Thread: A handy guide on who to blame in the event of a wipe.

Originally Posted by Auditor

Great post, and I absolutely agree as a burg. My favorite saying "How could it be my fault, I'm the only one still alive?". Then I have a seat and eat some cookies while the healer runs back to rez everyone.

I do this too Sometimes I pat my favourites in the head a little bit, laugh at my dead rivals and then just bring out my lute and start playing "Trolololo" while the healer is running back and the others are steaming from suppressed rage. Classic

Originally Posted by Vilan

I've found being a loremaster makes me relatively blame-free. I just stand at the back of the group waving my staff and pretending to do something.

Not true though. People don't have to know how a class works in order to blame it. If someone is stunned it's the LMs fault.

In Great Barrows with Thadur at level 22 I had players assuming that as LM I could remove all their diseases, keep up their power, and prevent all stuns. Honestly, I mention that they need to have disease potions or eat food with ICPR and they say "but we have an LM for that".

+Rep

This was just downright funny.

Pfff, what a load of old rot, I'm a champion - it's never my fault, whether you all realise this or not you're all just there as a support role to your DPS god. Guardians/Wardens just make something stand still so it's easier to hit, Minstrels hide behind us and try a lousy rendition of stairway to heaven on a lute - and forget DPS, you'll run out of power before I've gone sching sching twice and speaking of which I've just hit 13 targets twice, heal me shorty, captains give us more morale and help us increase our combat awsomeness, lore masters should all be dressed in black with bronze hair - you're a battery that waves a stick, give me power to hit longer and keep tweety out of my face, hunters hide half a mile away from battle and try to match a champions DPS, Rune keepers sit in the middle and annoy the lore freaks - good job. If any of you weaklings fail it's not my fault you're hopeless, play your support roles and everything will be fine - the big bad champion will protect you.

Funny post, but you forgot about the main suspect of the recent wipes... lag. :P

Originally Posted by shireborn

If you're the burglar, relax. It's never the fault of the burglar because no-one knows what they do. Just keep your mouth shut until the arguments finish and then set an incomprehensible 6 different colour fellowship manoevre to keep everyone on their toes. Remember also - if someone says "what sort of fellowship manoeuvre is that?" say "they're conjunctions". Equally, if someone says "what sort of conjunction is that?" say "they're fellowship manoevres". Make it clear that you are an inch away from adding "noob" to that phrase.

I do love to pop an occasional multicolored CJ and look at ppl trying to match the colors in utter confusion while I yell "Skittles" in TS :P

I HIPSily salute you

+rep ofc

Originally Posted by Lohi

Not true though. People don't have to know how a class works in order to blame it. If someone is stunned it's the LMs fault.

In Great Barrows with Thadur at level 22 I had players assuming that as LM I could remove all their diseases, keep up their power, and prevent all stuns. Honestly, I mention that they need to have disease potions or eat food with ICPR and they say "but we have an LM for that".

This reminded me of when, a couple of years back when I was running my LM through Grand Stairs -on one such occasion I was singled out for blame for a wipe because I was using my pet raven instead of the sabre cat!

Great story. Enjoyed the reading. Hope you can post more light hearted words on the forum.

Burst out laughing at the Burglar part. It's so true, too!

Playing a burglar and hunter I'd comment that it's always safe to blame the champ for breaking cc (hunters have cc too, also while pure dps traited), in any group that includes a champion it's almost certain that he'll break a cc at one point. (very fond memories of evening entertainment duo'ing with a champ in LG. CC traited hunter and laughing as the champ died 100 times while busy breaking my cc)

Apart from that, as a burglar if there's an lm in the group who actually gives power/anti-stuns/debuffs and so on, you can always blame him for anti-stunning the burg (can't count the amount of times I've begged an lm to stop anti-stunning my burg). Obviously if you hadn't been antistunned you could have used Find Footing instead of Hips and the healer wouldn't have needed to heal you and would have saved the tank.

