as probably the least run instance in the game, can we please get this instance updated for marks, barter tokens, and split up like GA and GB? It is surely due a slight tweak, as it is one of the cooler, but surely the longest with the least reward. I am thinking: exterior grounds (first two blade droppers) up until the interior courtyard search, then the courtyards up to the rooftop and right outside the keep, then bring back the warg in the basement as a prereq for opening remmanaegs balcony. Make it scalable and award STMs. Tweak the drops to make them relevant and as previously stated, make the camp outside a spot for bartering tokens just as they do with GA. I know you are super busy with Isengard, but I would like the Fornost area redone. It is rife with barrows that need exploring. Consider the North Downs for a revamp, not unlike the awesome one for Enedwaith. So much underused ground in the west downs...
I would like to see it scaled and split up. I rarely have the time to run the entire instance but also because right now there is no reason to really run it loot wise... you can out-level the loot way too quickly now. I've been playing since 2008 and have never seen the entire instance.
Signed!! I've never done Fornost, there has never been any incentive. I would love some added incentive to try something new (that has actually been around forever, just no one does it....hehe). I think this is a good idea. Get some nice barter rewards like there are for GA, and people might actually be looking for groups for Fornost :-D Yay!
I would like it to be scaled up to 75 too if it does get a revamp. I loved the place but it's annoying to navigate, takes too long, and has to many wonky quests.
I would appreciate an update just so it can be run more often.
No thank you, done Fornost for the first time and i enjoyed it the way it is
Personally, I like it, too. It is nearly impossible to get a group on level or really even otherwise to go in. You have to get lucky or as I saw someone offer in GLFF, pay up to a gold apiece to people to go in with you. It doesn't make sense to leave it as is while others have been spilt up. Splitting it would make everyone happy because people like you and I could always run all parts while others could split up their work.
Personally, I like it, too. It is nearly impossible to get a group on level or really even otherwise to go in. You have to get lucky or as I saw someone offer in GLFF, pay up to a gold apiece to people to go in with you. It doesn't make sense to leave it as is while others have been spilt up. Splitting it would make everyone happy because people like you and I could always run all parts while others could split up their work.
There is something to be said for retaining at least one long instance in the game for those that like long, complex instance runs. So, no, I don't think you'll please everyone by getting Fornost broken up.
One of the worst parts is getting the quest to free the Oathbreaker spirits from the bone piles, finishing Fornost, going back to turn in the quest, and finding out that the Oathbreaker Riamul you fought before Remmenaeg's tower, is actually part of another quest that is given after you free the other Oatherbreakers...that is extremely annoying.
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Even the people who don't want to see it split up, because it's "great how it is" and they "like a long, tough instance" aren't running it. They're not. If they say they are, they're lying. I know this, as a fact, because absolutely no one runs Fornost. Nobody.
To my way of thinking, great content that absolutely no one ever sees, is exactly the same as no content.
Here's what I think ought to happen...
1)Add North Downs to the F2P areas. After level 20, players have a chance to go to the Forsaken Inn or Trestlebridge, and pretty much everyone chooses to go to Forsaken Inn. One reason is that the Epic Quest Line points you there, another reason is that Lone Lands are F2P. The final reason, is that the quests out of Trestlebridge become Fellowship Only quests very quickly... but that's another issue.
2)There is a quest-hub outside the gates of Fornost that gives you quests to run inside Fornost. A lot of people don't know that this quest-hub is there. Around level 35, quests that send people there should become available; probably the same quest given from 3 different places (Tinnindur, Rivendell, and Esteldin). I learned of this quest hub, because there is an instance quest that activates inside Fornost that sends you back there. Yeah, I ran Fornost once. Two 65s from my Kin ran me through, when I was only a little over-level to be inside.
3)Break up the instance. Even into two parts would make it reasonably manageable. Perhaps "Deadman's Dike: Gates of Norbury" and "Deadman's Dike: Towers of Fornost." I'm really not sure how to best break up the instance, because I don't know my way around the instance well at all. Partly because it's so big, and partly because I've only been once (because no one runs it).
4)Make it scalable, and add Daily quests to the instance. Something to bring people back after the singular run. Have the instance reward Annuminas Marks, which are even useful at higher levels.
One of the worst parts is getting the quest to free the Oathbreaker spirits from the bone piles, finishing Fornost, going back to turn in the quest, and finding out that the Oathbreaker Riamul you fought before Remmenaeg's tower, is actually part of another quest that is given after you free the other Oatherbreakers...that is extremely annoying.
