Thread: Compilation of changes to the Warden.

Originally Posted by Regero

Aggression-- "A challenging shout that seems to come from all around the enemy drawing threat from the Warden's fellowship to the Warden." (Currently - Requires Fist/Shield/Spear - grabs aggro from the fellowship and deals damage) (it's a snap aggro tool)

Anyone knows if this is correct and if it is does it work like convition or is it a forced taunt and does it have any CD

Originally Posted by Protoss360

Anyone knows if this is correct and if it is does it work like convition or is it a forced taunt and does it have any CD

I'm not sure. Depending on how it is read it could be considered a force taunt with or without a leach, or just a potent leach, or some combination of those two. Currently there is no information as to whether or not it has a CD, normally I would say no, but it may be like our tactical defense gambit where one of its effects has a CD.

Originally Posted by Regero

I'm not sure. Depending on how it is read it could be considered a force taunt with or without a leach, or just a potent leach, or some combination of those two. Currently there is no information as to whether or not it has a CD, normally I would say no, but it may be like our tactical defense gambit where one of its effects has a CD.

I really think that Aggression will either be like Engage or War-Cry with a threat-leach component.

Originally Posted by Leo_Dan

I really think that Aggression will either be like Engage or War-Cry with a threat-leach component.

It is my opinion that Aggression is a raging blades like skill. An AoE + damage + threat but to make it wardeny they added a threat leach. This would fit with the War-cry line of AoE threat and damage.

Aggression

Melee Skill 10m range
Max Targets: 10
Resistance: Cry

A challenging shout that seems to come from all around the enemy drawing threat from the Warden's fellowship to the Warden.

Deals moderate light damage
Increased threat
Transfers a moderate amount of Threat from each member of the Fellowship to the Warden

Originally Posted by Drglory

It is my opinion that Aggression is a raging blades like skill. An AoE + damage + threat but to make it wardeny they added a threat leach. This would fit with the War-cry line of AoE threat and damage.

Aggression

Melee Skill 10m range
Max Targets: 10
Resistance: Cry

A challenging shout that seems to come from all around the enemy drawing threat from the Warden's fellowship to the Warden.

Deals moderate light damage
Increased threat
Transfers a moderate amount of Threat from each member of the Fellowship to the Warden

This would be nice too. Really as long as they add another tanking type skill that would be nice. Opening up a more reliable off-tank role using more up-front aoe threat gambits would be nice.

Originally Posted by Drglory

...

Deals moderate light damage
Increased threat
Transfers a moderate amount of Threat from each member of the Fellowship to the Warden

I like this idea except for that last part. If this is really supposed to be a snap aggro tool to swap with another tank in a time sensitive manner, it needs to have a lot bigger of an upfront component I think. Increased threat and moderate from each member isn't bad by any stretch, but in reality (when the other tank has quite a bit of aggro) I don't see this as coming out any stronger than Conviction, which I wouldn't describe as "snap" by any means. It would transfer the same amount of threat that Conviction does, but also would give "increased threat" which I would guess is about as much as the first Conviction tick on 6 people. I think if we're getting a snap aggro skill, it needs to be SNAP aggro.

It needs to transfer 10-20% from every member of the fellowship, ideally I would say it should target an ally and give us 50% of their threat or something (not making them go down, just us go up by 50% of their total). The same effect could be gained from just giving us 50% of the threat of the person that is tops on the threat list when we use it. That would make it a good snap aggro skill for swapping tanks. I would like this a lot because We can't just sit back and do nothing, and it's not foolproof like Engage (barring resists of course), but it requires us to at least stay close to the other tank in terms of threat, and not to get too far ahead or behind them. That's more Warden-like to me.

Originally Posted by Leo_Dan

This would be nice too. Really as long as they add another tanking type skill that would be nice. Opening up a more reliable off-tank role using more up-front aoe threat gambits would be nice.

IMO Wardens never have been and never should be off-tanks ESPECIALLY if we're talking about opening up a second role. We need our DPS picked up a little bit and the sustainability greatly improved to really open up a second role. Off-tanking is a terrible excuse of a second role for a class meant for main tanking.

Leave the off-tanking to Champs, Captains, and Burgs.

(Of course Champs can trait full tanking, and Guards can trait for a more DPS/off-tank role, but the vast majority of each class in raid situations will be Champ = DPS/off-tank and Guard = Main Tank)

Originally Posted by thunderchickn

IMO Wardens never have been and never should be off-tanks ESPECIALLY if we're talking about opening up a second role. We need our DPS picked up a little bit and the sustainability greatly improved to really open up a second role. Off-tanking is a terrible excuse of a second role for a class meant for main tanking.

