Code in an animation toggle switch to prevent player enacted animations, like faint
Basically, a request for Turbine to, at the earliest possible date, code in a switch for all players, that would enable them to control when they have to suffer, or enjoy, item based animations like emote or fire breathing, or any emote that a player starts, to prevent griefing behavior and enable everyone to have fun that does not impact on another persons fun.
Two way switch, with a result similar to blocked animations in the Beer Brawl area.
ON - No animations allowed, yours, or someone elses.
If you try to do one, you get the message 'You are trying to be serious, so can't be silly'
If someone else tries, they get this message 'This person is trying to be serious, stop trying to be silly.'
Perhaps a title 'Serious Gamer'
Item based animations are not used up (if current code does this, if not, oh well, bye bye item)
OFF - Open season. You can do them to others, they can do them to you.
Simple stuff really, and would make people happier all around I think. If they wish to be targets, they can opt in. If not, they can opt out. This is how it should be. This game is all about consent.
Re: Code in an animation toggle switch to prevent player enacted animations, like fai
That's a good point Heydt, I don't like being forced to do stupid jigs by entertainers either. It's just silly. Especially when it interrupts an action I want to be doing instead. My character, my control, not someone elses.
As far as the message goes, in case someone forgets they have it toggled on, they need to be given a message of some sort to let them know. Mine is just a suggestion.
Re: Code in an animation toggle switch to prevent player enacted animations, like fai
I agree. Other players should not have the ability to control my character's actions unless I have given them permission. A simple preference switch to make me immune to fainting, burning, etc. seems common sense.
Re: Code in an animation toggle switch to prevent player enacted animations, like fai
/signed
Im not against emotes in general, buit it seems, too many people lately use these emote just to make other people doing horseraces and fishing to fail theior tasks, and to be /censored/ /censored/ interrrupting player held concerts. No emote should be done without consent.
Thank you, Turbine, for listening and giving us an opt-out of FE! Good work!
Re: Code in an animation toggle switch to prevent player enacted animations, like fai
Not signed, with a caveat - if the force emotes can make people fail the dance class possibly having them not work in the dance class area would be good.
However I believe if you still execute the step via /.... that you get credit regardless if your toon swoons in the middle of it.
As far as the rest of it, it is just harmless fun. I've never really gotten into that aspect of the game. I've not learned one emote that you need do some repeated thing to learn. Never learned how to make people all faint away. Only used my cappy skill a couple times. First time to find out what it did. But other people seem to enjoy it and it does not hurt me. Why take this away from them?
Giving the option to opt out would take what fun there is out. While I've never gotten into this aspect of the game. Being in an area and having everyone faint away is a little bit of a kick. If only some people faint then this kick is removed. It is the fact that EVERYONE fell down that provides the fun.
So no to the option to not fall down. If you are going to add this just take the emote away.
Re: Code in an animation toggle switch to prevent player enacted animations, like fai
Originally Posted by tharkun3
Giving the option to opt out would take what fun there is out.
Of course, you have a right to state your opinion. But, I think this is the problem. What gives you the right to force your version of fun on total strangers against their will?
You know, nearly everyone will agree that sex can be fun. That doesn't mean they want it forced upon them. It fact, that has a name and it's a very serious crime.
For many people, they are only "fun" because they are making someone else miserable and ruining their game experience. That is the situation that should be disallowed.
Re: Code in an animation toggle switch to prevent player enacted animations, like fai
Originally Posted by Mandli
Of course, you have a right to state your opinion. But, I think this is the problem. What gives you the right to force your version of fun on total strangers against their will?
You mean what gives you the right to force your version of fun on total strangers who take themselves too seriously against their will. I guess that same thing should be applied to people who turn GLFF into a pvp e-peening forum. I usually end up leaving the channel because it gets too annoying, so wouldn't that be considered forcing their version of fun on others? That removes a very useful tool for finding groups for people who can't stand wallowing through the mud there to do it. Can of worms open.
Re: Code in an animation toggle switch to prevent player enacted animations, like fai
/signed
And it still gets me that folks fuss because such a toggle would 'ruin the fun' of those doing the emotes. Why should those doing the emotes care if those who don't /want/ them done to them can 'opt out' of it? The only logical answer is because such people believe their idea of 'fun' is more important than anyone else's idea of 'fun'.
I don't like the forced emotes (items or class skills) done to me. That's not /my/ idea of 'fun'. So, why should I be forced to cater to those who think performing such actions on me are 'fun'?
