Discussion: The 1/17/12 Patch Note Thread

Envoyé par Hrodberht

Er, what? I have the rep Return to Michel Delving on my Captain, who is definitely not a Hobbit.

Storebought is NOT a rep skill.

Rep Return to Michel Delving doesn't exist.

Envoyé par ChromiteSwiftpaw

Storebought is NOT a rep skill.

Rep Return to Michel Delving doesn't exist.

Hrm, well the game considers it to be that. :P I have a section for reputation ports on my skill list, and my Shire port is listed there. The tooltip says "Thanks to your friendship with the Hobbits......etc."

Did the moria instances become lower in level in the most recent patch, or during update 5? If so, why :/

I'm sure skumfil, dark delvings, the watcher etc used to be level 60, and they now read as 58.

Envoyé par Nellaen

Did the moria instances become lower in level in the most recent patch, or during update 5? If so, why :/

I'm sure skumfil, dark delvings, the watcher etc used to be level 60, and they now read as 58.

Not sure about the watcher, but the others were <60. 58 sounds right for most except GS which is 56 I think.

Envoyé par PerinStone

Not sure about the watcher, but the others were <60. 58 sounds right for most except GS which is 56 I think.

Everything used to be L56-60, but everything in Moria, except GS and Forgotten Treasury, got pushed down to L58 whenever RoI went live.

Seems that some creep mitigations went down even further when they were suppose to go up. So much for fixing creep mitigations.

And RK bug hasn't been addressed. When will RKs get the patch that lets them utilize all their healing potential without bugging out? People have simply refused to take RK healers on raids simply because they have a high chance of bugging out and ruining the fight. Pretty sure that would qualify as breaking the class yet it isn't even a known issue. lol

I've done Draigoch a bunch of times with a semi-regular group and we've never seen him bug out. Very curious that tonight after this patch we get our first glimpse at the brain-dead dragon so many have complained about in the past.

Envoyé par FormulaTroll

I've done Draigoch a bunch of times with a semi-regular group and we've never seen him bug out. Very curious that tonight after this patch we get our first glimpse at the brain-dead dragon so many have complained about in the past.

Uh oh......

from the patch notes:

If you are using [enable movement assistance] when using a ranged attack, you won't run all the way into melee range before using the skill.

I tested it today the 1st time with my RK in a skirmish. Occasionally he started to run towards the currently selected target. So this does not look fixed to me. Filed a bug report.

Captains Deeds still bugged : Echoing Shout / Adherent of Elendil

Reported/Bugged half a dozen times since Isengard, still did not made it to Know Issues

http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.p...ged&highlight=


And its just me or most of the Rhoirim great you with "Mae Govanen" and "Hope we get to Aragorns help in time" and such - that is are using the Grey Company greetings.


Not putting any faith in turbines willingness to do anything about it.

I like the fact they have correct the tradeable tokens for LI to any class again.

I don't Like (and I see it is the same with a lot of players), the non refund of skirmish marks spent. Why should players have to now spend 'real money' (TP) to correct 'ajustments' made to the game? Sorry the previous argument about jeans does not stand with this situation, Dev admitted the scaling was incorrect and lets be fair everyone got the impression or expectation there would be a refund. With regards to the 'jeans argument' that has been put forwards, Under trading standards faulty ietms must be replaced or refunded, the item in this case was faulty (not scaling correctly... like car with an over reving engine ).

Maybe it was to difficult to implement? if so why not either give a weeks code for a free skirmish marks refend (so we can do at least one toon), or just send one to all characters over a certian level?

Envoyé par FormulaTroll

I've done Draigoch a bunch of times with a semi-regular group and we've never seen him bug out. Very curious that tonight after this patch we get our first glimpse at the brain-dead dragon so many have complained about in the past.

Same for our group. We've done Draigoch a number of times without a single issue before. Tonight on our first run after 5.1 we also encountered our first brain-dead problem. GMs don't appear to be any better armed as they still have no way to address the problem other than to encourage players to try again at a future time.