I agree that off-tanking shouldn't really be a complete secondary role. More of an option. But why make our second role DPS? We have enough classes that can DPS. Give wardens something more unique.

There is nothing wrong giving tanks the ability to off-tank adds more effectively. There should be a benefit to having 2 main tanking classes in 6-man situations and for raid situations where only 1 tank is needed. Giving wardens the ability to reliably pick up adds is not a bad thing

Originally Posted by Leo_Dan

I agree that off-tanking shouldn't really be a complete secondary role. More of an option. But why make our second role DPS? We have enough classes that can DPS. Give wardens something more unique.

There is nothing wrong giving tanks the ability to off-tank adds more effectively. There should be a benefit to having 2 main tanking classes in 6-man situations and for raid situations where only 1 tank is needed. Giving wardens the ability to reliably pick up adds is not a bad thing

Why make our secondary DPS? Because any class that can main tank already can off tank. By definition, the tools are already there. Wasting time giving us "off tanking" skills is just that, a waste of time.

Off tanking would not be a second role, it would be an excuse for a second role because we don't need anything extra to do it. Is off healing a suitable secondary role for Minstrels? RKs? Is off tanking a suitable second role for Guardians?

Originally Posted by thunderchickn

Why make our secondary DPS? Because any class that can main tank already can off tank. By definition, the tools are already there. Wasting time giving us "off tanking" skills is just that, a waste of time.

Off tanking would not be a second role, it would be an excuse for a second role because we don't need anything extra to do it. Is off healing a suitable secondary role for Minstrels? RKs? Is off tanking a suitable second role for Guardians?

But aggression wouldn't just be an "off-tanking" skill. It is a tanking skill. If it is some type of snap aggro skill, or front loaded threat aoe dot threat leach, then it would be beneficial for off-tanking, but is still primarily a tanking skill.

And off-tanking is a role that guards fill. Given their snap aggro abilities it is easier for them to pick up adds more reliably

Originally Posted by Leo_Dan

But aggression wouldn't just be an "off-tanking" skill. It is a tanking skill. If it is some type of snap aggro skill, or front loaded threat aoe dot threat leach, then it would be beneficial for off-tanking, but is still primarily a tanking skill.

And off-tanking is a role that guards fill. Given their snap aggro abilities it is easier for them to pick up adds more reliably

I think we might be arguing about different things. I love the new skill, I think it needs to do more than just what Drglory proposed to actually grab aggro in a SNAP kind of manner from another tank.

I was only reacting to your comment about "opening up a secondary role for off tanking". That's not a secondary role. A true secondary role would be DPS, or some kind of crazy buff to our heal line to make us like a Cappy which I don't see happening. Pretty much the only realistic opening for our secondary spot in a raid would be DPS, not off tanking.

Originally Posted by thunderchickn

I think we might be arguing about different things. I love the new skill, I think it needs to do more than just what Drglory proposed to actually grab aggro in a SNAP kind of manner from another tank.

I was only reacting to your comment about "opening up a secondary role for off tanking". That's not a secondary role. A true secondary role would be DPS, or some kind of crazy buff to our heal line to make us like a Cappy which I don't see happening. Pretty much the only realistic opening for our secondary spot in a raid would be DPS, not off tanking.

I guess so lol. What I really meant to say with the comment "opening up a secondary role for off-tanking" was more along the lines of stating what type of benefit a snap aggro type gambit would provide. I agree that off-tanking isn't a legit grouping role.

I don't believe wardens should just be pigeon holed into DPS however. Something more unique would be very appreciated. But, like you said, I don't see that happening however.

Originally Posted by Leo_Dan

I guess so lol. What I really meant to say with the comment "opening up a secondary role for off-tanking" was more along the lines of stating what type of benefit a snap aggro type gambit would provide. I agree that off-tanking isn't a legit grouping role.

I don't believe wardens should just be pigeon holed into DPS however. Something more unique would be very appreciated. But, like you said, I don't see that happening however.

make desolation/traited war-cry proc the "cower" stuns (like what sorcs in sammath gul do) and I would definitely consider warden cc a useful secondary role by helping reduce the damage being taken and help keep all the mobs in the same place.

(note: "cower" stun implies there is no tail stun immunity and the mob is "stunned" as in it can take no action and can't move. The movement is my main beef with fears. Any mob immune to fear would be immune to the "cower" stun.)

