Thread: freeps are way to starong

It's amazing how a troll thread can turn out to be productive.

Orakhodegos scored a critical hit with Improved Staff-strike on Purebloodnakh for 1,059 Light damage to Morale

Yes this makes perfect sense in the demented mind of Turbine

Originally Posted by PurebloodWorg

Orakhodegos scored a critical hit with Improved Staff-strike on Purebloodnakh for 1,059 Light damage to Morale

Yes this makes perfect sense in the demented mind of Turbine

It does. This is a melee lm you are talking about there. The vast majority of lms won't even come close to that.

Originally Posted by silverkelt

Why should freeps be stronger? Some legendary warriors, sure. Are you telling me every person who roles a toon should be plopped into that category, pretty easy to do now, roll a mini, get to 75, go out and blast away. You win. Should have given them a lazer rocket, that played musical jingles while it fired. Sorta the same thing.

But for every one that did achieve this, there were hundreds who died. It should be more balanced, a Uruk Hai should be feared not just , LOL to death as the musical jingle fairies play thier dancing tunes and mock you , knowing they cant die except to a couple high ranked creeps.

I guess your right, but its not like turbine is gonna buff creeps because of this.

yeah they're stronger than creeps. but can be stupid.
i killed a chimp with my defiler friend. in HH. took time, but the chimp was soo stupid to stay attackin me...the def healed me allways. xD

I killed a warden easily in grothum..solo. think he didnt really know how that class workin. x) used a full-heal skill,but..no change i just repeated my actions.

minsi: silence it.

well..silence everyone xD SILENCE FREEPS!!

burglar - hate when they buy store stuff.. i atk a lower rank than i n i almost couldnt hit him? plz.. n he was close to kill me with a short stun only.
I hate those who uses 30s stun. COWARD!!!!!!!!!

to freeps its so much easier to rankup!

Originally Posted by Oldwiley

Hey graspn =)

Yeah hunters are not the problem.

Am waiting for the turbine classic, we are reintroducing the lock, but one way as before (creep - freep) not both ways, yay that will help (not). My attempt at a not joke - it was bad, like turbines recent takes on pvp amendments.

OK we need a lock BOTH ways. urgently. As in your game is utterly broken urgently.

Now class and side balance. No-one is ever going to be happy, the servers vary in numbers balance and unless u clone the sides (booorrring) then its never going to be right, the scissors-paper-stone thing will always be a factor.

However. Freep power is spiraling, its getting a bit silly. The buffing of freeps for pve means they will never get nerfed (most pve'ers appear to not want a challange anyway - or at least they not being offered one). The only answer appears to either change freep ability on the moors (pvp only debuffs) or further buff creeps :P

Classes in need of Dev love in order :-

1. Warden
2. Spider
3. Reaver
4. Warg

Classes in need of Dev Hatred in order :-
1. Mini's
2. Mini's - not a mistake they need some serious hatred
3. Burgs
4. BA's
5. Chimps (half the bubbles & sprintyness)

There are two fundamental problems in lotro pvp at the moment; a free lock, meaning people switch en mass to the winning side - sad but true - and that most freeps are way ahead over most creeps now, with more freep buffs to come will get silly.

I have lots more to say and could make a sound argument in more detail, but at this stage it feels, well pointless.

Totally ignoring the "unintentional" mitigation nerf:

Ok they fixed wardens, they fixed wargs, they nerfed BA's and reavers. so:-

Classes in need of Dev love in order :-

1. Spider
2. Reaver

Classes in need of Dev Hatred in order :-
1. Mini's
2. Mini's - not a mistake they need some serious hatred
3. Burgs
4. Chimps (half the bubbles & sprintyness)

Not that this matters now - the increase to dps from new gear alone will skew the balance to an insane degree, while the creeps, who mits even if they were back to normal will still have been effectively nerfed. Thats not allowing for "fixed in forthcoming patch" meaning months of reduced mitigations on top of this.

Yes pvp is pretty starwrong.

Originally Posted by silverkelt

Why should freeps be stronger? Some legendary warriors, sure. Are you telling me every person who roles a toon should be plopped into that category, pretty easy to do now, roll a mini, get to 75, go out and blast away. You win. Should have given them a lazer rocket, that played musical jingles while it fired. Sorta the same thing.

But for every one that did achieve this, there were hundreds who died. It should be more balanced, a Uruk Hai should be feared not just , LOL to death as the musical jingle fairies play thier dancing tunes and mock you , knowing they cant die except to a couple high ranked creeps.

