Thread: Champ moors play is infuriating...

Originally Posted by Lestache

ghbtwo?

Are you Sebastian Janikowski?

wish i had that dudes left leg and cash, but alas no, ghbtwo are my intials well technically ghb the second but i'm sure you caught on thunder - cheers

Originally Posted by VersatileArcher

QFT from a former pvp guard. Champ wuz one of the two first classes I wanted to play, that and hunter, and somehow rolled a guard :/. Dont get me wrong, had fun, but way too easy now. Really wish I had a champ right now, and I still applaud those dedicated champs that come to the moors day in and day out, getting pounded on like crazy by stronger classes, but still try to do better. Being one of the tougher 1v1 classes and stickin with it through rough times and learning is to be commended. True pvpers right there.

I would imagine champs should be doing somewhat better tho cuz of the new relics and gear, hopefully. Seen some with 7.5k and good stats.

To the op, you will be a lot more respected if you play a challenging class and stick with it, rather than take the easy path. Well, thats how I carry myself anyway, and how I view certain ppl and their playstyles. You're entitled to play the class that lets you have fun tho.

O rly? my champ has 10k moral. 1300 might 1200 vit. I go with resiliant warrior set, which really helps because bracing removes a bunch of debuffs every time. Heck i only got a 3rd age weapon adn I still kick booty out there. In raids spam aeo bleeds, stuns and damage. Chase their healers around and spam clobber. They will hate you more than the wardens.

Also, nothing is more OP in moors than 6 champs that all pefectly coordinate raging blades on a cluster of creeps. One shot whole creep raid.

Originally Posted by douglasburns

O rly? my champ has 10k moral. 1300 might 1200 vit. I go with resiliant warrior set, which really helps because bracing removes a bunch of debuffs every time. Heck i only got a 3rd age weapon adn I still kick booty out there. In raids spam aeo bleeds, stuns and damage. Chase their healers around and spam clobber. They will hate you more than the wardens.

Also, nothing is more OP in moors than 6 champs that all pefectly coordinate raging blades on a cluster of creeps. One shot whole creep raid.

you have perfectly summarized the problems creeps have with champs.

Back for a progress report. Have full audacity now, more than a few pieces as I was trying out different combos. Settled on one that I really REALLY like. I solo almost all the time (recently got into a kin that has more people interested in the moors though, so hopefully less soloing so often.) I think the only thing I can't win against now is a defiler with flies who just kites until I'm out of power. I've taken on three high ranked wargs at once and won, and can win against multiple numbers of creeps as long as they don't have a healer.

So now I have a new problem. I can't get a fight most of the time without creeps bringing a whole party against me. Case in point was yesterday. Creeps zerg-rushing EC and rez camping they had so many. I mapped out of EC and decided to go knock out a few Grotham quests. Was in there and see one other freep questing too. Then I see a BA round the corner after the other freep pulled all the mobs for the goblin leaders quest. I hightail it over there and smash the BA into pieces. I knew more creeps would come, but this was ridiculous. Somewhere around 5-7 of them map into the place. High ranked spiders, wargs, WL, reavers - a fully coordinated party to take on two solo freeps surrounded by NPCs. It was really, really stupid and lame.

So yeah, out of the frying pan, into the fire. I do enjoy things a lot more though now that I've got audacity sets.

I'll give you a small example. Champ with ~7k morale has also another 7k from bubbles, dire need I won't even count, incombat sprint, aoe stun every 20 seconds. My reaver has 15k morale, 1/3 of champ dps if not less, inferior mitigations, no sprint, no stun. Explain me where you find the balance problem of your champ.

You should expect creeps to get a whole group to kill you because you can faceroll anything in less numbers. The inherent imbalance of the game calls for this fail pvp.

Originally Posted by Aldeld

Back for a progress report. Have full audacity now, more than a few pieces as I was trying out different combos. Settled on one that I really REALLY like. I solo almost all the time (recently got into a kin that has more people interested in the moors though, so hopefully less soloing so often.) I think the only thing I can't win against now is a defiler with flies who just kites until I'm out of power. I've taken on three high ranked wargs at once and won, and can win against multiple numbers of creeps as long as they don't have a healer.

