Thread: Update 5: Armies of Isengard Release Notes - BULLROARER ONLY (B2)

Originally Posted by RandallSnow

To Orion - the reduction of Reprisal pipgen from 75% to 25% proc chance is too excessive, and produces insufficient pips in raid maintanking situations. 50% would be a more balanced amount.

QFT, absolutely QFT. Sure against landscape 75% (and probably 50% would be) was more than you need but landscape should be easy. Against 6-man and raid content you need those pips for all the new rotational skills that have to be kept up. If a Glory champ was getting 80% of pips from Reprisal before (and that's not far fetched, against EM/Nemisis/AN the number would be higher) you've cut the overall pip generation rate by more than half....against raid level content this would drop closer to 2/3rds fewer pips [the actual function would produce a series where, as the percent of pips coming from reprisal prior to this build increases the reduction in generation due to this build would approach but never equal a 2/3rds reduction].

Wait, so you are nerfing Warg in combat run speed...to boost speed while stealthed? That is one of the awfullest things I've ever heard. Or is this additive to the original effects of the traits? Please be the latter.

The benefit of the Anthem of Compassion has been changed to: Places an effect on you that reduces threat generation by 5% for 30 seconds.

...and it is now useless. No-one uses Lute Strings for a reason.

EDIT: Warg changes seem good, nothing to worry about. If you actually did change Anthem of Compassion btw, you failed to update the tooltip. It still reads 40% Threat Reduction. Here is to hoping it actually gives that much.

Any notes about the new appearances ?

We are wondering if they are rare drops or store bought or ?

Originally Posted by Sapience

[*]Freep Scaling Cloaks: Amount of finesse given on the the cloaks has been significantly increased.

I don't think Significant means what you think it means. Other Cloaks have more Finesse than these do. Other Cloaks have other vastly superior stats than these do. This buff was not enough. They remain completely worthless. Please do something more...

If I may make a suggestion, the +Fate one for sure needs to give + Will before you change anything else. And that alone won't make it not irrelevant.

Originally Posted by PurebloodWorg

Any notes about the new appearances ?

We are wondering if they are rare drops or store bought or ?

If I had to guess it has to do with these Ancient Steel Lockboxes or whatever.

A bit of testing...

They should change Revenge tooltip description to:

This attack deals massive damage (2000) but can never crit.

Originally Posted by defrule

The skill doesn't indicate any bonus whatsoever.

Revenge on live has a rather large inherent crit chance not mentioned in the tooltip. It's similar to reaver dev strike. By crit I just mean the normal crit, not devestate crit.

Originally Posted by defrule

A bit of testing...

They should change Revenge tooltip description to:

This attack deals massive damage (2000) but can never crit.

At least you did some testing with the skill. I'm curious what your actual test data came up with.

Originally Posted by Yogol

Wauw... going from 40% to 5% without any reasoning... you sure know how to nerf people... without any explanation, without any DEV commenting, nothing, just plain bam, NERFED.

And what a nerf too... not to 30% or so, no all the way to 5%, making the skill totally useless.

When there is some skill that gets a boost of 0.5%, then the DEVs show up and go ''oh, look at us, aren't we nice, look, look''. But when you make a skill totally useless, there is no DEV to be seen...

Good job, good job!!!

Do you realize that this is how your message will be received?

Originally Posted by Yogol

Something something something something something something something something

Good job, good job!!!

Originally Posted by Eldrandir

The whole thing was sarcastic, I know very well wardens are broken at the moment and that BAs are OP, but the evade buff not the Revenge crit is what needs to be hit. As for creep PoV, my freeps are higher ranked then my creeps so I know what both sides can do. The Moors will never be balanced though, that's just a fact.

Yeah nerf the BA's only survivability skill, that sounds like a great idea. Why don't we strip the spiders of their burrow and speed boost while we're at it so the freeps have to put even LESS effort in.

Originally Posted by defrule

I really must comment on this.

When you say reduce, do you mean that Revenge will crit less often than the BA's actual crit rating? So rather than the x% that is global to all skills and attacks, you think it should crit less often that game mechanics dictate.

The multipliers, if I am correct the skill gets the 50% from criticals and 100% from devastates. These are global to all skills and you think Revenge should not be subjected to the same game mechanics that all other skills are subjected to?

Revenge will now crit on the BA's crit chance. Currently it is the BA crit chance +25% crit chance from the skill

Originally Posted by Sapience

Monster Play

• Mobilize speed buff reduced to 35%
• March! speed buff reduced to 25%
• Delving of Fror Movement Speed potions have been removed from barter and loot. Potions currently in player inventory will not be removed, but the effect will not stack with Mobilize and March and their potency has been reduced to 5/7/10% from 10/15/20%.

Interesting wording here. DoF speed pots become mutually exclusive with the March! skill and the speed pots become only half as effective. It would seem there is no longer any need to purchase these speed pots in the future. Actually, "Potions currently in player inventory will not be removed" suggests that the devs don't intend creeps to use these pots anymore. Especially not when they are granting a +25% runspeed buff skill to all creeps for free.