Originally Posted by striverg

make desolation/traited war-cry proc the "cower" stuns (like what sorcs in sammath gul do) and I would definitely consider warden cc a useful secondary role by helping reduce the damage being taken and help keep all the mobs in the same place.

(note: "cower" stun implies there is no tail stun immunity and the mob is "stunned" as in it can take no action and can't move. The movement is my main beef with fears. Any mob immune to fear would be immune to the "cower" stun.)

I like this idea (a lot). The only thing I would add from a balance point of view would be to explicitly mention the "cower" mechanic to maintain desolation's random nature.

Don't want to see chain stunning yard trash as a viable (if boring) tanking technique.

Hey, what if it's a fear-based daze that will break on any damage EXCEPT light? This way we could ae daze, toss a war-cry or two, maybe a conviction, to stay ahead of the healer on the threat list?

Understood that RoI is currently in closed beta and changes aren't likely. Just enjoying the thought experiment.

Originally Posted by Alphane

Or have DBtD work at any morale level but make the amount of power returned indirectly proportional to the amount of morale you have. i.e. if you're at 100% morale you get 0 power back, at 50% morale you get 0.5 x N power back, at 0% morale you get 1 x N power back. Might be tricky to do in the code though I guess...

O.o That was my idea dang it! Copyright copyright!

Seriously though, I would love something like this. However, I would recommend not making the power-return at 100% zero. Simply because some of the most annoying times I've had tanking is when I'm out of power but the minstrel, rune keeper, and/or captain refused to let me fall below 100%. Maybe make the maximum power at 100% morale return 50% of what it does now up to 100% of what it currently does if below 50%. That or include a "nuke healer and replace" option. It was bad enough trying to get the related deed done when it seemed like everyone who had a healer passing bye just HAD to toss one at me right before I was going to use the gambit. Trying to use it in a group.... er, I'll just say a lot of people heard some new curses to add to their vocabulary and leave it at that.

To the total changes. I like. A much less unwieldy force-attack makes getting aggro back from the chiimps much easier (and gives me time to start a threat lead on the other mobs for a few seconds). Threat dump gambit also isn't going to hurt when it comes time for aggro-swapping fights. Stun immunity without having to grovel/ remind the LM is always nice, and extra tactical defense is yummy. What I really like is the battle-memory part. With that I can keep any long-chain gambit in "reserve" for when things go bad; no more being in the middle of a Conviction/ Shield Mastery and having to dump the entire gambit only to find my spear-shield mastery on is cooldown when I need in interrupt yesterday. Even if it's 5% of maximum moral that still isn't a lot; as a hunter I pay about that much for Blood Arrow and hardly notice it and when I do a quick Agile Rejoinder HoT makes up the difference. With a warden it will be even better; I don't need to be at a bad range and pray for a parry to basically replace the damage.

Also +rep for putting all this together. So much easier than having to hunt down individual developer blogs and posts.

PS:
If you're still looking Orion, could I bribe you to help Zombie-Columbus with the hunter updates? Not that he has bad ideas (because personally I LIKE the ideas he gave us), but because he needs someone to explain to him that those who scream the loudest about a change are often the ones with the least understanding and the most vested in maintaining the current situation at any cost.

Originally Posted by Regero

Way of the Warden-- Will grant the stance: Way of the Warden, and will also now come with all six mastery skills (the class mastery traits will now have different functions).

Master of the Spear/Shield/Fist-- Instead of providing the 6 current masteries, these skills will now apply a "Double Builder" Mastery. Master of the Spear for example will put a spear-spear into your gambit bar. The Mastery (not the Gambit) will have a power cost of zero.

Currently using masteries are a must for wardens. The ability to perform gambits quicker is needed for all things warden do. Conservation stance is used mainly because of the power issues we have and we can use a Li to boost the ICPR on the stance.
My questions:
1 Are we weaker as a class if the masteries are changed? Some don't even like to use never surrender now because of loosing the masteries
2 With our power issues when tanking, Conservation stance is a must but with the new changes if we want to use masteries we have to remove the Conservation stance for the Way of the Warden stance. Is the new masteries better than the old way?
3 It seems they want to remove the current masteries(allows u to build gambits fast) for the new Potency and Battle Memory(instant gambits). Which method is better?

