Sauron, Isuldir, Deagol, Smeagol, Bilbo, Frodo, Gandalf, Tom Bombadil, and Samwise Gamgee; making nine.
Did Gandalf hold it. I am reading that part of the fellowship now and I seem to recall (and I am trying to expunge the movie from my memory) that he did not touch it and was quite ginger about not doing so. Did he touch it in the Hobbit ? If so would he not have known what it was then?
Ire it, but the question was, "how many individuals held the One Ring".
For my question, what was the longest established Dunedain (Numenorian, Gondoran or Arnorian) settlement on Middle Earth?
What do you mean by "longest established"? Oldest, oldest continuously inhabited at the time of the War of the Ring, or something else?
* * * "From without the World, though all things may be forethought in music or foreshown in vision from afar, to those who enter verily into Eä each in its time shall be met at unawares as something new and unforetold."
I mean the settlement with the longest continuos inhabitation from its first founding until it was abandoned or destroyed, of the end of the third age if that comes first.
I believe it was Pelargir, though I'll take a Gollum and double the answer with Umbar. Of course I'm probably wrong and the answer is somewhere in an obscure spot of History of M.E. that I haven't gotten to yet.
I would say Annuminas, but that's a total guess. I'll get some books out tonight I think
edit: I forgot about Numenor. So yeah, that whole place is how we mark the years of the second age. I don't know how long the second age was, but that's my new guess.
Last edited by aleczander; Jan 22 2010 at 03:05 PM.
Going waaay off the board on this one, but according to Tolkien's writings, what would you need to find in your cake in order to mark you as an Elf-friend (among other consequences)?
Going waaay off the board on this one, but according to Tolkien's writings, what would you need to find in your cake in order to mark you as an Elf-friend (among other consequences)?
hmmm, a Keebler chocolate chip?
Like I told you... What I said...Steal your face right off your head.
I believe this question was asked and discussed on page 1 of this thread.
Your right, a very similar question was posed on the first page by Morthaur. He asked what was the first and oldest Numenorian city on Middle Earth; and accepted as the answer Tharbad.
Aleczander has suggested as the answer Annuminas (founded approx SA 3320, destroyed TA 1975 at the latest - total duration 2091 years); and the cities of Numenor (founded SA 30, destroyed SA 3319 - duration 3289 years)
Chem_aggie has suggested Pelargir (Founded SA 2350, still inhabited at the end of the Third Age - duration 4110 years at the end of the Third Age) and Umbar (founded SA 2280, still inhabited at the end of the Third Age - duration 4190 years at the end of the Third Age). I am, however, not certain that Umbar counts as a Dundedain city by the end of the Third Age. It had been in the control of the Corsairs from TA 1448, and though they were originally Dunedain, it is not clear they remained so.
The correct answer to Morthaur's question is Lond Daer, called Vinyalonde when Aldarion established it around SA 800. It is not, however, the correct answer to my question, for it was not continuosly inhabited until around SA 1800 and was abaondoned early in the TA (longest duration of continuos inhabitation, approx 1741 years.
Morthaur accepted as the correct answer Tharbad, founded circa SA 1800 and finally abandoned in TA 2912 (4660 years). It is, however, not clear that Tharbad was inhabited throughout the Second Age. Eregion fell so there was no advantage for trade with the Elves; and the area was denuded of timber (the original reason for settlement).
On that basis I will consider Chem-Aggie to have given the correct answer.
Thank you for the summary and analysis Cutholen. I deliberately said that the question had been asked and discussed - rather than answered - but was in a hurry and probably didn't make the distinction very clear. My real purpose was to direct the group back to those posts as being germane to the question at hand.
Going waaay off the board on this one, but according to Tolkien's writings, what would you need to find in your cake in order to mark you as an Elf-friend (among other consequences)?
A star.
You had me bamboozled for a while because I kept trying to solve the puzzle in Middle Earth. But then I remembered Smith of Wootton Major.
Returning to MiddleEarth, who was the tallest woman amongst the Eldar, and how tall was she?
A star is correct. A smallish silver star baked into a festival cake. The Smith of Wooten Major had it in his slice as a child and ate it without noticing.
According to "Numenorean Linear Measures" (Appendix to "Disaster of Gladden Fields" in Unfinished Tales), Galadriel was "man high" "according to the measure of the Dunedain of old", and gives an approximate height of 6' 4" (p 370).