I have heard that when you put a spirit to rest, if multiple people have the same quest, only the one person who releases a particular spirit gets credit for it. There's barely enough spirits in Fornost for one person to do the quest once; if the whole Fellowship has the quest, that means you'd have to run the instance at least 5 times, if not 6. Again, good luck getting into Fornost once.
Even the people who don't want to see it split up, because it's "great how it is" and they "like a long, tough instance" aren't running it. They're not. If they say they are, they're lying. I know this, as a fact, because absolutely no one runs Fornost. Nobody.
To my way of thinking, great content that absolutely no one ever sees, is exactly the same as no content.
And how do you know? do you have any facts to show?nope, its just your opinion only, just that
I have seen groups forming for Fornost, not often but still
I have heard that when you put a spirit to rest, if multiple people have the same quest, only the one person who releases a particular spirit gets credit for it. There's barely enough spirits in Fornost for one person to do the quest once; if the whole Fellowship has the quest, that means you'd have to run the instance at least 5 times, if not 6. Again, good luck getting into Fornost once.
Nah, that's not true. If 1 person releases a spirit and multiple people have the quest, everyone gets credit for it. I know, I've been there. But the fact that after releasing all of the spirits and NOT going back to the quest giver before you kill Riamul on the bridge means that, yes, it's twice through for you.
This is one of the reasons Fornost should be split up like GB and GA. You release all the Oathbreakers in the first part, turn in the quest, get the Riamul quest, and then go into the second part where Riamul is.
My other Warhorse is a Fleet Tactical Escort Retrofit, Defiant-Class, U.S.S. Say My Name, NCC-93144
You might see groups forming to run Fornost (not often, as you concede) but they don't. That "LFF Fornost, 3/6 Need Tank" you saw, or "LF2M Fornost, Need Heals" crop up for half an hour of recruiting eventually disbands without actually getting a fellowship together.
Don't believe me? Try to get a fellowship for it.
I'm not relaying just my opinion... join GLFF on your server, and ask around. Who's run Fornost? Who would run Fornost? Does anyone actually run this instance? What you'll hear, is that this is Dead Content. You may hear, from some hoary veteran "it's a shame, really, that no one runs it... it's kind of cool."
There is something to be said for retaining at least one long instance in the game for those that like long, complex instance runs. So, no, I don't think you'll please everyone by getting Fornost broken up.
I get this point. The difficulty with Fornost is that currently it is content that Turbine created that virtually nobody does anymore. I do not what Turbine should do to refurbish this instance to get people in it. Turbine needs to do something. To me it is kind of sad that does not get run much. I would really be surprised if Fornost gets run more than once a week on Meneldor.
I am not going back in Fornost again unless Turbine changes it some how to make it more interesting. It was ok when the only instances were GB, GA, Fornost, CD and Uru. Plus the Epic instances. These days, there are tons of more options. Fornost gets skipped.
Since Fornost is a fixed level instance, it is only viable for a small range of levels. I strongly suspect most people are only in the yellow, white, dark blue range for a few days. Maybe a week before they pushed on past it. It is pretty easy to level once a day. You end up with:
1) Do I want to mess with Fornost for a week?
2) Or would I rather get close to 50?
Unless stated otherwise, all content in this post is My Personal Opinion.
There is something to be said for retaining at least one long instance in the game for those that like long, complex instance runs. So, no, I don't think you'll please everyone by getting Fornost broken up.
--W. H. Heydt
Old Used Programmer
Respectfully, this argument doesn't make much sense. Breaking it up doesn't mean you can't run all three parts in one go. How is leaving this instance as it is now beneficial for ANY other reason than nostalgia? I get that some people wistfully remember the level cap at 50 and getting a group together for this. For the same reason that cable TV has changed broadcast networks, the expansion of content and raised level cap makes this an instance no one is willing to spend the time at. My kin graciously ran parts of this with me, but that was way back in March of 2010 and even then it was like pulling teeth.
Keeping it as is doesn't make sense. I won't say absolutely no one runs it, but 99 percent of people don't run it. If you're seeing it run or running it with a group, you should be advertising it for people who like to complete things, because it's not nearly as common as you seem to think it is.