My overall feeling is if the current masteries are removed, it is nerfing our class

Originally Posted by Protoss360

Currently using masteries are a must for wardens. The ability to perform gambits quicker is needed for all things warden do. Conservation stance is used mainly because of the power issues we have and we can use a Li to boost the ICPR on the stance.
My questions:
1 Are we weaker as a class if the masteries are changed? Some don't even like to use never surrender now because of loosing the masteries
2 With our power issues when tanking, Conservation stance is a must but with the new changes if we want to use masteries we have to remove the Conservation stance for the Way of the Warden stance. Is the new masteries better than the old way?
3 It seems they want to remove the current masteries(allows u to build gambits fast) for the new Potency and Battle Memory(instant gambits). Which method is better?

My overall feeling is if the current masteries are removed, it is nerfing our class

You only have to have the Legendary equipped to use the Masteries. You DO NOT need to be in Way of the Warden stance, just have the trait equipped. The current Masteries are moved to Way of the Warden, so we only use 1 Legendary Slot for what used to take 3 Class Slots.

Originally Posted by Protoss360

Currently using masteries are a must for wardens. The ability to perform gambits quicker is needed for all things warden do. Conservation stance is used mainly because of the power issues we have and we can use a Li to boost the ICPR on the stance.
My questions:
1 Are we weaker as a class if the masteries are changed? Some don't even like to use never surrender now because of loosing the masteries
2 With our power issues when tanking, Conservation stance is a must but with the new changes if we want to use masteries we have to remove the Conservation stance for the Way of the Warden stance. Is the new masteries better than the old way?
3 It seems they want to remove the current masteries(allows u to build gambits fast) for the new Potency and Battle Memory(instant gambits). Which method is better?

My overall feeling is if the current masteries are removed, it is nerfing our class

Yeah I see this as a nerf... that is unless they change Way of the Warden...

The way Way of the Warden currently works is 15 minute! cool down for about 1 min of stance... it may be a little longer, but I'm not sure. I'm sure to get grief from this, but I don't use it. I personally switch stances on a regular basis depending on situation, since there is no cool down on those... so that is every 15 minutes you get to use the double gambit building skills... for 1 minute!!!... really??? Might as well not even bother with them anymore, and heck, Never Surrender now becomes a little more useful cause you can't use the double gambit-builders anyway, which could be the intention (it would be a sad route though to break a mechanic to make one skill better). I'm sure there are some who think 15 mins is not that bad, you can make it up going from mob pull to mob pull, but not with the group I run with!!! We pull more during the fight or if we need a power break we regen it while we run to the next group which is never really more than a minute (I'm lucky to have a great mini who lets me hit half and keeps me there anytime I need... which isn't too often).

This is going to increase our power consumption pretty drastically, as you now are spending the extra power for each of the single gambit-builders. This will also slow down the process, cause now you have to spend extra time hitting each builder instead of doubles. This will make spamming gambits much more difficult, which could affect our threat building.

What needs to make this viable is to remove the 15 minute cool down from Way of the Warden, nerf it a little if it's a must, but allow us the ability to switch between all stances at any moment dependent on the situation. If we're getting pounded and need some extra morale boost, switch to Determination, if we need Power switch to Conservation, if we need Damage switch to Retaliation, if everything is going good and we need to go for the long haul use Way of the Warden. But make them viable enough to want to switch.

For example Way of the Warden allows you to regen half as much morale, power, does half the damage boost, but allows you to use double gambit-builders. Problem solved!

A question I have on Battle Memory that I haven't seen answered... I think i read that this does not go away after combat... but what about Death??? If the description we were given says it does not go away unless spent, and that we never "truly" die but "retreat," then shouldn't it stay persistent even after death? I would love this addition even more if that were true... because then you could que up a gambit just before death, say our new snap aggro skill, and be able to hit that first thing when raised.

The other question is... is Never Surrender's penalties persistent after death?

Originally Posted by heavenlyrock

so that is every 15 minutes you get to use the double gambit building skills... for 1 minute!!!

A little bit wrong here.... The WotW trait GIVES you masteries, you do not need to have the stance active to use them. It's like, you gain the masteries you gain normally, AND you gain the WotW stance. It's a 2 for 1 not a this, only if you're using this situation. Not to mention, WotW can last indefinitely, since it is based upon being in combat or not.

~Rae

Originally Posted by heavenlyrock

Yeah I see this as a nerf... that is unless they change Way of the Warden...
The way Way of the Warden currently works is 15 minute! cool down for about 1 min of stance... so that is every 15 minutes you get to use the double gambit building skills... for 1 minute!!!... really???