A toggle is the best way to go, imho. I daresay there will still be plenty of people out there who wouldn't turn it on, leaving those who enjoy doing them plenty of targets to play with.
Those who think emotes are 'fun' to do on other folks can still do so but ONLY to those who think it's 'fun' to have them done to them.
Re: Code in an animation toggle switch to prevent player enacted animations, like fai
Originally Posted by probitas
Basically, a request for Turbine to, at the earliest possible date, code in a switch for all players, that would enable them to control when they have to suffer, or enjoy, item based animations like emote or fire breathing, or any emote that a player starts, to prevent griefing behavior and enable everyone to have fun that does not impact on another persons fun.
Two way switch, with a result similar to blocked animations in the Beer Brawl area.
ON - No animations allowed, yours, or someone elses.
If you try to do one, you get the message 'You are trying to be serious, so can't be silly'
If someone else tries, they get this message 'This person is trying to be serious, stop trying to be silly.'
Perhaps a title 'Serious Gamer'
Item based animations are not used up (if current code does this, if not, oh well, bye bye item)
OFF - Open season. You can do them to others, they can do them to you.
Simple stuff really, and would make people happier all around I think. If they wish to be targets, they can opt in. If not, they can opt out. This is how it should be. This game is all about consent.
I agree we need something done.
I'd like to see a whole panel for emotes that have forced effects, and a check box toggle for each one so you can pick and choose and turn them off.
Re: Code in an animation toggle switch to prevent player enacted animations, like fai
Originally Posted by Hatter_of_Bree
/signed
Im not against emotes in general, buit it seems, too many people lately use these emote just to make other people doing horseraces and fishing to fail theior tasks
Not possible. Characters in the following states are immune to forced emotes:
1) Riding a mount
2) Have a skill inducting or executing
This is why many people get on a horse when they are at the dwarf or hobbit races. Only thing that happens is a minor fire effect or the screen effect if you have post processing on and someone use a Saffron's Lipstick on you.
You can set a mounted character on fire. You must be on foot. You have to time it so that the racer is passing thru the fire zone when the flame goes out. It would take some luck to get a racer. You can catch not em once they have started. You have to wait for them to approach.
If you got some D. R. A. G. O. N. s these have no induction, no deed. You might could disrupt someone racing a horse because of the extreme visual effect.
Turbine has a dynamic to disable forced emotes. It is called the "Frostbluff Theatre" buff. Currently it is a fixed hot spot buff. Turbine could make this buff a player toggle centered on your character with no area effect. I can not hazard a guess how difficult a portable personal version would be to implement.
Last edited by Yula_the_Mighty; Jul 10 2011 at 01:49 PM.
Unless stated otherwise, all content in this post is My Personal Opinion.
Re: Code in an animation toggle switch to prevent player enacted animations, like fai
Originally Posted by Celebrawn
You mean what gives you the right to force your version of fun on total strangers who take themselves too seriously against their will.
How serious someone takes themselves shouldn't even be relevant. You aren't suggesting that if I feel someone is taking themselves too seriously, it gives me the right to harass and torture them are you?
I guess what I'm not understanding is why some people can only have fun if they are making someone else miserable -- and why exactly it is that such an attitude should be catered to. I personally don't find it fun to make others miserable, and I don't find it fun to pull the wings off of flies, either. But, let's say I did. What gives me the special right to spread misery and grief among other players just because I think it's fun to do so?
In my humble opinion, adding a toggle to turn this stuff off will only ruin the fun of people who have a rather distorted sense of fun in the first place.
Re: Code in an animation toggle switch to prevent player enacted animations, like fai
Originally Posted by Mandli
Of course, you have a right to state your opinion. But, I think this is the problem. What gives you the right to force your version of fun on total strangers against their will?
You know, nearly everyone will agree that sex can be fun. That doesn't mean they want it forced upon them. It fact, that has a name and it's a very serious crime.
For many people, they are only "fun" because they are making someone else miserable and ruining their game experience. That is the situation that should be disallowed.
I'm sorry but all I can do is laugh at this. How on earth having your toon fall down can upset you is beyond me.
Let me ask you - do you tap your foot on the floor 3 times on each side of your shoe before you put it on??
I truly think the only thing about this that upsets you is the idea that someone else is getting enjoyment out of it.