It may not be a dead instance, but it's nearly there. If it's a ghost town now, wait until RoI is out for a little while. There is no way it makes sense at that point to grind through there when even the OD runs will be hard to get a group for as it is now.
The only runs through CD and Uru right now are deed runs or class quest item runs and they're done by 65s getting stuff for alts or kins running recruits through a little over level.
If it was given the GA and GB treatment, more people would pay attention. I can see a world where the second of three parts becomes a STM or SFM regular run. I STILL think they missed the mark by putting SS into the game instead of opening up one of the barrows and putting that six man near Fornost or at the very least, moving and changing StH.
Anyway, I resume my plea to the powers that be...give Fornost a second look. After that, move on to CD, Urugarth and the Rift. Make the lower level content playable again!
We did Fornost with a group of level 46-52 and it took a long time just to get 2 of 4 required items for a quest.
We stopped there, and I do not really think we will go back there as we already saw it once and that's enough.
Not everybody has time to do these runs for hours and hours.
The only runs through CD and Uru right now are deed runs or class quest item runs and they're done by 65s getting stuff for alts or kins running recruits through a little over level.
I was on two CD and one Uru run this week end. Kin runs to get specific class items for kin members. Do some quests for fun and experience points for the lower level characters at the same time. For my Hunter, I managed to make some progress on some deeds. Do some quests that my Hunter has never done.
There were some people wanting help to do CD today when we had open slots. We did not ask them to come along because it was clear they were after the same class items that we were planning to get for our kin members - The Slime - The Rune of Winged Dominance - Ashen Gorthorog (how over you spell it) Horn.
Last edited by Yula_the_Mighty; Aug 22 2011 at 02:31 AM.
Unless stated otherwise, all content in this post is My Personal Opinion.
In my opinion, it does not need to be split up. But it could do with an overhaul:
- Reduce trash mobs A LOT - they are THE time killers in there.
- Fix the quests, first and foremost the Oathbreakers. And the arrowheads should also be lootable by all, and not only by one member at a time. Other good ideas what could / should be done to the quests have been mentioned already.
Masses of thrash mobs + ages for everyone to collect quest items is what makes the instance LOOOOONG and boring.
- Yes a pointer quest to the camp outside would be neat. On the other hand, it was a nice surprise to find it back when exploring the region...
- Make the key to the gate a drop for all in the fellowship
in my thoughts and in my dreams they´re always in my mind
these songs of hobbits, dwarves and men and elves
come close your eyes
you can see them, too
- Yes a pointer quest to the camp outside would be neat. On the other hand, it was a nice surprise to find it back when exploring the region...
It was also a massive, massive kick to the teeth to have actually been inside Fornost, only to find this quest hub AFTER LEAVING, and realizing that I could have done five or so quests while I was in there, that I missed... and knowing, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that I wouldn't be going back in.
I was on two CD and one Uru run this week end. Kin runs to get specific class items for kin members. Do some quests for fun and experience points for the lower level characters at the same time. For my Hunter, I managed to make some progress on some deeds. Do some quests that my Hunter has never done.
There were some people wanting help to do CD today when we had open slots. We did not ask them to come along because it was clear they were after the same class items that we were planning to get for our kin members - The Slime - The Rune of Winged Dominance - Ashen Gorthorog (how over you spell it) Horn.
Sounds exactly like what I posted. Those instances would be next except that they still get run for those reasons. Fornost is pretty dead. I would want them to update the lifeless one first, then take a hard look at that one. I'd like them to split up Goblin Town, too...make more than just the throne room instance worthy. I'd like everything and anything related to the reflecting pools integrated into the panel, too. THAT'S a little more ambitious, but my view is, once I'm "outleveled" for it (it turns grey 8 levels past?) it should become accessible for me more easily. I completely understand if they want to keep those things "locked" in the panel on level or near level. Heck, make people have to gather there if you want, but once it's past my level, I'd like it to be something more easily accessed for helping kin members, helping in GLFF, and more valuable to me overall, even if they have to keep the drops from scaling or remove them skirmish style. I wouldn't be opposed to exceptions to that rule, but I certainly think the big ones need a look first. They don't have to do/promise it all at once. Do it little by little and see how people react and slowly change it to the way they decided to do it after Moria was released. I, for one, am not opposed to the barter system in place there, but I WOULD like them to move those tokens to a wallet, even if said wallet was something I had to carry with me in my inventory.