1. On Live, a +5% runspeed dp buff and +20% runspeed DoF, without a racial movement modifier gives a 125% max possible runspeed [130%, if you purchase the Lotro store version OOC buff]
2. On Bullroarer (B1), the +5% dp buff + 20% DoF buff + 32% runspeed March! skill, without racial modifiers provided a 157% max possible runspeed -- nearly comparable to a horse mount [162% runspeed w/ store buff -- directly comparable to a horse mount]
3. With Bullroarer (B2), speed pot stacking with March! was eliminated. Therefore, now either a 115% (+5% runspeed dp + 10% runspeed DoF) or 130% (+5% runspeed dp + 25% March! skill) runspeed is possible without other modifiers.

Barring any other changes, once U5 goes live, it will be as if OOC runspeeds weren't affected at all, except if you are running with a Warleader. Even if you are a spider the net speed increase would hardly be noticeable. I did think (B1) was promising because runspeeds nearly equal to mount speeds would give creeps a strategic advantage on an open playing field instead of being rundown all the time. With (B2), however, this is more than made up for with DoF buffs not being removed upon defeat, brands providing 60s slow, disarm, and silence immunities w/ CD reductions, Mastery ratings, and tier 6 corruptions. Those additions are especially good for veteran creeps who need better options. Not to mention the 20% glory/infamy gains with an Outnumbered buff could provide a steady amount of players in the game when both sides are out. I'm generally quite pleased.

Originally Posted by D.Laucsap

Interesting wording here. DoF speed pots become mutually exclusive with the March! skill and the speed pots become only half as effective. It would seem there is no longer any need to purchase these speed pots in the future. Actually, "Potions currently in player inventory will not be removed" suggests that the devs don't intend creeps to use these pots anymore. Especially not when they are granting a +25% runspeed buff skill to all creeps for free.

1. On Live, a +5% runspeed dp buff and +20% runspeed DoF, without a racial movement modifier gives a 125% max possible runspeed [130%, if you purchase the Lotro store version OOC buff]
2. On Bullroarer (B1), the +5% dp buff + 20% DoF buff + 32% runspeed March! skill, without racial modifiers provided a 157% max possible runspeed -- nearly comparable to a horse mount [162% runspeed w/ store buff -- directly comparable to a horse mount]
3. With Bullroarer (B2), speed pot stacking with March! was eliminated. Therefore, now either a 115% (+5% runspeed dp + 10% runspeed DoF) or 130% (+5% runspeed dp + 25% March! skill) runspeed is possible without other modifiers.

Barring any other changes, once U5 goes live, it will be as if OOC runspeeds weren't affected at all, except if you are running with a Warleader. Even if you are a spider the net speed increase would hardly be noticeable. I did think (B1) was promising because runspeeds nearly equal to mount speeds would give creeps a strategic advantage on an open playing field instead of being rundown all the time. With (B2), however, this is more than made up for with DoF buffs not being removed upon defeat, brands providing 60s slow, disarm, and silence immunities w/ CD reductions, Mastery ratings, and tier 6 corruptions. Those additions are especially good for veteran creeps who need better options. Not to mention the 20% glory/infamy gains with an Outnumbered buff could provide a steady amount of players in the game when both sides are out. I'm generally quite pleased.

Yep you are right.And i used on bullroarer the +5% DP runspeed and i saw no difference
And for christ shake this is ooc ONLY...how to compare it to the horses that are faster and they DONT dismount in combat?

Originally Posted by Zios

Yeah nerf the BA's only survivability skill, that sounds like a great idea. Why don't we strip the spiders of their burrow and speed boost while we're at it so the freeps have to put even LESS effort in.

Shhhhhhhhhhh. Spiders needs (dps) boost, not nerfs!

Originally Posted by defrule

A bit of testing...

They should change Revenge tooltip description to:

This attack deals massive damage (2000) but can never crit.

Saw a 9k HS and a 5k MS today but I guess too many freeps and creeps crying about BA's




PS If someone bought any skill from store and it is changed can they get thier money(TP) back?
Don't see how you can sell one thing then change it to something else without offering a person a chance at a refund
Not that any US laws are applicable to the "gods" at Joo Brahs

Originally Posted by celebion

Saw a 9k HS and a 5k MS today but I guess too many freeps and creeps crying about BA's

On Morthond the record for a HS is 14k without dev-crit, but yeah still complaining about BA's 5k crit-revenge, while hunter can onehit you.

Originally Posted by Murky_Majare

So about 1200 seals per set.
With 30 seals per skirmish, that is 90, and doing say 3 a week (since you need a "full" raid and all), that is 30 weeks or nearly a year...
Surely by then it will be time to level up again or at least trade for the next amour to come along.