Oh Nooees, Someone is getting enjoyment out of making my toon faint. HORRORs. It is MY TOON, how dare them get enjoyment out of it.
If anything in this world can be called harmless fun, this is it.
Re: Code in an animation toggle switch to prevent player enacted animations, like fai
Originally Posted by tharkun3
I'm sorry but all I can do is laugh at this. How on earth having your toon fall down can upset you is beyond me.
Let me ask you - do you tap your foot on the floor 3 times on each side of your shoe before you put it on??
I truly think the only thing about this that upsets you is the idea that someone else is getting enjoyment out of it.
Oh Nooees, Someone is getting enjoyment out of making my toon faint. HORRORs. It is MY TOON, how dare them get enjoyment out of it.
If anything in this world can be called harmless fun, this is it.
The fact is that many have complained that this type of continuous harassment makes them miserable and ruins their game play. So, you believe that making someone else miserable and ruining their fun is just harmless fun for you? You are correct, it does upset me that some are getting enjoyment out of that, and that there is currently no alternative but to accept it unconditionally. In real life, if someone was continuously poking me in the ribs, I could punch them in the nose.
Let me ask you -- do you also pull the wings off of flies for harmless fun??
Re: Code in an animation toggle switch to prevent player enacted animations, like fai
I agree that we really do need a toggle. I don't think it needs the title or announcements (or, if there are any announcements, they should be clear so that people don't get confused & just state "You have forced emotes toggled off" or some such thing if someone attempts to cast one themselves. I don't think any in-game message is necessary for the person casting them, seeing that they don't work on the target is message enough.
Re: Code in an animation toggle switch to prevent player enacted animations, like fai
A toggle like this would need to be on a long cooldown.
Personally, I don't really care if such a thing were introduced and I probably wouldn't use it myself. Though I would REALLY like the topic to die already as it seems to bring out a lot of ugliness (on both, yes BOTH sides of the argument). So if this can make it go away already, whatever.
Re: Code in an animation toggle switch to prevent player enacted animations, like fai
Originally Posted by Yula_the_Mighty
Not possible. Characters in the following states are immune to forced emotes:
1) Riding a mount
2) Have a skill inducting or executing
This is why many people get on a horse when they are at the dwarf or hobbit races. Only thing that happens is a minor fire effect or the screen effect if you have post processing on and someone use a Saffron's Lipstick on you.
You can set a mounted character on fire. You must be on foot. You have to time it so that the racer is passing thru the fire zone when the flame goes out. It would take some luck to get a racer. You can catch not em once they have started. You have to wait for them to approach.
If you got some D. R. A. G. O. N. s these have no induction, no deed. You might could disrupt someone racing a horse because of the extreme visual effect.
Turbine has a dynamic to disable forced emotes. It is called the "Frostbluff Theatre" buff. Currently it is a fixed hot spot buff. Turbine could make this buff a player toggle centered on your character with no area effect. I can not hazard a guess how difficult a portable personal version would be to implement.
While this is supposidly true, there have been numerous reports of players being knocked off stable mounts (Which are supposed to be imune to all effects) by the essence of toad. I realize this takes a good bit of timing by the trickster, and I am impressed by that skill, I am horrified that it is possible, and not punished as an EULA violation.
It clearly violates pragraphs 4 and 28 of the EULA, and causes monetary harm to the player dismounted from a ride they paid for.
Re: Code in an animation toggle switch to prevent player enacted animations, like fai
You'd have to better define what you consider "forced emotes". For instance, the fire-breathing has been mentioned a couple times, yet that's an emote you cast *on yourself*. You take out a torch and breathe a stream of fire. It's a festival street performer's act. If someone else is in the path of your flame, that's a different issue, no different than if they stand in a campfire. Should we not only take away the ability to put on a street performer's show, but take out the ability for players to make campfires as well?
Really, the only thing that's needed is to disable things like the faint emotes during the dance quest. That one I agree is out of place there (and should never have been encouraged by a quest that required it).
And for all those whining that somebody else was able to do something that could affect you, this is a multi-player game. They're not going to take out all player interaction. If you don't want to interract with other people (including sometimes people you didn't choose to be with) then get a single-player game.
Re: Code in an animation toggle switch to prevent player enacted animations, like fai
Originally Posted by whheydt
/signed
Though I prefer it without the messages....just do it's job silently, like the "no spar" flag.
And it should apply to ALL "forced emotes", including the class emotes.
