Thread: Hunter Parse Comparison

Originally Posted by kballard

Well Vieta, I guess I will post my "fail" red parse for you.

Same exact setup, food, scrolls hope only. No DP buffs or BH. I picked the same dummy as you for consistency. Unfortunately about 8-9s were added to the parse because I waited till combat ended to take the screen shot...stupid dummies exit combat when you apply a bleed and stay in when you are trying to stop. Oh well.

It was a little lower than your parse by about 80-90 dps, BUT if I were to use BH in the parse, there would be a LARGE difference (probably about 5%-10% ish) since my BH hits a heck of alot harder than the no traited one. Since you got about 5% dmg on my in that parse, it looks like the "fail" red trait is quite comparable. I don't know how many parses you took or if you just took the best out of a hundred, who knows, but it looks like that size of difference could be due to a few crits. That is my build and thoughts.

I did 2 other parses and got 2% lower damage on the second and a little higher on the third so very consistent (I chose the closest to the mean for statistics sake). A fourth gave abnormally low numbers and I was like "What the heck" till I looked up to see I was shooting at the armored dummy. Haha.


Thanks for the thread, I enjoy seeing comparisons so I can learn.

For clarity's sake: the parse was 205.8k in 2m15s (if you subtract the extraneous time at the end to exit combat).

That's really good for red traits. I can't see over 180K dmg on the dummy in 2 minutes when I trait reds.
Which orthanc set are you using? I've been wondering if the Red set makes up for the difference.

And that was out of 3 parses. I was actually rather sad because my parses were a lot lower then they were a week ago.
I had no problem hitting over 200K dmg before. The only thing I swapped out was the 7.5% dev mag. relic for a Physical mastery one...But I don't think that would have been what's dropped my dps?

Haha, funny story about the armor. I have downed the first 4 T1, F&F T2, and Lightning T2 CM, but still haven't done Saruman, since it is downed on Wed. in my kin and I can never raid on Wed. So I am using 4 faron set, which I was going to use for the moors when I get 5. I still enjoy traiting 5 blue in moors due to fleetness giving me more mobility for soloing creeps, but when I go in groups, I go 5 red for burst dps with BH. I have the seals to get 3 and a half more pieces, so I will finish my faron and start on my cudur set shortly. But yeah, I have experimented with blue vs. red for a while now and honestly your blue parse impressed me :P I always got a few hundred dps lower consistently. So it appears that I am probably playing that line slightly wrong or 5 Faron makes that big of an impact.

Originally Posted by kballard

No DP buffs or BH.

Since bowmaster is kind of built around BH, you should've used it.

Originally Posted by Estranger

Since bowmaster is kind of built around BH, you should've used it.

I realize that, and that is why I pointed our there would be a decently large discrepancy when I do use BH, but I wanted to prove that red can dps at a comparable rate to blue even without it. The only issue with red is you will be using more power pots as you will be popping BH more often :P

Originally Posted by kballard

I realize that, and that is why I pointed our there would be a decently large discrepancy when I do use BH, but I wanted to prove that red can dps at a comparable rate to blue even without it. The only issue with red is you will be using more power pots as you will be popping BH more often :P

It is actually quiet efficient power-wise, I think the -%power cost for 20s makes up more then enough for the power the skill costs.

Perhaps you are right, and I have not tested the power efficiency of it. By habit I pop a power pot when I hit BH, which pays for it. I am definitely curious if it pays for itself, especially since I burn through insane amounts of focus when BH is up. -20% on about 7-9 PS (BA doesn't count lol) is a sizable amount of power. From a rough calculation, assuming 8 PS, 3-4 QS, and 1 SB in the time of BH, which may be ambitious, would lead to power saving of about 300 power. So from a "back of the envelope" calculation, I would guess that it does not pay for itself, but I will do some testing to see.

Edit: Correct me if I am wrong but BH takes 20% of total power pool, which is about 600 for me, so I would guess it pays for half of it. However, 300 power for +50% dmg for 30s...worth it.