Envoyé par monk_tbd

I think the NPC's name is Tad Leafcutter. It is one of the guys near the hunting lodge in Bree.
He used to trade the tokens for Skirmish Marks before which was not that big of a deal either as a simple logout/login converted them the marks.

So it's Tad who trades those Tin-, Iron-, Platinum- etc tokens then? I was running around skirmish camp yesterday trying to find the NPC who trades my tokens for Marks, as the tooltip clearly says "these can be traded for Marks in skirmish camps" or something like that.

Oh well, I'll better go and talk with Tad then when I get back from home, it's been a while since I have been talking with old fella so maybe he has expanded his services then

Envoyé par Gilean-EU

So it's Tad who trades those Tin-, Iron-, Platinum- etc tokens then? I was running around skirmish camp yesterday trying to find the NPC who trades my tokens for Marks, as the tooltip clearly says "these can be traded for Marks in skirmish camps" or something like that.

Oh well, I'll better go and talk with Tad then when I get back from home, it's been a while since I have been talking with old fella so maybe he has expanded his services then

I have tried 'talking' with Tad today, the option to exchange is there, but is apparently not active.

Does this only work during the actual anniversary event?

Showing time stamps works for system messages, like item xp gain, but not for user created channels. This is the exact opposite of what many people were hoping for. We want to know whether the latest message in the chat box is new, or five minutes old, not exactly when we killed the orc.

Ideally, we'd have tick boxes for showing time stamps on each channel, next to the colour selection, but if that isn't feasible, at least extend it to user created channels. Ideally too, we'd have a choice of formats. It can be the same for all channels, but we should be able to pick whether we want the date, or just the time.

Envoyé par welden

I also used the refund scroll purchased from the store. I got qround 12000 marks back. When I repurchased my skirmish soldier skills it took about half that amount to get my soldier back to his current lvl. So apparently the game data does calculate the refund by what was actually paid (pre 5.1) and does not use the current pricing schedule.

This is fine, but that scroll costs 295 tp and in fairness to the customer this should be made right so that no personal tp need be used to finish correcting the initial error. An easy fix would be to give everyone this scroll or at least a coupon code to get one for free from the store.

My 2 coppers worth of thought!

Welden

Thank you for the info mate. Good news on the refund then.
Pitty Turbine cant provide clearence on changes they do and players have to find out.
About having to spend TP to get the marks which i believe i am entitled to... well thats my fault for being a VIP.

Cheers

Lots of things here!

Envoyé par Laire

They went and adjusted how many marks you get when running skirms. A level 71 kinsman just ran a t1 skirmish: got 380 marks and 36 medallions

Envoyé par oaxaca_dan

yah, I just did the same - t1 battle in the tower through the IF - got 10 medallions, not sure how many marks, but around what you got.

How did that other guy get 36 meds?

I'm with the others- unless that 71 was running a 75 skirm (a bit skeptical on that one) or doing something else, or didn't keep an accurate count, I doubt they actually got anything close to those 36 medallions. I ran a half dozen level 75 tier 1 skirms yesterday on my 75 hunter and didn't get more than 10 in any of them. 8 was the norm, and that was with using the Instance Finder. Even if I'd used a scroll that boosted marks it would have only netted me 10 or 11 medallions on average.

Envoyé par Gilean-EU

So it's Tad who trades those Tin-, Iron-, Platinum- etc tokens then? I was running around skirmish camp yesterday trying to find the NPC who trades my tokens for Marks, as the tooltip clearly says "these can be traded for Marks in skirmish camps" or something like that.

Oh well, I'll better go and talk with Tad then when I get back from home, it's been a while since I have been talking with old fella so maybe he has expanded his services then

Envoyé par WickedWitch99

I have tried 'talking' with Tad today, the option to exchange is there, but is apparently not active.

Does this only work during the actual anniversary event?

Tad is trading. I traded in several of my tokens yesterday. Remember that it's a barter vendor, which means right clicking on them doesn't work. You have to left click which one, then click on the "barter" button. But he was working fine for me.

I do find it almost funny (but not quite) that they screwed up the tool tip on the tokens (no one in the skirmish camps takes the tokens like the tool tip says), and that they forgot the "Anniversary Token" tokens in addition to the metal based ones. Hopefully we'll have an option to turn those in come April for the next anniversary.


