A is defeated within 60s of retreating and is worth 20% less Commendations. Subsequent defeats within 60s of retreat reduces his value 20% more. His value cannot be reduced below 90% His Commendation value would look like this: 200/160/120/80/40/20
· Defeating a player that is lower level will also return less Commendations in a similar manner to Diminishing Returns. Each level of difference the amount of Commendations awarded is reduced by 20% to a maximum reduction of 90%.
Now reconcile that with the current damage disparity in the moors, ergo freeps who are benefitting from the uncapped stats from ROI and the ridiculous damage output, that were not equally compensated for on creepside will be gaining far more Commendations.
It’s a bigger nerf then you think because not only are you loosing the DP you grinded for (he tells you to spend them now) you won’t be able to get as many as freep players assuming the disparity I pointed out still exists.
Kelsen continues to be a complete disaster for creeps.
Interesting change, cant wait to test this out myself.
Untill then, not saying anything about is it good or bad before I actyally get to try it myself.
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Echo the concerns over those of us who mainly play PvE and do PvMP to get DP to get buffs for raids and so forth. If you're taking away our source of DP, we need some sort of replacement--particularly for those of us with VIP accounts who in theory shouldn't ever need to buy additional TP.
If DP are going away entirely (and it's unclear to me if that's the case), I don't see any of the existing DP buffs listed as purchasable with Commendations.
Various Hobbits, Thwilda the dwarf lass, and Gnersk, Stalker
Echo the concerns over those of us who mainly play PvE and do PvMP to get DP to get buffs for raids and so forth. If you're taking away our source of DP, we need some sort of replacement--particularly for those of us with VIP accounts who in theory shouldn't ever need to buy additional TP.
If DP are going away entirely (and it's unclear to me if that's the case), I don't see any of the existing DP buffs listed as purchasable with Commendations.
It appears to me that the only thing going away is your ability to buy Creep perma-stuff for DP. Instead you'll acquire commendations and use them instead.
DP will still be a buffs currency acquirable in pve from the current PvE quests. ; The Moors PvMP quests will now award commendations.
People who were doing the PvE quests in the moors will simply do different PvE quests. Grand stairs daily, etc.
Since levelling will be the only source of DP will you be adding DP to higher levels as I didnt get any while levelling from 65 to 75 and not sure about 50-65
Removing the rank requirement on the pvp gear is idiotic, the more you pvp, the more pvp gear you have...its only rank 9 to get the whole set which is easily achievable by anyone who seriously pvps.
It appears to me that the only thing going away is your ability to buy Creep perma-stuff for DP. Instead you'll acquire commendations and use them instead.
DP will still be a buffs currency acquirable in pve from the current PvE quests. ; The Moors PvMP quests will now award commendations.
People who were doing the PvE quests in the moors will simply do different PvE quests. Grand stairs daily, etc.
Except I can't find where it says that those non-moors quests will still reward DP. Kelsan specifically states that DP will be awarded through leveling, implying that it is leveling ONLY.
I find the entire Dev Diary confusing, the rational behind the change just doesn't seem sufficient. What was the ultimate goal of this change?
At best it is just a timing issue with the release of dev diaries, where this was intended to address a longer term issue and that there will be another diary addressing the disparities between creeps and freeps. If that is the case, then shouldn't the changes affecting the more pressing issue have been addressed first then there would have been a more understanding audience waiting for the "How we are approaching motivation and reward for the future of the moors"?
At worst it is as the more vocal monster players feel, a complete misunderstanding of the underlying concern of the player base.
I'm hoping for the former and that, at a minimum, someone will say "There is more coming and it will address the balance issue".
I have a concern about those of us with a veritable stockpile of dull/bright/luminous/brilliant stones. If these are auto-granted as Commendations, won't we automagically hit cap at update -meaning any stones that would have sent us overcap will be wasted?
Thanks.
Also, is there anything in the works for monetizing freeside so premium players can purchase timed access or some other method?
"The role of Destiny will be changed to a strictly “perk” currency that will only be acquired through leveling."
Translation...
The least profitable customers are those who have been with Turbine the longest.
Lifetime accounts / Longtime VIP's are the focus of a money grab.
Your DP pools will dwindle over time...hehe..
but don't fret!
The LOTRO Store is there to help you on your continuing adventure to Mordor.
At best it is just a timing issue with the release of dev diaries, where this was intended to address a longer term issue and that there will be another diary addressing the disparities between creeps and freeps. If that is the case, then shouldn't the changes affecting the more pressing issue have been addressed first then there would have been a more understanding audience waiting for the "How we are approaching motivation and reward for the future of the moors"?
At worst it is as the more vocal monster players feel, a complete misunderstanding of the underlying concern of the player base.
I'm hoping for the former and that, at a minimum, someone will say "There is more coming and it will address the balance issue".
It’s the elephant in the room that we can’t get someone in turbine to acknowledge. We know it, you know it, freeps know it, my mother knows it (I talked to her yesterday, she’s doing fine by the way). We are getting updates from Orion, but it’s baffling why we can’t have a clear discourse about the uncapping of stats in ROI creating a large imbalance in damage output. Instead we have a confusing dev diary by someone who half the PvP players don’t trust to begin with.
This will only serve to fuel more animosity which is part of what’s so baffling to me about Turbine it’s like they don’t understand players want answers to the larger issues before a currency rework. It’s like updating the instance finder but draigoch is still brain dead….
We haven’t even had the parade of players who are on the anti store bandwagon yet. This is confusing enough that they will chime in soon enough, those perks from DP will they be available for TP?
Well there goes a few million DP down the drain for nothing along with the stone collection. Next step might as well be resetting everyone to rank 0 so we have no disparity in the game.
What inherent protections will there be to prevent, or lack thereof, to allow people to just help each other uh oh... im using the word... farm up the commendations?