/chillout

Originally Posted by ANewMachine

You only have to have the Legendary equipped to use the Masteries. You DO NOT need to be in Way of the Warden stance, just have the trait equipped. The current Masteries are moved to Way of the Warden, so we only use 1 Legendary Slot for what used to take 3 Class Slots.

/moarwordz

Did you not read the posts above you? Let me type it out bigger.

You do not need to be in WoTW stance to use masteries. Having the trait equipped alone will grant you masteries regardless of stance.

Originally Posted by Varenthor

A little bit wrong here.... The WotW trait GIVES you masteries, you do not need to have the stance active to use them. It's like, you gain the masteries you gain normally, AND you gain the WotW stance. It's a 2 for 1 not a this, only if you're using this situation. Not to mention, WotW can last indefinitely, since it is based upon being in combat or not.

~Rae

I can't find anywhere that Orion has officially said that they are indeed separated could you give me a link to a dev quote saying that please?... the way it reads is:

"Legendary Changes

Way of the Warden - In addition to granting the stance will also grant all of the Mastery Gambits."

can we just assume that they are not tied to the Stance? because...

Originally Posted by Protoss360

2 With our power issues when tanking, Conservation stance is a must but with the new changes if we want to use masteries we have to remove the Conservation stance for the Way of the Warden stance. Is the new masteries better than the old way?

apparently I'm not the only who read it as they were actually tied to the stance and not just having the trait equipped... I can see how it could also read that they could be independent... and I know I've read other threads where people say that it is not good to tie it to the trait but to make them just trainable.... Truthfully that is my only beef with the game... descriptions need work and can be misleading or do not mention a component that they actually do.

Originally Posted by geoboy

Did you not read the posts above you? Let me type it out bigger.

No need to get mean... Yes I have read above posts, but you will also notice i posted 15 minutes after ANewMachine... I'm at work, so it takes me a bit to make a post... and that one was not visible when I started my post.

I'm sorry... I know I can get a little excited... and yes Way of the Warden can last practically indefinitely if you continue to pull before mobs die... but most of the time... there is a break in combat... even if it is for a second. And if indeed that double gambit-builders are only active when the stance is active... then I do stand by my original post... if not, and just trait the legendary you get them (regardless of having Way of the Warden active), then that's better...

The reason it won't be is because it would cause an uproar of unimaginable proportions. And sorry for the comment above. I'm usually grumpy in the mornings.

Originally Posted by geoboy

The reason it won't be is because it would cause an uproar of unimaginable proportions. And sorry for the comment above. I'm usually grumpy in the mornings.

Oh no prob... you probably didn't have your cookie this morning

and yeah I know... that's why I'm like... verification please!!!

I'm just getting antsy cause I played a lot of MMO's and I'm used to the nerf bat and/or changes coming... and the warden is my class. I get weary when things can become potentially class changing... to the point where they don't play the same.

And what worries me is that I've seen it happen many times, where everyone thought they wouldn't do it some way because it would be preposterous, but they ended up doing it anyway... not necessarily in this game... but others I've played. They went with a "we made this change... and you're going to like it... you just don't know it yet" approach. I try not to make assumptions and theories anymore lol.

Thanks for clearing up the issue i had with stances but i don't understand why they are changing the current way we build gambits with masteries. I am hoping it all works well but i will miss instant PB and conviction using 3 actions.

Originally Posted by Protoss360

Thanks for clearing up the issue i had with stances but i don't understand why they are changing the current way we build gambits with masteries. I am hoping it all works well but i will miss instant PB and conviction using 3 actions.

The change regarding masteries is that you slot a single legendary trait instead of three class traits.

This leaves a certain legendary is a staple for every warden but frees up 3 class trait slots that can be used for different trait setups besides the usual 3 masteries plus 4 something else as it is now.

Originally Posted by Protoss360

Thanks for clearing up the issue i had with stances but i don't understand why they are changing the current way we build gambits with masteries. I am hoping it all works well but i will miss instant PB and conviction using 3 actions.

Pro, you will still have all of your masteries if you trait WotW.... which shouldn't be a problem since we're getting a 4th legendary slot. they're not changing the way you build with masteries, just the traits you need to get them. Instead of wasting 3 traits on masteries, we use one legendary slot, which as i said, we're getting with isengard. it's a win-win situation.