'This is sharper than thy tongue. Try but once more to usurp my place and the love of my father, and maybe it will rid the Noldor of one who seeks to be the master of thralls.'
Who said the above, and who was being addressed?
Like I told you... What I said...Steal your face right off your head.
Wasn't he referring to the Noldor as being thralls to the Valar? As I recall this all grew out of Morgoth's campaign of lies designed to make the Noldor restless in Valinor and resentful of the Valar for keeping them from their rightful destiny as masters of their own realms in Middle-earth. I believe Feanor began speaking out against the "yoke" they suffered under the Valar, although I don't recall whether he was to the point of pressuring his father Finwe to do something about it. I guess he must have, because Fingolfin was quietly urging their father against doing anything rash (or maybe he was simply asking Finwe to try and restrain Feanor). Feanor came upon Fingolfin speaking alone with Finwe (although as I recall there was nothing sneaky about the encounter on the part of Fingolfin) and it led to Feanor drawing a sword on Fingolfin and speaking those words. I think that was the first time an elf threatened another with a weapon in Valinor, and it earned Feanor a stern reprimand from the Valar (which in turn led to a festival being called to patch things up, which led to Morgoth and Ungoliant having easy access to the Two Trees, Finwe being slain in defense of the Silmarils, etc.). In the end, the entire history of the Noldor and Middle-earth in general would have been much happier if their best and brightest hadn't been such a complete a$s.
Yes, you remember it correctly.
Something that has always sort of bothered me about this part of the tale: It is told that Melkor taught the Noldor of arms and "spoke to them concerning weapons" and that they began to make swords, axes and spears.
It seems strange to me that the Noldor would just take up this smithying when there had been no mention of the use of such tools up to that point. Why would folk that had never been exposed to fighting take so easily to weapon smithing?
Like I told you... What I said...Steal your face right off your head.
I agree. I understand that they were excellent craftsmen, but I have a hard time understanding how they were persuaded, in the absence of any manifest threat, to take up the production of tools the sole purpose of which was violence against either their peers or their mentors. Perhaps the point can be saved by assuming that Melkor convinced them that the weapons would be needed when they returned to Middle-earth to take up their destiny.
You make one magic talking sword and it gets lonely, or you get sick of talking to it , ("talking swords are pretty one dimensional in their needs") so you make it a friend, then some talking dagger children, pretty soon you have yourself a whole armorey of talking swords looking for a fight.
High princes were Feanor and Fingolfin, the elder sons of Finwe, honoured by all in Aman; but now they grew proud and jealous each of his rights and possessions. Then Melkor set new lies abroad in Eldamar, and whispers came to Feanor that Fingolfin and his sons were plotting to usurp the leadership of Finwe and of the elder line of Feanor, and to supplant them by leave of the Valar; for the Valar were ill-pleased that the Silmarils lay in Tirion and were not committed to their keeping. But to Fingolfin and Finarfin it was said: 'Beware! Small love has the proud son of Miriel ever had for the children of Indis. Now he has become great, and he has his father in his hand. It will not be long before he drives you forth from Tuna!'
And when Melkor saw that these lies were smouldering, and that pride and anger were awake among the Noldor, he spoke to them concerning weapons ...
So first Melkor persuaded Feanor and Fingolfin that the other was plotting against that which was theirs by right. Then he casually mentioned a way they could retain what was theirs against the plots of the other.
Who or what was the oldest living creature on Middle-earth at the end of the third age, and approximately how old was she/he/it? Bonus points for giving both possibly correct answers on the age, and explaining why they differ.
Who or what was the oldest living creature on Middle-earth at the end of the third age, and approximately how old was she/he/it? Bonus points for giving both possibly correct answers on the age, and explaining why they differ.
That would either be Treebeard (unless the trees he spoke of count as living creatures), or Tom Bombadil.
I'm inclined to say the latter, as Tom has memories of times seemingly before Morgoth left the earth and came back as a dark lord, making him older then the ents. Treebeard is definitely the oldest of the 4 normal races though, since Tom doesn't exactly fit in any of them.
"The rejection of grammatical correction is proof of the level of intelligence hinted at by your writing."
Now please keep this discussion on topic or you may be reported for causing time mismanagement
Senior Member Online status:
Reputation:
Originally Posted by Cutholen
Grand Member Online status:
Grand Member Online status:
Grand Member Online status:
Poster of Note Online status:
Grand Member Online status:
Reply With Quote
Posting Permissions