I was going do some parses with my various builds. One issue I have is that I am currently Premium so I can't get out to GV. Are the dummies different out there, because I hate the ones in Galtrev breaking combat constantly. One other thing. If people posted their trait build that would be cool to know too, especially people using hybrid builds. One other thing I actually run out of power pretty quickly on a dummy, being as my toon is basically built for raiding where there is usually a cappy and LM helping out with power (mostly cappy). I know I don't run out in raids, but I will doing something like this. I'll have to play around with it and see what I get.

The dummies are the same in both areas (except the armored one in GV)

Originally Posted by kballard

Haha, funny story about the armor. I have downed the first 4 T1, F&F T2, and Lightning T2 CM, but still haven't done Saruman, since it is downed on Wed. in my kin and I can never raid on Wed. So I am using 4 faron set, which I was going to use for the moors when I get 5. I still enjoy traiting 5 blue in moors due to fleetness giving me more mobility for soloing creeps, but when I go in groups, I go 5 red for burst dps with BH. I have the seals to get 3 and a half more pieces, so I will finish my faron and start on my cudur set shortly. But yeah, I have experimented with blue vs. red for a while now and honestly your blue parse impressed me :P I always got a few hundred dps lower consistently. So it appears that I am probably playing that line slightly wrong or 5 Faron makes that big of an impact.

That's interesting. lol
As long as you are using a focus bow skill inbetween every induction skill, then you should be good!
Very weird that we both get different results from the manner of traits.

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

5b/2r : Faron set 5bonus: Fleetness'

Self buffs
5% dam (total ranged 93,9%) Still miss some agility items.
Breachfinders

Used BH and intent conc.

5b/2r : Faron set 5bonus: Fleetness

Self buffs:
5% dam (total ranged 105,9%)
Breachfinders
+68 agi food
icpr food

Used bh

It might be helpful if we standardize the parses somehow, because ppl using BH, 5% dmg, and other stuff makes it to where I cannot really compare them well. Any suggestions to even the playing field?

Edit: But thank you guys for posting. But do Orion and Jalessa (dummies) have the same mits and such. I chose Jalessa since others had been using that one.

I didn't use scrolls, tokens, destiny etc because frankly I'm not throwing away things I can use in a raid just to look neat on the internet.

This is a picture of one rotation of the dummy.



(1882 agility, 103.2% offence, 20% Crit).

I tried both needful haste (1332 DPS) and Burn hot (1313 DPS, pictured).


I go 5 red 2 blue (Strong Draw, Deep Concentration for blues), with burn hot capstone and ToO burn hot set.

-edited for pictures etc

Originally Posted by kballard

It might be helpful if we standardize the parses somehow, because ppl using BH, 5% dmg, and other stuff makes it to where I cannot really compare them well. Any suggestions to even the playing field?

Edit: But thank you guys for posting. But do Orion and Jalessa (dummies) have the same mits and such. I chose Jalessa since others had been using that one.

I think BH should be used as when the redline users actually throw up some parses, you better believe they will be using it... plus it is a skill, so why not use it?

as far as the +5% damage bonus, it's simple. Take that player's total damage and divide by 1.05. for ex. in Tim's post, it said he did 1713 DPS, divide that by 1.05 and it comes to about 1633 DPS w/out the DP buff.

It would be nearly impossible to figure out the base DPS for people who used BH or focus pot or the like, but since nobodys seemed to have used a focus pot yet, we should probably leave that out of the equation.

Burn Hot - yes
fleetness - yes
needful haste - yes
breach finder - yes
oils - yes
ICPR food - yes
agility food - yes
DP damage bonus - yes (since it's easy to "true up")

focus pots - no


I would also like to see these parses in raid trim, opposed to stacking as much agility/crit/mastery stickly for the purpose of blowing up a dummy... use what you would normally use in a raid. So if you normally sit with 2050 agility in raid build, don't do your parses with 1000 less morale and 2300 agility... IMO

Well, it is trickier to compare raid builds since I sacrifice dps gear for morale, but I expect to make it up with raid buffs. So depending on how is in my fellow, and how much morale the healer is comfortable with I change out gear before boss fights. It depends on the fight and class makeup.