Lore-wise, freeps should be stronger. That's how things were wanted by more people than just Turbine when PvMP was initially being implemented.
Although, now seems things have been changing for the balance due to new turbine directive.



Balance is perfectly achievable, but there is one giant problem in the way of truly achieving it. Rank.

Within a few weeks ago, the point was made to me that if turbine was to balance every class for 1v1's, pvp as a whole would be balanced. This is true. But which creep rank, and which freep gear compilation should be made to be balanced? There we have our problem with this method.

Originally Posted by Oldwiley

Totally ignoring the "unintentional" mitigation nerf:

Ok they fixed wardens, they fixed wargs, they nerfed BA's and reavers. so:-

Classes in need of Dev love in order :-

1. Spider
2. Reaver

Classes in need of Dev Hatred in order :-
1. Mini's
2. Mini's - not a mistake they need some serious hatred
3. Burgs
4. Chimps (half the bubbles & sprintyness)

Not that this matters now - the increase to dps from new gear alone will skew the balance to an insane degree, while the creeps, who mits even if they were back to normal will still have been effectively nerfed. Thats not allowing for "fixed in forthcoming patch" meaning months of reduced mitigations on top of this.

Yes pvp is pretty starwrong.

Wardens didn't really get a fix... Yes they got self heals. Thats merely one of their problems!

BA's had revenge nerfed. One finisher skill.
Reavers had ravage gut punch nerfed? This affected every classes combat fluidity in order to stop burglars from spamming counter defence 50 times in 1 second. Not just a nerf on reavers.

Mini's fix is easy. Reduce self healing by 40% when in warspeech (just like warleaders brawlers stance) Make bolster instant, and give it a bit of a longer cooldown? Throw in 5-10 seconds extra on their slow and make it curable, and you have minstrel balance.

Champs, nerf fervour damage and/or bubbles.

Spiders is going to be a tough one, it's obvious devs have been having problems figuring it out.

Originally Posted by Untg99

Lore-wise, freeps should be stronger. That's how things were wanted by more people than just Turbine when PvMP was initially being implemented.
Although, now seems things have been changing for the balance due to new turbine directive.



Balance is perfectly achievable, but there is one giant problem in the way of truly achieving it. Rank.

Within a few weeks ago, the point was made to me that if turbine was to balance every class for 1v1's, pvp as a whole would be balanced. This is true. But which creep rank, and which freep gear compilation should be made to be balanced? There we have our problem with this method.

I agree, trying to balance a rank system with a level and pve gear system is hard. I actually would want freeps to stay stronger to some degree, but the lore argument is funny.

Every soldier in the gondor and rohan army was not superhuman. Members of the fellowship were notable exceptions.

If you are going to go down the lore justification we'd only be fighting elves because they would be more powerful than the other races, hobbits would be almost useless in pvp. One elf would be worth 40 humans. Hobbits and dwarves would both have slower movement speeds than humans and elves. We could go on all day here with respect to both sides.

This lore argument keeps popping up. The inhabitants of middle earth were not overwhelmingly more powerful than saurons army. If you go off on the further tangent that every freep is a special hero; then there are enough of them to fight the way into mordor with frodo without breaking a sweat :P

If its a realism issue in a game which allows people in platemail and chainmail to swim, or spiders to not climb walls then >.<

Originally Posted by Untg99

Wardens didn't really get a fix... Yes they got self heals. Thats merely one of their problems!

BA's had revenge nerfed. One finisher skill.
Reavers had ravage gut punch nerfed? This affected every classes combat fluidity in order to stop burglars from spamming counter defence 50 times in 1 second. Not just a nerf on reavers.

Mini's fix is easy. Reduce self healing by 40% when in warspeech (just like warleaders brawlers stance) Make bolster instant, and give it a bit of a longer cooldown? Throw in 5-10 seconds extra on their slow and make it curable, and you have minstrel balance.

Champs, nerf fervour damage and/or bubbles.

Spiders is going to be a tough one, it's obvious devs have been having problems figuring it out.

Ok sorry wardens got some love would be fairer; The BA nerf was sufficient.

Reavers have been adversly effected for a number of reasons there was a huge thread about this. There was a much better way to fix burgs.

Agree on the rest.

well..they deleted one of the main warg skill: the stockable "maul" DoT. That was one of the reason why a warg pack could threaten freeps.