Going for all three sets at 3 skirmishes a week and then you get to have fun for some 90 weeks, or nearly 1.5 year.
I suppose if you are in an active kin, 6 skirmishes a week would reduce the required week to only 45, or 15 weeks (4 months) for the first set.

And that is if the number of seals stay at 30 of course. (And we do not always get 30 even).

Adding insult to injury, we also need to get the two other currency types (Have not bothered to look at those yet).

So.... I take it we will be able to buy seals in the store then, yes?

So you want new sets without any effort? You can easily do 15-20 skirms/week without even breaking a sweat, but if you just want to do 3/week... sure, but It WILL take longer. Most people i know do 10-15/week, and we're not even in any kins to begin with, just get a group togethere and you're sorted, it's not like the skirms are that hard either, well, apart from icy crevasse.


In general people moan and whine too much, classes change, sometimes for the better and sometimes for the worse, just live with it and give solid and balanced feedback. And if you complain about your preferred class getting nerfs (which will happen at soem point) just try to figure out how to deal with the situation, i.e. change rotations/gear/setup/etc.
In ettens EVERY class can kill stuff, yes, some classes will have a harder time killign certain classes but you can always pick your fights. Personally I prefer to avoid defilers and higher ranked BAs simply since they puddle/slow me and then I'm done for in the long run. My advice, just pick your fights and don't expect to be able to kill everything.

I really hope that you don't bring down the health of Draigoch though (unless that is changed from B1->B2). We had to stop dps for several minutes last time just to be able to get all the cj's in. If anything, increase morale on paws and body by 25%

As for spiders needing dps boost... yes, every class needs those dps buffs, and buffing boosts, and run speed and whatnot. Spiders are more or less a support class with their massive web and stuff. Support classes generally have less dps, but that's for a reason. A champ IS a dps class, and therefor has higher dps, on the other hand we have very few heals (true we got the shields with RoI, but break those down and there's nothing left). It's just getting frustrating when every class is complaining that they are broken. If some skills are broken there are other skills that can be used, so learn your class, and when it changes relearn it. That's the way of MMOs

The original option and i quote - help players form and fill Fellowships to tackle the various instances, raids and skirmishes found throughout Middle-earth. + Scale: Solo, 2-man,

Was great. Me and a friend who play at 3am playing 2 man in a raid. I hope you put this back. It's impossible to play otherwise, some people laugh at me for wanting to do some raids no one else wants to do, or that there's no way to gather enough people at the times I play, so I'd like to be able to access to the content I haven't been able to for nearly a full year now.


Not to mention just doing the raids was great, as we aren't forced to play with strangers that say "lol" and swear and generally talk in a way that totally destroys the immersion i am looking for in this RPG.

Not to mention actually getting to experience content I couldn't otherwise. standing around for a year is coming to an end for me. If I can't progress because I play at hours no one does and i refuse to pay for a third server transfer then the game is broke for group content, and a scaling system to allow me to solo or duo with at least one other person should exist.

I believe that the guardian Legacy of "melee range to target" is still wrong in bullroarer, where it's just 0.9m what it's relatively nothing, while in Live it's 3m what it does makes a difference and help us to control agro through AoEs.

As example in live:


In that video is just perfect, so... why did you nerfed so much that in bullroarer, turbine? now u don't want guardians does aoe? will be harder to get agro against the massive AoEs the champs does.

P.S. i'll try to get a video of bullroarer if bullroarer is up.

Originally Posted by Saelyth

I believe that the guardian Legacy of "melee range to target" is still wrong in bullroarer, where it's just 0.9m what it's relatively nothing, while in Live it's 3m what it does makes a difference and help us to control agro through AoEs.

As example in live:
<video removed>

In that video is just perfect, so... why did you nerfed so much that in bullroarer, turbine? now u don't want guardians does aoe? will be harder to get agro against the massive AoEs the champs does.

P.S. i'll try to get a video of bullroarer if bullroarer is up.

The legacy was greatly scaling with level past level 65, which it shouldn't.

Mind you, it's TARGETED Skill Range and doesn't affect guardian AoE range at all.

I very much agree that 0,9m starting point on a 75 2nd age is probably too low to even consider the legacy anymore outside of the moors.

BA's getting nerfed? Oh well guys, it was fun while it lasted. Perhaps Skirmisher Stance is also too OP. In fact why don't we just get rid of all the BA skills except hindering shot, strong pull and fire dot... but of course fire dot will be on a 1min CD.

I take it there are no more updated patch notes before update 5 goes live ? =/

Thats ok, watching freeps farm brill stones from GM's while having 20% off in store was right up there on my creep xmas list. =D

Why do creeps have to get any sort of nerfs.. I'm constantly one hit ko'd by hunters 6k+ crits yet when we have a skill that is only barely comparable it gets nerfed to hell? And even the removal/decrease of movement buffs? The freeps have mounts :/ Sure, it's just one map but it's still a time consuming run depending on where the actions at.