Side note- thank you to those that tested the mark refund scrolls! I'll be doing that today. Not liking spending the 295 points on it, but on my main I could really use those marks.

All right, I did some testing just a moment ago. First, yes, Tad Leafcutter outside Bree Hunting Lodge IS bartering Marks for all those extra Anniversary Tokens you have in your Barter Wallet. And you get 5-35 Marks per each token, so no need to have 5 tokens like it was before when you got gift boxes instead.

Then I tested that Skirmish Mark refund, using that...ugh... store-bought scroll. 295 TP, but as I had only one character who bought those ranks between RoI launch and 5.1, I thought that character lost most marks (all other characters had still lvl 65 soldiers, didn't touch them after RoI launch).

So, after RoI launch, and when I got to level 75, only then I bought all those missing ranks from 21 to 31 (or, whatever was the rank for lvl 65 soldier). I thought I saved most marks this way back then. But altough I had LOTS of marks, I still ran out, so I ended up having all ranks at 30 (lvl 74 equivalent), except one Training skill that was rank 27. Still with me? I hope so.

So, now I bought this Skirmish Mark resetting scroll, which gave me 34383 Marks back. Then I started to train those same skills back to the exact same that they were before resetting: Everything else at rank 30 except one training skill at rank 27.

I ended up having 26012 extra Marks! So, altough I hate to say this, I guess buying that scroll was worth it: 295TP for 26012 Marks. At least when you think how many solo skirmishes is needed to get that many marks...

So, confirmed, you can still use the scroll, even now after 5.1 is live, AND get back what you spent BEFORE.

Envoyé par Gilean-EU

I ended up having 26012 extra Marks! So, altough I hate to say this, I guess buying that scroll was worth it: 295TP for 26012 Marks. At least when you think how many solo skirmishes is needed to get that many marks...

So, confirmed, you can still use the scroll, even now after 5.1 is live, AND get back what you spent BEFORE.

Sounds like this might be a worthy purchase for my main then. I've been wanting to train up a different soldier anyways. It's just too bad Turbine didn't automatically refund our marks due to the adjustment, as they did in the past.

Envoyé par Gilean-EU

I ended up having 26012 extra Marks!

What also comes to play here: As a level 75 character it is cheaper to level a soldier up to rank 21 (or whatever) than it is with a level 65 character. So, technically, whenever you advance in max level, it would make sense to use that refund scroll and level the ranks up again.

Envoyé par FormulaTroll

I've done Draigoch a bunch of times with a semi-regular group and we've never seen him bug out. Very curious that tonight after this patch we get our first glimpse at the brain-dead dragon so many have complained about in the past.

Perhaps the available, previously randomly distributed, dragon brains have now been equally portioned out, leading in some cases to a *drop* in IQ :P

Envoyé par Gilean-EU

So, confirmed, you can still use the scroll, even now after 5.1 is live, AND get back what you spent BEFORE.

I'll triple confirm it (or whatever it would be, hehe). My skirm soldier was a ways from being maxed. Most skills I believe were around the rank 28-30 range, but I didn't look that close before I refunded. I got 22865 marks back, then maxed out everything and had around 4200 marks left over from the refund. Obviously I hadn't spent as much as some people but still a nice little some of marks to have left over.

Envoyé par scifispirit2424

"Players successfully dealing with this will now be required to deal with that."

What the frak? LOL. I have no idea what this means. hahaha. My ever and only wish is that one day they will fix the housing issues and address all of the concerns/complaints/suggestions about housing in LOTRO. So I guess for now, "that" is what I'm dealing with. lol.

It's a general joke about patching. Almost invariably, when one issue is solved, another one emerges. Any problem, either real or imagined, will only spawn a new one once corrected. Sometimes this means that in fixing one bug they accidentally create a new one, and so a problem people have already developed their own work-arounds for is fixed, only for a new one to emerge. Other times it just means they gave one group of players something they'd been demanding, only for the act to upset another group of players.