"as far as the +5% damage bonus, it's simple. Take that player's total damage and divide by 1.05. for ex. in Tim's post, it said he did 1713 DPS, divide that by 1.05 and it comes to about 1633 DPS w/out the DP buff."

If so, you should recalculate each dps since the 5% is just added to the physical mastery buff. Timmeg has 104% ranged damage, without the bonus, so ony by phs mas and agility, he has 99%.

My dps was 1431, but I only have 93.9 Ranged damag (only 1890 agility) (inclusive the 5%), so should you divide my dps by 0.93?

And what about strength stance, it adds 10% ranged damage, divided that by 1.10. ??
I think you have to look at the phys mastery percentage and post that togeter with the dps.
Then everyone can recalculate it by itself

So Timmeg RD 104%, DPS 1713. 1647 at 100% RD
Hannibal RD 93.9, DPS 1431 1522 at 100% RD
Vieta RD 104.8%, DPS 1616 1541 at 100% RD
Shredes RD 105.2% DPS 1650 1568 at 100% RD

Shredes also used 5%. see post:

I'll upload a Screeny later.
2217 agility
105.2% ranged dmg
22.1% crit chance
Buffs used:
Scrolls, Hope, Breach finder, fire oils, 5% dmg DP buff.

Another thing, What about Rain of Arrows? Should this be used? if crited on the 3 dummies then your parse would end up much higher from the stacked dmg. I vote to not use RoA or RoT.


The reason I did not use BH on my build because the CD on it is so large I didn't want to wait so long between each parse.

This is single target DPS. NO RoA/RoT/SS(lol)... period. Since we're doing 2min parses, any CD that's less than 2 mins is valid IMO, because it's infinitely repeatable in the 2 min intervals we're talking about.

That being said, here's some 5r fail for people to chew on. And I'm still 8 GSoEs from finishing the bow, and still don't have the red line 5 set bonus and there are a lot better wrists/earring than I've got. There will be a lot more damage where this came from. Sorry it's not 'legal' as it was only 1m 51s long, but the dummy reset on me in RIGHT before an induction so it ended the parse. The resulting 15s parse after was 1000 dps and no where near 15s of actual damage dealing.

5r/2b
NH/BH/IC/Breachfinders/Hope token/no scrolls/no focus pot/no agi food/non-crit ICPR food

I will reparse my hunter with BH. I am expecting about 230-240k on average, from previous parses. I will get a SS to post. But imho, 5 red is a VERY viable line and preferable to me.

Originally Posted by YesMaam

Only 1 way to get that extra +7% ranged dmg...Traited 7 reds!!! Don't you even use needful haste? :[

Ill parse again without the destiny buff. i only tried it once so ill see if i can get some better parses

After reading this thread i am very surprised how little DPS i do compared to the other people and there dps my states are as followed

Buff: none
Stance: Precison
Build: 5b2R
Set: Faron / Wood bound boots
Agility: 1951
Physical Mastier:28,537 (101.2%)
Crit:8,149
Crit (Chance):19.6
Crit (Dev chance):7.6%
Finesse: 4,982

i thought i was happy with my build (Only want 1 more ring of conflicr resolotion) until i notice my dps compared to others

no buffs at all, not even oils or chaints, BH not used
i dpsed the dummie 5 times each time i was around 125-140k damage in the 2 minute window



i may try a parse with hope/scrolls food and fire oil / chants to see how much more i do

I finally got my 5th piece of Orthanc gear today, so I went and did another parse. HUGE difference it makes when your pene shot only costs 2 focus. I was sustaining a good 1800-2000 DPS the entire parse...until I started running out of power.