So now I have a new problem. I can't get a fight most of the time without creeps bringing a whole party against me. Case in point was yesterday. Creeps zerg-rushing EC and rez camping they had so many. I mapped out of EC and decided to go knock out a few Grotham quests. Was in there and see one other freep questing too. Then I see a BA round the corner after the other freep pulled all the mobs for the goblin leaders quest. I hightail it over there and smash the BA into pieces. I knew more creeps would come, but this was ridiculous. Somewhere around 5-7 of them map into the place. High ranked spiders, wargs, WL, reavers - a fully coordinated party to take on two solo freeps surrounded by NPCs. It was really, really stupid and lame.

So yeah, out of the frying pan, into the fire. I do enjoy things a lot more though now that I've got audacity sets.

OP classes can only deserve zerging, if u play your champion with cds and bubbles that's all you can expect

if u want to have fair fights u've got to do your share of the job by refraining from using the full potential of your class

this means running fervour, dying to 2 wargs or any combo of decently ranked group of n>=3 creeps

I always thought Captains were at the lower end of the soloer pool for Freepside, so difficult to get a kill with one. Then again, I also imagined that Champions were on the top with Guardians because of how often Creeps complain about them.

Ah well, maybe I still have more to learn. :P

Originally Posted by Cilladh

OP classes can only deserve zerging, if u play your champion with cds and bubbles that's all you can expect

if u want to have fair fights u've got to do your share of the job by refraining from using the full potential of your class

this means running fervour, dying to 2 wargs or any combo of decently ranked group of n>=3 creeps

I loled. really? Hold back? people who do that in the moors arnt really Pvping, unless you're respecting someones 1 vs1. I can only assume this is some feeble attempt at sarcasm.

Originally Posted by douglasburns

I loled. really? Hold back? people who do that in the moors arnt really Pvping, unless you're respecting someones 1 vs1. I can only assume this is some feeble attempt at sarcasm.

there are 2 types of pvpers: those who like ezmoding points and those who do it to improve themselves and find challenges, up to you to choose in which category u want to be

from creep point of view i know that the only champ i'll ever try to jump on solo is a champ who does that, otherwise is simply useless fighting, like wardens i know that use DC and NS and OP minis

I guess based on some of these replies I should be flattered that they feel compelled to call in a small army for just one person. I sure as heck won't be holding back though, that's ridiculous. lol

Originally Posted by Aldeld

I guess based on some of these replies I should be flattered that they feel compelled to call in a small army for just one person. I sure as heck won't be holding back though, that's ridiculous. lol

it's not about holding back, it's about not using an overpowered build and overpowered cooldowns on an already overpowered class, we have plenty of these "good" champions on vilya yet i have to see one of those sacrificing to save some other freep...

anyway this is all in my opinion, but it's something shared among creeps (most will simply avoid fighting such champs) it's like running 1000m on a motorbike against runners, enjoy...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uOHyJV9KAsU


edit: for those who might not be able to translate the sentence in the vid is "Do you like winning easily?"

Originally Posted by Aldeld

So now I have a new problem. I can't get a fight most of the time without creeps bringing a whole party against me.

quite a nice "problem" you've got there when you're so strong no one will fight you solo :P

Originally Posted by Cilladh

it's not about holding back, it's about not using an overpowered build and overpowered cooldowns on an already overpowered class, we have plenty of these "good" champions on vilya yet i have to see one of those sacrificing to save some other freep...

anyway this is all in my opinion, but it's something shared among creeps (most will simply avoid fighting such champs) it's like running 1000m on a motorbike against runners, enjoy...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uOHyJV9KAsU


edit: for those who might not be able to translate the sentence in the vid is "Do you like winning easily?"

I have yet to fight a champ on Vilya that is on the same level of the champs on Brandywine. There's also a certain champ on E I think that's better than all of the Vilyan Champs. Aarodir is the only champ that comes close to the level of the Brandywine Champs...even then, he's noticeably easier to fight than some certain champs I've fought on Brandy...

