Thread: Two-word Tolkien Trivia

Mongrel Flycatcher - Eol

In Australia the word mongrel used to be free of its mixed race conotations, and meant a despicable person although often jokes would start with "there was this mongrel you see" and we ended up with having sypathy for the subject of the joke, so I guess it could mean an unfortunate person. Anyway Eol who may have been Sindarin or Avari sits like a spider in the wood of Nan Elmoth and traps Aredhel and seems to force her into marriage, a throroughly despicable spider. Eol was also described as being twisted and bent like a dwarf from forge work (and probably rickets from an aversion to sunlight) so could satisfy a modern usage of mongrel too. Oh I just rembered like a spider he has a poisoness sting aswell.

Not Eol, though I enjoyed the explanation.


Here's a hint: flycatcher ≠ spider.

Brambles of Mordor?

Mongrel Flycatcher = A bird or type of bird of mixed heritage, ergo Earendil. We already know of his lineage, and then had the flying Vingilot to make him a Flycatcher proper. He even snagged one of the greatest bugs of them all, Ancalagon.

Originally Posted by darkoutcast

Mongrel Flycatcher = A bird or type of bird of mixed heritage, ergo Earendil. We already know of his lineage, and then had the flying Vingilot to make him a Flycatcher proper. He even snagged one of the greatest bugs of them all, Ancalagon.

Very close.

Then mayhaps Luthien, also of mixed heritage, in her disguise as Thuringwethil, that kooky fly catching bat-lady?

Originally Posted by darkoutcast

Then mayhaps Luthien, also of mixed heritage, in her disguise as Thuringwethil, that kooky fly catching bat-lady?

Wow, what a great question and answer. If this isn't the "correct" solution, it is nevertheless amazing. I've decided the two-word riddle format is my favorite.

Originally Posted by darkoutcast

Then mayhaps Luthien, also of mixed heritage, in her disguise as Thuringwethil, that kooky fly catching bat-lady?

Nicely done. (And incidentally, the nightingale, poetically signified by Beren's name for her, Tinúviel, is often classified as a type of flycatcher bird.)

It's your serve, D.

I hadn't been so clever as to remember Tinuviel as nightingale. Like Vilnas said, what a wonderful riddle. I hope mine will be regarded nearly as well.

incendiary genealogy

Originally Posted by darkoutcast

incendiary genealogy

The seven sons and inheritors of the destructive legacy of Feanor, the Spirit of Fire, and burner of the ships at Losgar?

That is actually the runner up answer. After I made my post, I thought of that and considered modifying my clue. However, I believe my answer still stands as the ideal one.

Hmm... inciendary genealogy... Im stumped if it is not the sons of Feanor. What has to do with fire? Something about Balrogs,Maybe?

Perhaps incendiary in the context of making people hate eachother, as in the relationship between Feanor and Fingolfin?

Another clever thought but half of the first answer was closer. Not all the way there, mind. Just closer.

Originally Posted by darkoutcast

Another clever thought but the first answer was closer to the mark.

Then perhaps we can go in the opposite direction and say Miriel and Feanor, the Birth of Feanor(both are really the same in my mind) or even the line of Miriel(which is the same thing but more general as it includes the seven sons)? Miriel named Feanor due to his fire consuming much of hers, after all.

Closer figuratively, not literally. i.e. Not Feanor, although his end may be ringing a bell.

Originally Posted by darkoutcast

Closer figuratively, not literally. i.e. Not Feanor, although his end may be ringing a bell.

Hmm...If we want to take the end of Feanor at face value, I might just go with the War of the Jewels, but that seems way to general for me. Although we could also say that his manner of death might be the point, and that would make more sense, but I can't think of a good answer in that line of thought. I'll be back once I think of one.

Perhaps Denethor, last Steward of Gondor, burning himself and trying to do the same to his barely-living son, Faramir?

Growing ever closer. This clue may seem strange until you stumble upon the proper passage. Then, I hope, any grudge borne will be satisfied.

I'm going to suggest something in connection with the Kinstrife, in hopes that someone with access to the books has a flash of inspiration and can hit up on the correct answer (I'm stuck at work and won't be able to check until later this evening). I deny all credit if this turns out to be a useful lead.

*Edit: Did Osgiliath burn during the Kinstrife?

New guess:

"My ancestor was a burned dwarf."

Originally Posted by Vilnas

New guess:

"My ancestor was a burned dwarf."

Right or wrong, terrific guess.

Excellent job Vilnas. That's the one.

Originally Posted by Vilnas

New guess:

"My ancestor was a burned dwarf."

:O

Methinks the Two-word is beyond me, I would've never come to that one, very nice.