I couldn't get a full 2min in because I just blew through my power. Used power pot and Intent Concentrate with the legacy.

Sooo, here is all the stats:

Traits: 5B 2R
Gear: 5 Faron, 1 Wood-bound Boots (From skirm)
Agility: 2,239
PM: 29,673 (109.2% dmg with +5% DP buff)
Finesse: 5,978
Stance: Precision


Buffs used:
+700 Mastery scroll
+45 Agility Food
+5% Dmg DP buff
icp/mr Food
+2% power from Power of the Elder Race trait
Fire Oils
Bow Chant-Greater Breach Finder (lvl55)
Focus pot (lvl45 +15% dev mag)
Burn hot used


Results!
at 1m47.7s (where I completely ran out of power with no pots to use)
1,788 DPS (was a good 1850+ dps before I had to use Intent Con. to regain power)
192.5K dmg total
25.5% crit
6.8% Dev

Screenies for evidence:

Note: Wisdom traited to help with power consumption




It's 12.3 seconds short, but It dropped to around 1500dps at 2min cause I could only get off like 2-3 skills with no power in that time lol

A good way to get some more accurate parses, IMO is to have an LM friend just feed you some power. With LM and Cappy's in raids power is almost never an issue, without them I run out of power almost instantly (especially if I have my 4R/3B setup running).

I realize these are all parses on training dummies and help create a baseline. My question, not intended to be a rude one, but has anyone parsed their DPS on any meaningful mobs or fights, such as in Orthanc?


I hadn't read this thread til now, and I was a bit disappointed to see only training dummy parses, though I completely understand them, as they were the OP's original intention and request. I just find actual fights to be more meaningful.


I'll make sure to SS my parses in the future and post em here. I parsed a 1317 DPS - fight duration 7m 52s on Bukot T2 (shadow) last night as the only ranged class. There's alot of switching mobs, but I was hoping to find a top-notch player to compare to for that fight.

IMO, there is no point in comparing raid parses. Every raid I do, it will depend of if I have a cappy in my group, if I have a rk or mini healer (buffs), if I have a LM, and the skill level of those players (does mini give off call to greatness every time it is up? or does cappy pop 2arms/OB at proper times). The dummies gives players a chance to judge how much damage they as an individual do rather than how good their raid is. Granted raid comparisons is interesting but not the point of this thread.

Originally Posted by Odin_of_Freyr

I realize these are all parses on training dummies and help create a baseline. My question, not intended to be a rude one, but has anyone parsed their DPS on any meaningful mobs or fights, such as in Orthanc?


I hadn't read this thread til now, and I was a bit disappointed to see only training dummy parses, though I completely understand them, as they were the OP's original intention and request. I just find actual fights to be more meaningful.


I'll make sure to SS my parses in the future and post em here. I parsed a 1317 DPS - fight duration 7m 52s on Bukot T2 (shadow) last night as the only ranged class. There's alot of switching mobs, but I was hoping to find a top-notch player to compare to for that fight.

I very much agree that raid parses are virtually uncomparable. Each raid is its own thing and each strategy lends itself to DPS in its own way. A MAJOR thing now is how much aggro a tank can pull because I felt very limited in DPS for a long time going into a fight with that old bow, with my new one I'm compelled to S:E QS for the first 30s of every fight (that's ~700DPS I'm throttled to).

I did 1179 dps over 8m 59s in my first Bukot downing. That's all I know at this point and that was done with the crafted bow that generates 8% damage for the raid. Given that this was our first successful downing and was a bit on the shaky side, I'd expect that number to go up another 100 dps, even with that bow. Unfortunately, I won't be using that bow anymore now that I have a first age to deal with. I'll give you an idea how the 1st age numbers go as we run.