In my experience, a champ should stomp my Warg in Shadow with no CDs... and still beat me in Flayer (Chily, Soleus, Thyke*)

The only champ I've fought that has beaten me in Flayer(On Vilya) is Aarodir...and he doesn't use any cds. The rest all lose to me in Shadow. (if they don't use CDs, but I can easily drop shadow / kite until Flayer is up) In my experience, on Vilya and Brandy...Flayer>Shadow for Champs.

I don't know if it's gear, knowledge, or both...but I've had a WAY less tougher time fighting Champs on Vilya than I did on Brandy. I have opened the eyes of many(On Vilya) with my knowledge, when on Brandy there are Wargs there that are leagues better than me. (Lovepounce, Snoopey, Stylen, Imnotmalarick) to name the ones off the top of my head...

*Thyke uses CDs and our fights are usually 50/50.... With Soleus in Chily they beat me every single time with no CDs.

Kidefence is the best Champion I've seen. Shray is the second best. The difference between them and most Champs is vast. Between each other is minutia. Played at different times and with different enough tactics.

High functioning skill translated as:

fluid movement + optimized skill rotation

Those two do/did it better than anyone. Never out of position. No 'dead air;' going more than .5-1.0 seconds without firing off a skill or strafing into position.

Point is: focus on movement and skill timing/rotation if you think "Champ moors play is infuriating..."

I know Champ moors play as infuriating for the Creeps. Burst DPS w/ good mitigations and potent, short cool-down survival skills. CBR + Sudden Defence/True Heroics (toggle Ardour!) + Sprint = 12+ Creeps focus-firing to kill you. No other visible melee class has it this good.

Oh, and then there are those "Ayy ohh eee" skills and traits.

Originally Posted by CodeofMisconduct

Kidefence is the best Champion I've seen. Shray is the second best. The difference between them and most Champs is vast. Between each other is minutia. Played at different times and with different enough tactics.

High functioning skill translated as:

fluid movement + optimized skill rotation

Those two do/did it better than anyone. Never out of position. No 'dead air;' going more than .5-1.0 seconds without firing off a skill or strafing into position.

Point is: focus on movement and skill timing/rotation if you think "Champ moors play is infuriating..."

I know Champ moors play as infuriating for the Creeps. Burst DPS w/ good mitigations and potent, short cool-down survival skills. CBR + Sudden Defence/True Heroics (toggle Ardour!) + Sprint = 12+ Creeps focus-firing to kill you. No other visible melee class has it this good.

Oh, and then there are those "Ayy ohh eee" skills and traits.

You forgot Fight On...

This thread was created almost two* years ago back in Siege of Mirkwood. And the Original Poster was completely right about Champions back then, they were almost as squishy as Hunters.

Do not take what he said about Champions then out of context to talk about now.



*actually, more like one and a half. My point still stands.

Originally Posted by Ivaneus

This thread was created almost two* years ago back in Siege of Mirkwood. And the Original Poster was completely right about Champions back then, they were almost as squishy as Hunters.

Do not take what he said about Champions then out of context to talk about now.

Originally Posted by Aldeld

Back for a progress report.

pretty sure theyre talking about dat dude

Originally Posted by Cilladh

OP classes can only deserve zerging, if u play your champion with cds and bubbles that's all you can expect

if u want to have fair fights u've got to do your share of the job by refraining from using the full potential of your class

this means running fervour, dying to 2 wargs or any combo of decently ranked group of n>=3 creeps

There are those to whom the Moors are a jousting arena, who gallantly wish to 1 vs 1 in fair fights. They exist on both sides - however wierd it may sound to have a creep with a knightly attitude. And that's fair and fine.

There are those to whom the Moors are a warzone, who use every weapon and skill at their disposal, whether alone, in groups or in zergs. They exist on both sides - however wierd it may sound to have a freep with a hate that would make Sauron cower. And that's fair and fine.

And there are those who are a bit of both. Maybe even moving from side to side, depending on their mood, whatever. And that's fair and fine.

At the end of the day though, we all share one common ground: we come to the Moors to have fun! Thing is, having fun in a PvP MMORPG is a twoway thing: you gotta give some to others if you want yours given to you.