Originally Posted by Lunathiel

well..they deleted one of the main warg skill: the stockable "maul" DoT. That was one of the reason why a warg pack could threaten freeps.

You're QQing that warg packs aren't ezmode anymore? Poor baby.

The biggest problem is that Creeps advance by rank, not level, which is very confusing. New player rolls creep, sees level 75 and thinks he should be equal to PvE players that spent hundreds of hours going from level 1 to 75. If he had rolled a new creep and it said "level 1" he would understand why a level 75 Freep would (and should) mulch him in seconds. Put a couple hundred hours and some ranks on a Creep, then its much more even. The same problem existed back when the level cap was 50.

Originally Posted by gimli4480

You're QQing that warg packs aren't ezmode anymore? Poor baby.

Plz come to eldar n i show u what kind of baby i am. said that was one of the best skills. we had a good hunt ytday. )

Originally Posted by dhat2

The biggest problem is that Creeps advance by rank, not level, which is very confusing. New player rolls creep, sees level 75 and thinks he should be equal to PvE players that spent hundreds of hours going from level 1 to 75. If he had rolled a new creep and it said "level 1" he would understand why a level 75 Freep would (and should) mulch him in seconds. Put a couple hundred hours and some ranks on a Creep, then its much more even. The same problem existed back when the level cap was 50.

I agree. n freeps can rank up easily with kills (soloing) but a r0 creep cant do that. Low rank creeps have as much chance to beat a freep as if u were playing in pve with freep n fightin with a lower lvl monster. And creeps cant beat 2-3 freep solo but it works in reverse. (oc not with r0,bout r6)

Originally Posted by Lunathiel

well..they deleted one of the main warg skill: the stockable "maul" DoT. That was one of the reason why a warg pack could threaten freeps.

Maul doesn't stack anymore?

Originally Posted by PhantomPunkk

Maul doesn't stack anymore?

as i said: NO. but have fast cd

I need to check this out on my Warg, I can't believe Turbine would seriously do that.

Originally Posted by Lunathiel

well..they deleted one of the main warg skill: the stockable "maul" DoT. That was one of the reason why a warg pack could threaten freeps.

Wait a sec... Maul doesn't stack anymore? Are you kidding? This game is really going down the drain, they keep nerfing those who need boosts and boost those who need nerfs.

Originally Posted by SophiaMarquette

You have got to be kidding me, right? Please tell me you are kidding!

Time to show a freeps side.... My burg is lv75, has 3 pieces of lv75 pvp armour, 5 pieces of awesome jewellry, decent agility, very high tact mitigation, pretty high stats overall.... yet I still die going against most creeps!

My average hit is around 200-300, I have never had a dev hit above 600! Yet I have creeps getting crit hits (non-dev crits mind you) for 1,000 to 2,000!

I will tell you that either side I happen to be playing I hear them QQ'ing about how the other side is soooo OP!

Freep or Creep sides are not OP, its certain players on both sides that are OP!

That is funny ,you have only 1000 agi ,your last 3 pieces of armours are purple ones ,and i wonder which piece of your jewlery is nice.

Most of burgs' surprise strike and flashing blades deal more then 2000 dmg .

Yeah you have many lvl75 toons.But none of them is geared.

Originally Posted by stoffi

Wait a sec... Maul doesn't stack anymore? Are you kidding? This game is really going down the drain, they keep nerfing those who need boosts and boost those who need nerfs.

Ignore the idiots, maul stacks exactly how it always has.

It amazes me how much misinformation people can spread about this forum then others without actually checking it run around and make silly posts and begin crying over nothing.

oo all the ppl saying 'because of lore we shud be op' ok then...that works both ways..i dont remeber any dps minstrels..any burglers(bilbo was only pretending to be a burglar)..only 3 lms allowed per server..and rks?..delete all of these then lets talk lore

Yeh, I have to agree with the thread starter. I went away from MP for a long long time(years+) I came back one night and was wondering around. I saw a lone low ranked champ and was like BINGO time to get a kill(I thought this based on my experience with champs in pvp years ago.) I guess you could imagine my surprise at the end of that encounter.

Since returning I've learned that no freep is really solable anymore unless they are playing their toon incorrectly or are a hunter with less than top of the line gear. I can agree with the idea of giving the freeps a large advantage, but there should be some kind of a skill check in pvp. In other words, skill should count for something. The way things are now, if you beat a freep in one on one, you can immediately conclude that he sucked or was afk, but it really had nothing to do with you.