Or more poetically: You can deal with this, or you can deal with that. You can deal with this, or you can deal with that. You can deal with this, or you can deal with that, or you can deal with us!

Envoyé par Adelric

Showing time stamps works for system messages, like item xp gain, but not for user created channels. This is the exact opposite of what many people were hoping for. We want to know whether the latest message in the chat box is new, or five minutes old, not exactly when we killed the orc.

Well now that's odd. I haven't had any such issue.

Envoyé par Gilean-EU

I ended up having 26012 extra Marks! So, altough I hate to say this, I guess buying that scroll was worth it: 295TP for 26012 Marks. At least when you think how many solo skirmishes is needed to get that many marks...

So, confirmed, you can still use the scroll, even now after 5.1 is live, AND get back what you spent BEFORE.

Wow, this is kind of crazy. I just tried it as well. I had 1228 marks, used the scroll and had 24,304. I checked all of my skirmish traits to make sure I brought them all back to the same level. When I did that, I ended up with 18,826 remaining.

They've refunded marks before when they've changed the skirmish traits, I don't see why they didn't do it this time.

Envoyé par sirwillow

I do find it almost funny (but not quite) that they screwed up the tool tip on the tokens (no one in the skirmish camps takes the tokens like the tool tip says), and that they forgot the "Anniversary Token" tokens in addition to the metal based ones. Hopefully we'll have an option to turn those in come April for the next anniversary.

Those are the tokens I was trying to convert, the tooltip indicated those were convertable. Mystery solved, now solve this oversight please

Envoyé par PerinStone

They've refunded marks before when they've changed the skirmish traits, I don't see why they didn't do it this time.

You just spent 295tp... a lot of people are spending 295tp...

Envoyé par Jadzi;5937221
Well now that's odd. I haven't had any such issue.

[IMG

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y280/imarichan/LOTRO/timestamp.jpg[/IMG]

I wish my chat were functioning like that. It isn't. I'd ask people having similar problems to Adelric to post here: and to /bug

http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.p...-Issues-Thread

Just did it myself i had my skirm soldier maxed to 35. bought the scroll and was refunded for 76912 marks.
After re-maxing my skirm soldier to 35 i was left with 53175 out of those 76912.

Thank you Turbine happy VIP here -.-

Me and many of my kinnies has experienced a remarkable rise in the number of crashed clients since the patch, even when not in loadscreen but just standing still. Just us or others as well?

RE: Skirm Soldier mark refund...

Maybe what we are all discovering here has been the intended behavior of the store bought scrolls all along? For better or for worse, maybe it's as Turbine intended it?

What I mean is.... if you are at level 75, and you choose to "over-level" your soldier, that means you would spend exorbitant amounts of Marks to go from level 30 to 35 on your soldier's traits. (If you've never checked, the prices skyrocket after the current level cap.) Then, when the actual level cap is raised, maybe Turbine intends (hopes?) that people will level their character's to the new level cap, use the store-bought scroll, reset the Marks, re-level the soldier (at the then much lower rates), and end up with more marks left over. It's a sure fire way to get many people to buy the item from the store.

When I was at level 65, I did just that - over-levelled my soldier to an equivalent of level 70. Then, when ROI cam out, and my character had reached level 75, I added 5 more levels to my soldier. I too used the store-bought scroll yesterday, and came out making 47K extra Marks then before. I'm certain that the variety of results in this post - some making a couple thousand extra Marks, some making 10s of thousands - is due to when (or if) you chose to over-level your soldier.

Just my two cents. I think many people would spend 295 TP at every level-cap increase to get some Marks back....

Now someone could easily prove my theory wrong if they have used the refund store items in the past and had NOT seen this same benefit....

Envoyé par Rhino-Man

RE: Skirm Soldier mark refund...

Maybe what we are all discovering here has been the intended behavior of the store bought scrolls all along? For better or for worse, maybe it's as Turbine intended it?

What I mean is.... if you are at level 75, and you choose to "over-level" your soldier, that means you would spend exorbitant amounts of Marks to go from level 30 to 35 on your soldier's traits. (If you've never checked, the prices skyrocket after the current level cap.) Then, when the actual level cap is raised, maybe Turbine intends (hopes?) that people will level their character's to the new level cap, use the store-bought scroll, reset the Marks, re-level the soldier (at the then much lower rates), and end up with more marks left over. It's a sure fire way to get many people to buy the item from the store.