--W. H. Heydt
Old Used Programmer
I agree and /sign. Make it a checkbox in Social Options where we can control participation in many other things. And I totally agree that this should extend to class emotes as whheydt suggests. It should include not only animations, but visual effects as well. I think the "on fire" thing is a visual effect and not an animation.
Turbine should fast-track this and get it in the next patch.
Originally Posted by Yula_the_Mighty
Turbine has a dynamic to disable forced emotes. It is called the "Frostbluff Theatre" buff. Currently it is a fixed hot spot buff. Turbine could make this buff a player toggle centered on your character with no area effect. I can not hazard a guess how difficult a portable personal version would be to implement.
Good point. I had forgotten about Frostbluff Theatre. At least the tech is there to disable forced emotes so what is being asked for isn't unprecedented.
Re: Code in an animation toggle switch to prevent player enacted animations, like fai
Originally Posted by 2ElfCrew
Can we please stop using obsessive-compulsive disorder, or needing to see a psychiatrist, as a form of insult to mean "I think you are wrong"? This is an ugly form of prejudice called ableism and really doesn't belong on these forums. Mood disorders can be acquired in an instant just like physical problems -- if you're in a car accident, you may wind up with post-traumatic stress disorder to go with your broken leg. They're not a sign of weakness any more than, say, a congenital heart defect.
Then again, I'm not totally sure why I'm hoping for polite disagreement from someone with a toon named "Lezbein." *tilts at a windmill*
We haven’t seen a lot of MATURE, HONEST or POLITE debate on either side of this discussion.
“Say, those new forced emotes are a bit annoying.”
“Yes, I know they might annoy you, but I really want the deed.”
^ This would be an honest conversation. Instead of this, however, we have the forums flooded with exaggerated rage, vicious attacks, and mocking derision for any viewpoint that isn’t one’s own. In these threads, I have seen references to TORTURE, MISERY, TRAUMA, and I cringe to write this, actual ####. When the conversation begins this way, it’s kind of hard to take seriously. A serious discussion would be nice, but we’re not getting closer to it, the more people, on both sides, refuse to see more than one piece of the issue, or wildly embellish their own position.
Re: Code in an animation toggle switch to prevent player enacted animations, like fai
Let me start by saying that I have been enjoying playing LoTRO off and on for two years. Although I have taken time off to play other games, I have been maintaining a vip subscription so that I could pop in from time to time. This spring and summer, I have been playing very regularly. Then the summer festival began and the harassment started.
Yes, I know that some of you don't consider the forced emotes to be harassment, but I do. I acknowledge that this is just my opinion, but in regards to my enjoyment of the game, my opinion is what really matters. I have grown tired of staying mounted whenever possible so that most of the forced emotes can't take effect. I have found myself avoiding areas with other players whenever possible. Thus, my gameplay has been significantly disrupted.
Consequently, I have chosen to set my subscription to expire at the end of the current 3-month cycle. If I'm not enjoying playing that much then I see little reason to keep paying to play. This is a major change since, before the harassment began, I had set my account to change to 12-month billing for the next payment cycle.
I truly hope that Turbine will choose to listen to the players asking for a way to prevent other players from forcing an action upon our characters. This isn't that much to ask for. If I am given the ability to keep forced emotes from effecting my characters then I will happily reinstate my subscription.
Re: Code in an animation toggle switch to prevent player enacted animations, like fai
Originally Posted by Mandli
... and ruining their fun is just harmless fun for you? You are correct, it does upset me that some are getting enjoyment out of that, ....let me ask you -- do you also pull the wings off of flies for harmless fun??
If you read my first post you would be able to recall that I in fact not only have never used one of these emotes. I do not have any idea how to make people faint away or breath fire or anything else.
I have had people use these emotes on me. Possibly I even once or twice found it inconvienent. What baffles me is how anyone can get so worked up about it.
I was in a kin raid the other night and while we were standing round waiting on loot someone used the faint emote, and someone got all bent out of shape in vent. I'm sure he is /signed here someplace. I was dumbfounded. All I could think was who put a bug in that guys bonet. Actually what I thought was 'Wow talk about being born with a stick ....
All I'm saying is if Turbine gives people the option to not be affected by these emotes they might as well just take them out. The only humor or fun in them is the fact that everyone falls down or everyone does what ever.
So leave it like it is or just take it out all together. Removing them would probably be easier then giving people a switch anyway.