As a burglar, if the healer didn't heal you, he should have to allow you to be more into the fight and dps/debuff more. If the healer did heal you, you could have taken care of yourself and he should have healed the others instead

If you draw aggro as a burglar, blame the tank for not keeping aggro or the healer for allowing the tank to die. And remember to comment on the hunter's lack of dps since obviously if you get aggro as the tank dies with a burglar that means the hunter wasn't doing his job.

If, as a burg, you by accident press Enrage on the boss (or if the tank is bothering you) make sure to blame the tank/dps/healer or whoever grabs the aggro first. DO NOT tell anyone what Enrage does.

Also when things start going wrong, use hips and dodge any accusations by saying that obviously you did well as you survived.

Thanks for the laugh!

As a Hunter, always blame "the hobbit" (doesn't matter what class)... if there aren't any hobbits around, any dwarf will do as they're short too. Not as good as blaming the hobbit, but since dwarves smell, close enough. If your fellowship has neither, refer to OP's guide.

It ultimately falls on the leader, and if the leader is playing a hunter, you are doomed!

Originally Posted by Lohi

Not true though. People don't have to know how a class works in order to blame it. If someone is stunned it's the LMs fault.

In Great Barrows with Thadur at level 22 I had players assuming that as LM I could remove all their diseases, keep up their power, and prevent all stuns. Honestly, I mention that they need to have disease potions or eat food with ICPR and they say "but we have an LM for that".

absolutely. why waste all that silver on healer pills & potions?

disease & wounds are always the LM's fault.

fear the captain [or at a pinch mini]'s fault.

poison the hunter or burglar's fault.


having played an LM quite a bit recently i feel that they get it fairly easy overall. people are always grateful for power top-ups, even if perhaps a tad unrealistic about how well a single LM can serve a full 12-man raid. i think that most players more or less understand that CC doesn't really work with loads of AoE being chucked around willy nilly, even if many [champions being the obvious example] go ahead with it anyway.

an old cliche but tank is by far the most stressful IMO. the job's frequently made impossible idiotic hunters in solo-friendly single target nuke stance shooting stuff randomly, captains [etc] & there's just nowhere to hide if it all goes wrong. support classes definitely have it that little bit easier.

You could just do what our raid group does... and blame someone who's not there.

If we wipe.. it's their fault for not being with us.

As I like to play my hunter a lot, I'm used to PUG's blaming me. My kin doesn't, they know I don't pull adds, and I can control my aggro while keeping my DPS up. Yet is a PUG, things go all to hell and a handbasket, the healer and tank usually start blaming me right away. Well, that's usually my sign that I picked the wrong group of chuckleheads to PUG with.


So I take my bow and go home. Then I pull out my burglar and play him for a while so I don't get called &&&&&&& every time there's a wipe.

I don't remember my hunter ever being blamed for a wipe although I used to do a lot of pug groups. But pugs are always extra exciting.

Originally Posted by Tainted_Black

You could just do what our raid group does... and blame someone who's not there.

If we wipe.. it's their fault for not being with us.

That is an awesome way to do it especially since the ones not there can't defend themselves and blame anyone else

Gee and all this time 99% of the time its if we wipe its the healers fault and when it goes well its the praise goes to the tank. Honestly i got a smile out of the post. my main is an LM perhaps they should change the class name to what itis becoming EB for short or EnergizerBunny.

Can't believe it's almost a year since I wrote the OP!

As you can see from my post count I tend to read rather than post, so it was a bit of a (pleasant) shock to see this thread on the first page.

Thanks for the nice words everybody

In fact, even if I'm in a group with other burgs, I almost never get corrected on my actions. Of course I take this to mean that I'm doing my job perfectly, all the time.

However, to educate the masses on what burgs SHOULD be doing, let me clear some things up. I'm drawing on my experience as a burg, things that I do situationally.

1) I always throw Reveal Weakness, except when the mob is dying too fast, then I throw a trick. Reveal is "instant" but not, it takes about a second or so to fight through lag and then play the silly animation which is really annoying when the mob dies in the entire time it takes to do this. The other exception is the moors, sometimes combat is just too chaotic in a non-burg raid, so I fail to use Reveal in some of those situations. If a burg is not following these general guidelines, that's a few strikes.