When I was at level 65, I did just that - over-levelled my soldier to an equivalent of level 70. Then, when ROI cam out, and my character had reached level 75, I added 5 more levels to my soldier. I too used the store-bought scroll yesterday, and came out making 47K extra Marks then before. I'm certain that the variety of results in this post - some making a couple thousand extra Marks, some making 10s of thousands - is due to when (or if) you chose to over-level your soldier.

Just my two cents. I think many people would spend 295 TP at every level-cap increase to get some Marks back....

Now someone could easily prove my theory wrong if they have used the refund store items in the past and had NOT seen this same benefit....

The common wisdom before the patch was that it would refund the cost of leveling each rank at your current level and not what you originally spent to do it. So if you spend 800 marks taking a rank from 69-70 when you were 65, but that same increase would only have cost 300 marks when you are 75, using the refund scroll at 75 would result in 300 marks, not 800. I have no idea if this was true or not.

I did notice that they made leveling a lot cheaper in the 5.1 patch. Taking skirmish skills from 75-76 now costs soemthing like 115 marks. Before the patch that was a lot higher. They must have refunded what you spent originally or at least what the cost was before the change. Who knows what this means for future refunds...

Envoyé par PerinStone

The common wisdom before the patch was that it would refund the cost of leveling each rank at your current level and not what you originally spent to do it. So if you spend 800 marks taking a rank from 69-70 when you were 65, but that same increase would only have cost 300 marks when you are 75, using the refund scroll at 75 would result in 300 marks, not 800. I have no idea if this was true or not.

^^and that's what I wonder if it was true or not?

Envoyé par PerinStone

The common wisdom before the patch was that it would refund the cost of leveling each rank at your current level and not what you originally spent to do it. So if you spend 800 marks taking a rank from 69-70 when you were 65, but that same increase would only have cost 300 marks when you are 75, using the refund scroll at 75 would result in 300 marks, not 800. I have no idea if this was true or not.

I strongly suspect that this is still true, and the reset scroll is just incorrectly using the old price algorithm and not actually refunding spent points. I think you could test this by buying a reset scroll, re-leveling your soldier to his original stats (which will apparently leave you with plenty of extra marks) and then buying the scroll again. I predict you'll get the same amount of marks as the 1st scroll and make your extra marks all over again. If this works then you could make even more marks by leveling everything about your soldier that you can, including traits you don't use and then resetting. I'd try this myself, but I'm TP poor at the moment.

EDIT: A possibly better test would be to take a brand new level 20 character, run some skirms, level the soldier some and then reset. If you get more marks back, it's definitely the algorithm. You wouldn't get as many extra marks this way though.

Scroll of Greater Empowerment has its price increased.

Haha, it was only taking a reasonable amount of time to procure the dozens of scrolls we wanted/needed and people went back to gaining more of their rewards in-game instead of using the store. Shame on you all!

Envoyé par PerinStone

The common wisdom before the patch was that it would refund the cost of leveling each rank at your current level and not what you originally spent to do it. So if you spend 800 marks taking a rank from 69-70 when you were 65, but that same increase would only have cost 300 marks when you are 75, using the refund scroll at 75 would result in 300 marks, not 800. I have no idea if this was true or not.

I probably should have chimed in with this much earlier in the thread, but as far as I'm aware the skirmish mark refund scroll has always refunded what you actually spent, not what the cost would be to get those ranks at the level you currently are.

I tested this on BR prior to RoI launching. I had two toons that had only spent skirmish marks to improve skirmish soldiers once the toons were at level 65, and had purchased the same number of skills to the same levels. I wanted to see if getting a skirmish mark refund, then re-leveling a solider once the skills would be cheaper would actually work, and if it mattered whether I got the refund right away or waited until the toon hit 75.

For one toon I auto-leveled him to 75, purchased a skirmish mark refund scroll, and used it.