In my opinion, it does not need to be split up. But it could do with an overhaul:
- Reduce trash mobs A LOT - they are THE time killers in there.
- Fix the quests, first and foremost the Oathbreakers. And the arrowheads should also be lootable by all, and not only by one member at a time. Other good ideas what could / should be done to the quests have been mentioned already.
Masses of thrash mobs + ages for everyone to collect quest items is what makes the instance LOOOOONG and boring.
- Yes a pointer quest to the camp outside would be neat. On the other hand, it was a nice surprise to find it back when exploring the region...
- Make the key to the gate a drop for all in the fellowship
This plus it should be on par levelwise with the rest of ND, say 25-30.
I'd like them to split up Goblin Town, too...make more than just the throne room instance worthy. I'd like everything and anything related to the reflecting pools integrated into the panel, too. THAT'S a little more ambitious, but my view is, once I'm "outleveled" for it (it turns grey 8 levels past?) it should become accessible for me more easily.
Goblin Town is a public instance except for the Throne Room. Once the critters go gray, you can explore with out being bothered. The exploration deed becomes an exercise in finding all the places. Not a Battle Royale while trying to get to uncover the entire map.
Last edited by Yula_the_Mighty; Aug 22 2011 at 05:19 PM.
Unless stated otherwise, all content in this post is My Personal Opinion.
I remember running Fornost back a while ago, after (somehow) managing to get a group together for it. Its also a really good place to get the Orc Slayer/Troll Slayer/Goblin Slayer/Warg Slayer/Shade Slayer deeds done for the North Downs. We made it through the entire instance. It really is some fun content, and its a shame that nobody runs the instance anymore. I'd love to see the instance get a facelift to make it worthwhile for people to run that content again.
It really is some fun content, and its a shame that nobody runs the instance anymore. I'd love to see the instance get a facelift to make it worthwhile for people to run that content again.
Fornost is still fun the way it is, its not the instance that has the problem but people who dont have patience and just like to do easy things
I have done Fornost and it was one of the best/most exciting/fun experiences i had in LOTRO
If you got no time then thats not Fonost's problem, its yours, there is nothing wrong with the instance it self, its that people just want things their way(which is usually easier)
If you got no time then thats not Fonost's problem, its yours, there is nothing wrong with the instance it self, its that people just want things their way(which is usually easier)
So, the problem isn't the instance, it's the people?
...and again, given how no one runs Fornost, it must not be a few, or even some, people but most people?
Don't know if I want to get into that with you, but I will say this: Turbine can change the instance, but they can't do a thing about the people.
So, the problem isn't the instance, it's the people?
...and again, given how no one runs Fornost, it must not be a few, or even some, people but most people?
Don't know if I want to get into that with you, but I will say this: Turbine can change the instance, but they can't do a thing about the people.
So what you saying here is ,you agree that its true that Fornost has no problems but its people who do have them,but simply because Turbine cant change people(true) and they can change game content they should do that just because they can? doesnt matter that its wrong? *looks amazed*
Fornost is still fun the way it is, its not the instance that has the problem but people who dont have patience and just like to do easy things
I have done Fornost and it was one of the best/most exciting/fun experiences i had in LOTRO
If you got no time then thats not Fonost's problem, its yours, there is nothing wrong with the instance it self, its that people just want things their way(which is usually easier)
Excuse me, but its not necessarily the thing that's troubling me, though time constraints certainly are an issue. Nobody runs it because no reason to run it. Its a long instance with very little reward and most people feel that their in-game time can be spent better elsewhere. And while I agree with you that Fornost is a VERY enjoyable instance, that still doesn't change the fact that most people pick their instances based on the actual goodies they can get for their characters. Ergo, its next to impossible to get a group together to run the instance. And that's terrible.
A revamp of the instance is in order, to get people to come back to it again and run that content again.
Excuse me, but its not necessarily the thing that's troubling me, though time constraints certainly are an issue. Nobody runs it because no reason to run it. Its a long instance with very little reward and most people feel that their in-game time can be spent better elsewhere. And while I agree with you that Fornost is a VERY enjoyable instance, that still doesn't change the fact that most people pick their instances based on the actual goodies they can get for their characters. Ergo, its next to impossible to get a group together to run the instance. And that's terrible.
A revamp of the instance is in order, to get people to come back to it again and run that content again.