Originally Posted by kballard

IMO, there is no point in comparing raid parses. Every raid I do, it will depend of if I have a cappy in my group, if I have a rk or mini healer (buffs), if I have a LM, and the skill level of those players (does mini give off call to greatness every time it is up? or does cappy pop 2arms/OB at proper times). The dummies gives players a chance to judge how much damage they as an individual do rather than how good their raid is. Granted raid comparisons is interesting but not the point of this thread.

I have to agree with you on that one ... also just the play of the classes. Are your cappies hitting War Cry when they unlock a defeat response or are they blindly hitting RC, is your LM using the Draig set for +5% on See All Ends. It can go on and on. I know i've had nights where I can't seem to get over 1300DPS in a Shadow T2 and others where I'm blasting through stuff at like 1700-1800. Too many variables to really make any kind of useful assessment.

Originally Posted by Odin_of_Freyr

I parsed a 1317 DPS - fight duration 7m 52s on Bukot T2 (shadow) last night as the only ranged class. There's alot of switching mobs, but I was hoping to find a top-notch player to compare to for that fight.

Originally Posted by Thraxz1982

Each raid is its own thing and each strategy lends itself to DPS in its own way. A MAJOR thing now is how much aggro a tank can pull because I felt very limited in DPS for a long time going into a fight with that old bow, with my new one I'm compelled to S:E QS for the first 30s of every fight (that's ~700DPS I'm throttled to).

I happen to be in the same boat. I only do Shadow T1 at the moment, and with even giving the tank 30s of ZERO damage, plus another 30s of QS in S:E, I still end up pulling with ~100-400k to go, and of course I ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS hear over vent "you need to watch your DPS" or "Hunters watch your aggro" etc... I feel like putting my first through my friggen monitor... sigh, I digress.

Like the posters above have commented, while I agree being in a raid setting will give more "real world" comparitive parses, without actually having 2+ hunters in the same group at the same time doing the same fight to parse (and even then I don't know if there are other classes buffs that effect only one target), it would be nearly impossible.

EDIT:

@Shredex - Do you have any stat tombs on? j/w

Originally Posted by SCHawks73

I happen to be in the same boat. I only do Shadow T1 at the moment, and with even giving the tank 30s of ZERO damage, plus another 30s of QS in S:E, I still end up pulling with ~100-400k to go, and of course I ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS hear over vent "you need to watch your DPS" or "Hunters watch your aggro" etc... I feel like putting my first through my friggen monitor... sigh, I digress.

Like the posters above have commented, while I agree being in a raid setting will give more "real world" comparitive parses, without actually having 2+ hunters in the same group at the same time doing the same fight to parse (and even then I don't know if there are other classes buffs that effect only one target), it would be nearly impossible.

EDIT:

@Shredex - Do you have any stat tombs on? j/w

I have the same issue in Lightning T2. We had a couple weeks in a row where I pulled aggro and got one-shotted immediately, got a rez and was able to just go full tilt. I think I'm coining this the hunter flop. All joking aside, unless you have a warden tanking (aggression is awesome) it just isn't fun to play a DPS hunter right now because our aggro management is just nil.

Before i post my own parse id like to know 2 things.

1) Is there any difference between Etten's and Galtrev's dummies?
2) Is it possible to have bugged CombatAnalysis, or some old version, which parses incorrectly?

Originally Posted by Sheepscalp

Before i post my own parse id like to know 2 things.

1) Is there any difference between Etten's and Galtrev's dummies?
2) Is it possible to have bugged CombatAnalysis, or some old version, which parses incorrectly?

1) The non armored GV dummies are identical to the Galtrev dummies.
2) I have not yet had any issues with CA, if your parse seems odd I'd suggest relogging and trying again. The current version of CA is 4.04.

Originally Posted by SCHawks73

@Shredex - Do you have any stat tombs on? j/w

I have +70 Agility/Vitality on Vieta

Nice to see the parses. In raids I something like 1-1.5k dps depends on tank.

Also it is interesting when I made the thread about how limited hunter threat/dps balance management is, I got quite alot of people who disagreed with that, even some -rep