For the other toon I kept him at 65, purchased a skirmish mark refund scroll, and used it.

They got the same number of skirmish marks refunded.

The common wisdom you mention may have been the common wisdom, but I've known that it was wrong since last August. I generally don't follow skirmish mark discussions, so I never realized that people were thinking it worked differently. Sorry I didn't mention this earlier.

Envoyé par Lestache

I probably should have chimed in with this much earlier in the thread, but as far as I'm aware the skirmish mark refund scroll has always refunded what you actually spent, not what the cost would be to get those ranks at the level you currently are.

I tested this on BR prior to RoI launching. I had two toons that had only spent skirmish marks to improve skirmish soldiers once the toons were at level 65, and had purchased the same number of skills to the same levels. I wanted to see if getting a skirmish mark refund, then re-leveling a solider once the skills would be cheaper would actually work, and if it mattered whether I got the refund right away or waited until the toon hit 75.

For one toon I auto-leveled him to 75, purchased a skirmish mark refund scroll, and used it.

For the other toon I kept him at 65, purchased a skirmish mark refund scroll, and used it.

They got the same number of skirmish marks refunded.

The common wisdom you mention may have been the common wisdom, but I've known that it was wrong since last August. I generally don't follow skirmish mark discussions, so I never realized that people were thinking it worked differently. Sorry I didn't mention this earlier.

Thanks for the info. That's really good to know.

Envoyé par Lestache

I probably should have chimed in with this much earlier in the thread, but as far as I'm aware the skirmish mark refund scroll has always refunded what you actually spent, not what the cost would be to get those ranks at the level you currently are.

I tested this on BR prior to RoI launching. I had two toons that had only spent skirmish marks to improve skirmish soldiers once the toons were at level 65, and had purchased the same number of skills to the same levels. I wanted to see if getting a skirmish mark refund, then re-leveling a solider once the skills would be cheaper would actually work, and if it mattered whether I got the refund right away or waited until the toon hit 75.

For one toon I auto-leveled him to 75, purchased a skirmish mark refund scroll, and used it.

For the other toon I kept him at 65, purchased a skirmish mark refund scroll, and used it.

They got the same number of skirmish marks refunded.

The common wisdom you mention may have been the common wisdom, but I've known that it was wrong since last August. I generally don't follow skirmish mark discussions, so I never realized that people were thinking it worked differently. Sorry I didn't mention this earlier.

Thank you for confirming/adding to what I had wondered about up above.

Is it cheaper to level up your soldier when you are level 75 versus when you are level 65 to get to the same trait rank? I/e/ from 1 to 20? Does it cost less to level from 1 to 20 when you are level 75 than to go from 1 to 20 when you are level 65?

If it is cheaper (which I think it is) then I can imagine many Scrolls of Skirmish Reset selling at every level cap increase.

Envoyé par Rhino-Man

Thank you for confirming/adding to what I had wondered about up above.

Is it cheaper to level up your soldier when you are level 75 versus when you are level 65 to get to the same trait rank? I/e/ from 1 to 20? Does it cost less to level from 1 to 20 when you are level 75 than to go from 1 to 20 when you are level 65?

If it is cheaper (which I think it is) then I can imagine many Scrolls of Skirmish Reset selling at every level cap increase.

Yes its cheaper at higher levels. When you first start skirmishing, you soldier is ready to enter combat right away if you start on level as soon as its available. If you pick up your skirmish soldier at level 75 he is relatively useless to you. So its cheaper to level up past the points that you skipped.

After reading the posts here I decided to purchase the Skirmish Mark Refund Scroll. I got 12,354 Marks back after use and then took my Herbalist back to where it was before the use of the Scroll; Had an extra 6,489 Marks leftover. Was able to max the Herbalist up to rank 31 (level 75) and still have ~5,000 extra.

So not bad indeed, but the refunds should have been applied automatically with 5.1 as they had admitted that the costs were way too high after U5. And yes all the expenditures to level up the Soldier was post U5 as I had applied a Refund Scroll the night before they implemented U5 thinking that leveling was going to be better due to the changes they made then; fooled me.

Well the Store now has another venue to stream sales.