Its not about the rewards, its about the experience
I got useless rewards from Fornost but i still say that it was one of the most fun times i had in LOTRO, simply because it was an experience, and it was challenging and fun and it really felt like a Enemy Fortress
Its the same as we say about LOTRO, this: Its not about the destination, its about the journey and thats what matters
So its the same for Fornost, i dont care about the rewards, its the experience, the journey that matters
Its not about the rewards, its about the experience
I got useless rewards from Fornost but i still say that it was one of the most fun times i had in LOTRO, simply because it was an experience, and it was challenging and fun and it really felt like a Enemy Fortress
Its the same as we say about LOTRO, this: Its not about the destination, its about the journey and thats what matters
So its the same for Fornost, i dont care about the rewards, its the experience, the journey that matters
You're not listening. I agree with you. I really do. But the bulk of players don't, they pick their instances based on the loot and because of that its next to impossible to find a group that will be willing to run Fornost with you. Its a long instance, with very little reward. Giving better drops from the bosses, or even some nice rewards with Marks of Fornost (for use of bartering in the skrimish camp) or some such or - to use the Eglain Method - Tokens of Esteldin or some such that drop within the instance and can be used to barter for decent L39-40 equipment from a vendor near the start of the instance would give incentive for players to actually run that content again. Hence, a revamp would be very nice. Then more people would run the content again.
WinterStar, you just don't get it do ya. It doesn't matter that you like it as is. Did you like Great Barrows as it was? People did run GB and GA before the overhauls, but MORE people run them now and people STILL run all the parts in one go. How is splitting it up different than, say, adding a lock to DN? Split it up and people like you, the vast and unbelievably small minority, can have a long crushing and rewarding waste of time. Meanwhile, people who might not EVER get to experience it at all will get to see what it is that the level grind has cost them...a great experience that no one wants to help them run except a few people here and there at odd hours. Once you are maxed out with rep and the deeds are finished and you are level 65, what is REALLY the motivation to go back in? Have you completed it 100 times in less than an hour? Is that your goal? If you cant get this point, you never will. People who want to run it are unable to. I can't justify going in when I need skirmish marks or STMs or daily TC runs and only have a couple of hours a day OR WEEK to play. People who play all day long confuse and terrify me...honestly. I don't care about you, to be more honest. Turbine won't and never will, either. You do not drive their economy and cant keep them in business. People who have a little time but like the game and are willing to spend a little time and money...
You know what? I can't explain it any better than I already have. It is too frustrating when I know there is NO WAY you will see it any other way. It is selfish of you to want it to stay that way. Elitist. I am not lazy. I have done the instance front to back and I ENJOY it, but it needs a change.
So what you saying here is ,you agree that its true that Fornost has no problems but its people who do have them,but simply because Turbine cant change people(true) and they can change game content they should do that just because they can? doesnt matter that its wrong? *looks amazed*
Actually, what I was saying was that it was incredibly arrogant of you to imply that there is a problem with 90% or more of the players of LOTRO. I'm insufferably arrogant, but that was leaps and bounds above my worst offenses.
I never conceded that there wasn't a problem with Fornost. The elemental problem of Fornost is that no one runs it; and this is something that Turbine can do something about.
I've run Fornost on pretty much all of my 7 toons. On Brandywine it's usually not much of a problem to get a group during busy server times. With an on-level (more or less) group it's tons of fun and tons of XP. It's a good challenge for lvl 38 - 42 players and that's a nice reward in itself.
Do I think the drops & quest rewards ought to be upgraded... sure. There are some good things in the ranger camp quests for 38 39-ish heavy armor and shield users now though.
I don't mind so much if it's split up but I'd sure prefer it if there was an option to run the whole thing contiguously. The place has a nice sense of progression and there's a story unfolding as you make your way to Remmenaeg's barbeque party. It's also got a maze like quality after you exit the third boss' tower.
Skirmiczied content loses it's context and sense of place and progression... all those things that apparently no one playing Lotro cares about (where'z da lootz?)
Last edited by SashaPayneDiaz; Aug 23 2011 at 07:16 PM.
I'm certainly not the first, nor will I be the last to call for a change. SOMETHING should be done, but I won't imagine that I've got the only ideas that would work or be the best fit for everyone. You might notice even the "don't break it up" threads have a healthy amount of people calling for it to be divided. I'm not afraid of posting both sides to this argument.
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Re: Split up and update Fornost.
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Originally Posted by WinterStar
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