Ok, I'm making the next one as intentionally difficult as I can manage. It requires a difficult logical connection and represents a departure from the usual way in which we have been presenting clues (although I believe it can be viewed as an extension of a recent trend):

Oublietted Royal

Hurin as last lord of Dor-lomin and figuratively oublietted in Angband?

A good guess, but incorrect.

My best guess would be Finrod Felagund, imprisoned with Beren and companions by Sauron.

Also a good guess, and also incorrect. Allow me to emphasize that the clue works in a different way than our normal usage.

Alright, as my way out there guess - Nienor. Here's why:

Oublietted meaning little place of forgetting. Her memory was definitely gone.

Royal = "blue" = sad. Both Nienor and Niniel have a component of sad in their name (I believe "tear" in specific, one in Quenya, one in Sindarin)

A very thoughtful response, but also incorrect. The clues have literal meaning, but the application is unorthodox.

I have a question: is "oublietted" used in the sense that they were literally locked up, or were they just forgotten about?

In this case locked up plus forgotten by almost everyone, although forgotten isn't exactly right.

Also, this clue is presented in a way that is more akin to the Odin's time clue than to our usual way of riddling.

I don't post much, but I couldn't resist hazarding a guess...

The Silmarils, lost to Earth and Sea, at the end of the First Age?

Reasoning: Both are "locked away" and, for the time being, "forgotton" by the time of the Lord of the Rings. They were also created by Feanor, born to King Finwe and King in his own right eventually, and thus royally "issued". They're also highly prized by the royals of Ea during the first age (Thingol, Melkor, etc.. Even you might say Manwe, but his purpose being benign in his desire to bring about the rebirth of the Two Trees).

Also, the "Royal" has a possible double entendre in that a "royal" is a special mast of a ship, thus possibly referring to Earendil the Mariner and the Silmaril in his possession.

Yet another excellent guess. In this riddle oublietted means imprisoned and "forgotten", and royal means a person of royal lineage.

The answer to this riddle involves a two step process, and the second is fairly straightforward. The cruel trick is in the initial application of the clues.

Originally Posted by kethavel

I don't post much, but I couldn't resist hazarding a guess...

The Silmarils, lost to Earth and Sea, at the end of the First Age?

Reasoning: Both are "locked away" and, for the time being, "forgotton" by the time of the Lord of the Rings. They were also created by Feanor, born to King Finwe and King in his own right eventually, and thus royally "issued". They're also highly prized by the royals of Ea during the first age (Thingol, Melkor, etc.. Even you might say Manwe, but his purpose being benign in his desire to bring about the rebirth of the Two Trees).

Also, the "Royal" has a possible double entendre in that a "royal" is a special mast of a ship, thus possibly referring to Earendil the Mariner and the Silmaril in his possession.

That was a sweet first post, friend!

Thanks ^.^

I had this one half in mind when I wrote the other...

Thorin Oakenshield. He was a king and he was imprisoned briefly by the Elves of Mirkwood. His name was forgotten in delirium by his father, Thrain, when he gave the map to the secret entrance to the Lonely Mountain to Gandalf.

Edit: I'm a bit confused at the moment as to whether Thrain forgot his own name or his son's. So, could be him or Thrain, in this case, as both were imprisoned, royal and one way or the other forgotten. Sorry for the double answer. Memory is cloudy on this part and I've not my book at hand!

Originally Posted by kethavel

Thanks ^.^

I had this one half in mind when I wrote the other...

Thorin Oakenshield. He was a king and he was imprisoned briefly by the Elves of Mirkwood. His name was forgotten in delirium by his father, Thrain, when he gave the map to the secret entrance to the Lonely Mountain to Gandalf.

Edit: I'm a bit confused at the moment as to whether Thrain forgot his own name or his son's. So, could be him or Thrain, in this case, as both were imprisoned, royal and one way or the other forgotten. Sorry for the double answer. Memory is cloudy on this part and I've not my book at hand!

Not Thorin either. Thrain actually is alarmingly close to qualifying as an acceptable alternative answer, but it isn't the one I have in mind.

As for your confusion, Gandalf states that Thrain couldn't remember his own name, much less that of his son.

Ar-Pharazon the Golden, imprisoned in the Caves of the Forgotten until the Dagor Dagorath?

Sheesh. Another great alternative answer.

Ok, for the "official" answer you need to take a different approach to the question, similar to what was required for the "Odin's time" riddle. As I said, it is a two step process.

For now, I will say that the official answer is not in fact a person that has been locked up and forgotten, even though that is what the clue initially points to. The correct answer will hopefully become fairly obvious once you realize what the first step in the clue is talking about.

I will be more clear about the process later today if that isn't a strong enough hint.