Besides the diminishing return, which is easy to work around, especially freep side.
It’s the elephant in the room that we can’t get someone in turbine to acknowledge. We know it, you know it, freeps know it, my mother knows it (I talked to her yesterday, she’s doing fine by the way). We are getting updates from Orion, but it’s baffling why we can’t have a clear discourse about the uncapping of stats in ROI creating a large imbalance in damage output. Instead we have a confusing dev diary by someone who half the PvP players don’t trust to begin with.
I hear you and feel for you guys, I really do.
Originally Posted by Thorgrum
We haven’t even had the parade of players who are on the anti store bandwagon yet. This is confusing enough that they will chime in soon enough, those perks from DP will they be available for TP?
Not having to grind the delving for stones to get the consumables, horrible idea to begin with, is the only good thing about this change. The rest of it is bunk. I have over 500k DP myself. Off to buy the rest of the "skins" I didn't buy earlier, and I couldn't agree more that the DPS issues needed to be reworked before any "currency" issues. Unbelivable Turbine. /facepalm
I meant this issue specifically, but yes they are out. this is mroe fuel for them because those DP perks are nice and you bet they'll be in here soon enough with the "this is another money grab from turbine". Heck I dont even care if it is, I understand capitalism, but meh, im irritated (not with you) time to go to another game forum I haunt.
Also very concerned about what will happen to the dp perks which freeps can use in pve and whether dp will only disappear from the ettenmoors, or also from the other places in the pve world where you can get dp. Surely they won't make dp perks store-only in the long run? This would drive even more people away from the game out of dismay with how the store grows on the game like a fungus infection on globsnaga orcs. I hope we'll get a statement on this soon before we get another crazy angst wave like when store armour was announced.
One disadvantage about removing dp rewards from the ettenmoors: a lot of freeps go to the ettenmoors in part (or solely) because they earn dp which they can then use in pve, or on their creeps. Removing this could cause the ettenmoors population to drop even more, and possibly also make the divide between pvp and pve players bigger.
Also, is there anything in the works for monetizing freeside so premium players can purchase timed access or some other method?
Oh Gods...NO!!!
F2P/"Premium" players, I'm sorry if this offends you, but oh well. When F2P was released, VIP players were ASSURED there would be benefits to paying a monthly subscription, one of those benefits was PvMP would remain a subscription only area. Turbine broke that promise when they allowed F2P players on creepside. While it's not been as much of a disaster as everyone feared for creepside, it has NOT been anywhere near pleasant, as we had to turn those little f2p greenies with no skills other than what they'd purchased from the store into something that might come close to resembling a veteran creep. And those little f2p greenies had to suffer defeat after defeat before they were anything close to a viable player on the moors, because unless they had enough TP to buy all their skills, they had nothing.
Monetizing freepside for premium players? Ugh. Nightmare city. Don't ask for it. Just go pay $10 a month for a subscription. It's the difference between having two more Starbucks coffees a month and buying your way to being a permanent member of Ettenmoors society. It's well worth it. Just don't ask them to allow f2p/premium players onto freepside. Subscribers have lost enough benefits of subscribing already!!!
As for the Commendations issue. Turbine, you're copying SWTOR. Stop it already. This is Not SWTOR. It's LOTRO. Make it your own, don't copy someone else's stuff. We have Destiny and Spirit Stones for barter. Why can't that be good enough for you??? It's good enough for us!!!
The awarded Commendations will be divided equally between all contributing players. Contributing Players are classified as any player that does damage to the target or heals a player that damaged the target.
I'm kind of reading this that I shouldn't bother healing certain classes because they don't aoe at all, I'm better off maximizing my potential commendations by healing the big aoe classes and I'm better off doing a small, quick heal on everyone and hope for the best. In a raid setting, what incentive does a guard have to stay back and SW a squishy? Let me answer that: none.
Think I'll stock up on barter pots since all the stones I have will be worthless after this change, few other things I might as well update because, even though I don't pvp much, I have some accumulated items from over the years. I feel bad for the high ranked pvp'ers who are being set back to 0 currency; doesn't matter if they'll acquire 10k commendations in a week or so, they're still losing currency.
F2P/"Premium" players, I'm sorry if this offends you, but oh well. When F2P was released, VIP players were ASSURED there would be benefits to paying a monthly subscription, one of those benefits was PvMP would remain a subscription only area. Turbine broke that promise when they allowed F2P players on creepside. While it's not been as much of a disaster as everyone feared for creepside, it has NOT been anywhere near pleasant, as we had to turn those little f2p greenies with no skills other than what they'd purchased from the store into something that might come close to resembling a veteran creep. And those little f2p greenies had to suffer defeat after defeat before they were anything close to a viable player on the moors, because unless they had enough TP to buy all their skills, they had nothing.
Monetizing freepside for premium players? Ugh. Nightmare city. Don't ask for it. Just go pay $10 a month for a subscription. It's the difference between having two more Starbucks coffees a month and buying your way to being a permanent member of Ettenmoors society. It's well worth it. Just don't ask them to allow f2p/premium players onto freepside. Subscribers have lost enough benefits of subscribing already!!!
I don't see what the big deal would be, provided the cost/hour is kept at a level where any more than casual dabbling would make a Subscription a better solution. It's obviously different for Freepside than creepside - there are no insta-rolled characters, and gain skills the same way VIP do. I might get the bug to play PvP for a couple hours once a month. Since I've cancelled my sub, I've spent money buying content so I don't have to pay a sub. Now that I'm entrenched as a Premium player, the only thing left is Freepside PvMP. Plus, subscribers haven't LOST anything. The more people on the field, the more opportunities for .. commendations... Your anti-Freemium sentiment is so 2010, it's time to move on.
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