Go glory, I recently hit tactical mitigation cap and enjoy it very much out there.

If all else fails pick up the relic and invincible lol

Originally Posted by CodeofMisconduct

Kidefence is the best Champion I've seen. Shray is the second best. The difference between them and most Champs is vast. Between each other is minutia. Played at different times and with different enough tactics.

High functioning skill translated as:

fluid movement + optimized skill rotation

Those two do/did it better than anyone. Never out of position. No 'dead air;' going more than .5-1.0 seconds without firing off a skill or strafing into position.

Point is: focus on movement and skill timing/rotation if you think "Champ moors play is infuriating..."

I know Champ moors play as infuriating for the Creeps. Burst DPS w/ good mitigations and potent, short cool-down survival skills. CBR + Sudden Defence/True Heroics (toggle Ardour!) + Sprint = 12+ Creeps focus-firing to kill you. No other visible melee class has it this good.

Oh, and then there are those "Ayy ohh eee" skills and traits.

I was referring to Kidefence, but I forgot about Shray as well. So that goes for TWO Champs on E. But Shray was originally from Vilya himself.

Originally Posted by Rainothon

At the end of the day though, we all share one common ground: we come to the Moors to have fun! Thing is, having fun in a PvP MMORPG is a twoway thing: you gotta give some to others if you want yours given to you.

yep, that's the concept expressed in a much better manner, i was a bit biased on my first response because i just came from a r7 champion using brand and sprint on my peaceful r2 ba questing in hh

Originally Posted by Aldeld

So now I have a new problem. I can't get a fight most of the time without creeps bringing a whole party against me.

Try not playing a class my cat can effectively play all the while spamming store items, just a thought.

Originally Posted by Efol

Try not playing a class my cat can effectively play all the while spamming store items, just a thought.

Sorry, not shelving a class I've been playing for over five years just because you think it's easy. As far as store items goes, the only time I'll use one is if I'm getting zerged. I have no shame in using them if I'm getting zerged either. You want an easy zerg target pick someone else. Besides, as I cycle through creeps more often than not there's a nifty blue 1 min immunity sitting in their buffs. Pot meet kettle.

Originally Posted by Aldeld

Sorry, not shelving a class I've been playing for over five years just because you think it's easy. As far as store items goes, the only time I'll use one is if I'm getting zerged. I have no shame in using them if I'm getting zerged either. You want an easy zerg target pick someone else. Besides, as I cycle through creeps more often than not there's a nifty blue 1 min immunity sitting in their buffs. Pot meet kettle.

Responds to purported illegitimate gameplay by committing said illegitimate gameplay.

Always good l0ls.

Originally Posted by MaroonDragoon

Responds to purported illegitimate gameplay by committing said illegitimate gameplay.

Always good l0ls.

Who said it was illegitimate? I sure didn't. Last I checked these are available in the store to everyone, and Turbine is selling it. Sounds legit to me. Point is, don't call me out for using them when your team uses them all the time.

Originally Posted by Aldeld

Who said it was illegitimate? I sure didn't. Last I checked these are available in the store to everyone, and Turbine is selling it. Sounds legit to me. Point is, don't call me out for using them when your team uses them all the time.

Its like a new meta game.... How much rl money can we make the baddie camp waste!

Originally Posted by Efol

Its like a new meta game.... How much rl money can we make the baddie camp waste!

^^ this is what most freeps do on meneldor while they sit and farm creeps till a organized group shows up then they do it on creep side till the creep group leaves and repeat

Originally Posted by douglasburns

I loled. really? Hold back? people who do that in the moors arnt really Pvping, unless you're respecting someones 1 vs1. I can only assume this is some feeble attempt at sarcasm.

Originally Posted by Aldeld

I guess based on some of these replies I should be flattered that they feel compelled to call in a small army for just one person. I sure as heck won't be holding back though, that's ridiculous. lol

you guys would fit right into brandy. although that is the reason i traited the way i did and fought zergs rather than trying to 1v1 everyone when i did play. think some of the vids i made are in my sig still

Originally Posted by eagleeye64

I don't know if it's gear

definitely not the case with me lol



inb4glory