2) I always throw Counter Defense on heavily armored foes that take some time to beat down, except when the healer is having trouble keeping the tank up, and then I throw disable on to help keep the tank alive.

3) If someone is kiting a mob, I throw dust in the eyes, unless it's immune to CC, and then I don't bother.

4) If someone is dying of poison, and I can target them, I generally hit them with antidote. Unless I just used a pot and expect possibly poison. In this case I selfishly keep it for myself.

5) If the tank is having trouble keeping aggro, I try to spam Provoke, but I often forget.

6) If the tank has lost aggro by failing to try to keep it and/or the hunter is not skilled enough to realize their mistake of pulling aggro, then I sometimes throw on enrage followed by provoke as soon as it has the tank targeted. This sometimes works. It generally causes chaos which is highly entertaining. I don't think I've ever wiped a raid from this tactic, to my defense.

7) For DPS, I'm throwing bleeds bleeds bleeds. Yes, the burst damage on burgs is nice. But if you reduce your CD's on Well-placed-Strike, Gamblers Strike, and packed on the two cunning attack legacies, AND possibly traited to use Clever Retort, you can stack so many bleeds on a mob that a burglar can start pulling aggro. Also this approach doesn't require all of your power to be DPS effective.

8) If my group needs heals, and the healer is down, I pop a conjunction. Only about 20% of the time does the group think to go all-green. This one is kind of sad but true.

9) If a Lore Master uses stun immunity on me, I get sad.

10) I use Diversion ALL THE TIME before pulls. I think it mostly just confuses the group as to what just happened, which is kind of the point of a skill called diversion, right?

11) I use Knives out from behind to simply hit multiple mobs. I realize any sane burg will lol at this abuse of the skill, but I rarely have to tank so it's never caused a problem.

12) I use small snag in Draigoch on occasion.

13) I never use Confound. In groups of trash mobs, there's always someone using AOE, so the CC from it is pointless unless legacied down to a shorter CD to the CC. Except, sometimes I use it in the Moors, just to screw with monster players. Generally it's useless, with some exceptions.

14) I try to always HIPs at the end of fights when the group is near wiping, this saves wear and tear on my armor and I think is responsible for my slow accumulation of wealth.

15) I would love to use Share the Fun with a raid to try to sneak them one-by-one past mobs, but I haven't yet met a raid with this kind of patience.

16) I spam addle. Seeing a yellow "interrupted" text above a boss repeatedly is a highlight of my raid experience.

17) Making you sneeze is stupid, and it doesn't work like 70% of the time. I'd much rather make you do some other strange emote, like search for your wallet.

18) I use Riddle randomly on distant targets to keep them away, except when the hunter is hitting his target select as often as his primary dps skills.

19) I try to use the tactics signals as much as I can, but invariably I only remember to hit them when the FM color window is already up, meaning there is no time to hit both the tactics signal and my color on the conjunction. If you ever notice this happening, I am a fail burg. (you never will)

20) I *always* throw stones at mobs when circumstances require me to not be in melee range like a pool of damaging something around the mob). It's quite satisfying. The best part is when I hit a warg in the moors and they get a temporary stun from range. I always pray they pot this.

21) I HIPs to hide from people I don't like. Then I stalk them and laugh at them when mobs occasionally give them trouble, or they PvP someone and lose. Did you know you can laugh from stealth and no one hears you?

22) There's exceptions to all these rules, so no burg is ever wrong.

Originally Posted by TFP

an old cliche but tank is by far the most stressful IMO.

I feel my healer is when I play it. I stress about making sure I don't look like an idiot, making sure I don't accidentally overlook someone before they're defeated, worried about the impending arrival of a wave of adds, etc. But then I have also noticed that when I'm not on a character that can heal that I feel nervous that I can't heal, I see someone taking damage and I feel useless.

+1 Rep. I loved it!

Originally Posted by shireborn

If you're the burglar, relax. It's never the fault of the burglar because no-one knows what they do.

I always blame the burg. Everyone else just assumes that if you're blaming the burg you must know what you're talking about & they are all too happy not to take the heat. Just say, "The Burg needs to do a better job with their marks". Works like a charm.

Lmao I love the hunter part, +rep!