~Rae

oh happy days

Originally Posted by Varenthor

Pro, you will still have all of your masteries if you trait WotW.... which shouldn't be a problem since we're getting a 4th legendary slot. they're not changing the way you build with masteries, just the traits you need to get them. Instead of wasting 3 traits on masteries, we use one legendary slot, which as i said, we're getting with isengard. it's a win-win situation.

~Rae

When did they say we were getting another Legendary Slot? Must have missed that.

Originally Posted by Mysterion

When did they say we were getting another Legendary Slot? Must have missed that.

<_<

>_>

...

knows something we don't apparently.

I forget which magazine it was but Turbine said that we would be getting another Legendary slot. If that isn't the case then both my Captain and Warden will be up in arms.

Class slot is mostly wishful thinking and hope.

Somewheres, someone was asking about the effect of changing the source of masteries on leveling wardens. Well, I can answer from my personal experience, it would help me a lot. You can start earning spear mastery from 40, but it takes a while(10days min) to earn the trait. Shield+fist mastery needs level 50, and at level 58 I still need atleast three more days to complete them. Meanwhile, I completed the legendary quest as soon as I turned level 45, thanks to alts.

The last time we got an additional legendary slot was with Moria. We also got three new legendary traits there. I think something similar will happen with Isengard. So I wouldn't expect that this new legendary slot will help with the fact that WotW is wasting a slot.

Great news - WotW and GMWT can stay....unless we're getting a new one

(I have no inside knowledge...wish i did)

Just wondering, with these proposed changes, we aren't losing our current masteries, right?

Originally Posted by Araelinnis

The last time we got an additional legendary slot was with Moria. We also got three new legendary traits there. I think something similar will happen with Isengard. So I wouldn't expect that this new legendary slot will help with the fact that WotW is wasting a slot.

I don't know if you just don't like it because it has no block or evade, but i don't see how this is a waste of a legendary trait.

In fact, i'm quite happy with all of the legendaries atm. Could they be better? Yes. But we are wardens. I am beating rank 11 reavers in recklessness spear line subpar. We don't need buffs at all, except to make up for pve raid performance (not that tanking even matters in this game). And here we are getting buffs for all-around 0.o

Originally Posted by Untg99

We don't need buffs at all, except to make up for pve raid performance (not that tanking even matters in this game). And here we are getting buffs for all-around 0.o

(Emphasis mine). Doesn't matter? Sure, a lot of Small Fellowship and Fellowship content is doable without a "proper" tank or a tank "properly" traited, but in Ost Dunhoth I've seen attempts to let a Captain or Champion tank non-bosses for more than 30 seconds and it wasn't a pretty sight. True, the current balance is wrong (in my opinion) but we're still needed in places and we do make things go smoother in instances. The Fervour Champ may make things appear to go faster but from what I've seen when running on other characters, those runs typically include one or two wipes or semi-wipes requiring a short break for resses and buffs.

Originally Posted by Untg99

I don't know if you just don't like it because it has no block or evade, but i don't see how this is a waste of a legendary trait.

In this thread and the other related threads a lot of people explained why they like WotW or why they don’t, so I won’t repeat all the different reasons here.

I don’t find it useful now, and once the block/evade caps are increased with Isengard it gets even worse.

I prefer JoDF, but I will have to trait WotW for the masteries, so unless we get an additional legendary slot (and no new legendary traits!) I will have to exchange a javelin attack which I use frequently for a stance I never use. That’s why it’s a waste of a legendary slot, at least for me.

For 90% of content, tank classes are only convenient imo.

Araelinnis; I do like JODF however i find myself personally not using it as much as i'd like to D:



Anyway.. back to my original questions, anything changing with the current masteries?
I didn't really understand most of the jabber about them, maybe i will have to reread it next chance i get :/

Originally Posted by Untg99

For 90% of content, tank classes are only convenient imo.

Same could be said of any class, no? I mean, warden + off heals = healer, right? Any class can DPS, I don't see the point.

Originally Posted by geoboy

Same could be said of any class, no? I mean, warden + off heals = healer, right? Any class can DPS, I don't see the point.

Well thats right, you dont need to follow tank class = tank, dps class = dps, healing class = heals, cc = cc, debuffs = debuffs and so forth.

I can go in on my captain and tank a 6man with minstrel DPS whilst traited yellow, LM heals, guardian DPS, hunter CC and a mischeif traited burg, and still get things done the same as an ideal 6man group. It might not be as convenient as the stereotypical group, but it doesn't mean i cant get things done just as well, assuming there are no mechanics preventing this.