Either way does not bother me. People doing it does not bother me, but then again neither would it never happening. What would bother me is for someone to make everyone faint away and see half the people standing. Or 3 people standing or even one standing.
edit - Oh and yes, I did in fact do things to flys for fun as a little boy. But I pulled their legs off not their wings. What would be the fun in pulling off their wings.
Pull their legs off then watch them them try and land.
Re: Code in an animation toggle switch to prevent player enacted animations, like fai
Originally Posted by tharkun3
What would bother me is for someone to make everyone faint away and see half the people standing. Or 3 people standing or even one standing.
To be fair, that’s already in the game. If you are mounted up, you will not faint. If you are in the middle of an induction (like /music mode, or casting something) you will not faint. So already if two or three people are playing music and everyone else is standing around listening, the musicians will still be standing after the emote has been unleashed. Sorry to disappoint you.
Re: Code in an animation toggle switch to prevent player enacted animations, like fai
I think what this thread really is about is not the emotes or consumables but that some have found ways to confound others in the Summerfest events, in quests, and even in other activities where they shouldn't. Some of this could be ill timing, but we all have seen them used to try and influence outcome of the keg race for one example enough to know the majority is intentional.
In a perfect world these people would not disrespect their fellow players with this trickery, using something meant for entertainment to gain an advantage, But it's not so perfect is it? So what really is needed is to place around the vulnerable events an area effect that disables these toys. None of these items will work in 'Monster Play' so restrictions are clearly built in.
I feel the items themselves are not to blame. And have to ask, to remove every thing that can be abused would leave us with what?
Re: Code in an animation toggle switch to prevent player enacted animations, like fai
Originally Posted by tharkun3
Not signed, with a caveat - if the force emotes can make people fail the dance class possibly having them not work in the dance class area would be good.
However I believe if you still execute the step via /.... that you get credit regardless if your toon swoons in the middle of it.
As far as the rest of it, it is just harmless fun. I've never really gotten into that aspect of the game. I've not learned one emote that you need do some repeated thing to learn. Never learned how to make people all faint away. Only used my cappy skill a couple times. First time to find out what it did. But other people seem to enjoy it and it does not hurt me. Why take this away from them?
Giving the option to opt out would take what fun there is out. While I've never gotten into this aspect of the game. Being in an area and having everyone faint away is a little bit of a kick. If only some people faint then this kick is removed. It is the fact that EVERYONE fell down that provides the fun.
So no to the option to not fall down. If you are going to add this just take the emote away.
Fun for whom? For the person who doesn't want to suffer your forced action, or for the person doing the action that forces it? It's far to easily a griefing tool, and really should be curtailed. Giving people an option does not remove the fun, it gives people a way to choose the type of fun they wish to be exposed to. No one should really be forced to have fun the way someone else does, or everyone in the game would be forced to group for raids and skirmishes using an automatic matchmaking system, or forced to duel, or forced to PVP. Consent goes a LONG way in ensuring people are having FUN, which is the primary goal of the game, isn't it? (Well, perhaps from the player perspective, I know from Warners' and Turbines' it's all about the Benjamins).
Re: Code in an animation toggle switch to prevent player enacted animations, like fai
Originally Posted by tharkun3
I'm sorry but all I can do is laugh at this. How on earth having your toon fall down can upset you is beyond me.
Let me ask you - do you tap your foot on the floor 3 times on each side of your shoe before you put it on??
I truly think the only thing about this that upsets you is the idea that someone else is getting enjoyment out of it.
Oh Nooees, Someone is getting enjoyment out of making my toon faint. HORRORs. It is MY TOON, how dare them get enjoyment out of it.
If anything in this world can be called harmless fun, this is it.
You're utter and complete lack of understanding about personal space is obviously at the center of your problem. You NEVER joke with strangers, do you? Do you know why you don't? Because you are likely to get involved in a very negative confrontational situation. It is precisely because the game allows you to do it, and gives the affected player no way of dealing with it, that enables this sort of anti-social behavior.
If you were ogling some female in the real world, and she said stop, and you didn't, you'd get into serious trouble. But MMO's allow people with severe social problems to act out all sorts of fantasies and other behavioral problems in utter anonymity. And it needs to stop. I'm sorry if you find spamming forced emotes onto other players fun and having it stopped would make your life less fun, but if they ask you stop, you should do it, and if you won't, you sir have the problem, and a rather sad and pathetic one too.
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Originally Posted by tharkun3
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Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.
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